World of darkness

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bigglesworth
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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Fri Jan 30, 2009 6:04 pm UTC

Dynamic magic? As in magic that allows you to do anything you describe?

Yes, the new Mage game contains that. It's very well designed, and I'm a huge fan of it. To get the full effect, you can buy the Tome of Mysteries as well as the Mage corebook, which fully describes the intricacies and consequences of the magic system.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Fri Jan 30, 2009 6:22 pm UTC

What biggles said.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Terebrant » Mon Mar 02, 2009 5:44 pm UTC

Saturday, when buying Inferno, I heard about New Wave Requiem. Even though playing vampires again sounds fun, I fear that I wouldn't be able to do the setting (eighties in the USA) justice. How do the older and american people here feel about that setting ?

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Mon Mar 02, 2009 6:38 pm UTC

I saw the new wave vampire cover and thought it was awesome hilarious.

I don't do much vamp, but I might pick it up for that alone.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Terebrant » Tue Mar 03, 2009 2:24 pm UTC

It is a pdf, I think I will wait until they set up the pod version. I think I might try to make an educative scenario about AIDS, discrimination and minority rights for a civics association.

I have started reading inferno. The editing is sloppy but it looks like it will cover a lot of things. At this point, I wonder what they will put in Geist: The Sin-Eaters.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:24 pm UTC

So, I'm gonna be running a continuing changeling: the lost larp. And I know some of my larpers are reading these forums, so no plot here (you know who you are...) But I can't wait. Should be a lot of fun.

Or it'll be hell.

Or I'll fail.

One of those three possibilities.

---

I really want to know more about Geist. I wish they could start the previews soon. the Sin-eaters. Strange name. Also, they've said it's not wraith 2.0 as if it were, they would have called it Wraith. So... hmmm.

Anyone else playing a long term WoD game?
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Terebrant » Wed Mar 11, 2009 7:16 pm UTC

I started playing in a new oWoD mage campaign. The traditions we have at the table are euthanatos, verbena and sons of ether (specialized in cyborgization), I guess we will have some fun discussions about life.

Will you change your avatar to include geist ? I must admit I am even more curious about this game after seeing the logo.

I was surprised by the positive reaction to using RPGs in civics education, I will try to do a Innocents and Dogs of War scenario next.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby existential_elevator » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:04 pm UTC

Jessica wrote:Anyone else playing a long term WoD game?
I'm hoping my current Changeling: the lost game is going to be long term, though it looks as though we have a couple of drop outs after.. I think it's been four or five sessions. I've not played Changeling before, in fact I've not played new WoD before, but I am really, really enjoying this setting. I can't tell you how unbearably happy I was to find myself with a hedge steed [a giant mechanical chicken!] as a result of a pledge. The flexibility pledging gives you, even for just a day of gameplay, is wonderful. Yeah. I really hope this one lasts out :mrgreen:

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:47 pm UTC

I hope it does too, EE! Man, I want a robot chicken to ride around...
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Terebrant » Tue Mar 24, 2009 3:59 pm UTC

Amazon wrote:A rulebook for playing the Sin-Eaters, mortals who have passed through the gates of Death and returned, bonded with the unusual shades known as geists. An expanded look at death and the Underworld in the World of Darkness, from simple ghosts to strange threats such as the Kerberoi. Provides new player types and antagonists for crossover chronicles as well as chronicles focusing on Sin-Eaters.

And the interest suddenly vanish. At least for me, what do you all think about this ?
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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Tue Mar 24, 2009 4:24 pm UTC

I'm very interested; if only to see whether the expanded information on Death fits in with my current theories about the WoD's metaphysics.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Tue Mar 24, 2009 6:35 pm UTC

I'm... quazi interested. I'm reserving judgement for more previews. I mean, it makes sense that they're not just making ghosts playable... I mean there are rules for ghosts, and the information for ghosts currently make them unplayable (along with spirits). But, that doesn't mean that similar themes won't come through when playing these weird geist-possessed people.

