The Forum Games Discussion Thread - Farming RPG Coming Soon

For all your silly time-killing forum games.

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faubiguy
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby faubiguy » Fri Dec 20, 2013 2:38 am UTC

dudiobugtron wrote:So perhaps the relevant factor for deciding whether or not you need to qualify a factette should be how noteworthy the particular universe it is true in is.


Of course, there might exist a universe which is noteworthy, but the universe it exists in is not itself noteworthy. And it is even possible for that not noteworthy universe to not be noteworthy in our universe, but to be noteworthy in another universe which is in turn noteworthy in the first, despite none of them being noteworthy in our universe, creating a recursive cycle of noteworthiness.

So obviously there are other factors in determining the noteworthiness of a universe (and by extension the factette-ness of a factettes that are true in the context of that universe) besides being subjective.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Wed Dec 25, 2013 10:37 am UTC

I don't think the noteworthiness of an universe is relevant to decide if something is a factette or not.

For instance, in dudiobugtron's example, the one million factettes thread doesn't even exist in Adam H's hypothetical universe, even if an identical copy of it appeared in it. Thus, it would be fine for him to post the "Vytron hasn't posted in this thread" factette in the thread of his fantasy in where I didn't post, or in the thread in his fantasy where I posted but that is still a factette, but not on the thread in reality where there's not a factette.

Otherwise, the word "this" in that sentence requires a redefinition as it wouldn't be referring to that thread so much as referring to that thread's version in Adam H's fantasy.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby dudiobugtron » Fri Dec 27, 2013 7:26 pm UTC

From 'turn forum games into xkcd comics':
Vytron wrote:Heh, all forum games need some brief version like that! a log!/


viewtopic.php?f=20&t=102073
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Sun Dec 29, 2013 7:35 am UTC

Oh, nice!

Curiously, I don't have a use for this. It's one of those "Hey, it would be cool if this could be done. ... Cool! This can be done!" sort of thing.

Like, a viewer of phpBB forums that strips a thread from all fancy stuff and just shows the messages in abridged format. Yup, would love to see it, would probably only use it once XD
Go! Go! You can do it username5243!
Cheers Marsh'n!

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Djehutynakht » Sun Jan 05, 2014 7:44 am UTC

Country-Creation game:

Hello, my friends. On this forum threads dealing with the creation, control and conquest of regimes, governments, organizations and empires, frankly, find themselves with a little bit of issue staying maintained. I miss these games, and I enjoy them. So I'm looking for some feedback in rising a new one to life. Some feedback on the following questions below (along with whatever other comments you feel to add) would help in me finding a direction a lot of people would be willing to play:

For multiple choice questions, feel free to pick more than one option/rank by preference/etc. This is just kind of informal:

1. First, would you be interested?
-Yes
-No

2. What style do you prefer?
-Everyone starts off with their own country/group
-Everyone starts off as an individual/small party within a country
-Everyone starts off as an individual/small party within the same country (playing off each other for power but cooperating to run the place)

3. Age/Technology levels?
-Ancient - Magic/Fantastical
-Ancient - No Magic/Realistic
-Medieval/Renaissance - Magic/Fantastical
-Medieval/Renaissance - No Magic/Realistic
-Early Modern (1800s-WWII)
-Modern (Cold War-Present)
-Futuristic (Sci fi maybe? Possible space)

4. Location?
-Real World (Earth/Possible space in future)
-Fantasy World (Pre-created map)
-Fantasy World (Create-your-own)
-Fantasy World (Use that collaborative map we've been making around here)

5. Style?
-Concrete achievement oriented (such as points)
-General Achievement Oriented (such as general ideas/government positions/accomplishments made/etc.)
-Storyline oriented
-Mixed style

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Adam H
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Mon Jan 06, 2014 2:25 pm UTC

1. no. ;)

But I have weird taste in forum games! :)
-Adam

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Diemo
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Diemo » Mon Jan 06, 2014 5:29 pm UTC

Oooo, pick me, pick me :lol:
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby orangedragonfire » Mon Jan 06, 2014 5:48 pm UTC

1. First, would you be interested?
-Yes

2. What style do you prefer?
-Everyone starts off with their own country/group
-Everyone starts off as an individual/small party within a country

3. Age/Technology levels?
-Medieval/Renaissance - Magic/Fantastical
-Futuristic (Sci fi maybe? Possible space)

4. Location?
-Fantasy World (Pre-created map)
-Fantasy World (Create-your-own)
-Fantasy World (Use that collaborative map we've been making around here)

5. Style?
-Storyline oriented
-Mixed style

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patzer
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby patzer » Mon Jan 06, 2014 9:22 pm UTC

I'd like to be mapmaker in any sort of game if possible, but am not very interested in actually playing.
If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small aquatic bird of the family Anatidae on our hands. –Douglas Adams

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Diemo » Tue Jan 07, 2014 1:16 pm UTC

Im looking for a replacement for diplomacy.
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby orangedragonfire » Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:47 pm UTC

Does anybody know whether there currently is an active version of the Science Game or of Challenge Your Assumptions? I sort of lost track of those during the holidays :P

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Tue Jan 14, 2014 3:23 am UTC

Nope, the only active games (real games, not toys like count to a million) are Defend the Quarry - Silver into Stone, Diplomacy and Intergalactic Sports Gambling and Kingdom Control 2.0, the rest are pretty much dead.

Oh, you mean one that hasn't finished yet...
Go! Go! You can do it username5243!
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Diemo » Tue Jan 14, 2014 4:29 pm UTC

On the other hand, if you are looking for an intro to diplomacy, there is an opening in the game at the moment. . .
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This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
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Adam H
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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Tue Jan 14, 2014 4:40 pm UTC

Also fantasy animal haggle is in signups.
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Wed Feb 05, 2014 8:56 pm UTC

So... anyone want to play a game or something?
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby orangedragonfire » Wed Feb 05, 2014 9:07 pm UTC

Sure. What did you have in mind?

