Interesting HTML commands

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Rasputin
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Interesting HTML commands

Postby Rasputin » Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:00 pm UTC

I play around with HTML a lot, and yesterday I got familiarized with FRAMESET (and FRAME), UL (creates an indented list of sorts), and LI (creates a bullet). FRAMESET is VERY helpful when making a web page (I had been doing it the hard way using IFRAME or no frames at all).

What other nifty codes or tricks are out there for HTML that you have used?
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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby @trophy » Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:09 pm UTC

I hold in my hand two pills:

If you take the blue pill, you wake up in your bed, believe whatever you want to believe.

If you take The Misogyny Kool-Aid, I'll show you around w3schools.com and you'll learn about CSS.

(I'm envisioning a fight scene between you and an unruly div: "Stop trying to position me and position me!")

You will do all sorts of neat things with stylesheets in Firefox, and then you'll feel so proud of yourself that you'll show it off to some asshole who will open it in IE, and then it will all come crashing down. Three days of cursing Microsoft later, you will have turned your beautiful code into a sea of hacks, that will do *almost* what you originally wanted it to, and *almost* act the same between FF and IE.
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zigdon
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Postby zigdon » Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:18 pm UTC

Be wary of frames - there are few cases where you should want to use them. More often than not, your site would be much easier to use if you avoid frames.

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Postby Cosmologicon » Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:28 pm UTC

I like the tags that nobody ever uses, the ancient ones, from when HTML was primarily for technical computer documents. I'm talking about KBD, CITE, DFN, SAMP, INS, and VAR.

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Postby EvanED » Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:39 pm UTC

I like some of the recent table stuff, like THEAD, TBODY, and TFOOT (I think that's what they are called).

I also really like LABEL. People really ought to start using that more, especially for checkboxes and radio buttons. (If you make a label, you can click on the text rather than just the little circle to select that option.)

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Rasputin
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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby Rasputin » Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:04 pm UTC

@trophy wrote:I hold in my hand two pills:

If you take the blue pill, you wake up in your bed, believe whatever you want to believe.

If you take The Misogyny Kool-Aid, I'll show you around w3schools.com and you'll learn about CSS.

(I'm envisioning a fight scene between you and an unruly div: "Stop trying to position me and position me!")

You will do all sorts of neat things with stylesheets in Firefox, and then you'll feel so proud of yourself that you'll show it off to some asshole who will open it in IE, and then it will all come crashing down. Three days of cursing Microsoft later, you will have turned your beautiful code into a sea of hacks, that will do *almost* what you originally wanted it to, and *almost* act the same between FF and IE.


I love CSS, but HTML is going to be better going over browsers, as you have already pointed out. CSS is more for those who learned to code C++ and other things before web sites. I learned to code web sites first. HTML is also very easy and more people understand it so they can change the code once I stop running a site.

I also never use DIV because I did not start out with it. However, it would be useful to pick up and perhaps replace some of my old code.

I say all of this because I have redesigned a web site for my American Meteorological Society (AMS) club (weather nerds' club), and I am totally revamping the site with new graphics, layout, and color scheme... basically a brand-new site. I'll probably run it for 2-3 years (depending on whether I go to grad. school here or not), then I'll have to pass it on to the next in line. This is why I'm trying to keep all my code simple and easy-to-read.

Old AMS Page: http://www.atmos.albany.edu/AMS/
- Old style will soon be replaced with the new one, but I will keep the old one up under /oldsite/
My New Page: http://www.atmos.albany.edu/AMS/newsite/

EDIT:
New link for the new page
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recurve boy
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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby recurve boy » Sat Sep 15, 2007 12:50 am UTC

Rasputin wrote:I love CSS, but HTML is going to be better going over browsers, as you have already pointed out. CSS is more for those who learned to code C++ and other things before web sites. I learned to code web sites first. HTML is also very easy and more people understand it so they can change the code once I stop running a site.


So don't target really old browsers. All browsers support CSS pretty well these days. C++ was not designed for people who learned to code. It was designed to separate the presentation of a page, from the content of the page.

I also never use DIV because I did not start out with it. However, it would be useful to pick up and perhaps replace some of my old code.


Not really a good reason to not use current (and better) techniques.

If the website is fairly small and you don't expect a lot of updates, frames are OK. Else you probably want to try something else. Perhaps a blogging framework or something?

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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby Rasputin » Sat Sep 15, 2007 4:50 am UTC

recurve boy wrote:
Rasputin wrote:I love CSS, but HTML is going to be better going over browsers, as you have already pointed out. CSS is more for those who learned to code C++ and other things before web sites. I learned to code web sites first. HTML is also very easy and more people understand it so they can change the code once I stop running a site.


