Search found 163 matches

by Toffo
Sun Feb 26, 2017 7:53 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Hey guys I have solved the problem from the previous page. Are you interested? Probably not. Well it's not a long story: The problem was that mass near event horizon hanging on a very long wire, is lowered down 1 m, which results the released energy traveling up million meters along the wire. That k...
by Toffo
Wed May 04, 2016 3:33 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Does potential energy have mass?
Replies: 78
Views: 15548

Re: Does potential energy have mass?

What's the problem Himself? Exploding nuclear bomb releases some of its nuclear gravitational potential energy as all kinds of gravitational potential energies. Sound gravitational potential energy, light gravitational potential energy, and so on. Above I created a theory, I did it by appending &qu...
by Toffo
Tue May 03, 2016 6:13 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Does potential energy have mass?
Replies: 78
Views: 15548

Re: Does potential energy have mass?

"Sound gravitational potential energy" ? Look, you can persist in your nonsense, but don't drag poor Himself down with you. Himself, your potential energy relative to a black hole you are not falling into is probably going to be really negligible. ~1/r^2, knocks it right down. Matter fall...
by Toffo
Tue May 03, 2016 4:25 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Does potential energy have mass?
Replies: 78
Views: 15548

Re: Does potential energy have mass?

What's the problem Himself? Exploding nuclear bomb releases some of its nuclear gravitational potential energy as all kinds of gravitational potential energies. Sound gravitational potential energy, light gravitational potential energy, and so on.
by Toffo
Fri Mar 18, 2016 11:03 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

OK now, if I may suggest, the experts may start protesting, and the non-experts may start giving suggestions what might be the "non-obvious lifter". :) It depends on what the reaction mass is. ⋅ If you lift an object by hand, your feet push the earth down. The center of gravity ...
by Toffo
Fri Mar 18, 2016 10:50 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

When an object is lifted, increasing its energy by E, the energy of the planet, from which the object is lifted, increases by E. This is quite clearly required to avoid ugly asymmetry. What ugly asymmetry? I want both gravitating objects to equally gain energy when a lifting process is happening. B...
by Toffo
Thu Mar 17, 2016 9:16 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

When an object is lifted, increasing its energy by E, the energy of the planet, from which the object is lifted, increases by E. This is quite clearly required to avoid ugly asymmetry. I can't even That is not even the odd part, when two objects want to be close to each other and we move the object...
by Toffo
Thu Mar 17, 2016 4:55 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Now I would like to consider energy, again. So when an object is lifted, by a lifter that uses energy E, the energy of the object increases by E. This is quite believable. When an object is lifted, increasing its energy by E, the energy of the planet, from which the object is lifted, increases by E....
by Toffo
Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:14 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Hey I changed my mind. :) When a box that is already moving fast is accelerated, the blue shifted photons emitted by the box blue shift more, and the contracted box contracts more, and the magnitudes of these effects are almost equal. So there's no room for ridiculous number of length contracted pho...
by Toffo
Sun Feb 28, 2016 3:18 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Does the composition of a body depend on its speed? Let's say there's a box far from all masses. There are two scientists, A and B, with clocks at the opposite ends of the box, inside the box. Every second A sends a photon towards B, and every second B absorbs a photon that was emitted by A. Now we...
by Toffo
Fri Feb 26, 2016 11:30 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

the moving box is contracted (less room for photons), but the photon gas is contracted more (more photons fit into the box). Why would the photon gas contract more, and not by exactly the same amount? Good question. In the fast moving box there are blueshifted photons and redshifted photons, bluesh...
by Toffo
Fri Feb 26, 2016 11:20 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Copper Bezel wrote:Are you reading anything anyone else is posting? Appending "let's say that [additional wrong thing]" to a wrong statement is not an improvement.


