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DFTM: Spring 02 (Replacement England wanted)

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 3:56 pm UTC
by Diemo
Rules
Spoiler:
http://www.wizards.com/avalonhill/rules/diplomacy.pdf


Players:
1. Blue firechicago (Spring '01) (Confirmed)
2. Lawrencelot (Confirmed)
3. Dudio (Austria) (Confirmed)
4.Adam H Vytron (Confirmed)
5. Snark (Confirmed)
6. Sproklem (Confirmed)
7. DJ (Confirmed)

Replacements:
1. firechicago

Power Assignments:
Austria: Dudiobugtron
England: Snark
France: Vytron
Germany: Blue firechicago
Italy: Sprokelm
Russia: Djehutynakht
Turkey: Lawrencelot

Orders will be due on Tuesday at 10pm GMT every week. Retreats will be due on Wednesday at 10pm, build on Thursday at 10pm (where applicable).

Current Deadline:
Tuesday 14th January 2014

Adjudication will be done using RealPolitik. This works on Windows and on Mac, and I would advise people to download it as it is an invaluable tool to have.

Classic Map with Names.
names.png


Classic Map with Starting Units:
winter1900.png


Current Map:
Winter01.png


Spoiler:
If you have a preferance as to what country you play please let me know. Otherwise it will be randomised.
Countries are:
England (Dark Blue)
Russia (White)
France(Light Blue)
Italy (Green)
Turkey (Yellow)
Austria (Red)
Germany (Black)

Keep an eye on this first post for edits, though I will make a new post for anything that game related (this will just be rules etc.)

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 3:58 pm UTC
by bluebambue
Confirm. Also, I request not Britain as that is what I played in my only other game. I do not care a lot about this request if it is decided that giving people choices about their country isn't a good idea or some other infeasibility comes up.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 4:03 pm UTC
by Vytron
In for classic!

/has never heard about Diplomacy before but finds fantastic the game has already 6 players, must be fun!

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 4:04 pm UTC
by Snark
Confirming desire to play.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 4:37 pm UTC
by Adam H
Sorry, I'm out. Looks too complicated for me right now. I'll play if needed.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:17 pm UTC
by dudiobugtron
Confirmed. I'm happy to be assigned a different country if needed, but Austria is my first choice for aesthetic reasons.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:28 pm UTC
by Adam H
Actually, I'll play if you don't get someone else to be your 7th player.

How game-breaking would it be if someone went AWOL? Like on a scale of 1=Count to a Million to 10=MTG Table... :)

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:55 pm UTC
by Diemo
Uh, people going AWOL is pretty bad. Say an 8.

The rules themselves are pretty simple though. THey boil down to
1. 1 unit per province
2. Armies can't move onto water
3. Fleets can only be on coastal or ocean provinces.
4. Each unit has strenght 1. Two units of the same strenght moving into a province results in a bounce. Defender always wins ties.
5. You can support units provided that the unit that is supporting unit can also attack the province.
e.g. you have a fleet in Tri and a army in Ven and an army in Trl. Then the army can attack Ven/Tri and the fleet/army can support, but the army in Ven can attack Trl but the Fl in Ven can't support as it can't attack Ven.
6. You can convoy an army. This is how you move armies across sea. You need to use a fle to convoy. e.g England has an army in Yorkshire (Yor) and a fl in Nth. Then the Army orders
A Yor - Sweden
and the Fleet orders
Fl Nth Convoy A Yor - Sweden

This will succeed unless
a) Sweden is occupied.
b) The fleet is dislodged (attacked with strenght 2)

And that is it.

The main role of the game is cooperating with the other players. You NEED to cooperate, but there is no rule about telling the truth, so people will lie to you in order to get you to move to their plans.

Oh, and I will be happy to explain anything to anyone, just drop me a PM.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 6:33 pm UTC
by orangedragonfire
Can you support an attack by a unit that is not yours?

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 6:34 pm UTC
by dudiobugtron
orangedragonfire wrote:Can you support an attack by a unit that is not yours?

That's basically the game, right there.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 6:36 pm UTC
by Djehutynakht
Interest confirmed. Proceed with caution.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 6:47 pm UTC
by Vytron
Requests to be put at the end of the player list so I can see the moves of everyone else before making mine.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 6:53 pm UTC
by Adam H
Diemo wrote:Uh, people going AWOL is pretty bad. Say an 8.
Mmmmm OK then I definitely won't play. Can't play at work and looks too time consuming to commit to playing from home.