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Wed Feb 05, 2014 9:25 pm UTC

Dunno. ;)
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Wed Feb 05, 2014 9:43 pm UTC

Battleships.

I'm really good at Battleships.

Yeah, that's what I tend to think of games until I play people that are actually good at them, but, after connecting to OMGPOP to win 10 times in a row I really need some good competition.

The idea would be:

MULTIPLAYER BATTLESHIPS!

The never before seen edition that goes like:

Player A tries to sink the ships of Player B
Player B tries to sink the ships of Player C
Player C tries to sink the ships of Player D
Player D tries to sink the ships of Player A

Once C is eliminated, B continues with its job to sink D, and so on, until only two players remain trying to sink each other.

The game also would feature items that players hide themselves on their map, which is the cross powerup, the vertical line power up, the horizontal line power up, the one shot against the maps of all players, and the dotdotdot (either vertically or horizontally shooting 3 on-off-on-off-on bullets.)

How does this sound? Battleships is a great game of strategy where ship placement and covering the opponent's field as efficiently as possible is everything.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby patzer » Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:08 pm UTC

I haven't played Battleships for years, but it's a good game. I'll play.
If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small aquatic bird of the family Anatidae on our hands. –Douglas Adams

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Nylonathatep » Thu Feb 06, 2014 2:29 am UTC

Just wondering if anyone is up for D&D 3.5 game Free-style RP, play by post style?

Need Min of 4 players + me as GM.

To add some structure to gameplay we'll have character declare actions and roll a d20 on an online dice roller to determine how successful their action is. (Not sure if I want the critical failure/success ruling: If you rolled a 20 you automatically successful and something else that's good happens, if you rolled a 1 you automatically fails and something really bad happens.)

I imagine Character creation would be the most complex part, but everything is a go in regards do what you envision your character to be line and what they can do.

The player's characters in this game have already met and familarized with each other, in fact, they are a reputable adventuring party that just finished a successful advanture and travelling thru a metropolis. (Hint: While I won't outright disallow Player vs Player hostility or allow a player's action to intentionally harm another player, I try to discourage it, at least without creditable reasons.)

I'm still debating whether we should have base stats for player characters.

The game will take place in a Fantasy medieval setting on just starting industrial revolution.

Online Dice Roller:
http://www.brockjones.com/dieroller/dice.htm
Last edited by Nylonathatep on Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:08 pm UTC, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby orangedragonfire » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:51 am UTC

I definitely wouldn't mind a play-by-post RPG, but I've never played D&D.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Thu Feb 06, 2014 3:43 pm UTC

I'd try D&D if it's OK that I'm a newbie who won't read more than a couple pages of rules. That is, I'll roleplay and someone else tells me how to phrase my actions. Unless it's less complicated than I think it is.
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Fri Feb 07, 2014 3:47 pm UTC

Nylonathatep wrote:Just wondering if anyone is up for D&D 3.5 game Free-style RP, play by post style?

Need Min of 4 players + me as GM.

To add some structure to gameplay we'll have character declare actions and roll a d20 on an online dice roller to determine how successful their action is. (Not sure if I want the critical failure/success ruling: If you rolled a 20 you automatically successful and something else that's good happens, if you rolled a 1 you automatically fails and something really bad happens.)

I imagine Character creation would be the most complex part, but everything is a go in regards do what you envision your character to be line and what they can do.

The player's characters in this game have already met and familarized with each other, in fact, they are a reputable adventuring party that just finished a successful advanture and travelling thru a metropolis. (Hint: While I won't outright disallow Player vs Player hostility or allow a player's action to intentionally harm another player, I try to discourage it, at least without creditable reasons.)

I'm still debating whether we should have base stats for player characters.

The game will take place in a Fantasy medieval setting on just starting industrial revolution.

Online Dice Roller:
http://www.brockjones.com/dieroller/dice.htm

I think you ninja-edited my last post because I don't remember reading this! :P

Anyways yeah I'm definitely up for this.

I think one thing that bogged down the last two RPGs that I remember was that everyone split up and did their own thing. At least for me, it kind of made me lose interest in my sub-plot. So it sounds like this one could do well.

Also, there needs to be a plan for when a player flakes out. Games are always dying because they aren't set up to handle quitters. And I don't blame the quitters; stuff happens and forum games should not be a high priority for anyone. ;)
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:06 pm UTC

I'd really like to mod a Baseball-themed game on the forum. Strangely, I have never watched a Baseball match, and recall it was a bore trying to watch one. But the rules of the game and its events, I love, so I was wondering if we could have a forum version.

The most important thing on the game would be the mechanics, here, I'm thinking players set up their teams, and afterwards, it all becomes a series of pitcher vs. batter battles.

Players would pick simultaneously, a number from 1 to 6, and those numbers would be added. If they're even, what happens is decided by looking up the pitcher's card (which would contain more strikeouts and fouls). If they're odd, what happens is decided by looking up the batter's card (which would have more hits and home runs.)

That would be the baseline of the game, does it sound fun? Because, several things could be added on top of it:

Since players could learn fast what numbers work better against a certain pitcher, the pitcher could have 6 pools from where to draw from, so the player picks 2 numbers from 1 to six for the result. These pools would be replaced by back-up pools in order, all on the player's card, and so, the batter player wouldn't see what numbers were sent by the pitcher until game over.

The batters could also have two pools of their own, say, an aggressive pool with more risk/reward radio, and another one for when you just need a hit to score a run but want safe play or something.

I was thinking to allow a player to send 12 names of characters (say, fictional characters, historical persons, or made up names with appearances), then, I generate player cards for all of them, which includes all their data as players and pitchers. Players would then pick 9 of those characters for the game, and choose their battling order, which would be able to be changed later in the game.

