Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby kernelpanic » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:37 pm UTC

This is getting more and more like something that should be in Fictional Science.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby ThePragmatist » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:39 pm UTC

kernelpanic wrote:This is getting more and more like something that should be in Fictional Science.


TV science IS fictional science.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Izawwlgood » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:57 pm UTC

ALL OF IT! BLUE PLANET IS NOTHING BUT CGI OF A WATERED DOWN PANDORA!
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Glass Fractal » Sun Feb 06, 2011 5:32 pm UTC

Eebster the Great wrote:So you need 50 million km of wire. Give me a million years and I'll get it for you, easy.

But even bathed in supercooled helium, I don't think the wire would be conductive enough over 50 million km. It's only a "perfect conductor" at absolute zero, afaik.


They do have 10 micron aluminum wire and you can make aluminum into a superconductor at around 1K. Less room for insulation though.

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby TheChewanater » Sun Feb 06, 2011 6:23 pm UTC

Obviously the most elegant solution is to spend six months porting an old JVM to the device, and use it to control the detonation digitally. That'll give you at least three minutes while it boots.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Technical Ben » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:34 am UTC

New series. "CSI: Wizards School"
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Tass » Tue Feb 08, 2011 5:12 pm UTC

Glass Fractal wrote:
Eebster the Great wrote:So you need 50 million km of wire. Give me a million years and I'll get it for you, easy.

But even bathed in supercooled helium, I don't think the wire would be conductive enough over 50 million km. It's only a "perfect conductor" at absolute zero, afaik.


They do have 10 micron aluminum wire and you can make aluminum into a superconductor at around 1K. Less room for insulation though.


That sort of defeats the point that it was "a resistor" doesn't it?

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Eebster the Great » Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:13 pm UTC

Tass wrote:
Glass Fractal wrote:
Eebster the Great wrote:So you need 50 million km of wire. Give me a million years and I'll get it for you, easy.

But even bathed in supercooled helium, I don't think the wire would be conductive enough over 50 million km. It's only a "perfect conductor" at absolute zero, afaik.


They do have 10 micron aluminum wire and you can make aluminum into a superconductor at around 1K. Less room for insulation though.


That sort of defeats the point that it was "a resistor" doesn't it?

You don't think a superconductor makes a very good resistor?

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Technical Ben » Tue Feb 08, 2011 11:35 pm UTC

Ok. This is too much now. The most gross film I ever made the misfortune of watching was Saw. It was a mistake. However, I did not feel as sick as I felt just now from CSI:New York. No, it was not the gruesome autopsy, or death. It was the crime against science, logic, intelligence and reality. I actually felt physically sick from it. :shock:
In all it's horror. With self repairing car, decapitating laser (car mounted of cause) and a nanowire/supercomputer in a SD card. :roll:
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby You, sir, name? » Wed Feb 09, 2011 12:19 am UTC

Technical Ben wrote:Ok. This is too much now. The most gross film I ever made the misfortune of watching was Saw. It was a mistake. However, I did not feel as sick as I felt just now from CSI:New York. No, it was not the gruesome autopsy, or death. It was the crime against science, logic, intelligence and reality. I actually felt physically sick from it. :shock:
In all it's horror. With self repairing car, decapitating laser (car mounted of cause) and a nanowire/supercomputer in a SD card. :roll:


I see this post is made in real time. I'll create a gui interface using visual basic, see if I can track an IP address.

Lest we forget.

Though the latest episode was kinda ridiculous too. There was a party in a trailer truck. The truck drove off, nobody inside noticed. The truck raced like a maniac through the streets, nobody inside noticed. It finally accelerated into the river, and then they suddenly noticed they were no longer stationary when it hit the water.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby BlackSails » Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:22 am UTC

You, sir, name? wrote:
Though the latest episode was kinda ridiculous too. There was a party in a trailer truck. The truck drove off, nobody inside noticed. The truck raced like a maniac through the streets, nobody inside noticed. It finally accelerated into the river, and then they suddenly noticed they were no longer stationary when it hit the water.


That seems rather reasonable. I imagine that the kind of people who party inside a truck are also the kind of people that imbibe substances that impair balance and cognitive function.

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby You, sir, name? » Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:33 am UTC

BlackSails wrote:
You, sir, name? wrote:
Though the latest episode was kinda ridiculous too. There was a party in a trailer truck. The truck drove off, nobody inside noticed. The truck raced like a maniac through the streets, nobody inside noticed. It finally accelerated into the river, and then they suddenly noticed they were no longer stationary when it hit the water.


