EVE Online

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Spambot5546
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Tue Feb 22, 2011 2:46 pm UTC

My CEO insists the Basis have to be paired to they can cap chain. I don't know enough about flying logistic ships to argue the point.
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Swivelguy
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Swivelguy » Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:11 pm UTC

You could roll with 1 basi if you put cap transfers on the mega (assuming that reps from 1 basi is enough). The mega will need 2 large cap xfers if the basi pilot has logi 4 and 1 cap xfer if it has logi 5. Or if one of the basi pilots can fly a scimitar, you can use that solo. The dps gain from an extra ship would far outweigh the loss of 1 or 2 guns on the mega.

SPRs aren't stacking penalized. I don't think anything that effects shield or cap recharge is. 4x SPR drake tanks about 1000 dps. A passive rokh can do about 1150, but won't actually tank better after taking sig radius into account. It also won't necessarily do more dps, depending on range.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:32 pm UTC

Another thing to consider is that fitting the T2 variety of energy transfer arrays results in the creation of cap, so you can probably actively tank the Drake if you have t2 META or LETA's moving stuff in a chain.

But Basilisks put out a TON of reps, I'm not sure that you really need ALL the repping power. When we ran C6 Sleeper sites we had 3x Logistics and typically had one of them on stand by or repping off targets. I'd be surprised to hear that 0.0 complexes put out that kind of damage, but, this is Eve, I've been surprised before.

Swivelguy wrote:SPRs aren't stacking penalized.

Ah, didn't know that. I don't know as much about shield tanking, but I'd wager that a Scorpion with it's 8x midslots put out a pretty heavy shield tank if you go that route.
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Mishrak
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:07 pm UTC

I run 3 accounts personally and I can do any of the rated DED complexes in Sansha nullec. 6/10's and 10/10's.

Black Ops + Covert Cyno/prober + Loki tank. Works like a champ. I'm convinced this is the safest, most efficient way to run complexes in regions that see a lot of hostile traffic. It's also the best way to run them in a region that doesn't have a jump bridge infrastructure (although it helps immensely when it's up). Most people don't bother trying to find you, and as soon as probes appear on scan, you warp to a safe, cloak and wait for them to leave. It's some of the most fun I've ever had in this game earning ISK.


Also on a different note, you can do all kinds of things with your alts on the same account. You can pause training for less than a week and train up a cyno alt, or you can have 0 sp alts in trade hubs or managing your assets in distant locations. Just depends on what you want to do. They don't all have to be training actively to be useful.

Izawwlgood wrote:Ah, didn't know that. I don't know as much about shield tanking, but I'd wager that a Scorpion with it's 8x midslots put out a pretty heavy shield tank if you go that route.


Rattlesnake is a pro tanking ship either passively or actively.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:23 pm UTC

Mishrak wrote:Black Ops + Covert Cyno/prober + Loki tank.

So Widow + Buzzard + Loki?
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Mishrak
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:26 pm UTC

Anathema, but yes.

Panther is probably the best one, but Widow is super pimp. If the Redeemer didn't have such major capacitor issues, it would be the best one hands down for Sansha PVE.

/buff Black Ops

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Alasseo
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Alasseo » Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:44 pm UTC

Wait, since when did the panther become useful?
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:48 pm UTC

The Panther is faster, has a better drone bay and has better range. T1 torps is the best way to go with the Widow, but that requires you to be up close.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Paranoid__Android » Wed Feb 23, 2011 3:07 am UTC

Aw crap, I had to uninstall it.

Degree takes priority right now :(
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Mishrak
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Wed Mar 02, 2011 5:45 pm UTC

Has anyone been able to make any sort of sense out of the exploration dev blog?

http://scrapheap-challenge.com/viewtopi ... 63&start=0

The blog is really vague outside of
a) New pirate loots
b) Rated DED plexes from 6/10 thru 10/10 for every pirate faction in the next release
c) Somehow tied to an Ihub Upgrade

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Re: EVE Online

Postby halbarad » Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:41 pm UTC

The way I understand plexes to currently work is that after completion they respawn else where in the region. With null sec IHub upgrades they increase the chance the plex will respawn in that system.

The dev blog says they will be making more plexes for null sec so the Ihub upgrade actually makes a difference (which I don't think it does now).

