EVE Online

Of the Tabletop, and other, lesser varieties.

Moderators: SecondTalon, Moderators General, Prelates

User avatar
Negrebskoh
Posts: 139
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:49 pm UTC
Location: The Netherlands

Re: EVE Online

Postby Negrebskoh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 11:20 pm UTC

How have I not listened to EVE Radio before today...

And 'Hurricanes' is a totally brilliant song.

Spambot5546
Posts: 1466
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:34 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:58 pm UTC

Also, the first issue of "EVE True Stories" came out yesterday.

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev ... he-future/

No spoilers, I only got to read the first page before I had to head in to work.
"It is bitter – bitter", he answered,
"But I like it
Because it is bitter,
And because it is my heart."

User avatar
BlackSails
Posts: 5312
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:48 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby BlackSails » Sat Jun 28, 2014 11:13 am UTC


User avatar
Alasseo
Posts: 526
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 4:25 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Alasseo » Sun Jun 29, 2014 6:36 pm UTC

Did a bunch of posts just disappear?
Eruantale wrote:(I did... I've always wanted to get a Dudley Do-right out of a vending machine)

User avatar
BlackSails
Posts: 5312
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:48 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby BlackSails » Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:52 pm UTC

I dont think so

Spambot5546
Posts: 1466
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:34 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:36 am UTC

So I hopped on EVE tonight for the first time in a while. It was a good night, overall. Ran some FW plexes, and got a couple fights.

We had a frig/dessie fight that ended with my dumbass getting trigger happy and popping a friendly Rifter.

Then, later, some guys showed up in shiny cruisers and wiped us out pretty easily. I didn't even know about the Curse and Ashimmu until afterwards. That's how quickly I died.

So I refitted into a Stabber. For some reason a Moa tried to take us all on solo. That ended about how you'd expect.

Then an arby showed up 100km out and just sat there. We decided I would burn toward it and they'd warp to me when I got point on it. Which is when we learned that you'll warp directly to the anchor point on large FW sites. Sad face.

Finally, I decided to try a dragoon for the first time. The first engagement we got was against some Neutral Worm who wiped out our entire four man gang by himself (The venture wasn't with us, just purple and in-system). I mean, the fact that we'd been chasing an errant rat when he showed up definitely helped him, but I can't imagine it would've gone much differently otherwise. He was dual propped and none of us had a web, so we couldn't keep him in place. We took out two or three of his 'Augmented' drones, but sadly I don't get a KM for those.
"It is bitter – bitter", he answered,
"But I like it
Because it is bitter,
And because it is my heart."

User avatar
Koa
Posts: 503
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:20 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Koa » Mon Dec 05, 2016 7:01 am UTC

So, the story. I guess it's not that interesting.

My less than two week old character is outside of a station. Someone near me contacts me and starts a conversation. They ask if I'm interested in joining a corporation and I say somewhat. We chat a bit, I get an open invitation to their corp (they were CEO) and then they say goodbye and leave.

I joined their public channel and a few days later I decide to send in the app. I was looking at other corporations but this seemed as good as any. I tried to ask where they were located but I couldn't get a straight answer. I had another ten minute conversation with the person that contacted me before, they went through my API, then they let me in.

I was kicked in about a minute. Er, why? "You have been labeled a spy."

As soon as I joined I saw a bunch of war-related chatter, military coms, whatever. I wasn't told that they were pretty deep in a conflict. They were in the process of moving to an alliance they were soon joining, but I was trying to get up to date on the war that they were fighting so I was still curious where they were currently located. I asked again, and I assumed the name of the wrongest of systems in my question. Merely mentioning this system got me kicked out as a spy.

I have another five minute conversation where I absolve myself from being a spy.

> don't worry about it
> worry? I mean even if you wanted me back int he corp you would owe me for this bs
> whatever happens the corp has disabled recruitment for now. sorry about that.
> oh please

And then they cut all communications.

I was a little mad at this point. Worst of all was me absolving myself for no reason. I got screwed when I was kicked, and then I got screwed again by convincing them that I wasn't a spy. I was still treating them like a new companion and trying to work it out, but they had no interest. Their interest was whether or not they made a calculated mistake. They fired me then took my shirt in a hot minute. Wow, it's just like real life.