That seems rather reasonable. I imagine that the kind of people who party inside a truck are also the kind of people that imbibe substances that impair balance and cognitive function.


I'd imagine them falling over like bowling pins from all the sudden acceleration would be an indicator that something wasn't quite right.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby The Scyphozoa » Wed Feb 09, 2011 2:19 am UTC

Maybe the CAI shows are just an elaborate jab at other shows with bad science, and it's not quite ridiculous enough for us to notice?
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby el_cheato » Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:43 am UTC

Plutonium is apparently an infinitely powerful fuel source that can be easily used to power any type of machine you choose, namely cars. As much as I loved Back to the Future, the plutonium fuel source for the DeLorean always irked at me. First of all, plutonium is a byproduct of nuclear reactions. Anotherwords, it is waste. It has no use, other than weapons. Secondly of all, even if it is possible to use plutonium as a fuel source, you can't get a nuclear reactor small enough to fit inside a DeLorean. The nuclear reaction generates crap tons of heat, which boils water into steam, which turns a turbine. Yet I don't see any turbines or steam pipes on the DeLorean!

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Eebster the Great » Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:44 am UTC

Technical Ben wrote:Ok. This is too much now. The most gross film I ever made the misfortune of watching was Saw. It was a mistake. However, I did not feel as sick as I felt just now from CSI:New York. No, it was not the gruesome autopsy, or death. It was the crime against science, logic, intelligence and reality. I actually felt physically sick from it. :shock:
In all it's horror. With self repairing car, decapitating laser (car mounted of cause) and a nanowire/supercomputer in a SD card. :roll:

OK, so the self-repairing car is pretty nuts, but the idea of a memory polymer is not in itself new. The SD card actually was supposed to just be an ordinary data card with some sort of security key on it (I don't know what it was supposed to be, really). The actual "supercomputer" was really just single-purpose hardware used for disabling their firewall, but supposedly it was wired into a tux (actually, the tux had "nanowires" (which were somehow macroscopic) which "acted as" a computer or something), which is of course beyond ridiculous. I didn't watch far enough into the clip to see a decapitating laser, but there's no reason that's impossible, just highly impractical.

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby The Scyphozoa » Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:55 am UTC

(In my above post, I meant CSI, not CAI.) :?
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Sizik » Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:57 am UTC

The Scyphozoa wrote:(In my above post, I meant CSI, not CAI.) :?

That's what the Edit button is for.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby TheChewanater » Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:58 am UTC

Eebster the Great wrote:OK, so the self-repairing car is pretty nuts, but the idea of a memory polymer is not in itself new. The SD card actually was supposed to just be an ordinary data card with some sort of security key on it (I don't know what it was supposed to be, really). The actual "supercomputer" was really just single-purpose hardware used for disabling their firewall, but supposedly it was wired into a tux (actually, the tux had "nanowires" (which were somehow macroscopic) which "acted as" a computer or something), which is of course beyond ridiculous. I didn't watch far enough into the clip to see a decapitating laser, but there's no reason that's impossible, just highly impractical.

Okay, maybe some of that stuff in the video linked to is possible-ish. Regardless, the "GUI in Visual Basic" thing is enough to justify eternal damnation.

You, sir, name? wrote:
BlackSails wrote:
You, sir, name? wrote:
Though the latest episode was kinda ridiculous too. There was a party in a trailer truck. The truck drove off, nobody inside noticed. The truck raced like a maniac through the streets, nobody inside noticed. It finally accelerated into the river, and then they suddenly noticed they were no longer stationary when it hit the water.


That seems rather reasonable. I imagine that the kind of people who party inside a truck are also the kind of people that imbibe substances that impair balance and cognitive function.


I'd imagine them falling over like bowling pins from all the sudden acceleration would be an indicator that something wasn't quite right.

Perhaps they mistook that for a result of their substance abuse?
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Eebster the Great » Wed Feb 09, 2011 7:10 am UTC

TheChewanater wrote:Okay, maybe some of that stuff in the video linked to is possible-ish. Regardless, the "GUI in Visual Basic" thing is enough to justify eternal damnation.

What she said in that line was probably also sort of possible if twisted enough, but I agree it is still horrendous enough to make me consider tearing out my own eyes. The horror doesn't stem from whether or not it is possible.

