You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

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Thadlerian
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Thadlerian » Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:57 pm UTC

korora wrote:I went to embark in the new version, only to find that the embark details have been mostly obscured: rather than seeing all the layers, you just see indicators of how much soil there is (deep/some/little/no soil) and whether there's clay, flux, "deep metal", or "shallow metal". Which makes sense, from a realism standpoint. Not sure whether the deep/shallow metals imply type or just location, and the wiki is no help on the matter.

Toady has cut down the abundance of metals and minerals real hard, in order to make it more realistic. The time of plenty coal, iron and gold is past, and for good reason - a trade economy wouldn't make sense otherwise. But in one of the main forum threads he said he'd make it an option to have something like the old abundance.

Not sure how I feel about it. It could be fun - ending up importing iron ore or coal or whatever to be able to run your industry.

Shallow metal implies iron and iron-esque stuff, that is, metals in the upper layers. Deep metal is more like the stuff you find way down, including adamantine.

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Vaniver
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Vaniver » Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:39 pm UTC

Thadlerian wrote:Toady has cut down the abundance of metals and minerals real hard, in order to make it more realistic. The time of plenty coal, iron and gold is past, and for good reason - a trade economy wouldn't make sense otherwise. But in one of the main forum threads he said he'd make it an option to have something like the old abundance.
By "old abundance" you mean the recent explosion, where it seemed like you got a vein of metal in every block, or how things were before that? (I seem to remember that changing with 40d, but I don't trust my memory on that)
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Thadlerian
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Thadlerian » Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:44 pm UTC

Vaniver wrote:By "old abundance" you mean the recent explosion, where it seemed like you got a vein of metal in every block, or how things were before that? (I seem to remember that changing with 40d, but I don't trust my memory on that)

DF2010 abundance. Coal and iron everywhere when you're on sedimentary. In 40d it was moderate, but more than now. Can't say before 40d.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Menacing Spike » Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:54 pm UTC

Amazing drawing from the Fanart thread on their forums:

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:45 pm UTC

Need coal. Managed to find silver but nothing more. :(
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby korora » Wed Feb 23, 2011 10:33 pm UTC

I think the reduced ore will work better once the caravan stuff is fixed/finished. I can easily see myself settling on a volcano with little to no ore, importing wagons upon wagons of ore, and exporting metal goods. Throw in some clay for infinite free containers and that sounds pretty good. The only problem is wagons still don't show up, and it sure would be nice to have the request cycle run faster than a year.

I really like the livestock improvements though. In my first fort on the latest version, I embarked with chickens, rabbits, sheep, and yaks in a savage area. I was still getting my first few rooms dug out; all my animals were in a big pasture zone and all my items were in a big common stockpile outside. I built some workshops outdoors and made some nest boxes for my hens, and here's where it gets good: I q-look at one of the boxes and notice that it's been claimed by a water crocodile. As soon as I unpause, a green C sprints into my pasture to get to the nest box and apparently gets very territorial, because the next thing I know both my hunting dogs are dead and my livestock is scattered. I activate my hunter (the only dwarf among them who knows how to fight) into the military, but he's already used up all the ammo that came free with his skills and I haven't made more yet, so he gets chomped pretty fast, walks away fainting, then bravely comes back for more and dies, at which point I chalk the fortress up as a loss.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Thu Feb 24, 2011 9:13 am UTC

Well, my World gen keeps throwing little elves at me. So I close up the fort, and watch them fall in my cage traps. All good. Only 1 casualty, no worries, no one liked em anyway.
Now, I have lots of cages and some wild animals too. I see I can select them for a trade. Cool. Lets see if I can sell elves.

"Interrupted by elf bowman".
Oh, seems they can escape from cages.
5 elves, 2 buzzards run around my fort causing chaos. The traders just look on in astonishment. As the elves are out of ammo and weak they cause no damage, but it did get confusing for a while. :P
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Jar'O'Jam » Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:11 am UTC

Technical Ben wrote:"Interrupted by elf bowman".
Oh, seems they can escape from cages.
5 elves, 2 buzzards run around my fort causing chaos. The traders just look on in astonishment. As the elves are out of ammo and weak they cause no damage, but it did get confusing for a while. :P


I believe the glitch with trading cages hasn't been fixed yet. There's also a brilliant Three Panel Soul strip on that:

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Levi
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Levi » Fri Feb 25, 2011 5:01 am UTC

How much do you all focus on individual dwarves? Sometimes I'll keep an eye on one who does something amazing or if they're a noble, but usually I don't keep track of them or even bother to check their personality traits and physical ability before assigning their jobs. I like to deal more on the macro level and usually build up a large population as fast as I can. I was wondering how many people actually bother to put together the things their dwarves like best and assign them to the jobs they'd be best at.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Menacing Spike » Fri Feb 25, 2011 7:22 am UTC

Levi wrote:How much do you all focus on individual dwarves? Sometimes I'll keep an eye on one who does something amazing or if they're a noble, but usually I don't keep track of them or even bother to check their personality traits and physical ability before assigning their jobs. I like to deal more on the macro level and usually build up a large population as fast as I can. I was wondering how many people actually bother to put together the things their dwarves like best and assign them to the jobs they'd be best at.


If the dwarf strangles a horde of crundles with his toes or something, I'm going to pay attention to him. Same for legendary migrants.
Aside from that, no, dwarf therapist -> custom job for menial works -> assign and forget.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:53 am UTC

Only if really needed. I'll check materials and put them in a nobles room if he likes it. With the lesser availability now. I might just make a large pool, next to a trap... as I have not got Magma yet! :wink:
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:13 pm UTC

As an update, the game has had a lot of bug fixes lately, with more coming. Which is really good. So if you stopped playing because of an irritating bug, likelihood is it's gone now! :D
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby uncivlengr » Sat Mar 12, 2011 3:02 am UTC

Started playing this week and really like the new version... caverns are great, always being able to find magma is great..... staying up obscenely late on a week night isn't so great.

Also, anyone looking to try it should check out the "Lazy newb Pack"... it puts all the worthwhile mods together, as well as makes it easy to change a lot of the settings.

I have one question about screen resolution: is there absolutely no way to get the window to be less than 80 tiles wide? If not, what the hell?
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Sat Mar 12, 2011 3:24 pm UTC

Scroll mouse button? As in you can zoom in and out now with it. :D
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Shivahn » Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:41 pm UTC

So, I'm finally getting into Dwarf Fortress because I haven't already.

Is there a concise, relatively simple tutorial out there? I ask because at the moment I have one two three tutorials and a wiki open in tabs and I'm trying to synthesize information from all of them and adapt to the fact that some are for outdated versions and frankly, it's a bit overwhelming. I mean, I know the game is to begin with, but it seems like I could cut down on the number of active resources I'm using. I'm also reading the manual, albeit slowly, because I tried to play once before, and got frustrated when after an hour of reading I still couldn't do anything. Now that I know how to mine it's exciting but I'm having trouble with everything else so...
Last edited by Shivahn on Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:21 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:57 pm UTC

Hmmm. I've learnt by trial and error mainly. Then using the Wiki to find out what materials do what, then what jobs/trades/workshops make the things I want.
Having an embark on a good location helps. (I'm setting it to hight resources :D) Then you can just cut down loads of trees, and gather lots of plants. Look up "farming" on the wiki. Once you get enough food, at least you can take the rest of the learning at your own pace... until "fun" tuns up. :(
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby SecondTalon » Sun Mar 13, 2011 4:56 am UTC

Shivahn wrote:So, I'm finally getting into Dwarf Fortress because I haven't already.

Is there a concise, relatively simple tutorial out there?

Outside of being comfortable with your first 10 dying horrible deaths? Not really. Not that I'm aware of, at least.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Shivahn » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:04 am UTC

All right. I have accepted my death and begun building my fortress. I feel like I might be missing a few things though, but I'm sure I'll pick them up about ten seconds after they would've been useful.

One question I have, though: is it usual to have a leader type person and doctor type person with no other purpose in the beginning? I had two miners, a carpenter, a farmer, a doctor, a leader, and a mason, but everyone was idling except the miners and farmer so I let everyone begin mining and such. That seems kind of weird to me, and makes the miners superfluous, but it seems like an ok strategy in the beginning. Am I wrong?

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Patros » Sun Mar 13, 2011 12:46 pm UTC

I learned to not die immediatly from the Youtube Tutorial.
Right now, i wait on the new stuff to lose its bugs, then i will be playing again.

And yes, i always take extra picks to have my doctor help out the miners.
Better then letting him stand around, i guess.