Also lying to me to try to get me to go away. Such a pathetic lie, after all the conversations I had with them they should have known that I wouldn't ever buy it. How you handle this situation is you bribe me for the mistake. The spare change in their pockets is worth a lot to me, it would have been easy.

It's funny how very sensitive about information they were, and how much information I was exposed to in such a short amount of time... I might as well turn this experience around. I contacted their enemies, told them everything; became the spy I was destined to be.

The CEO finally responds to the mail that I sent right after the lie, about how ugly it all was. If they just left it alone they would have been better off, but they caved in to my scorn and tried to level with me. And in doing so, gave me more intel which I forwarded to their enemy. What a shame.

Enemy thanked and rewarded me. The corp that kicked me has lost a quarter of their members, left the alliance, and now the CEO left. Maybe a corp that is so suspicious of new members is doomed to collapse, maybe there wasn't a covert op in the secret system, maybe the intel wasn't that useful. I have to imagine that it was because it had some invaluable things like "the corp is struggling, we have x with z problem" etc. I don't know, it was a bizarre experience at least.

Update 12/12, a second CEO left and they're down another 25%. It's looking pretty dead.

User avatar
Izawwlgood
WINNING
Posts: 18638
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:55 pm UTC
Location: There may be lovelier lovelies...

Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Dec 15, 2016 3:13 pm UTC

... I think you took that way too personally, and indeed, that you turned around and gave intel to the corps enemy, shows that their paranoia wasn't unwarranted.
... with gigantic melancholies and gigantic mirth, to tread the jeweled thrones of the Earth under his sandalled feet.

Tyndmyr
Posts: 10139
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:38 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Tyndmyr » Thu Dec 15, 2016 8:24 pm UTC

Koa wrote:Also lying to me to try to get me to go away. Such a pathetic lie, after all the conversations I had with them they should have known that I wouldn't ever buy it. How you handle this situation is you bribe me for the mistake. The spare change in their pockets is worth a lot to me, it would have been easy.


The idea that you are owed bribes for this is...very odd. And probably did not endear yourself to them, if expressed.

It's funny how very sensitive about information they were, and how much information I was exposed to in such a short amount of time... I might as well turn this experience around. I contacted their enemies, told them everything; became the spy I was destined to be.


Uh, yes. That's normal, if you're in a conflict, you need to keep some stuff kind of quiet. If you come into a corp, and start asking about all their secrets in a conflict, yeah, you do look like a spy. Which it appears you actually are. So, I'm gonna say that their paranoia was entirely justified, since the danger was quite real.

The CEO finally responds to the mail that I sent right after the lie, about how ugly it all was. If they just left it alone they would have been better off, but they caved in to my scorn and tried to level with me. And in doing so, gave me more intel which I forwarded to their enemy. What a shame.


Obviously, him trying to fix the mistake and be straight with you was an error, then.

Clearly, they have insufficient levels of paranoia, and need to talk to their folks about being overly friendly with new people who pose a risk to them.

User avatar
Koa
Posts: 503
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:20 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Koa » Fri Dec 16, 2016 6:08 pm UTC

I wasn't asking about secrets. I was asking where they were currently located, and because I wasn't getting an answer I started looking around in the corp window for what it might be. I then asked again, suggesting that a system name that I found in the corp window was their location. You're saying that where a corp is located is off limits for new members when a corp is at war? That's silly.
Tyndmyr wrote:Obviously, him trying to fix the mistake and be straight with you was an error, then.

This is correct, but I had pulled the trigger and made my allegiance already. It came much too late, many hours after the fact, and it wasn't terribly sincere. It was their fuck up to leak information to me at that point.
Tyndmyr wrote:Clearly, they have insufficient levels of paranoia, and need to talk to their folks about being overly friendly with new people who pose a risk to them.

I've seen this logic used a lot lately and have no idea why people subscribe to it. They're justified in treating me like a spy because after the fact I was a spy, except I only became a spy because of how they treated me. You can think how I reacted to how they treated me was stupid, but this reasoning is far more stupid. They slighted me, all I had was information, so I used it. It's ultimately a tale of ironic vengeance. You might think vengeance unjust, but frankly I don't care. It's Eve, the whole point of the game is senseless conflict to play with the deep mechanics and freedoms of the game, and to make interesting stories. That doesn't mean full chaos is the way to go but if no one in Eve lived by the "eye for an eye" rule then the game would be dead.