This does bode well for high/low sec as they will hopefully make more plexes of 1/10 to 5/10.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Wed Mar 02, 2011 8:33 pm UTC

So no more wandering around Fountain for three hours without ever probing down a single combat site? Because that sounds pretty awesome!
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Re: EVE Online

Postby halbarad » Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:01 pm UTC

Spambot5546 wrote:So no more wandering around Fountain for three hours without ever probing down a single combat site? Because that sounds pretty awesome!


Figuring in :CCP:, I wouldn't be surprised if all the plexes end up in high sec.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Swivelguy » Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:45 pm UTC

They're filling in the gaps in the plexes. So after the change, there will be every difficulty for every faction. This doesn't actually mean they're going to increase the overall spawn rate. I'm with halbarad on this one, they'll probably accidentally set spawn rate = 0 or something.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby halbarad » Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:09 pm UTC

So CSM stuff is up. Anyone got any favourites for who they are likely to vote for or want to see in? I'm hoping Trebor gets in as he was pretty good in CSM 5 and lots of people seem to favour Selene as being a former employee could be useful.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby BlackSails » Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:44 am UTC

Im going to vote for Arden from suddenly ninjas, past that, I dont even know any of the names. Ill probably avoid anyone from a large alliance though.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Alasseo » Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:35 pm UTC

I'm splitting my votes between Seleene and Mittani. Seleene has experience none of the rest of them do, period. And the Mittani, like him or not, is very good.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:32 pm UTC

Mishrak wrote:Has anyone been able to make any sort of sense out of the exploration dev blog?

http://scrapheap-challenge.com/viewtopi ... 63&start=0

The blog is really vague outside of
a) New pirate loots
b) Rated DED plexes from 6/10 thru 10/10 for every pirate faction in the next release
c) Somehow tied to an Ihub Upgrade

So I wanted to ask a serious question about this, rather than just the glib one I used earlier. How do sov upgrades work in relation to plexing? My CEO was looking into upgrading a few of our systems for better money-making, but we don't know enough about the effects to know if it will pay off.
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Mishrak
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:43 pm UTC

That's a great question. I know we just installed the upgrades in one of our systems.

I'm a bit curious myself about how they spawn in general. I've made a lot of money off of them but I don't really know how they work. The information out there is notoriously dated or ambiguous, especially when it comes to the various escalations. My only concern is that the additional plexes will only be tied to the sov upgrade. I really hope that they're all allowed to spawn randomly like the current sigs do. I also hope they don't jack around with the difficulty too much (or at all).

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 03, 2011 6:48 pm UTC

Claiming sov allows you to upgrade your system. Some of the upgrades include creating different sites. For example, the pirate upgrade, at level 5, makes it so the system always has 2 pirate of some sort sites. The wormhole generator thingy at level 5 makes it so there's always 2 wormholes in the system, etc.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Thu Mar 03, 2011 7:04 pm UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:For example, the pirate upgrade, at level 5, makes it so the system always has 2 pirate of some sort sites.

So if we have this upgrade in my system, then when I pop out in my Helios I am guaranteed to find at least two combate sites? As in I run one, finish it and let it despawn, and there will be another one instantly? Will it always spawn pirate sites, or will it spawn drone sites too? Or by "pirate sites" do you mean anything pirate related, including hacking/salvage sites?
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Mishrak
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 7:25 pm UTC

If that's how it works for the Entrapment Upgrade, that's pretty awesome. If that were so, however, it's be fairly comparable to Sanctums and Havens, so I find that unlikely.

From Evelopedia:

Entrapment Array
This military upgrade increases the chance of DED complexes spawning within a system. Every level of the upgrade increases the chance of a higher level DED complex.


This is pretty ambiguous though. Is it higher chance for higher rated DED plexes when they do spawn (but not necessarily an increase in spawn rate), or increased spawn rate, or is it both?

Google isn't turning up much.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:03 pm UTC

From what I understand, it's both. A full upgrade will result in two in system at all times, and I believe they are... uh, 10/10?
This is from a dude in the alliance I was in before I quit who used to solo them dual boxing a Thanatos and Proteus.

I know it seems like a pretty sick deal, but remember that to fully upgrade a system you need to take a lot of time to get the sov up, pay a lot of money to hold the standings, and you probably aren't doing that solo. Two in a system means only two people can solo chain them, and that assumes they finish at the same time. Also, the money is pretty good, about 70m/hr/account, but there are definitely better things to do for cash. Ultimately, I think it's just another perk to bring money in, but by no means the best.