The set up part and how to use the players would then be important, and flavor-wise we could see what would happen with pitcher-Darth Vader against batter-Spider man in a game, or something :)

I don't know how much complexity would need to be added to the game. Remember, no matter how much complexity the game has, the players are still sending numbers from 1-6 to play the game, so I think this allows for some detail to be added. Players could have specific abilities that are triggered in certain circumstances, like stealing bases. After a hit, the ball could go to some zone of the field, and a new battle could be had against the fielder to see if they grab it or it drops to the floor, etc.

But first I'd need to see if there would be interest in this, if there's enough interest, a 4 player variant where a team of 2 players fights another, alternating their characters could be arranged. Still don't think it's possible for me to mod and play since someone has to make the player cards and there's information to be hidden, but would be looking forward to see how such a game would be like.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:05 pm UTC

Oooo sounds fun. I can't say I understand the rules (see below), but count me in!

Rules:
Spoiler:
It kind of sounds like a "player's card" consists of 6 outcomes like this:

Pitcher:
1 - Double
2 - Single
3 - Ball
4 - Foul
5 - Strike
6 - Fly Out

Hitter:
1 - Foul
2 - Ball
3 - Single
4 - Double
5 - Triple
6 - Homerun

So the pitcher submits a 4 and the hitter submits a 3 then the hitter wins (total is odd) and the result is a single.

I think what you had in mind is that the player cards are secret and the results on the player's cards don't correlate with how high the number is (e.g. 1 - strike, 2 - homerun, 3 - ball, 4 - fly out, etc). I think this would just result in a lot of random actions, but I think it would be interesting after the hitting player gets a feel for the pitcher's player's card, for example.

I can think of a twerk that would make the game more simple but less dependent on Rock/Paper/Scissors type luck: instead of even or odd, the pitcher wins if the total is less than 7 and the hitter wins if the total is greater than 7 (or vice versa, doesn't matter). For example:
Pitcher:
1 - Ball
2 - Foul
3 - Strike
4 - Fly Out
5 - Double Play
6 - Triple Play

Hitter:
1 - Homerun
2 - Triple
3 - Double
4 - Single
5 - Ball
6 - Foul

With the above, if the total of the two submissions is greater than 7 then the hitter wins and the result is whatever the hitter submitted. If the total less than 7, the pitcher wins and the result is whatever the pitcher submitted. (Maybe if the result is 7 then there's a coin flip to decide). Then I think the strategy becomes interesting. Perhaps the hitter will consistently pick 4 or 5 and the pitcher consistently picks 2 or 3, but they both have incentive to throw in extreme numbers as long as they don't get too predictable.

The problem with that is that you can't really customize those player's cards. A small twerk would result in one player being heavily favored with an easy optimal strategy.
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:03 pm UTC

Thanks for the feedback! Yeah, the idea was sort of like this (for a given pitcher/batter pool):
Spoiler:
Pitcher:
2 - Homerun
4 - Single
6 - Ball
8 - Foul
10 - Strike
12 - Fly Out

Hitter:
3 - Ball
5 - Single
7 - Double
9 - Triple
11 - Homerun

Okay, so here, if the pitcher sends a 1, the the results of the Hitter when they send a number are:

1- Homerun
2- Ball
3- Single
4- Single
5- Ball
6- Double

I.e. both numbers are summed, and they bring a result.

Anyway, the whole point of all this is getting rid of things like dice rolls and making players strategize depending on the reads that they have against the opponent players, this should be doable as there are 9 innings on the game so there'd be a lot of battling.

However, I don't mind at all the twerk of hitter/pitcher winning based on being higher/lower than 7. Since on Baseball there are dominant pitchers that strikeout their competition and there are long streaks of no runs happening, I'd give the edge to the pitcher by making the 7 give the victory to the pitcher.

Let's take a look at how that would look like:

Pitcher:
2 - Foul
3 - Strike
4 - Fly Out
5 - Double Play
6 - Homerun
7 - Triple Play

Hitter:
8 - Homerun
9 - Double
10 - Single
11 - Ball
12 - Triple

How does this look like? The idea here is to make the pitcher want to avoid the 7 result because it's very close to the Homeruns, I hope in the end we can have mechanics as engaging as Boxing Chess that wasn't Rock-Paper-Scissors at all and highly strategical.

I think this still allows for customized player cards as long as they're well balanced? Say, one could apply numbers to the Pitcher's card like Double Play=4, Triple Play=5, and lower this number until the Pitcher doesn't have any more points to spend on good stuff, so the rest of his numbers are filled with homeruns.

Say, there could be a pitcher like this:

2 - Single
3 - Strike
4 - Strike
5 - Strike
6 - Strike
7 - Single

And another like this:

2 - Homerun
3 - Triple Play
4 - Triple Play
5 - Triple Play
6 - Homerun
7 - Homerun

But since the player got 12 different pitchers they can choose which strategy they want to use.

Anyway, once we agree to something we could probably play a practice game to see how things work out :)

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:02 pm UTC

The first setup you have is much better than anything in my post! :D If you're up against an opponent who is picking completely at random, then as pitcher you should pick even numbers and as hitter you should pick odd numbers. And picking high numbers increases the variance, so that's another layer of strategy.

More stuff
Spoiler:
I do think in general you would need to skew the results more towards the pitcher than what you have. A lot of the pitches should be strikes or fouls. As you have it a hitter can pick 3 every time and win (the worst that can happen is to hit fouls ad nauseum). And since as above the pitcher should pick even and hitter should pick odd, the totals should be odd more often than not, which favors the hitter even more. I realize this was just an example and you weren't trying to balance it. :)

Here are some other possible results for a pitch I can think of:
Strike / runner advances: strike, if another player is on first or second base then they advance one base, if able.
Out / runners advance: out, if other players are on first, second, or third base (and this was not the third out) then they all advance one base. (e.g. sacrificial bunt)

I think it's worth putting those in because it changes the strategy slightly depending on whether runners are on base.