So don't target really old browsers. All browsers support CSS pretty well these days. C++ was not designed for people who learned to code. It was designed to separate the presentation of a page, from the content of the page.

I also never use DIV because I did not start out with it. However, it would be useful to pick up and perhaps replace some of my old code.


Not really a good reason to not use current (and better) techniques.

If the website is fairly small and you don't expect a lot of updates, frames are OK. Else you probably want to try something else. Perhaps a blogging framework or something?


Yeah, now describe to me how you program that. Exactly. Don't need no .php :)
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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby recurve boy » Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:43 pm UTC

Rasputin wrote:Yeah, now describe to me how you program that. Exactly. Don't need no .php :)


you don't. you look for some framework or some such, and just modify pages to your needs. Like blogger for example. It's built so that a user need only provide content and design. I'm sure something like that will exist for people who want to host on their own server.

edit: hah easy: http://www.typosphere.org/ and it's done in ruby which is an interesting language to learn.

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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby hotaru » Sat Sep 15, 2007 11:54 pm UTC

recurve boy wrote:edit: hah easy: http://www.typosphere.org/ and it's done in ruby which is an interesting language to learn.

too bad ruby on rails is...

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Postby Peshmerga » Sun Sep 16, 2007 12:21 am UTC

Frames?

This

is

PROPER WEB DEVELOPMENT!!!!!
i hurd u liek mudkips???

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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby Rasputin » Sun Sep 16, 2007 4:20 am UTC

recurve boy wrote:
Rasputin wrote:Yeah, now describe to me how you program that. Exactly. Don't need no .php :)


you don't. you look for some framework or some such, and just modify pages to your needs. Like blogger for example. It's built so that a user need only provide content and design. I'm sure something like that will exist for people who want to host on their own server.

edit: hah easy: http://www.typosphere.org/ and it's done in ruby which is an interesting language to learn.

I've got a blogger, too. It's useful, but I don't see the practicality of using it for the frame site. That site I did is just like 6 different pages, so I didn't consider putting a blogger in.

Why so much hate on the frames?
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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby EvanED » Sun Sep 16, 2007 4:43 am UTC

Rasputin wrote:Why so much hate on the frames?


They may break bookmarking (they are broken in Firefox 3 alpha, but not in IE 7), they do break linking unless you put in a fair amount of effort to not have it break, they make it easy to forget to put a target attribute for external links, so they break outgoing links, and they are generally obnoxious for most things.

This topic has come up before.

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Postby ubergeek42 » Sun Sep 16, 2007 5:02 am UTC

Because frames don't do history properly?
Because they make more requests to the server then necessary?(Most browsers cache .css files as well, so you save bandwith)

More reasons I can't think of because it's too late, but in general frames are made of fail.

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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby recurve boy » Sun Sep 16, 2007 7:32 am UTC

Rasputin wrote:I've got a blogger, too. It's useful, but I don't see the practicality of using it for the frame site. That site I did is just likeges, so I didn't consider putting a blogger in.

Why so much hate on the frames?


Generally, bloggers are s content management system. So it provides a simple way to easily update content without having to mess with the html. And looking at your site, that us what you want.

If it's going to be small, frames may be ok. But I'm just saying. There are some pretty easy ways to get around them.

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Postby mrkite » Sun Sep 16, 2007 7:57 am UTC

I really like the fieldset tag

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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby e946 » Sun Sep 16, 2007 2:02 pm UTC

Rasputin wrote:
recurve boy wrote:something about a blogging framework


Yeah, now describe to me how you program that. Exactly. Don't need no .php :)


Python + django.

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Rasputin
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Re: Interesting HTML commands

Postby Rasputin » Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:46 pm UTC

recurve boy wrote:
Rasputin wrote:I've got a blogger, too. It's useful, but I don't see the practicality of using it for the frame site. That site I did is just likeges, so I didn't consider putting a blogger in.

Why so much hate on the frames?


Generally, bloggers are s content management system. So it provides a simple way to easily update content without having to mess with the html. And looking at your site, that us what you want.

If it's going to be small, frames may be ok. But I'm just saying. There are some pretty easy ways to get around them.

I'll look into alternatives at some other date. As of right now, my site is running fine (and everything works properly on it), and I have classwork to do. Hopefully between semesters I can throw some alternative code up there.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions, I'll keep them in mind for my next project.
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