If you're interested in long term, gigantic cash flows, do the wormhole upgrade for a system of yours that has a station. That way, if the wormhole opens to hostiles, big deal, you're supported, if it opens to 'friendlies', they can use your market, and if it opens to no one (more likely), you have 12-24 hrs of farming a C6 without the nightmare of maintaining a POS in W-Space. Sleeper sites are still the best isk/hr/account that I've seen in game, bottoming at about 80m.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:08 pm UTC

I think you're thinking of Sanctums, not 10/10 plexes. There's no way that the upgrades guarantee two static 10/10's in a system, or that would totally trump the Military upgrade and people would be using it very very often.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:09 pm UTC

Maybe not then? I know the dude said you couldn't solo them in just a Thanatos. I'm not sure what level they were though.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:22 pm UTC

Yeah I'm not sure either.

Rated DED plexes have acceleration gates so you couldn't actually use the Carrier inside it. Can you assign fighters to something in a plex that uses acceleration gates? That's the only way a Carrier would be able to contribute to running a plex.

The only thing I can think of where you'd use a Carrier in a plexing scenario would be the unrated Provincial HQ final escalations. Those are pretty ridiculous in terms of dps output and usually only a super tanked T3, a Carrier or a command ship + logi can tank it. But those final ones wouldn't be seeded anywhere.

The Military Upgrade, when at level 5, guarantees two Sanctums and several Havens in system, all the time. Run it once, and in ~2 minutes (or less) another one spawns. Every time. You can run those in a Thanatos no problem, it's just slow. Dual boxing those with a Thanatos to tank and a Proteus for DPS would dramatically speed it up.

[edit]

In hind sight, I may run a set-up similiar to that when I get bored of plexing and have a while to do it. I can easily dual box a dpser and my thanatos to tank them.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:27 pm UTC

That may be what this dude was doing then, the military thingy. Seems like a good deal, except you need to remember that everyone else in the alliance is going to want to take advantage of it too.
Ratting, for example, is pretty solid isk/hr, except when you factor in that other people are also going to want to do it.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:42 pm UTC

An alliance that's big enough to own a significant portion of a region would be wise to give each corporation a system. The corp is then responsible for paying for the sov upgrades. In exchange, they get exclusive rights to the sanctums, havens, etc in their system. That way the only people you're really competing with are people from your corporation, which is much much easier to work out than it would be with someone in the alliance. If you're not in an alliance that does that, and maybe they pay for sov upgrades (rather than the corps), then yeah you're right about that.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:49 pm UTC

Again, it's like ratting; there's a limited number of [thing] and probably a larger number of people. Obviously it's not going to be 23/7, but I wouldn't count on 1 of 2 sites being available for MY usage. That was one thing I liked so much about W-Space. We were seeing on average, 90m/hr/account, lowballing at 80m and maxing at about 120m, and could have sextipled our numbers and still seen that kind of income.

Of course, Wormhole systems run dry eventually.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:55 pm UTC

Yeah definitely. It's one reason I like plexes, and the way I do plexes. I have a bigger range (working on JDC5) and I can get in and out faster than anyone else will ever be able to conventionally.

W-Space sounds pretty cool, I've never done much in there.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:58 pm UTC

So you dual box? Scan down the plex, cyno in, hop the scanner into another ship, run the plex with carrier and other ship, and cyno back out?

I'd worry about getting ganked.

W-space was awesome, but after we had it more or less figured out, it became just a grind, and quite limiting.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:10 pm UTC

Triple box actually. I dual boxed at first, but I hated probing and tanking on the same character, and it's really hard to black ops a plex with only two accounts (might not even be possible).

Covert cyno alt does all the scanning, contributes nothing to the plex. The only thing at risk is about 60m in a ship (cov ops + sisters launcher) and about 90m in implants if she gets podded (+4's).

Loki tanks, Black ops bridges and does dps.

There is never any risk of being ganked if you're smart and pay attention. If hostiles come into local, the only thing you have to watch for is probes. If they start probing, you warp out and cloak. Even a combat scanner will still have to go through the gate, which gives you about 45 seconds to a minute minimum (from when they enter system), if they're really pro scanners, to get out.