Haven't really figured out the strategy for the second one you posted. It seems a lot more random.

Also, in real baseball they don't often sub out the pitcher, and when they do the pitcher can't come back in the game. That might add an interesting dynamic.
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:55 pm UTC

Spoiler:
Adam H wrote:I do think in general you would need to skew the results more towards the pitcher than what you have.


Oh, it's because I didn't plan to have strikes, per se, and balls, or fouls, at all, just strikeouts (you hit those, you're out) and runs. Probably wanting to keep those things simple and focus the details on something else, for instance:

Groundball Out - [If no runners: Batter out][If runner on first: Both out][If Runner on second: Batter Out - Runner goes to third][If Runner on third: Batter out - Runner scores][Runners on 1st and 2nd: Batter out - runners move to 2nd and 3rd][Runners on 1st and 3rd: Batter out - runners move to 2nd and home][Runners on 2nd and 3rd: Batter out - runners move to 3rd and home][Bases loaded: Batter out - 3rd to home, 2nd to 3rd, 1st to 2nd]

Groundball In - [If no runners: Batter out][If runner on first: First moves to 2nd, batter safe at 1st][If Runner on second: Batter Out - Runner holds at 2nd][If Runner on third: Batter out - Runner holds at 3rd][Runners on 1st and 2nd: Batter safe at first, runners move to 2nd and 3rd][Runners on 1st and 3rd: Batter safe at first - runner at 1st is out, runner at 3rd scores][Runners on 2nd and 3rd: Batter out - runner holds at 2nd, runner at 3rd scores][Bases loaded: 3rd to home, 2nd to 3rd, 1st to 2nd, Batter safe at first]

Tricky Groundball: [If no runners: Batter safe at first][If runner on first: player at first out, batter safe at first][If Runner on second: Player at second out, batter safe at first][If Runner on third: Player at third out, batter safe at first][Runners on 1st and 2nd: Batter safe at first, player at 2nd out, runner moves to 3rd][Runners on 1st and 3rd: Batter safe at first - runner at 3rd is out, runner moves to 2nd][Runners on 2nd and 3rd: Batter safe at first, runners move to 3rd and home][Bases loaded: player at 3rd is out, 2nd to 3rd, 1st to 2nd, Batter safe at first]

Because in the end it doesn't matter if a base was because of a hit or because of balls, or if an out was because 3 strikes or 2 strikes and one foul, it's more interesting to see how the players moved.

This would allow players to pick numbers depending on the situation and have hits and scores while players are getting outs.

Adam H wrote:As you have it a hitter can pick 3 every time and win (the worst that can happen is to hit fouls ad nauseum).


Yeah, but I think that no matter what method ends being implemented, there will always be some dominant strategy so you'll end using 1 number or another most of the time, with the other 4 options never happening, because, really, it's pointless to attempt to home run if you can just maximize your hitting chances in some manner.

That's why I think pools to choose from (a batter can bat in two ways, it takes time to figure out what to do against a pitcher) and secret setups is the way to go. Lest the game becomes stale as we keep sending mostly the same actions over and over.

Adam H wrote: And since as above the pitcher should pick even and hitter should pick odd, the totals should be odd more often than not, which favors the hitter even more. I realize this was just an example and you weren't trying to balance it. :)


Heh, I wonder if I have it the wrong way around, and it should be even favors batter and odd favors pitcher? Making it so pitcher has to pick odd and odd favors the pitcher could balance for this.

Adam H wrote: Strike / runner advances: strike, if another player is on first or second base then they advance one base, if able.
Out / runners advance: out, if other players are on first, second, or third base (and this was not the third out) then they all advance one base. (e.g. sacrificial bunt)


Yes! In my mind the game would be able to emulate all those kind of things that could happen on a game, that's why I think having zones, and having different batters batting to different zones could be very fun. I.e. guy from 3rd moving home wouldn't depend on a [if hitter and pitcher give some numbers and there's a runner on third] but be more like [if batter hits the ball to zone 4/5 and fielder doesn't grab it].

Adam H wrote: I think it's worth putting those in because it changes the strategy slightly depending on whether runners are on base.


Yes, would like the strategy to change completely depending on how are the bases filled, and how many outs are there, this should be more than the same battle between pitcher and batter over and over.

Adam H wrote:Also, in real baseball they don't often sub out the pitcher, and when they do the pitcher can't come back in the game. That might add an interesting dynamic.


Maybe something like you can't change a pitcher until after the fourth/seventh inning is about to start, so the order of pitchers that you pick is also important (maybe you'll save your best pitcher for the last three innings - this all requires custom players).

Anyway, thanks again, designing a game is like a game itself :)

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:11 pm UTC

Baseball:
Spoiler:
Vytron wrote:Oh, it's because I didn't plan to have strikes, per se, and balls, or fouls, at all, just strikeouts (you hit those, you're out) and runs. Probably wanting to keep those things simple and focus the details on something else, for instance:
...
Because in the end it doesn't matter if a base was because of a hit or because of balls, or if an out was because 3 strikes or 2 strikes and one foul, it's more interesting to see how the players moved.

This would allow players to pick numbers depending on the situation and have hits and scores while players are getting outs.
Sounds good. Yeah, picking a number for every pitch would take forever...

I like the complicated groundballs, but to be honest it doesn't seem worth it to read/understand the differences between the different ground balls, let alone to use the differences to affect your strategy. But if it will help create new and different game situations, then I can see the value.

Vytron wrote:
Adam H wrote:As you have it a hitter can pick 3 every time and win (the worst that can happen is to hit fouls ad nauseum).