Also, how is the mineral situation right now?
I heard that there are less veins now, so how is it playing out?

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:47 pm UTC

Shivahn wrote:All right. I have accepted my death and begun building my fortress. I feel like I might be missing a few things though, but I'm sure I'll pick them up about ten seconds after they would've been useful.
...

This. Yes. A THOUSAND times. (Don't know if I should use a laughing or crying smiley.)

I tend to use the leader for moving objects to begin with, as I don't want him training on task he will never get the time to use. You don't want him off milking a cow getting goblin arrows in his back. Or cleaning out a zoo when the traders are getting impatient.

The doctor I get to either hunt (and make him a combat medic!... but not had a chance to use him for that yet) or have him cut down trees. As it's a skill that is quick and easy to train, so I can replace him easily. I can also interrupt it, as it's not as vital as making drink etc.

My miners, I try to never let sit still. A busy Dwarf is a happy Dwarf.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby SecondTalon » Sun Mar 13, 2011 4:49 pm UTC

Shivahn wrote:All right. I have accepted my death and begun building my fortress. I feel like I might be missing a few things though, but I'm sure I'll pick them up about ten seconds after they would've been useful.

One question I have, though: is it usual to have a leader type person and doctor type person with no other purpose in the beginning? I had two miners, a carpenter, a farmer, a doctor, a leader, and a mason, but everyone was idling except the miners and farmer so I let everyone begin mining and such. That seems kind of weird to me, and makes the miners superfluous, but it seems like an ok strategy in the beginning. Am I wrong?

I usually have 2 miners, 1 woodcutter/carpenter, 1 mason/engraver/architect, 1 stone carver with minors in jewelry skills, 1 grower/brewer/cook with minors in herbalism, and a diagnoser/appraiser with a minor in mechanics who just hauls shit until I build an office so he can record keep.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Jessica » Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:03 pm UTC

If you check out the wiki, there are a few quickstart guides which are ok for getting off the ground, but otherwise, it's trial and error.

The wiki is your best friend for DF.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby uncivlengr » Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:13 pm UTC

There are also plenty of youtube tutorials, which is how I originally learned - many provide download links to their save files, which allows you to play along with the same map. Once you get the basics down on how to dig, build workshops, create stockpiles, construct furniture, and farm, you're left with enough freedom to play around - without those you're certainly going to run into immediate problems.

I can't be arsed to find all the links, but the videos of captduck are one of the more popular choices, though most of his beginner stuff is the older versions of the game.

I've recently found videos by a user named Revocane, which I haven't had time to watch, but seem to be fairly in-depth and current.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Shivahn » Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:44 pm UTC

All right, thanks everyone. I am confident in my ability to get all my dwarfs killed. The only things I'm not confident in at the moment are the military and hospitals. I'm abandoning my current fortress because of some errors I made earlier, so now that I understand labor and setting stuff up a lot more, I should be able to make a much better fortress.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Levi » Tue Mar 15, 2011 8:51 pm UTC

WAR ELEPHANTS

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Jessica » Tue Mar 15, 2011 8:57 pm UTC

Every time I enter this thread I want to play DF again.
If only I had time to devote to these horrible creatures called dwarfs.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Mar 15, 2011 9:01 pm UTC

Shivahn wrote:All right, thanks everyone. I am confident in my ability to get all my dwarfs killed. The only things I'm not confident in at the moment are the military and hospitals. I'm abandoning my current fortress because of some errors I made earlier, so now that I understand labor and setting stuff up a lot more, I should be able to make a much better fortress.

Honestly, given a long enough entrance to the outside/underdark, and a sufficient number of Stone Fall Traps that you cycle out and replace with Weapon Traps, you don't really need a military.

And if no one gets hurt, you don't need a hospital.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Shivahn » Tue Mar 15, 2011 9:11 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
Shivahn wrote:All right, thanks everyone. I am confident in my ability to get all my dwarfs killed. The only things I'm not confident in at the moment are the military and hospitals. I'm abandoning my current fortress because of some errors I made earlier, so now that I understand labor and setting stuff up a lot more, I should be able to make a much better fortress.

Honestly, given a long enough entrance to the outside/underdark, and a sufficient number of Stone Fall Traps that you cycle out and replace with Weapon Traps, you don't really need a military.