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Technical Ben » Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:22 pm UTC

Eebster the Great wrote:
Spoiler:
Technical Ben wrote:Ok. This is too much now. The most gross film I ever made the misfortune of watching was Saw. It was a mistake. However, I did not feel as sick as I felt just now from CSI:New York. No, it was not the gruesome autopsy, or death. It was the crime against science, logic, intelligence and reality. I actually felt physically sick from it. :shock:
In all it's horror. With self repairing car, decapitating laser (car mounted of cause) and a nanowire/supercomputer in a SD card. :roll:

OK, so the self-repairing car is pretty nuts, but the idea of a memory polymer is not in itself new. The SD card actually was supposed to just be an ordinary data card with some sort of security key on it (I don't know what it was supposed to be, really). The actual "supercomputer" was really just single-purpose hardware used for disabling their firewall, but supposedly it was wired into a tux (actually, the tux had "nanowires" (which were somehow macroscopic) which "acted as" a computer or something), which is of course beyond ridiculous. I didn't watch far enough into the clip to see a decapitating laser, but there's no reason that's impossible, just highly impractical.

Before you say "decapitating laser" is possible... I know they said it was a steel cutting laser, which DO exist. I'm guessing there is some reason why a military car mounted laser gun does not exist. If the thing was possible, we would see the Army, Mafia, Police and everyman and his dog with a laser gun. If you show me wrong though, I'd be over the moon. I'd have legitimate laser weapons to add to sci-fi. :D
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Wildhound » Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:49 pm UTC

Lasers lose a lot of their power when travelling through dense atmosphere and they are also disturbed/misaligned by atmospheric turbulence. Further, to do any real damage you have to be way above the MW range and you would have a lot of trouble mounting that kind of power supply on a car. The world's fastest production car, for example, produces 883 KW at peak output. Let's say that engine masses 250 Kg. You get a lot of gun for 250 Kg.

That said, have a look at the following for an idea of what might or might not be possible in the near future:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed_energy_weapons

That should scratch your sci-fi weapon itch. ;)
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Eebster the Great » Wed Feb 09, 2011 2:12 pm UTC

Technical Ben wrote:Before you say "decapitating laser" is possible... I know they said it was a steel cutting laser, which DO exist. I'm guessing there is some reason why a military car mounted laser gun does not exist. If the thing was possible, we would see the Army, Mafia, Police and everyman and his dog with a laser gun. If you show me wrong though, I'd be over the moon. I'd have legitimate laser weapons to add to sci-fi. :D

I don't think there are any deadly portable laser weapons. There are portable laser weapons that can stun, one that can electrocute, and some that can do a variety of other tasks. And there are much larger laser weapons that are deadly (such as the THEL which can shoot down planes and missiles). The FIRESTRIKE gives a good comparison for how difficult it would be to create a truly portable variation. Each 15 kW FIRESTRIKE module is 400 lbs, so a single 100 kW weapon would weigh at least 2800 lbs. Now, for a laser only designed to fire for a second or so continuously, you could drop a lot of weight, but it still wouldn't be car-mountable.

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby gmalivuk » Wed Feb 09, 2011 7:15 pm UTC

el_cheato wrote:plutonium is a byproduct of nuclear reactions. Anotherwords, it is waste. It has no use, other than weapons.
That's not true. Plutonium is still radioactive, and thus releases energy which can be used, for example, by some spacecraft. Granted, they typically don't produce enough heat for something as energy-demanding as a car, but that's still far from useless.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Yakk » Wed Feb 09, 2011 7:39 pm UTC

I was under the impression that some kinds of Breeder reactors will munch on plutonium quite nicely, thank you?
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby sikyon » Wed Feb 09, 2011 7:43 pm UTC

el_cheato wrote:Plutonium is apparently an infinitely powerful fuel source that can be easily used to power any type of machine you choose, namely cars. As much as I loved Back to the Future, the plutonium fuel source for the DeLorean always irked at me. First of all, plutonium is a byproduct of nuclear reactions. Anotherwords, it is waste. It has no use, other than weapons. Secondly of all, even if it is possible to use plutonium as a fuel source, you can't get a nuclear reactor small enough to fit inside a DeLorean. The nuclear reaction generates crap tons of heat, which boils water into steam, which turns a turbine. Yet I don't see any turbines or steam pipes on the DeLorean!


Plutonium can be used as a power source, easy, and you don't need a nuclear reactor to harness the energy. And you don't need to boil water with the heat to harness the energy.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Moose Hole » Wed Feb 09, 2011 8:37 pm UTC

Sigh. The flux capacitor takes heat as an input and converts it to chronoton flux which is released when the wheels/turbines are spinning fast enough to use it (88mph). Time travel is an exothermic reaction, which is generally observed as flaming tire treads in the previous time frame, and icy metal in the next time frame.

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby gmalivuk » Wed Feb 09, 2011 8:46 pm UTC

Yakk wrote:I was under the impression that some kinds of Breeder reactors will munch on plutonium quite nicely, thank you?
Yeah, that's also true. And after all, any nuclear reaction that's usable as a weapon is, in theory, also a potential power source. It's just an engineering problem, so to speak, to control it for that purpose.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby The Scyphozoa » Wed Feb 09, 2011 10:36 pm UTC

Moose Hole wrote:Sigh. The flux capacitor takes heat as an input and converts it to chronoton flux which is released when the wheels/turbines are spinning fast enough to use it (88mph). Time travel is an exothermic reaction, which is generally observed as flaming tire treads in the previous time frame, and icy metal in the next time frame.

Wait, so the 88 mph isn't about velocity at all, it's about spinning speed?
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Antimony-120 » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:33 am UTC

The Scyphozoa wrote:
Moose Hole wrote:Sigh. The flux capacitor takes heat as an input and converts it to chronoton flux which is released when the wheels/turbines are spinning fast enough to use it (88mph). Time travel is an exothermic reaction, which is generally observed as flaming tire treads in the previous time frame, and icy metal in the next time frame.

Wait, so the 88 mph isn't about velocity at all, it's about spinning speed?


That actually makes more sense, spinning (centripital acceleration) is an absolute, velocity is frame-dependant.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Soralin » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:45 am UTC

Yakk wrote:I was under the impression that some kinds of Breeder reactors will munch on plutonium quite nicely, thank you?

More than that, any fission reactor should be able to use plutonium, it's a fissile fuel, just like uranium-235. It's a lot easier to use plutonium as a fuel then it is to uranium, because u-235 is fissile, but u-238 is not, whereas all the plutonium that's produced is fissile, which makes things easy. You can dilute it a bit in natural uranium or such if it's a bit rich for your reactor, which is often done with nuclear warheads when they're disassembled, the plutonium or highly enriched uranium is diluted in natural uranium, and used for nuclear fuel.

Breeder reactors, or fast neutron reactors, are useful in that they can produce useful quantities of plutonium from U-238, and then fission it. You can design them to run at around a 1:1 ratio of fuel produced to fuel used, which means that once you have one up and running, you could fuel it from then on using only depleted uranium, or natural uranium, or the waste from other reactors which is largely unused fuel, etc. Not to mention, any radioactive waste you don't like, you can toss into one, and transmute it into something else that's not as bad.

Although using a small amount of it in a reactor that only takes up part of a car would likely be difficult, and an RTG wouldn't work that well with Pu-239, which is what you'd be using for a bomb, and an RTG wouldn't work well if you wanted a big pulse of power anyway. You'd need it to fission a lot in order to get a big pulse of power out of it for a short length of time, and that would be difficult to do with a small quantity. And figuring out how to convert all of that energy into electrical power. And not to mention not having your car melt or your driver irradiated in the process. And if you do have a lot of radiation shielding between the reactor and the driver, getting the car up to 88 mph with all of that weight might be a bit difficult. :)

Antimony-120 wrote:
The Scyphozoa wrote:
Moose Hole wrote:Sigh. The flux capacitor takes heat as an input and converts it to chronoton flux which is released when the wheels/turbines are spinning fast enough to use it (88mph). Time travel is an exothermic reaction, which is generally observed as flaming tire treads in the previous time frame, and icy metal in the next time frame.

Wait, so the 88 mph isn't about velocity at all, it's about spinning speed?


That actually makes more sense, spinning (centripital acceleration) is an absolute, velocity is frame-dependant.

Well it could still be frame-dependent and still make sense, like needing to be moving 88mph perpendicular to the Earth's gravitational field, etc. :)

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby phlip » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:49 am UTC

The spinning idea wouldn't explain why it needed to reach 88 mph whilst in flight, in Part 2... or for that matter, why you wouldn't throw in some gears, bring the activation speed down to a more easily-reachable level in Part 3...

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby The Scyphozoa » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:07 am UTC

Or why you would even need a car at all. So the least bad explanation is probably that it has to be 88 relative to the nearest/largest center of gravity.
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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Eebster the Great » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:22 am UTC

Clearly the need for radiation shielding was met already because it was a DeLorean.

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Re: Facepalm TV / Doing It Wrong

Postby Mahou » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:59 pm UTC

I'm just pissed that they always insist on showing the laser as a visible beam. Does the car also have a built in smoke machine just so the laser will show up when they shoot it? Even Star Wars had the courtesy to call them "blaster bolts."


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