Yeah, but I think that no matter what method ends being implemented, there will always be some dominant strategy so you'll end using 1 number or another most of the time, with the other 4 options never happening, because, really, it's pointless to attempt to home run if you can just maximize your hitting chances in some manner.
I dunno, as long as you can counter the other player's number then there's no dominant strategy, and you can always counter the other player's number with the even/odd method. That's why I like it so much!

Vytron wrote:
Adam H wrote: And since as above the pitcher should pick even and hitter should pick odd, the totals should be odd more often than not, which favors the hitter even more. I realize this was just an example and you weren't trying to balance it. :)


Heh, I wonder if I have it the wrong way around, and it should be even favors batter and odd favors pitcher? Making it so pitcher has to pick odd and odd favors the pitcher could balance for this.
I don't think it makes a big difference. The pitcher has 6 outcomes and the hitter has 5, so I think it all evens out.

Vytron wrote:Anyway, thanks again, designing a game is like a game itself :)
Yeah so fun! :D

To create the player cards, you could do this: first assign all the possible outcomes with point values...

Hitter:
10 - Homerun
9 - Triple
7 - Double (runners advance 2 bases)
6 - Single (runners advance 2 bases)
5 - Single (runners advance 1 base)
4 - Walk
3 - Single (runners don't advance, if they are forced then they are out)
1 - Fly Out (runners advance 1 base)
0 - Strikeout

Pitcher:
10 - Triple Play
9 - Double Play
7 - Strikeout
4 - Fly Out (runners advance 1 base)
3 - Fly Out With Error (runners advance 2 bases)
1 - Stolen Base (one runner on first or second advances)
0 - Walk

Then let players assign the outcomes how they want, with the following rules:
1) The total points on a card must be less than ~25
2) The total combined points on all the hitters on the team must be less than ~125 (to force some players to have less than 25); same with pitchers, perhaps.
3) For hitters, the outcomes must not decrease in value from 3 to 5 to 7 to 9 to 11. Similar for pitchers, except they can make 2 anything (so the values must not decrease from 4 to 6 to 8 to 10 to 12).

Or players can just tell the mod the general sort of personality they want, and the mod creates the nitty gritty details for them.

Examples:

Speedy hitter with small strike zone:
3: Walk, 5: Walk, 7: Walk, 9: Walk, 11: Triple

Slugger:
3: Strikeout, 5: Fly Out, 7: Walk, 9: Triple, 11: Homerun

Typical pitcher:
2 - Strikeout, 4 - Walk, 6 - Fly Out With Error, 8 - Fly Out, 10 - Strikeout, 12 - Strikeout

Careless pitcher:
2: Stolen Base, 4: Stolen Base, 6: Stolen Base, 8: Fly Out With Error, 10: Double Play, 12: Triple Play
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Wed Mar 19, 2014 7:10 pm UTC

Baseball:
Spoiler:
Adam H wrote:I like the complicated groundballs, but to be honest it doesn't seem worth it to read/understand the differences between the different ground balls, let alone to use the differences to affect your strategy. But if it will help create new and different game situations, then I can see the value.


Well, it depends on what runners you have on the bases. Seems with no runners it's a better strategy to avoid Groundballs, while they're better with guys in third (as they have a chance to score even when your batter is out), so, yeah, I think it enriches the game.

Adam H wrote:I dunno, as long as you can counter the other player's number then there's no dominant strategy, and you can always counter the other player's number with the even/odd method. That's why I like it so much!


Okay, so I've been convinced secret statuses aren't necessary. The whole strategy of the game is seeing what your opponent can do and then predict what they will do and play what is best against them.

So, this case where the best hitter strategy is to go with a 3 as it ensures winning is fine, but should be just one of the possible scenarios in a batter-pitcher battle among several different possibilities. That's why I hold allowing players to choose from different pools is the way to go. It should be fine and non-random as long as you can see what your opponent can do and predict on the fly.

Adam H wrote:To create the player cards, you could do this: first assign all the possible outcomes with point values...


Okay, I like that. I was thinking about creating a list of players from names sent by them (still looking forward to a Mario vs. Kratos pitcher-hitter battle if those names are sent by players) to create, say, a 24 player pool.

Then, players get to see all the cards and to form their teams, they simultaneously pick one of the cards for their team. If two players pick the same card, this card is banned from play.

The concept with this is that it doesn't really matter how unbalanced the cards are because, say, if there's some broken pitcher that strikeouts very easily and to which it's impossible to home run against, both players can see it, so both pick it, and it's eliminated from play. If there's a great pitcher and a great hitter for grabs, one player picks one and the other the other, or, one of the cards is eliminated.

So, before game starts there's a Player Choosing phase that ensures fair play, or makes it so that if one team is stronger than the other, it was the player's fault for poor card selection. This base will make the game strategical because against random play, you'd pick the best players while a random opponent would pick randomly.

---------

Anyway, yesterday I obsessed over this and went to search for similar games that already exist for Baseball, for inspiration. While I like what we've gotten sorted out so far, it does seem shallow, I wonder if one can add depth to the game by making players do long term plans about what players will be on bases on a future play, so, say, at some point you can force a situation where hitters are guaranteed 3 runs in a row no matter what the pitcher picks, due to poor past decisions, or something.

I seems there are 3 main ways in where players can decide on game events:

1.- Direct: What we're doing currently. This is very easy as you just match the hitter card with the pitcher card and read an outcome. The problem with this is that it makes irrelevant how filled are the bases and the situations with the outs. It also gets rid of all the dynamics about fielders, as, in a normal game, where the ball goes and how good the fielder that was going to catch it is abstracted.

When you are out, you are out, there's no more talking about this, and we don't get to see to where the ball went and who caught it and what happened. We also don't get more complex situations like when a fly ball is caught late, sent to first too late so the batter is safe but the guy that was on first was too slow and is out in his way to second.