Looks like you have enough players anyways.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 7:15 pm UTC
by dudiobugtron
Vytron wrote:Requests to be put at the end of the player list so I can see the moves of everyone else before making mine.

LOL. :P

Everyone has to move simultaneously, or you get a massive advantage.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 7:43 pm UTC
by Vytron
Rats, it's not the kind of game that can be learned as one plays, huh? :mrgreen:

*Starts reading the rules.*

Oh, give me Russia! So it can play me.

...

Oh, this totally looks like Kingdom Control XD

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 8:25 pm UTC
by Diemo
dudiobugtron wrote:
orangedragonfire wrote:Can you support an attack by a unit that is not yours?

That's basically the game, right there.


Pretty much. Because everyone starts out equal, and the map is pretty well balanced, you need to help someone (and have them help you) in order to get anywhere. That is why you have a week to take moves, so that you can make deals with other players.

So, yeah, you can support a unit that is not your own. The only exception is that you can't support a unit against yourself (e.g. Germany is in Venice and Trl, with Austria in Trieste. Germany can't support the Austrian army into Trl from Venice unless his army successfully moves out in the same turn.

Moves are submitted to me, and then I adjudicate them all at the same time.

The game is quite time consuming, yes.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:28 pm UTC
by Vytron
People will be able to use @Player Spoilers that other players can't read instead of private messages, right?

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:52 pm UTC
by firechicago
Ooh, it's been forever since I've had a good Diplomacy game!

Not sure if you're full up, but I'd love to play. My country preference is France.

If not, I'd still be interested in observing.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 5:06 am UTC
by Sprocklem
Confirming interest

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:05 am UTC
by Djehutynakht
You'd be the seventh player, so welcome.

I finally finished reading the rules. And it looks interesting.

Anyone have a country recommendation?

Also, can't see map or any such images.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 11:34 am UTC
by Lawrencelot
Confirm

I prefer Turkey or England

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 2:29 pm UTC
by Diemo
DJ wrote:Also, can't see map or any such images.


This could be a problem, does anyone else have this issue? I will be uploading images after those two (I just linked to them on the redscape servers) so will upload a set when I get home to see if that changes anything. I have changed it so that the images are uploaded instead of being links, let me know if problem presists.
You can find them in those four places, though the last one is from the wiki page and tiny. It turns out to be really hard to find a map with units on it in google images!

We have 8 confirmed at the moment. As firechicago was the last to express interest I'm going to leave her(him?) as a replacement.

PLEASE DO NOT POST IN THE THREAD IF YOU ARE NOT PLAYING

There will be a avatar to use for public anonymous posting if people want to. Details will be sent by PM (when they work again).

What do people want to do for Xmas? How long a break do you think there should be?

Power Assignments:
Austria: Dudio
England: Snark
France: Vytron
Germany: Blue
Italy: Sprokelm
Russia: DJ
Turkey: Lawrencelot

I don't care how you communicate with each other. However, keep in mind that this is a game without any rules outside of the movements of the pieces, so if you post a @player spoiler there is nothing stopping people from reading it to find out what you you are saying. (It is also perfectly within the rules to hack someones account, create a special account called Snaark, etc.)

DEADLINE: Spring 01

Tuesday 17th of December 2013 at 10pm GMT. After this there will be a week between adjudication as per OP.

Deadline will be soft, you can continue to submit orders until I have posted the adjudication.

If you want a PM with the results please let me know, I'd be happy to send one. The same with an email with the results if that is what you prefer.

Good luck!

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 3:24 pm UTC
by bluebambue
I requested NOT England. Is it too late to change?

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 3:40 pm UTC
by Snark
I'll trade you, blue.

If I come in last because I didn't have a country preference, I'll have no one but myself to blame.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 5:07 pm UTC
by bluebambue
Thanks Snark!

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 5:19 pm UTC
by Diemo
Nevermind

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:02 pm UTC
by dudiobugtron
I'm pretty sure it is against the forum rules to hack someone's account, so probably de facto against the rules of the game.

I understand that 'spying' on people's conversations if you can is an important part of diplomacy though, so I can see why you don't want to enforce the spoiler rule for flavour reasons. But all that it basically does is make spectating less interesting, and force everyone to use PMs. Anyway, just my opinion. :)

Diemo wrote:What do people want ... for Xmas?