Tyndmyr wrote:The idea that you are owed bribes for this is...very odd. And probably did not endear yourself to them, if expressed.

And here I thought if I had expressed it we could have parted on good terms. If they're just going to dump me to the curb and I have something of theirs, they should probably consider how I feel about them and try to rectify that by giving me what would be less than a tenth of a percent of their total worth. 10m isk would be fine. When they thought I was a spy they treated me like an enemy, when they found out I wasn't a spy they treated me like I was both powerless and worthless. Just collateral damage. I had every incentive from my perspective.
Last edited by Koa on Fri Dec 16, 2016 7:09 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

Tyndmyr
Posts: 10139
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:38 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Tyndmyr » Fri Dec 16, 2016 7:08 pm UTC

Koa wrote:I wasn't asking about secrets. I was asking where they were currently located, and because I wasn't getting an answer I started looking around in the corp window for what it might be. I then asked again, suggesting that a system name that I found in the corp window was their location. You're saying that where a corp is located is off limits for new members when a corp is at war? That's silly.


The whole point of spying is to figure out what they have where, yes.

Tyndmyr wrote:Obviously, him trying to fix the mistake and be straight with you was an error, then.

This is correct, but I had pulled the trigger and made my allegiance already. It came much too late, many hours after the fact, and it wasn't terribly sincere. It was their fuck up to leak information to me at that point.


If the time to apology and trying to sort things out is measured in hours, that's kind of reasonable. People don't play constantly, and information takes a while to trickle about.

Tyndmyr wrote:Clearly, they have insufficient levels of paranoia, and need to talk to their folks about being overly friendly with new people who pose a risk to them.

I've seen this logic used a lot lately and have no idea why people subscribe to it. They're justified in treating me like a spy because after the fact I was a spy, except I only became a spy because of how they treated me. You can think how I reacted to how they treated me was stupid, but this reasoning is far more stupid. They slighted me, all I had was information, so I used it. It's ultimately a tale of ironic vengeance. You might think vengeance unjust, but frankly I don't care. It's Eve, the whole point of the game is senseless conflict to play with the deep mechanics and freedoms of the game, and to make interesting stories. That doesn't mean full chaos is the way to go but if no one in Eve lived by the "eye for an eye" rule then the game would be dead.


Look, it seems like you got really upset over something that didn't actually cost you anything. They did you no harm. Ultimately, you were in the same place after being not accepted into their club as you were before. This wasn't good enough for you, and you feel they owed you a lot.

Frankly, that attitude is always a liability.

Tyndmyr wrote:The idea that you are owed bribes for this is...very odd. And probably did not endear yourself to them, if expressed.

And here I thought if I had expressed it we could have parted on good terms. If they're just going to dump me to the curb and I have something of theirs, they should probably consider how I feel about them and try to rectify that by giving me what would be less than a tenth of a percent of their total worth. 10m isk would be fine. When they thought I was a spy they treated me like an enemy, when they found out I wasn't a spy they treated me like I was both powerless and worthless to them. I had every incentive from my perspective.


See, from their perspective, they tried to bring you on board, you acted really fishy, and now you want money. Why on earth should they give you money? People who try to blackmail you *often* cannot be trusted, and will go on to betray you anyways even if paid.

User avatar
Koa
Posts: 503
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:20 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Koa » Fri Dec 16, 2016 7:18 pm UTC

Why would a spy want money? I don't really feel like they owe me so much as I had leverage on them and they slighted me, so I pulled it. If they had kicked me and didn't say anything to me but a cheap apology, I probably would have never thought of doing it. I was primarily motivated by the way I was treated afterwards, in exactly the way I originally described. I didn't consider doing it until I had those thoughts about how the parting was handled, which was obviously after the fact. And I didn't consider that I would have taken a bribe until after I had pulled the trigger.

Tyndmyr
Posts: 10139
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:38 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Tyndmyr » Fri Dec 16, 2016 7:38 pm UTC

*shrug* In my experience, people who try to burn everything down over feeling slighted will always do so eventually. Best to rip the bandaid off and do it as swiftly as possible, without giving them more leverage.

Look, as a brand new player, you *do* offer fairly little to a corp. Just the nature of it. Newbies mostly benefit from corps, not the other way 'round.