Everything read and understood. :D
by Toffo
Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:39 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Let's consider a warm black box. Interestingly, when this black box moves fast, it contains more radiation compared to a still standing box, because the moving box is contracted (less room for photons), but the photon gas is contracted more (more photons fit into the box). I'm referring to the blue ...
by Toffo
Tue Feb 23, 2016 11:03 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

I created this play to enlighten you all: The story about a Moving Guy and a Standing Guy Standing Guy to Moving Guy: Hey Moving Guy, are you moving? Moving Guy: No. Standing Guy to Moving Guy: Hey Moving Guy, are you cold? Moving Guy: No, because I am not moving. Standing Guy to himself: Moving Guy...
by Toffo
Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:59 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Let me put this another way. The central idea of special relativity is that the laws of physics do not depend on your reference frame. You cannot tell if you are in motion because even if you move from one reference frame to another (by some brief acceleration), nothing will fundamentally change, l...
by Toffo
Mon Feb 22, 2016 10:16 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Let's say we have a hot metal block in vacuum. It emits some electrons. If the block moves fast, it still emits electrons, although it's cool now. From this we learn that fast moving objects have lowered boiling points, melting points, and so on. Let's say we have a cool metal block in an electric ...
by Toffo
Mon Feb 22, 2016 10:06 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Eebster the Great wrote:Are you even reading our posts? Moving something does not make it colder.


Yes some people say that moving something does not make it colder.
by Toffo
Sun Feb 21, 2016 11:59 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Let's say we have a hot metal block in vacuum. It emits some electrons. If the block moves fast, it still emits electrons, although it's cool now. From this we learn that fast moving objects have lowered boiling points, melting points, and so on. Let's say we have a cool metal block in an electric f...
by Toffo
Sat Feb 20, 2016 1:58 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Time dilation only cools down radiation (or heats it up) because the temperature of radiation is a resultant of it's frequency, or vibrations of the electromagnetic field per second. If you change the speed of seconds then the radiation temperature changes. Kinda, but not exactly, like the Doppler ...
by Toffo
Fri Feb 19, 2016 12:03 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Neil_Boekend wrote:
Toffo wrote:this causes the pizza to cool down

Why?


Because of some reason. Maybe time dilation.

Thermometer on the pizza does not measure any temperature change, because it time dilates, maybe.
by Toffo
Fri Feb 19, 2016 11:10 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Let's say I have an infrared thermometer at the middle of of a large spinning space station. All parts of the space station are in thermal equilibrium. So everything is in equilibrium with the infrared thermometer, which measures the same temperature for everything, let's say 3 K. Let's say I have a...
by Toffo
Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:35 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

I don't know why lowered objects cool down.

I just know that an infrared thermometers will tell us that the temperature of a lowered object is going down.
by Toffo
Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:17 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Maybe now I finally understand what people have been trying to tell me all the time: Let's say I have a pizza at temperature 3 K in an universe with 3 K cosmic background radiation. There's a deep gravity well. I start rapidly lowering the pizza to the well, this causes the pizza to cool down, this ...
by Toffo
Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:28 pm UTC
Forum: What If?
Topic: What-If 0145: "Fire From Moonlight"
Replies: 157
Views: 72869

Re: What-If 0145: "Fire From Moonlight"

Solar wind turbines surrounding sun at close distance - not very good efficiency, because light is diffuse. Solar wind turbines surrounding sun at far distance - better efficiency, because light is less diffuse. Solar wind turbines surrounding sun at far distance, but there's a light diffusing film ...
by Toffo
Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:37 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Toffo Talks about Trains
Replies: 128
Views: 18563

Re: Toffo Talks about Trains

Train propulsion by heat transfer Let's say there's a rail on board on a fast moving train. The front end of the rail is heated. The heat starts to move towards the other end of the rail, which causes the rail to recoil. The recoil propels the train. Before the heat reaches the rear end of the rail...
by Toffo
Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:44 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Toffo Talks about Trains
Replies: 128
Views: 18563

Re: Toffo Talks about Trains

Why is it difficult for electric trains to accelerate to the speed of light?

Because at speed close to c scooping up energy causes almost the same drag force as the train motor can generate with that energy.
by Toffo
Fri Feb 05, 2016 11:09 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Toffo Talks about Trains
Replies: 128
Views: 18563

Re: Toffo Talks about Trains

Uh, isn't that one really easy too? The thing slowing the train down is this energy (mass) having to be brought up to speed. The kinetic energy from the train is being transferred to the energy (mass) it's picking up. It's a simple trade-off, same as if a stray hobo hopped on board instead. Hobo ca...
by Toffo
Fri Feb 05, 2016 9:00 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Toffo Talks about Trains
Replies: 128
Views: 18563

Re: A new relativity paradox

SDK wrote:... The electricity?