A tricycle! No, wait, World Peace. And maybe a ps4.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:53 pm UTC
by Vytron
Wait, I requested Russia. Did requesting have no effect?

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:18 pm UTC
by Diemo
Vytron wrote:Wait, I requested Russia. Did requesting have no effect?


Uh, crap, I missed it, sorry. Otherwise I would have given you Russia.

If DJ doesn't mind I am happy enough with you swopping. I can't enforce that though because people might have started talking :(

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 12:22 am UTC
by bluebambue
I messaged DJ, but they hadn't read it yet and I just deleted it. I am fine with a swap

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 1:15 am UTC
by dudiobugtron
I do not claim to have any current negotiations which would be affected by a Djehutynakht/Vytron mind-swap.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:58 am UTC
by bluebambue
oh wait, I have talked to Vytron, so I don't think a swap is a good idea.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:37 am UTC
by dudiobugtron
As France, Vytron will have a much better opportunity to conquer Spain, and rule it with an Iron fist as he has always wanted to. ;)

-----------------
I think if Vytron really cares about it, though, he could be trusted to pledge not to use any of the information gleaned from conversations to your disadvantage.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:54 am UTC
by Djehutynakht
If Vytron wants to switch I'd be willing to, so long as anything sent as negotiations for France are re-sent to me.

It's good to have some favor with someone who's not in your immediate (relatively) sphere of influence.

Vytron, let me know if you wish to proceed.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:01 am UTC
by dudiobugtron
Just a thought about the account hacking thing - is it against the rules of the game to hack Diemo's account?

Diemo wrote:Power Assignments:
Austria: Dudio
England: Snark
France: Vytron
Germany: Blue
Italy: Sprokelm
Russia: DJ
Turkey: Lawrencelot

Can you add this list to the OP? Thanks if you can! :)

Also, can we over-write orders that we have sent with new ones if it's before the time limit, or are our order submissions final? I'd like to submit orders early so I don't forget, but obviously might want to change them later as the result of some negotiations.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 6:14 am UTC
by Djehutynakht
Question:

I can see the map now. Which is great. So which brings me to my question...
-Littered all over the map are tiny black dots/targets? What are they? (do they denote supply centers, and places without the dots are just simply provinces to move in and out of?)

-Also, can someone remind me what's the law for creating units? It's... the supply centers which you have no units in that are under your control in your home country, yes?

Just asking.


My personal suggestion, for our first phase (putting phases in the title like for KC would be helpful) is that we leave each other well enough alone and focus internally (while of course discussing our eventual mastery). Indeed, save... Austria and Italy, actually, we really can't attack one another anyways.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:47 am UTC
by dudiobugtron
Djehutynakht wrote:Littered all over the map are tiny black dots/targets? What are they? (do they denote supply centers, and places without the dots are just simply provinces to move in and out of?)

Yup, supply centres.

-Also, can someone remind me what's the law for creating units? It's... the supply centers which you have no units in that are under your control in your home country, yes?

At the end of every second turn (there is a 'spring' turn, then a 'fall' turn each year, so at the end of the fall turn), you can build units like you suggest, with the proviso that you can't have more units than your total number of supply centres. (Black target dots.)

That's just from my reading of the rules, though. I've only played this game once (10 years ago), so I am not an authority!

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:26 am UTC
by Djehutynakht
Okay then, many thanks.

I'm eager to play, but of course I need to hear from Vytron first. I kind of like Russia, but Vytron asked for it, so if he wants to trade I have not many issues moving to France.

In any case, hm...

I predict most of us will stay put in our own areas during this first year, though there may be at least one cheeky disturbance who tries to mess with another country.

-Austria, the Ottomans, and possibly Russia and Italy are going to spend quite a bit of time trying to outmaneuver each other (diplomatically and militarily) over the Balkan states and their four juicy unclaimed supply centers.

-Germany, England and Russia will look towards the Scandinavian nations

-France, Germany and England will look towards Belgium and the Netherlands

-France will look towards Spain and Portugal

-Italy will spend a significant amount of energy attacking their neighbors' homelands, with little room to expand outside of the hellhole that will be the Balkans.


This should be fun. I look forward to sending out a barrage of plans and treaties soon.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:38 am UTC
by Black Mask
Hi there, this is your friendly Black Mask talking. Who could it be?

Please use this for anonymous posting.

Re: Diplomacy For The Masses

Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:50 am UTC
by Lawrencelot
So can we get an update on which player is which country?