Search found 387 matches

by Trebla
Thu Dec 04, 2014 7:57 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

...seriously, this doesn't need to be a dichotomy. It is absolutely, 100%, totally possible that both sides have made mistakes in how they described things. It is absolutely, 100%, totally possible that both sides were acting irrationally, possibly aggressively out of fear. I don't disagree at all,...
by Trebla
Thu Dec 04, 2014 3:50 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

I'm not claiming that's literally what happened - to my understanding, you're saying it's more plausible that Brown bent down in order to assault Wilson , and presenting it as a dichotomy between that and Brown standing straight up and Wilson lunging out of his window. I'm saying that setting that ...
by Trebla
Thu Dec 04, 2014 1:05 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

It happens "all the time"... but it happens significantly less frequently than the other way around. At least, that's the impression I have. Most people don't shoot someone who's fleeing from them, even if "all the time" a tiny fraction of people do. My default assumption for AN...
by Trebla
Thu Dec 04, 2014 12:47 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: The Thread To Remind Me We're Living In The Future
Replies: 1922
Views: 388482

Re: The Thread To Remind Me We're Living In The Future

MartianInvader wrote:The "bots: no lying" form of captcha has now become a reality:

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2473062,00.asp


I must be missing something, while this is obviously an improvement for human usability, how does it deter bots?
by Trebla
Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:58 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

Er, if you're six-four and somebody stops to talk to you from a car, wouldn't you have to bend over to talk to them in any sensible way? I'm five-eight and I need to bend over to talk to someone inside a car. SUVs sit somewhat higher than cars, but they're generally less than six-four, and the driv...
by Trebla
Wed Dec 03, 2014 5:07 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

Then you should reexamine your assumptions, because good LORD this kind of thing happens all the time, especially with overt racists. Also, the fact that all of your assumptions rely on arguing what a normal person would do when not highly stressed and thinking irrationally -- which, presumably, wo...
by Trebla
Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:36 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

Occam's Razor, I would assume. Accepting Wilson's testimony requires the fewest unsupported assumptions (or assumptions counter-indicated by physical evidence)? Which is not the case, as I've already been over with the altercation at the car. There are a number of more implausible assumptions we ha...
by Trebla
Tue Dec 02, 2014 4:09 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

What exactly is the point of a Grand Jury? From what I've been reading they're usually criticized in the opposite direction, in that they usually result in indictments. I'm not clear why there's this mini pre-trial where only one side, the prosecution, gets to basically be involved. Especially if t...
by Trebla
Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:14 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

razor thing? As a serious thought exercise, are you capable of entertaining the notion that a cop made a mistake? I've notice you tend to rely on hyperbole to make your points here; have you considered that he screwed up, made an honest mistake due to getting in over his head or being racist, and n...
by Trebla
Tue Nov 25, 2014 6:16 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

My point is simply that the "Brown assaulted Wilson" version has no more to back it up than the "Wilson pulled Brown" version. The "Brown assaulted Wilson" version is the implicit conclusion of the Grand Jury who is probably the most reliable source of a complete pictu...
by Trebla
Tue Nov 25, 2014 5:01 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

Reliable citation needed on the claim that it was Brown who robbed the store. Depends on what you call "reliable" I suppose... take it with a grain of salt: http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/ferguson-police-name-michael-brown Snippets: "In an interview with msnbc shortly after the report wa...
by Trebla
Tue Nov 25, 2014 3:28 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Police misbehavior thread
Replies: 6957
Views: 1115968

Re: Police misbehavior thread

I don't give two shits what lies media has been reporting. The evidence I care about is photos and audio and video recordings taken of people saying things directly. And what the police have said directly has changed repeatedly in the past 110 or so days, whereas eyewitness reports and medical exam...
by Trebla
Fri Oct 24, 2014 1:56 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Wave of anti-abortion bills advance in the states
Replies: 164
Views: 30075

Re: Wave of anti-abortion bills advance in the states

Remove that basic drive and ask yourself if sex would be important, would you still desire it? I'm not saying that your intellect desires to have children, I'm saying that biology doesn't care what your intellect wants. You can hold your breath until you pass out, but the minute you do the biology ...
by Trebla
Thu Sep 25, 2014 6:52 pm UTC
Forum: Logic Puzzles
Topic: to switch or have it not matter?
Replies: 9
Views: 3701

Re: to switch or have it not matter?