2.- Situational: This is like the Groundballs in my example. If there's no runners something happens, but if there's 1 or more, something else happens. This makes sense, as, in a real word, if the bases are loaded you'd rather get out the guy in 3rd trying to score instead of the guy going to first.

The Direct outcomes aren't complex enough and would simplify to "the batter is out, or the batter is out but guy on 3rd stole base to score or batter and third is out or batter is safe and third scores", but in the guy on first and third bases the Direct outcome wouldn't allow for things like "batter is out but 3rd scored and 1 moved to second" or "Batter is out but guy on 2nd stole a base" or "batter safe at first, 1st to second, 3rd player holds" even though in a real game the third player would hold if they see moving would just get them out.

Situational outcomes would just have several charts, one for each configuration of runners on bases, to be looked up, so any number of different outcomes can be coded into those charts. This becomes a Direct combat where the pitcher and batter have different actions depending on who are on the bases, so, instead of "fly out", the pitcher would have in there, say "Situation 9". Then, Situation 9 would be different depending on how the bases are filled, say, no runners could be "batter gets two bases", while a runner on second would be "batter safe at first, player at second steals 2 bases to score" but bases loaded could be a simple "Out".

This means that situation 9 is good for the pitcher or the batter depending of the situation, unlike with Direct when out is always good for the pitcher and home run is always good for the batter, here it would only be a home run if there's a player in 3rd, but an out otherwise. This is very powerful as anything that can happen in a game can be encoded in the Situations, since those situations are unlimited, while Direct can have "every runner gets a base", Situations could have "guy in 2nd stays in second, guy in 3rd scores and batter is out" which is too complex with direct. Just having to check what chart will be used next before making your decisions would be worth it.

3.- Fielder Choice: This is my favorite one. Here, the power of what happens is given back to the player cards and where you put them in the field. So, besides having events for numbers picked when you are pitcher, and numbers for when you are hitter, it also has numbers for when you are fielder.

In Fielder Choice, every hit goes somewhere, say, Left Field, Center Field or Right Field, then, the guy that catches the ball there gives an outcome depending on the batter-hitter total. Say, 7 could be an out, while 1 could be a home run. It allows also to encode the things from situational here, like "Out but if there's a guy in 2nd (with 3rd free) they steal a base". The catch here is that it gives more flexibility to the pitcher. Currently, all the pitcher wants to do it to out players or increase their double plays, in Fielder Choice you may want to allow the batter to hit to Center Field because the guy there has a very high chance of making a triple play.

It also enriches the players as maybe you want someone because they're awesome hitters that home run on a regular basis, but they suck as pitchers and at ball catching, but if you want them to bat they've got to be on the field somewhere, and the other player knows they want really bad to hit their ball there because that guy will probably not catch it and allow several runs.

It also adds the mechanics for player placement on the field that the other two methods were lacking.

----------------

So, I was thinking to mix all these three with pools to make some sort of trybrid game:

A player card would have 3 sections for batting: The direct one that we have already discussed, the Situational one which will have situations depending on how the bases are loaded, which would make the batter a bit more interesting (maybe they get really nervous and suck with the bases loaded while with no runners they calm down and do triples), and one that sends the ball to different parts of the field to trigger Fielder choice.

In the very first battle of the game, a player can choose from among any of those, but for the rest of the game, any batter can only choose from one of the not used ones. I'd predict that then batters would keep switching between two ones, because the third one favors the pitch, but this allows the pitcher to make better predictions about what the batter will do.

The pitcher section would have 6 pools to choose from at start, with 3 backup pools to replace them. 2 Direct pools (as discussed), 2 Situational pools, and 2 Fielder Choice pools. 1 pool of each type for backup. Then, the player would start using them against the hitters, with the backup pools taking the place of their used ones and wouldn't be able to use already used pools until having used 6 of them. Once they have faced 9 players they must use the pools that have never seen used and then the process starts again. This will allow the pitcher to avoid obvious "just use 3 strategies" while forcing the player to pick from their pools with care, if the pitcher has a pool full of home runs then the player got to know when to risk it out, allowing the dynamics of having to decide when to use your pools (as you know the order of the incoming batters.)

Finally, there would be a fielder section, where outcomes for results would range from 2-11 (depending on batter+pitcher chosen number), in this part it would be obvious to make even results bad for the batter, while odd results would be good for him, but then, a batter would probably pick Fielder Choice half the time because they know if they win against the pitcher they'll beat the fielder too, so a balance has to be put in place.

Anyway, there it is, I know you're against being a feature creep, but I envision the game as one where players are the managers of a team and they have to pick their players, their battling order, their place on the field, and the numbers when batting and pitching very carefully. Less like tic-tac-toe and more like chess. Here, algorithms picking from random pools would suck.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:56 pm UTC

If you build it, I will come. ;)
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Thu Mar 20, 2014 6:19 pm UTC

What? Wow. I was totally expecting you to say that it sounded overly unnecessary complicated to play and that you'd rather play in a more elegant solution that was more fun because of its simplicity even if it required sacrificing a bit of baseball events, then I was going to be all like "well, whoops, you are right, will work on this to make it less convoluted so it doesn't feel like a chore to play!"

But... maybe the idea as it is could work!

I'm thinking to just use a "ramp-up" strategy of game complexity of the game, basically, we'd create an open Practice Game for game design and it would start in its bare bones, i.e. the most simple way to play. We could play an inning and then discuss changes to be made and make the game a bit more complex if necessary, and play another inning. If we like it those changes stay, if the game looks worse then we go back to the basics, etc. This is how I designed games with my sister back when I was a kid, too bad I never wrote the rules of our chess variants :mrgreen:

Tell me if this sounds good so I create the thread!

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Thu Mar 20, 2014 6:42 pm UTC

Sounds fun to me!
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Lawrencelot » Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:07 pm UTC

Hey guys, I wanted to make a thread for this but then I noticed there is a discussion thread already:

Lawrencelot's old forum games
So I've run several forum games, including mafia, in the past few years. Some were successful, some were a failure, but I think all of them are worth reviving should there be enough interest. I would like to revive one of these games, because I like modding games and am out of ideas for new games, and I would like to hear which games sound most interesting to each of you. Please, do not search for these games on the internet (they are out there), because then I can't run them here anymore. If you are 100% sure you don't want to play in a game but you do want to find out more about the already played game, please contact me.

Non-mafia forum games

Clue / Cluedo: the murder mystery boardgame in forumgame format. The idea was nice, but the game failed because players had to wait too long for each other's turns. To make this a succesful forumgame, it would somehow need to be adapted to include simultaneous turns.
Mercatores: a game I made up where each player is a trader in the Roman empire, trading in several resources and building warehouses and offices in different cities and such. The game continued for quite a while and then suddenly died out.
Haggle: I hosted two Haggle games on this forum, you can search for those, and one medieval-themed on a different forum (do not search for that one if you want me to host it).

Mafia games

Grimmmafia: a theme game with the characters from the Grimmm fairy tales. Successful, but I'd use the outcome of the game to balance it more.
R1000 mafia: a theme game with the most influential people from the last 1000 years. I think it was my first theme game, it's nice to have famous characters in a game but it was not heavily themed, so more similar to a normal game.
Super Mario Mafia 1 and 2: a theme game with the characters from the Super Mario videogames. Heavily themed: players can spend coins to buy items like mushrooms, fireflowers and stars, princesses can be kidnapped, etc. In my opinion, these games were very successful, and I would really like to run them again, but it would require some help from co- or backup mods and I would again use the outcome of the games to balance them.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby orangedragonfire » Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:15 pm UTC

Mercatores sounds interesting.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Lawrencelot » Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:04 am UTC

Any more opinions now that everything is readable?

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:08 am UTC

Interested in Clue.

Proposed implementation:

Let the players take 3 turns per post, but the last 2 are secret (say, in spoilers that can't be read by other players). Once a round is over, the mod reveals the other 2 turns of all players. Game can be 3 times as fast or something.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Adam H » Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:22 pm UTC

Mercatores would be my vote.
-Adam

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Lawrencelot » Thu Apr 03, 2014 3:43 pm UTC

The problem with Clue is that you want to base your turns on what other people did before you (since other people's turns give you information as well). That's why simultaneous turns or Vytron's solution change the game too much in my opinion.

Looking back at Mercatores, I think it is very fit for this forum. I will probably start a sign-up thread somewhere next week, but feel free to continue expressing your opinion on any of the games.

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Re: The Forum Games Discussion Thread

Postby Vytron » Thu Apr 17, 2014 1:06 am UTC

Alright, so it turns out I can't control my urges to try to simulate some sport. I was meant do do this until after Horse Racing was over, but AAAAAARRGRHHRGRH, I can't control myself!

Okay, so the idea is to hold a game like Animal Kingdom or Intergalactic Sport Gambling, but where the actual games between the teams can be seen.

So I was thinking about making the teams play Grand Slam, a variation of Baseball in where, instead of an inning happening where a team tries to score, and then changing to give the other team a chance to score, here a change happens at every at-bat. I.e. the current position is saved, the other team bats, that position is saved, and the other team bats, etc. The first team to have a score of 3 at the bottom of a change wins.

The teams would be based on Mythical Creatures, and the players can send suggestions about what creatures to include. Those teams would be open for everyone to see.

Players can also send "a team of their own", they can manage this team, which comes out to selecting a pitcher and batter order, plus having the betting odds of their team double. This means the championship can be won by a player's team.

Each team consists of 9 players, each has three numbers. Every event is decided by matching up the pitcher's card with the first number of the batter's card. These are numbers from 0 to 6. Who wins is determined by the chart:

0 beats: 4, 5 and 6
1 beats: 0, 3 and 5
2 beats: 0, 1 and 6
3 beats: 0, 2 and 4
4 beats: 1, 2 and 5
5 beats: 2, 3 and 6
6 beats: 1, 3 and 4

Note that beating the opponent doesn't mean you get a positive outcome.

Events are decided by who wins.

Batter wins:
Spoiler:
6 - Batter and everyone on bases score
5 - Everyone on bases score, batter to third.
4 - Batter moves to 2nd, everyone else advance two bases.
3 - Batter moves to 1st, everyone else advance 1 base.
2 - Batter moves to first, players forced to move advance 1 base.
1 - If bases are empty, batter is out. Otherwise, player on highest base steals a base and batter tries again. Another batter winning with a 1 becomes a walk.
0 - If there's exactly 2 players on the bases, they advance a base, and batter is out. Otherwise, batter advances 2 bases, and all players forced to move advance a base or two.


Pitcher wins:
Spoiler:
6 - All players on bases are out, and the batter is out.
5 - All players on bases are out, and the batter moves to first.
4 - Batter and the player on highest base are out.
3 - Batter and the player on lowest base are out.
2 - Strikeout
1 - If bases are empty, batter to first. Otherwise, player in lowest base is out and batter tries again. Another pitcher winning with a 1 becomes an out.
0 - If there's exactly one batter on the bases, it moves 2 bases, and batter goes to first. Otherwise, batter is out.


Tie results:
Spoiler:
0-Batter moves to 2nd, if there were players on 1st and/or 2nd, they're out.
1-Batter out, rest of players advance 3 bases
2-Batter out, rest of players advance 2 bases
3-Batter out, rest of players advance 1 base
4-All players on bases are out, batter to second
5-All players on bases are out, batter to third
6-All players on bases are out, batter score


Some numbers are more common than others, so some players should be stronger than others, and thus, some teams stronger than others.

Teams would look like this:

The Empousais
Description: These vampiric demonesses got tired of seducing men. They noticed all of them had one bronze leg and one donkey leg (not shown), so they decided to form a Grand Slam Team.
Spoiler:
Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image


The Kobalois
Description: Already masters of mischief and trickery, these sprites can change their shape at will and frighten children. Apparently, some also like having really long names for some reason.
Spoiler:
Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image


Now, theoretically, you could ask your neighbor's dog to compute the result of the match, and bet accordingly. So I'm thinking having players sending a number from 1 to 9 when they send bets, and then, sum them up, and use mod9 to decide which player of the team will pitch for that game (pitcher always bats last), so a given match between teams will have 9 possible outcomes.

For the sake of running this, I'm going to assume the sum of numbers gave 18, this is mod9 0, so the teams will be sending their last players as pitchers, and the rest of the players will bat in order. Had the number been a 3, 3rd player would be pitching, and 4th player would be batting first.

The way the cards are matched is:
Pitcher's first number against batter's first number [1][1]
Pitcher's second number against batter's first number [2][1]
Pitcher's third number against batter's first number [3][1]
Pitcher's first number against batter's second number [1][2]
Pitcher's second number against batter's second number [2][2]
Pitcher's third number against batter's second number [3][2]
Pitcher's first number against batter's third number [1][3]
Pitcher's second number against batter's third number [2][3]
Pitcher's third number against batter's third number [3][3]

A game would look like this:

The Empousais Vs. The Kobalois
Spoiler:
[1][1]
Empousais - Kobalois
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Vana beats Croagunk's 3 with a 1, with bases empty this means Croagunk lands safely on first.

Kobalois - Empousais
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Euboea beats Mikado's 6 with a 5, with no players in bases this means Mikado lands safely on first.

[2][1]
Empousais - Kobalois
Croagunk on first.
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Both 1s tie, this means Thermopylai is out but Croagunk scores!

Kobalois 1 - Empousais 0
Mikado on first.
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Euboea beats Empusa's 5 with a 0. With exactly 1 player on the bases, Mikado moves to third, while Empusa moves to 1st.

[3][1]
Empousais 0 - Kobalois 1
Bases empty. 1 out.
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Choroimane beats Vana's 0 with a 3, so he goes to first.

Kobalois 1 - Empousais 0
Mikado on 3rd, Empusa on 1st.
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Dia beats Euboea's 2 with a 4. This is a double, Mikado scores! Empusa to third, Dia moves to second.

[1][2]
Empousais 1 - Kobalois 1
Choroimane on first. 1 out
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Aiolomorphos beats Vana's 1 with a 2. Choroimane advances to second, Aiolomorphos goes to first.

Kobalois 1 - Empousais 1
Empusa on third, Dia on second.
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Aulora beats Euboea's 5 with a 0. As there's exactly 2 batters on the bases, Aulora is out but Empusa scores and Dia goes to third!

[2][2]
Empousais 2 - Kobalois 1
Choroimane on second, Aiolomorphos on first. 1 out.
Image Image

Both 1s tie. Kobold is out, but Choroimane and Aiolomorphos score!

The Kobalois have gone over the winning threshold!

Kobalois 3 - Empousais 2
Dia on third. 1 out.
Empousais need to score to not lose. If they score 2 runs they win the game!
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Euboea's 0 beats Orian's 4. There's exactly one batter on the bases, so Dia scores and Orian goes to first!

Scores are tied!

[3][2]
Empousais 3 - Kobalois 3
Bases empty. 2 outs.
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Galgenmännlein beats Vana's 0 with a 1. Bases are empty, Galgenmännlein is third out!

Now the Empousais can keep attempting to score until they get three outs, if they do it, they win!

Kobalois 3 - Empousais 3
Orian on first. 1 out.
Pitcher - Batter
Image Image

Altana's 5 beats Euboea's 2. Altana to third, Orian scores! And that's the game!

Final score: Empousais 4 - Kobalois 3


I'd like to ask for feedback on how it looks like and whether managing a team trying to win the championship under this system sounds fun. I know the game would contain unprecedented amounts of fluff since I don't really expect people would read random games, but I'd expect people to read the games of their team and finally if some big upset happens we can see how it did :)

Redundant
Spoiler:
EmpMikado.png
Mikado Empousai
EmpMikado.png (12.49 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
empempusa.png
Empusa Empousai
empempusa.png (11.13 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
empdia.png
Dia Empousai
empdia.png (10.88 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
empaulora.png
Aulora Empousai
empaulora.png (10.94 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
emporian.png
Orian Empousai
emporian.png (11.74 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
empaltana.png
Altana Empousai
empaltana.png (11.44 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
emptemptress.png
Temptress Empousai
emptemptress.png (10.7 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
EmpDalam.png
Dalam Empousai
EmpDalam.png (11.49 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
empvana.png
Vana Empousai
empvana.png (9.81 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
KovCroagunk.png
Croagunk Kobaloi
KovCroagunk.png (6.98 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
kobthermopylai.png
Thermopylai Kobaloi
kobthermopylai.png (11.72 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
kobchoroimane.png
Choroimane Kobaloi
kobchoroimane.png (11.19 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
kobailomorphos.png
Ailomorphos Kobaloi
kobailomorphos.png (10.99 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
kobkobold.png
Kobold Kobaloi
kobkobold.png (9.94 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
kobgalgenmannlein.png
Galgenmännlein Kobaloi
kobgalgenmannlein.png (9.69 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
kobheinzeilmannchen.png
Heinzelmännchen Kobaloi
kobheinzeilmannchen.png (11.51 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
KobYitzak.png
Yitzhak Kobaloi
KobYitzak.png (11.59 KiB) Viewed 5580 times
kobeuboea.png
Euboea Kobaloi
kobeuboea.png (12.43 KiB) Viewed 5580 times


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