Most of the traffic I've seen has been solo bombers and inties, none of which can find you where you're at. It's about as safe as it gets and worlds safer than running anoms or sanctums.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:19 pm UTC

Ah, forgot about the gate they'd have to go through. Yeah, good deal. Except that the presence of probes means you lose all the work you've done once you warp off, but yeah, least you don't lose the ship.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:21 pm UTC

Sites don't usually despawn until you've completely cleared them, do they?
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:26 pm UTC

The DED plexes don't despawn just because you warp out of them, so outside of them ninjaing the plex from you (roaming gangs don't ever do this), the worst thing you have to do is burn back through some acceleration gates. You won't lose any work though. That is different with escalations. Once you're on the 2nd or 3rd one (1st one won't despawn), they will despawn if you warp out completely. Fortunately they're usually 1-kill encounters so you're never there for more than a minute or two. I don't think the final escalation despawns either, but it's been a long time since I've run those. I hate them, personally, and I don't usually do them. I especially hate Prov HQ's because those sigs scan like 10/10's. Buggers.

I once cloaked up for about 2 hours in a system because two roaming gangs were fighting and probing, it was the most irritating plex I'd ever run, but the thing never despawned. I've also found 6/10's that have the entire thing cleared but the last room and the boss (which is the despawn trigger once you kill it and warp out) and it probably had been sitting like that for hours.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Fri Mar 04, 2011 4:18 am UTC

At the risk of making everyone in this thread want to run plexes: This is in the last 20 days of casual stuff. Ignore the shield mods, smart bomb and the subsystems, I've had those for awhile.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby halbarad » Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:27 am UTC

Everything I've heard about how the plex ihub upgrade is that it just increase the chance that a plex will spawn in your system once it's completed elsewhere in the region. I'm not sure how good the bonus is (been a while since I lived in null sec) but I know people generally just farm sanctums for quick isk and go out elsewhere in the region if they want to get plexes.

Edit: Which basically means that if you've got the spare isk and your corp/alliance is keeping the military rating up anyway with ratting sanctums then it might be worth putting a few levels of it in. I guess it depends on how many people are likely to run them when they do turn up.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Spambot5546 » Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:00 pm UTC

Any of you guys Recon pilots? I've been watching videos of the Pilgrim and Arazu and they look like a lot of fun to fly.
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Re: EVE Online

Postby Mishrak » Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:25 pm UTC

Recon 5 finishes in a little over a week.

I would LOVE to fly the Arazu, and might train Gallente Cruiser 5 once Recon 5 finishes. Those things are especially nasty when you have faction points. Fully bonused and overheated you can point stuff at nearly 100km. The Huginn is what I'm enjoying right now, with some Shadow Serpentis webs (~30m each). Curse is another one. A-type Nosferatus (recon 5) and Meta 4 Neuts make it a beast. It smokes the Pilgrim too btw.

The only negative thing about them is they're almost always primary, so you need to be on your game. Also, since you really can't reach their full potential unless you use some faction stuff on them, they can be rather expensive to lose. They're also a bit slow and can be paper thin (Falcon!), but despite that, if you fly them in a good gang or fleet, they're pretty survivable. Recon 5 is necessary to really utilize their maximum fitting potential since they're really tight on CPU until then and the bonuses are freaking wonderful, however you can still get some solid fits out of Recon 4.

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Re: EVE Online

Postby Alasseo » Fri Mar 11, 2011 3:51 am UTC

Recon 5 since who knows when checkin in. Rapier/Huginn here.

You don't need faction stuff to enjoy your recons. It's handy, but by no means needed. In point of fact, there's rarely a use for faction webs on a huginn. You're webbing well out of point range for anything but an arazu, and if you have a fleet fight such that you can "hide" well out of range of the main melee, your t2 webs will very likely make you just as safe. Also, pah huginn. Fly a rapier. Same webs, and you can cloak and probe (and BLOPS). and if you complain about low DPS on rapier vs faction webbing huginn...

But yes, cloaky stuff and ewar stuff is fun to fly. Pilgrim/Curse have more limited engagement ranges solo cause they need to find an active tanker, but that's getting to be less and less hard in the solo/small gang world. All of the cloaky recons are (nowadays) not that great at solo anyways. They either don't have the DPS (rapier, falcon, and being honest, arazu) or depends on the target being active tanked (and hopefully turret based) (pilgrim). Rook/curse are the superior two for non-cloakies, followed by lach/huginn, though I know those who quibble about my lach placement. It's great at single target shutdown, but lacks dps. Eh.
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