So... I guess you still switch? I thought this was going to somehow go somewhere more interesting... By this I mean my argument, not the general discussion It becomes far more interesting (and more similar to the linked thread) if you don't know the value of either envelope prior to opening either....
by Trebla
Wed Sep 24, 2014 7:55 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Converting to Post Scarcity
Replies: 139
Views: 28858

Re: Converting to Post Scarcity

Within the realm of possibility, sure. The point I have been making is not that it is impossible for computers to be creative or artistic, but rather that a computer that does not interact broadly with the world at large is going to have difficulty creating art that will be meaningful to humans who...
by Trebla
Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:38 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Converting to Post Scarcity
Replies: 139
Views: 28858

Re: Converting to Post Scarcity

The idea that we could possibly run out of things to hire people to do any time soon is absurd. You see automation as massive unemployment. I see it as an opportunity to have classrooms with 1 teach for every 8 students. Police departments that never have to ignore crimes for 'lack of resources'. N...
by Trebla
Wed Aug 27, 2014 9:15 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: The Right to Record
Replies: 72
Views: 24852

Re: The Right to Record

Trebla, the relevant question is nor just what you would or should do in a hypothetical situation. It's also whether other people should be able to make that choice for themselves. The 'right to record' is also a right 'right to expose'. It takes away the choice whether to hide or to be in the open...
by Trebla
Thu Aug 21, 2014 1:28 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: The Right to Record
Replies: 72
Views: 24852

Re: The Right to Record

If I held beliefs that could get my family killed by expressing those beliefs, even if I could guarantee that my actions would lead to their acceptance, I would not seek to change society. If you wanted to do something harmless that could get you (or your daughter) fired, would you do it? Would you...
by Trebla
Wed Aug 20, 2014 6:23 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: The Right to Record
Replies: 72
Views: 24852

Re: The Right to Record

If you have a way to eliminate the social stigmas surrounding these sorts of issues, I'd love to hear it. Only time and effort. Hiding your actions so they won't be judged just allows this generation to teach the next that your actions can be discriminated against... confronting the stigmas in soci...
by Trebla
Wed Aug 20, 2014 4:14 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: The Right to Record
Replies: 72
Views: 24852

Re: The Right to Record

As I said before, all metrics of privacy are problematic in some form. That doesn't however obviate the clearly credible notion that some situations are more private than others. Do you disagree with the basic premise that there are degrees of privacy? If you're on board with that, pick any measure...
by Trebla
Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:34 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: The Right to Record
Replies: 72
Views: 24852

Re: The Right to Record

It's also kind of irrelevant in the context of facial recognition software. And verbal affirmation of someone doing a thing is a lot weaker evidence than photographic evidence of them doing the thing. "Hey, everyone, jseah eats his boogers." Is a lot less damaging than 'Here is a photo of...
by Trebla
Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:27 pm UTC
Forum: Logic Puzzles
Topic: One Question Quiz
Replies: 7
Views: 4787

Re: One Question Quiz

Spoiler:
It could also be "The Name Game" song....

Joanna Armstrong-Miller, Joanna Armstrong-Miller, bo-Boanna Armstrong-Miller
Banana-fana-fo Foanna Armstrong-Miller
...

etc.
by Trebla
Wed Jun 04, 2014 4:00 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Taliban Releases US POW
Replies: 196
Views: 27393

Re: Taliban Releases US POW

I understand your position, but it doesn't seem that you do when you go on to make claims about murder being wrong when there's a population shortage. Your argument is that statements like that are meaningless, so why do you keep making them? You think that we as a society shouldn't tolerate the mu...
by Trebla
Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:05 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Taliban Releases US POW
Replies: 196
Views: 27393

Re: Taliban Releases US POW

You'll notice that the moral standard here does not change over time, the definition of who qualifies as human does. Morals are absolute and science informs how we apply those morals. This doesn't seem very accurate to me. I don't think the vast majority of people (Americans, at least) who don't be...
by Trebla
Tue Jun 03, 2014 12:01 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Taliban Releases US POW
Replies: 196
Views: 27393

Re: Taliban Releases US POW

Put it this way: If you would under no circumstances (beyond absurd hypotheticals like having a gun pointed at your head) support the institution of slavery, then we're at accord, and just quibbling over definitions. If (when?) we manage to create fully autonomous machines that have sapience (Ok, &...
by Trebla
Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:22 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Definition of Marriage
Replies: 132
Views: 29101

Re: Definition of Marriage

Show me. I want to see the legal document, the law, the act, the whatever that explicitly defines an interracial marriage as something other than "marriage" or "married." I'm not talking about legal distinctions. I was very explicit multiple times that there should be no legal d...
by Trebla
Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:39 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Definition of Marriage
Replies: 132
Views: 29101

Re: Definition of Marriage

It is different. The terms "straight" and "gay" specifically refer to the sexual orientation of individuals. Its deeply relevant because there is real discrimination and violence in this world based on that information. If there is no legal difference between a heterosexual marr...
by Trebla
Wed Apr 23, 2014 2:13 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Definition of Marriage
Replies: 132
Views: 29101

Re: Definition of Marriage

There is real harm in having a different name even if the legal privileges are the same. There will always be the stigma that a civil union is something that is lesser than a real marriage. Why else have a different name if not to force the difference into the faces of everyone who cannot get marri...
by Trebla
Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:43 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: What do you mean by consciousness?

My point is language isn't the definition or reason for consciousness, it's a by product of the need for communication. I never said it was. I simply said that language gave me a more complex set of experiences. This could by part of the confusion on this whole language discussion. On the previous ...
by Trebla
Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:37 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Cultural Appropriation / Assimilation
Replies: 501
Views: 79757

Re: Cultural Appropriation / Assimilation

How do you know that guy isn't from that culture? A person can look very different to what their parents nationalities are. Maybe that white looking guy actually has an Indian father and he was actually respecting his family tradition with the feather? Then another Indian comes along being offended...
by Trebla
Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:32 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: What do you mean by consciousness?

You're talking about experience tied intimately with the understanding to associate a telegram with a far away event. Again, this is more in the sapience ballpark (which very well may be more inline with the overall topic, but the recent post merged into this thread specifically addressed sentience)...
by Trebla
Wed Apr 16, 2014 12:33 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Cultural Appropriation / Assimilation
Replies: 501
Views: 79757

Re: Cultural Appropriation / Assimilation

Imagine you live in a country where black people have to pay double fare to sit down on a bus. Even if seats are free they must not sit down unless they pay double. White people may sit or stand as they please and pay only single fare - there is no mechanism for the white people to pay the extra fa...
by Trebla
Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:54 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: What do you mean by consciousness?

The view is anthropocentric because the concept is. I would love to talk to a whale about the issue. This quote is the start of my reentry into this thread A whale or a dog can feel, perceive and express preferences even if they're incapable of discussing it with you. (At least, the way they behave...
by Trebla
Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:43 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: What do you mean by consciousness?

What's a complex language It is what we have, versus what we know of say a, dogs barks, or a songbirds melody, or a whales song. That doesn't mean that they aren't complex. But their complexity is different because they have lesser capacity. That's a very anthropocentric (and ultimately circular) v...
by Trebla
Tue Apr 15, 2014 11:10 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: What do you mean by consciousness?

What's a complex language? Do ants have a complex language in their ability to give precise instructions toward food and away from danger? Do humans even have complex language? Saying "hay bales" and describing what you experience doesn't really convey much... when compared to the ability ...
by Trebla
Mon Apr 14, 2014 7:23 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: What do you mean by consciousness?

While I respect your line of reasoning, this defines consciousness as untestable and maybe even unfalsifiable. Yes, it does. It means we have to be more careful in forming the question; for starters, by adding an "as opposed to what ?" to the end. If the question is "as opposed to a ...
by Trebla
Mon Apr 14, 2014 5:49 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: What do you mean by consciousness?

The brain scans can tell us how this response is occurring, but that doesn't, in itself, tell us whether consciousness is involved. For that, you need to compare the test subject with the first person. And only the first person knows. While I respect your line of reasoning, this defines consciousne...
by Trebla
Tue Apr 08, 2014 12:02 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: The blurred line of sentience

But what if our behaviour IS possible to perfectly predict and it's just that WE aren't able to do so? Then we wouldn't meet that heuristic for determining sentience (not even considering sapience). If all of our actions are reduced to predictable stimulus-response, I don't see how we could be said...
by Trebla
Mon Apr 07, 2014 6:35 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: What do you mean by consciousness?
Replies: 253
Views: 59464

Re: The blurred line of sentience

Note: This was a new thread until Az merged it, so it was not written as if it were a reply to a thread. Sentience... It is a really incredible thing. It has been given to us very early, and it is incredible how it developped over time. Our mind is quite complex now, but was it always like that? No...
by Trebla
Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:53 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Flight from Malaysia disappeared
Replies: 181
Views: 48374

Re: Flight from Malaysia disappeared

Of course the 'in control' part of driving is largely an illusion, there are so many circumstances that you have no control over. It is also not really rational to value being in control over safety, but yeah, that is how instinct works. It will be interesting to see how this will affect the adopti...

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