I am curious as to where they're going with it. I'll probably get the base book. I currently own all the nWoD base books (except werewolf) so I'll probably get this one too. Again, waiting for previews.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Syns » Wed Apr 01, 2009 9:46 am UTC

I love World of Darkness. I haven't played much nWoD but I'm currently in an online Changeling game that's... interesting. I like it for the most part. And I'm trying to get together an online VTR game. I'm a little nervous about it though since I've never been ST before. I'm having trouble finding people to play that aren't complete flakes though. The one I found online that I don't know IRL seemed ok at first but then he got all high and mighty about how experienced he is and how he fully expects me to suck. And I just don't need that.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Tue May 12, 2009 9:41 pm UTC

There's a saying over at rpg.net: "No gaming is better than bad gaming".
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Re: World of darkness

Postby FACM » Wed May 13, 2009 2:52 am UTC

bigglesworth wrote:There's a saying over at rpg.net: "No gaming is better than bad gaming".


I read that, and immediately thought of 3 ways to interpret that sentence. I suspect all are true.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Wed May 13, 2009 10:09 am UTC

Hah! I hadn't thought about that...
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Re: World of darkness

Postby tzar1990 » Wed May 27, 2009 9:45 pm UTC

Hey, have any of you guys checked out Genius: The Transgression, available at http://moochava.googlepages.com/genius? It's a free, fan-made game in the nWoD, and you all play as some kind of mad scientist (crazy roboticist, ray-gun wielding nutbar, techno-organic timeship pilot, etc.) I downloaded and read the book, and the concept certainly sounds interesting enough, but I'm not exactly sure what it would be like to play, and how easy a game it is for newbies to the WoD to get into.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Wed May 27, 2009 10:04 pm UTC

I was kinda put off by the attitude that the creators had toward nMage. Very antagonistic.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Belial » Thu May 28, 2009 10:41 am UTC

bigglesworth wrote:I was kinda put off by the attitude that the creators had toward nMage. Very antagonistic.

Man, is there another attitude to have towards nMage?
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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Thu May 28, 2009 11:28 am UTC

*looks at pile of books*

Apparently so.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Belial » Thu May 28, 2009 12:08 pm UTC

Okay, putting aside my baseline hatred for any of the nWoD remakes, it is kindof unsurprising that the mad science crew has a hate-on for new mage. I suspect they are the same group of oMage players who cried bloody murder when nMage cut out all the mad science concepts (the Sons of Ether, Virtual Adepts, etcetera). When your creation group is basically self-selecting for a demographic that feels actively betrayed by nMage, that's going to seep into the product.

Indon wrote:Way back when, I half-hacked out a correspondence chart in the event that the universe in the Age of Sorrows is warped by some sort of catastrophe into the World of Darkness: The Exalt shards shattered and the Solars came to be Hunters, The Sidereal to Mages, The Abyssals to Vampires, the Infernals to Demons, the Lunars to the Changing Breeds, and that's all I remember offhand. The Underworld, Malfeas, and Heaven melted together into the Umbra, The Wyld was forced out of three-dimensional space and became the Dreaming and associated areas... I don't remember what happened to the Dragon-Bloods, but since I know the elemental poles were to be destroyed in the twisting of the world (from a flat shape to a sphere), I'm not sure I ever had a place for them.


I'm glad I'm not the only one who sat around pondering what everything would become over a long enough timeline. The conclusions I reached were basically the same as yours except:

The underworld wouldn't become the umbra, it would become the shadowlands (Wraith: The Oblivion), since that's pretty clearly what it was modeled on.

Also, the Dragon-Blooded have some obscure but pretty blatant references to the Wan Xian, the ten thousand immortals, who committed a great betrayal, became corrupt, and fell, becoming the Kuei Jin (eastern vampires).

I'm not so sure about the Abyssals-to-Vampires equivalency. They seem more like one-off super-powered revenants than anything else. I think I just assumed they eventually vanished, or went back into the shadowlands full-time and became deathlords or something.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Thu May 28, 2009 12:21 pm UTC

Oh it's understandable. I just dislike it.

Which is why I had a puzzle when I read the Unknown Armies entry for Mechanomancers. They're, to put it gently, slightly out of place with the other types of magic user. Then it occurred to me that they're Sons of Aether, toned down to the Unknown Armies power level.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Belial » Thu May 28, 2009 12:42 pm UTC

Random question to people who know the nWod System better than me, but are also familiar with the old one:

Will anything break forever if I just bring the barebones of the combat system from the nWod backwards into the oWod, and replace the old one? I'm not seeing any huge drawbacks, here.

One roll for attack and damage, opposed by a static defense value would simplify my life severely, compared to the, say, four or five fucking rolls that the old system requires.