And if no one gets hurt, you don't need a hospital.


That's true, but I'd still like an army to help hunt the most dangerous game.

Spoiler:
I'm pretty sure they're called Megabeasts and I want to cook and eat one.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Mar 15, 2011 9:30 pm UTC

Nah. The most dangerous game is Hidden Fun Stuff, or HFS. THAT is immune to traps and requires a substantial military to beat back.

Megabeasts are stupid and will let rocks fall on their head. Or heads, depending on the beast in question.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Shivahn » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:17 pm UTC

Ah. That was unfortunately spoiled for me by Captain Duck's video tutorial. Grr. I have the worst luck with spoilers.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby BlackSails » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:21 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:Nah. The most dangerous game is Hidden Fun Stuff, or HFS. THAT is immune to traps and requires a substantial military to beat back.

Megabeasts are stupid and will let rocks fall on their head. Or heads, depending on the beast in question.


Arent some megabeasts unkillable?

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Shivahn » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:24 pm UTC

From what I've read, that was recently patched up.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:59 am UTC

Shivahn wrote:All right, thanks everyone. I am confident in my ability to get all my dwarfs killed. The only things I'm not confident in at the moment are the military and hospitals. I'm abandoning my current fortress because of some errors I made earlier, so now that I understand labor and setting stuff up a lot more, I should be able to make a much better fortress.


I'd recommend Digging a trench for protection. I have been making walls all this time, but then realised a trench takes a fraction of the time to dig, and offers the same protection. Only flying enemies get past, and you'll have time to get prepared for that.

So Dig a 2 block deep trench around a large square above ground. This is going to be your fortress outside. You can now cut trees and get plants safely. You can set animals in a pasture too.
Then dig out a tunnel underground with a ramp at least 3 squares wide. This will act as a tunnel to get to your Depot. Put a depot at the end, then off from the depot put your entrance to your main underground fortress. At this point I put storage on the level beneath the depot, and everything else beneath that.
You can then but floodgate/bridges in the tunnel for a series of safety doors to hold out enemies. You can add traps too. Then on the surface have a bridge for your trade caravans to get over the trench (do this first else you block everyone out). To add even more protection wall off the outside fortress so arrows cannot get in. Then add a long outside corridor for even more traps and bridges/gates.

Oh, the only problem with this setup is the 20 odd levels you get. Which one powers the Atom Smasher, and which one floods the hospital? :lol:
Using this setup, I successfully held off 2 goblin attacks that came at the same time a Titan and Caravan turned up. They all weakened the titan, and my lone military Dwarf finished him off. He only broke a finger taking out a Giant.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:43 pm UTC

And that's why labeling levers is important.

One thing to remember, though, is that when Wagons get fixed, if there isn't a path RIGHT THEN, Wagons won't come. Doesn't matter that you can open a path by pulling levers and popping bridges back out - wagons will see that there's no path, and refuse to come.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Menacing Spike » Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:14 pm UTC

Technical Ben wrote:
Shivahn wrote:I'd recommend Digging a trench for protection. I have been making walls all this time, but then realised a trench takes a fraction of the time to dig, and offers the same protection. Only flying enemies get past, and you'll have time to get prepared for that.



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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:18 pm UTC

Trench first, wall second, glass ceiling third.

Complete Dwarven Security - Priceless.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Technical Ben » Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:11 pm UTC

You don't even need a glass ceiling. Stone will do.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Menacing Spike » Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:20 pm UTC

Technical Ben wrote:You don't even need a glass ceiling. Stone will do.


Hello? Above-ground cultures?

Hopefully in version 0.73b frying your dwarves with the greenhouse effect?

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:42 pm UTC

Technical Ben wrote:You don't even need a glass ceiling. Stone will do.

But how else do you keep the Dwarves down?
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already

Postby Jessica » Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:31 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
Technical Ben wrote:You don't even need a glass ceiling. Stone will do.
But how else do you keep the Dwarves down?
<3
Menacing Spike wrote:Hello? Above-ground cultures?
I like that as long as it was once built from the surface, even if you make a regular floor, everything underneath it is still open to the sun.

Because dwarf fortress logic is awesome.

I love my greenhouses, made with stone.
doogly wrote:On a scale of Mr Rogers to Fascism, how mean do you think we're being?
Belial wrote:My goal is to be the best brain infection any of you have ever had.


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