And spies are simply a fact of life for wardecced corps.

Yeah, they probably should have been smarter/more subtle about it, but this really wasn't weird on their end. And even if people have left the corp(which can happen for strategic reasons, and does not necessarily mean a lack of power), it's pretty likely that if anyone kept tabs on you afterward, your involvement is known, and you likely won't be remembered positively.

User avatar
Koa
Posts: 503
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:20 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Koa » Fri Dec 16, 2016 8:35 pm UTC

I think posting the story on this tiny corner of the internet caused more of a reputation swing than my character in game. However, being remembered for anything in Eve is more than I could ask for. The idea that I'm on anyone's list is very charitable. The enemy told me they blacked out my name when they forwarded the intel. I appreciated the gesture but honestly I was a little disappointed.

Tyndmyr
Posts: 10139
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:38 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Tyndmyr » Fri Dec 16, 2016 10:06 pm UTC

That, too, is sound operational procedure. Might or might not be traceable all the same, but it's only good sense to try.

User avatar
PeteP
What the peck?
Posts: 1451
Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2011 4:51 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby PeteP » Fri Dec 16, 2016 10:07 pm UTC

What kind of info did you actually get?

User avatar
sardia
Posts: 5813
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:39 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby sardia » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:54 am UTC

The idea that people get off on disapproval is kinda weird. I'd tell him more directly, but it'd weird me out that Koa get a e-peen out of it. Then again, that's the textbook definition of an internet troll, is it not? EVE Online is a crazy world, which is probably much more boring then people let on.

User avatar
Izawwlgood
WINNING
Posts: 18638
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:55 pm UTC
Location: There may be lovelier lovelies...

Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:24 pm UTC

The stories are great. People writing up their actions reveals a lot about how they view... well, themselves, and others, etc.

Koa, it seems like the corp was pretty reasonable top to bottom, and if you wanted back in, you could have politely said 'please contact me after this wardec is over.' instead, you were vindictive and basically became an example of why that policy exists at all.
... with gigantic melancholies and gigantic mirth, to tread the jeweled thrones of the Earth under his sandalled feet.

Tyndmyr
Posts: 10139
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:38 pm UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Tyndmyr » Tue Dec 27, 2016 3:17 pm UTC

sardia wrote:The idea that people get off on disapproval is kinda weird. I'd tell him more directly, but it'd weird me out that Koa get a e-peen out of it. Then again, that's the textbook definition of an internet troll, is it not? EVE Online is a crazy world, which is probably much more boring then people let on.


It's both crazy and boring at the same time. Which is...really odd.

They do some stuff really well, like most of their econ, etc stuff. The politics and player intrigue that grows out of that is really cool.

On the other hand, running missions or what not is boring as all hell. Combat in general tends to feel very samey unless you entirely swap ship roles...and then that ship will also do pretty much the same thing every fight. PvP can be exciting, when it isn't brutally unfair, like gate camping, but those are brief spurts of excitement.

Design wise, I feel like their design needs to collide with WoW or something, and if the best parts of each were stolen, something really amazing could be made.

User avatar
Koa
Posts: 503
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:20 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby Koa » Wed Dec 28, 2016 4:13 am UTC

sardia wrote:The idea that people get off on disapproval is kinda weird. I'd tell him more directly, but it'd weird me out that Koa get a e-peen out of it. Then again, that's the textbook definition of an internet troll, is it not? EVE Online is a crazy world, which is probably much more boring then people let on.

Very bizarre to me that that is your take-away, very strange assumptions. I don't think you even understand the mentality of a troll, but to think that I was trolling by writing and sharing an experience I had, and that I get off on people being critical of me and making inaccurate judgements... I would say something like Izawwlgood did about how interesting of a world you must live in, but rather I think you've picked a side and are being obtuse, granting me no empathy. If anything what the missing puzzle piece is is that I've been screwed over by corps in the distant past in another long story, wherein I instead didn't leak intel and got fucked for it. But that I'm a troll or expected a red carpet laid out before me or that I think a two week old character is going to be valuable to a decently powerful corp... I'm not a fan of this barrage of mischaracterizations. I understand the eve culture of spies, the reason I might say that I'm new is because I'm tenthousand patches behind and don't know a lot of the new rules and ships and mechanics.