That does not make any sense. I suggest you study carefully Sevenperforce's answer.

Let me summarize:

"From the train" was one answer to question "were does all the momentum come" ... other answer was "from wires".
by Toffo
Fri Feb 05, 2016 6:53 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Toffo Talks about Trains
Replies: 128
Views: 18563

Re: A new relativity paradox

... The electricity? What he said. Energy is mass, so if energy is moving from the overhead electric wire to the train, mass is moving from the overhead electric wire to the train. Not a lot, mind you (mass flux is equal to the power consumption divided by c 2 ), but some. However, the train is mov...
by Toffo
Fri Feb 05, 2016 10:59 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Toffo Talks about Trains
Replies: 128
Views: 18563

A new relativity paradox

Let's say a train powered by an overhead electric wire moves frictionlessly along an infinitely long linear track, and some light is shining out of the train's side windows. That's what the train needs the electricity for, for lights. The aforementioned light carries linear momentum in track frame, ...
by Toffo
Thu Jan 21, 2016 12:40 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Since gmalivuk has provided a proof that the force will increase as you lower the object (with basic Newtonian gravity , no less) I think that it is time to reconsider the knowledge that the force will not change. Unless you postulate it as a preset condition of your thought experiment, of course. ...
by Toffo
Wed Jan 20, 2016 8:38 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

I was asking about the part that I quoted, where you claim towing it takes twice as much energy. Pointing out something that seems to have as much energy as the rest mass doesn't actually prove anything about the claim you're making. If we divide that large energy by c 2 , then we get a mass, 1 kg,...
by Toffo
Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:47 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

1 kg mass is lowered, acceleration is 1g, the mass weighs 10 N all the time. When we lower the mass very close to Rindler-horizon, the extra weight on the batteries approaches 10 N. So it takes twice as much energy to tow a mass with a very very long rope compared to a short rope. How about you do ...
by Toffo
Tue Jan 19, 2016 6:11 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

It does get weirder with relativity and very long ropes, though. The rear has to have greater acceleration than the front in order to maintain the same distance under continued acceleration, which presumably means tension on a tow rope would increase with length. Actually the force on the hitch sta...
by Toffo
Mon Jan 18, 2016 11:12 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

sevenperforce - I notice that you did not disagree with the idea that when towing a mass and accelerating, the length of the towing rope does not affect the force on the hitch. Maybe you might even say I did not make any error in description of the thought experiment? I mean the observations of the ...
by Toffo
Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:24 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Don't post "Yes, except I still believe the opposite of what you said." That's not helpful. Let us consider some scenarios inside an accelerating rocket in order to try to see if we can make sense of potential energy. If we lower down a mass using a winch attached to the rear of the rocke...
by Toffo
Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:08 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Toffo, you're forgetting some fairly basic Newtonian stuff here. Potential energy can be positive or negative depending on where you set your zero. It's kind of like temperature that way. When we talk about the potential energy of a mass we hold only slightly above the surface of a much larger body...
by Toffo
Sun Jan 17, 2016 9:23 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

I think you can get away with some of this, but it's not recursive. Gravitational potential energy doesn't have potential energy. Yes, except when there's one potential energy on the left and one potential energy on the right, and the two independent potential energies attract each other, correctio...
by Toffo
Sat Jan 16, 2016 9:51 pm UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

Oh, so you want to spin it to a relativistic speed, use the (deprecated, but alright) relativistic mass formula, and then put the value from that mass into the classical gravitational potential energy formula? That seems like a reasonable thing to do. Somehow I feel you find it very very dumb. :) I...
by Toffo
Sat Jan 16, 2016 3:33 am UTC
Forum: Science
Topic: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo
Replies: 162
Views: 28285

Re: Gravity-temperature musings by Toffo

I think we need to study gravity some more. So here's a question: Let's say you are in a tower with a flywheel weighing 10 Newtons. You spin up the flywheel, which causes it to weigh 10.1 Newtons. Flywheel has now some extra potential energy. Shall we say that A) the extra potential energy is the po...

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