Should maybe allow stamina to determine defense as well, to represent soak from the old system so all the soak-based powers don't fall apart.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Serrin » Thu May 28, 2009 3:06 pm UTC

If you condense everything into a single (possibly opposed) roll, then it makes Potence and Fortitude WAY better than they are, and that's saying something. If I were you, I'd just let Potence add its dots to strength for one scene per activition, and ditto for Fortitude and stamina. Autosuccesses basically murder anyone who doesn't have those disciplines because those autos from Potence can no longer be soaked, except by Fortitude. If you have Fortitude, and nobody has Potence, each dot is basically worth 3 points of armor.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Belial » Thu May 28, 2009 3:14 pm UTC

I run Masquerade basically never, so I'm not but so worried about that. I'm thinking in terms of apocalypse.

Still, I'm not really clear. Assuming you run it like New WOD, where the attacker gets a single attack roll, and successes are subtracted for the defender's defense (with some twerking to make stamina factor into the defense, instead of just wits or dex), how is that worse than the way potence works in the oWoD already? It was basically autosuccesses on strength (damage) rolls, and if the damage pool was going to be terribly high it was already going to be more damage than you had soak dice....
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Serrin » Fri May 29, 2009 12:24 am UTC

Well, I played a bunch of Masquerade, and loved the everloving shit out of Ascension, but Apocalypse is like Greek to me. Except worse, since I know a little Greek.

The whole to-hit thing was a check on Potence. Can't autodamage if you can't hit. Soaking was also something of a check on Potence. Neither of these exist any more. The only possible soaking that can occur is through Fortitude, which is now ridiculously overpowered, as is Potence. I'm going to talk out my ass a moment, so forgive me if I get some of the bits wrong.

NWoD is simply: Str/Dex+Skill+Weapon Rating-(Defense+Armor). Dodging doubles defense.
OWoD is Dex+Skill vs Dex+Dodge, then Str+Weapon for damage, followed by a soak roll.

Because of the way Str and Dex get factored into pools in OWoD, you really need both to maximize your combat ridiculousness. In NWoD, you only need one or the other. If you fail your dex based roll, you never get to bring your crazy Potence to bear. And if the attacker rolls poorly on damage, but still gets his auto successes, you can soak those. In a single roll system, defense and armor will never subtract successes, and nothing will ever make the attacker miss. Therefore, 1 Potence = 1 damage, no matter what, period. Unlike in OWoD where it can miss or be soaked.

Another consequence of this is the corner case of envenomed weapons. Consider that 1 Potence is all you need to never, ever miss.

To clarify: If you run it just like NWoD, Defense and Armor subtract from your attack pool, they don't subtract successes. If you roll Defense+Armor and then subtract those successes from the attacker's successes, that could work equally well, but it's another extra roll.

This all leaves aside the fact that Fort 5 makes you invulnerable to mundane attackers, and Potence 5 basically autokills. That was a power level issue with OWoD, and working as intended.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Belial » Fri May 29, 2009 11:36 pm UTC

Yeah, that makes sense, I can see how that would be problematic as hell.

Is this a problem that is in new vampire by default as well, or did they do something to potence and fortitude for requiem to make it work?

It seems like the obvious fix would be to calculate the actual "do I hit or not" without factoring in potence, and then add the autosuccesses only on the damage done. That is, if the dice say you don't hit, you don't hit and potence doesn't change that, but if they say you do hit you get X number of extra successes.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Fri May 29, 2009 11:39 pm UTC

That's one of the most common changes to the nWoD combat system I've heard (to combat the whole "sniper rifle almost guaranteed to do some damage, but not necessarily a lot" problem) so I think it should work.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Yuri2356 » Sat May 30, 2009 12:51 am UTC

Belial wrote:Yeah, that makes sense, I can see how that would be problematic as hell.

Is this a problem that is in new vampire by default as well, or did they do something to potence and fortitude for requiem to make it work?

It seems like the obvious fix would be to calculate the actual "do I hit or not" without factoring in potence, and then add the autosuccesses only on the damage done. That is, if the dice say you don't hit, you don't hit and potence doesn't change that, but if they say you do hit you get X number of extra successes.

In Requiem Vigor (new potence) just gives gives pluses to strength when its on, adding dice instead of success. Resilience (new fort) grants temporary extra health and lets you downgrade damage. They balance fairly well in nWoD so if you wanted to switch to one-roll fighting in masque you may want to just carry over how those two work.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Serrin » Sat May 30, 2009 2:01 am UTC

They're now Vigor and Resilience. Vigor adds its rating to strength or maybe just strength pools (in the manner of blood buff). It's no longer autosuxx. One vitae lasts the entire scene, though. Resilience adds health boxes, and gives you a limited ability to downgrade agg.

The houserule Bigglesworth's talking about is usually for guns, not Vigor/Potence, in case that wasn't clear from context. Which, by the way, is a great houserule for making guns lethal and scary, instead of allowing for "gun-nibble". Would work for OWoD Potence too. Personally, I'd tone down potence...but then if you still have 6-action-a-round-celerity, that's treating a gunshot victim with tylenol, and so I'd rebalance everything else and end up playing NWoD. So if you keep the OWoD ruleset mostly intact, your proposed solution is sound.

The trouble with carrying over Resilience and Vigor from Requiem is that Potence and Fort were merely on par in Masquerade, and Celerity would still be the feared and hated autocrat of asskicking.

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Belial » Sat May 30, 2009 4:16 am UTC

Ahh, that makes sense. Well, excellent. It's all kindof academic, really, since I'd probably only be using vampires as NPCs. But it gives me an idea how to handle automatic-success combat gifts, if I run across any.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Sat May 30, 2009 4:52 am UTC

You can play mad scientists in new world of darkness mage. There are, in fact, at least two legacies who specialize in it, and I'm sure a magical tradition or two to do it. The issue is that new mage has so much going on, that running a mage game with just the core and the main is like trying to run a D&D game with just warriors stat-ed out, and the discussion of how wizards and rogues might work. Ok, it's not that bad, but... there are issues.

Eh. I like new mage a lot. Second favourite game to date. New changeling is so much better than old changeling, and is so awesome in general, that I have a hard time liking anything else. But yeah, new mage is good. I know there are idiots some people who prefer old to new, but personally, I couldn't disagree more. Of course, that argument is pointless. So I won't start it again.*

*please don't start it because of this... it was a joke... please... I'm sorry belial...
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Re: World of darkness

Postby bigglesworth » Sat May 30, 2009 11:27 am UTC

Yeah, the core is very much lacking. But the supplements cover virtually any type of game you'd care to think of. * I think you could theoretically run a game using every single supplement. But for a focused game, it's better to concentrate on just one or two supplements with the core.

*I'm still waiting for the Seers versus Pentacle mages in Atlantean ruins on Mars supplement.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Belial » Sat May 30, 2009 5:17 pm UTC

New changeling is so much better than old changeling, and is so awesome in general, that I have a hard time liking anything else.


New changeling *is* pretty awesome. Probably the only one I'll admit is better than the game it replaced. Also, aside from the nWoD core (which is neat for running a lot of things), the only books of theirs I actually buy.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Terebrant » Wed Jul 01, 2009 9:21 pm UTC

Geist's quickstart is out, I skimmed it and it seems not that bad. From what I saw, it has a small DtF feel that I like.

Thoughts ?

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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Wed Oct 14, 2009 11:46 pm UTC

So, I'm slowly reading my copy of geist. Fantastic :)
this game seems... it just seems fun. Like changeling, in that way that it's just neat to see what they can do, and that they're not really all that somber and down. But, they can be. And, I can see where Belial likes it more than changeling, as it has a direction. A very obvious direction.

I want to play :(
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Maseiken » Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:13 pm UTC

Our Geist game is starting on Sunday >X3

I made the creepiest character, a 14 Year-Old Mute, with the Reaper Archetype, who was offered the Deal when he was buried alive for several days with only an air-tube and a trickling water supply.

The fliup-side is that his Geist is completly selfess, and exists almost exclusively to protect and nurture innocents.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Jessica » Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:59 pm UTC

So, Torn? Or Silent? I mean, it looks like a very silent thing, but being buried alive is kind of murder...

So, it's a ghost Spirit geist of children's deaths?
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Maseiken » Fri Oct 16, 2009 6:39 am UTC

Silent.

And yeah, pretty much, I used one of the Chinese Earthquake comics as source for the Geist.
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Re: World of darkness

Postby Marbas » Thu Oct 29, 2009 7:05 am UTC

I wasn't around of Old Mage. But the more I find out about it, the less I like it.

This probably isn't helped by the fact that I really really like New Mage. It makes me smile.


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