A real troll wouldn't have given you a real story, they would have told you everything that makes them look good and everything that makes the other side look bad, and you would have believed them and lolololed none the wiser. Don't you find that reality a bit at odds with your words?

Izawwlgood wrote:Koa, it seems like the corp was pretty reasonable top to bottom, and if you wanted back in, you could have politely said 'please contact me after this wardec is over.' instead, you were vindictive and basically became an example of why that policy exists at all.

lolno. As soon as they had their suspicion it was over. I don't understand how these things aren't clear and why I have to keep explaining things I originally wrote. I don't care if people don't like it but since no one is willing to give me the benefit of the doubt it's like my story is being changed into something else. If people gave me the benefit of the doubt I don't think I would have to make so many clarifications about the corp that I interacted with and not you. How would you know better than me what my chances were of rejoining this corp? How can I be an example of why the policy exists when the policy doesn't account for someone doing something like I did? Do you really believe I would have done it if the "policy" didn't exist? I'm the black sheep to the policy.

I put policy in quotes because it's just a way of eve rather than something this corp decided. If someone new is suspicious during wartime you should probably kick them. That really wasn't the issue, which I think I had already made clear a few times now, assuming anyone is actually reading. If I simply joined a corp and was kicked as a spy I would be a little pissed but no where near motivated enough to do any of this. If I was kicked as a spy and treated with an unnecessary baseline of respect I probably would not have even been pissed. The policy should include don't interrogate and antagonize people you might suspect of being spies while they still have intel, treat them like they're powerless and insignificant when you find that they're not a spy, and then lie and block them as soon as (or just before) they show how agitated they are without resolving the agitation. That sounds like a good addendum to me.

If we're talking policy or practicality, they fucked up. If we're talking everyday morality of the severity of actions and their consequences, then I understandably fucked up, but that sort of everyday morality doesn't perfectly apply to eve so I don't care. For instance, what would happen if, right afterwards, by a huge stroke of luck unknowing of my situation, the enemy corp contacted me to join their corp. We get along and I joined them and told them everything I knew, in much the same way. Would it then be okay to leak the information? How curious if yes.

Besides, the corp is definitely dead. They've been inactive on zkillboard for weeks when they had daily activity. I'm guessing the CEO had a ton of alts and reformed a new corp with some of the key members.

User avatar
Hellaphunt
Posts: 112
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 4:59 pm UTC
Location: DC
Contact:

Re: EVE Online

Postby Hellaphunt » Thu Jul 06, 2017 2:29 pm UTC

Hey, a giant Eve thread that's gone undisturbed for over half a year!

Well, Eve consumed my free time for a good seven damned years. I was enamored by the vastness and freedom. The parallels to human society in trade, "honor", strategies, geopolitics, and history, all contribute to an immersive and (arguably) transcending MMORPG.

The mysterious wormhole space was what locked me in, though. I haven't played in almost a year, though, but I do miss my folks. It was definitely the people that kept me going for so long.
Many of man's greatest achievements were largely inspired by a woman.

User avatar
DaBigCheez
Posts: 809
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2011 8:03 am UTC

Re: EVE Online

Postby DaBigCheez » Thu Jul 06, 2017 5:46 pm UTC

Spooky space is best space.
existential_elevator wrote:It's like a jigsaw puzzle of Hitler pissing on Mother Theresa. No individual piece is offensive, but together...

If you think hot women have it easy because everyone wants to have sex at them, you're both wrong and also the reason you're wrong.

User avatar
Izawwlgood
WINNING
Posts: 18638
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:55 pm UTC
Location: There may be lovelier lovelies...

Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:34 pm UTC

So, this happened.

Biggest EVE heist to date, one of the betrayed leadership kind of threatens the traitor and gets banned for it... Ah EVE. I'm glad I don't play you, but I just can't quit reading about you.
... with gigantic melancholies and gigantic mirth, to tread the jeweled thrones of the Earth under his sandalled feet.

User avatar
Hellaphunt
Posts: 112
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 4:59 pm UTC
Location: DC
Contact:

Re: EVE Online

Postby Hellaphunt » Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:18 am UTC

Haven't seen so much of one event on the front page of r/eve in a long time.
Many of man's greatest achievements were largely inspired by a woman.


Return to “Gaming”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests