Magic : The Gathering : The Thread : The Rename

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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby rrwoods » Thu Oct 08, 2009 3:24 pm UTC

Klapaucius wrote:Additionally: Rite of Replication is pure win. Blue may have the worst creatures, but six of anything tends to own.

Kicking Rite of Replication at Kokusho seems really good :-P
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Jessica » Thu Oct 08, 2009 3:47 pm UTC

That does sound pretty awesome, but not really necessary. Just cloning works, no? I mean, assuming you have the kokusho...
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby rrwoods » Thu Oct 08, 2009 3:51 pm UTC

Jessica wrote:That does sound pretty awesome, but not really necessary. Just cloning works, no? I mean, assuming you have the kokusho...

That's only ten life though. You still have ten points of work to do.

Kicking a Rite at him is 30 points of lifeloss... even if your opponent has persisted several Kitchen Finks, you're in the clear.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Fin Archangel » Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:00 pm UTC

rrwoods wrote:
Klapaucius wrote:Additionally: Rite of Replication is pure win. Blue may have the worst creatures, but six of anything tends to own.

Kicking Rite of Replication at Kokusho seems really good :-P


Too much mana. Rite is REALLY good anyway, though :D

Jessica wrote:That does sound pretty awesome, but not really necessary. Just cloning works, no? I mean, assuming you have the kokusho...


Yeah. Rite is bettar.

Rite is also a huge bomb. Seriously.

So is Iona :O
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Jessica » Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:05 pm UTC

Oh, I agree Rite is better. I'm just saying rite + kokusho isn't really necessary... I mean, there are better and faster kills no?

But, that's because I don't enjoy needing to have a 6 cost black dragon in play, not winning with it alone, and waiting for 9 mana to make 6 of them and drain for 30. If I'm gonna combo out, I'd rather dragonstorm for 4 bogardan kellkites, no?
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Fin Archangel » Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:07 pm UTC

Jessica wrote:Oh, I agree Rite is better. I'm just saying rite + kokusho isn't really necessary... I mean, there are better and faster kills no?

But, that's because I don't enjoy needing to have a 6 cost black dragon in play, not winning with it alone, and waiting for 9 mana to make 6 of them and drain for 30. If I'm gonna combo out, I'd rather dragonstorm for 4 bogardan kellkites, no?


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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Jessica » Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:19 pm UTC

Then the same deck with kokusho. And it kills everyone.

What I'm saying is getting 4BB and 7UU is harder than getting 8R once. Especially since, in the first instance you have to either put 4BB turns before the 7UU, and not have it die. and if you put it in play turn 6, and have to wait 3 turns before you can rite it, you can do better things with 9 mana.

But, that's me. I'm not saying rite is bad. I'm just not thinking of pairing it with Kokusho.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby rrwoods » Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:22 pm UTC

Jessica wrote:I'm just not thinking of pairing it with Kokusho.

I just think it's wacky and hilarious :-P D-storm is obviously better.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Jessica » Thu Oct 08, 2009 8:15 pm UTC

:)
I like what the serious fun guy was talking about this week. Attacking with 6 7/1s. :D
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Klapaucius » Thu Oct 08, 2009 8:39 pm UTC

Jessica wrote::)
I like what the serious fun guy was talking about this week. Attacking with 6 7/1s. :D

The Zektar Flame Expedition and Rite of Replication, or Elemental Affinity and Rite of Replication, would make 6 6/1s with trample and haste for eight to twelve mana.

So, I've made a goblin deck. It turns out that the red/blue intro pack was one good red dragon, one good blue spell (RoR) and a bunch of goblins; I got a 2010 booster with Goblin Chieftain, and knew I had to make a mono-red goblin deck.
Now I really want to play a tag match with me and a friend against two other friends, my ally using the goblin deck and me using my devour deck--which includes Voracious Dragon, which has devour and upon entering play does damage to target creature or player equal to twice the goblins it devoured. By the same it sees play we'll probably have eight goblins on the field, at least, making it a 12/12 with flying that does 16 unblockable damage before it attacks.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Bulvox » Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:57 pm UTC

Fin Archangel wrote:Elves are more awesome anyway.
Elementals are better.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby RetSpline » Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:15 pm UTC

If we're going to get into some sort of tribe war, I must insist upon the superiority of zombies

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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Azrael001 » Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:39 pm UTC

Knights (Or soldiers if you prefer) are better. Especially when complimented by Angels.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Bulvox » Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:42 pm UTC

wow...I didn't see that last page pop up...So, for my standard deck I'm trying to build a Red deck, because red is the colour of budget. Here's my list:
14x Mountain
4x Arid Mesa
2x Teetering Peaks

4x Ball Lightning
4x Plated Geopede
4x Hellspark Elemental
4x Goblin Guide/Ruinous Minotaur
3x Hell's Thunder

4x Zektar Shrine Expedition
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Burst Lightning
4x Volcanic Fallout
3x Mark of Mutiny
2x Spire Barrage

SB
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4x Unstable Footing
3x Pyroclasm
4x Magma Spray
4x Punishing Fire
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Azrael001 » Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:47 pm UTC

That doesn't look like fun at all. At least from a defending standpoint. I'll show you the deck that I want to make. One moment please...
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Fin Archangel » Fri Oct 09, 2009 12:41 am UTC

Budget? Last time I checked Ball Lightning was like $10, and Hellspark was pretty high too.

I'm thinking of putting together a Legacy goblins deck. Lemme post a decklist in a few...
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Bulvox » Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:54 am UTC

Fin Archangel wrote:Budget? Last time I checked Ball Lightning was like $10, and Hellspark was pretty high too.

I'm thinking of putting together a Legacy goblins deck. Lemme post a decklist in a few...
I managed to pick them up before they really jumped in price. Also, a foil Lightning Bolt is $12.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Fin Archangel » Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:35 pm UTC



I'll assume no budget restrictions. If there are, tell.
You've got very, very little early game action. I'd say...
-1(or 2) Iona
-4 Battlegrace Angel (it's just not good enough, man.)
-4 Journey to Nowhere (o-ring / path has got it covered.)
-2 Oblivion Ring (too much removal.)
-1(or 2) Jenara, Asura of War (it's legendary. Plus, drawing one is usually enough anyway. Also, it dies to everything.)
-4 Wall of Denial (No.)
-8 Borderposts (there are much, much better options.)
-1-3 Day of Judgement (Creature heavy deck + Wrath effects don't go together very well. I'd personally keep it at 3.)

Additions:
+4 Baneslayer Angel (This guy needs no justification.)
+4 Rhox War Monk (Awesome card.)
+2-4 Bant Charm (It's much better removal with a lot more versatility, and you can support the colors. It protects you from Doom Blade, which would otherwise wreck you.)
+4 Noble Hierarch (You NEED this guy. You NEED him.)
+4 U/G Fetchland (Dunno what it's called. w/e.)
+4 U/W and W/G M10 Dual (and replace all holes in your manabase with basics. These + fetch = good mana.)
+2-4 Dauntless Escort (This guy is amazingly good on defense. It makes combat almost impossible for your opponent.)
+3-4 Jhessian Infiltrator (Helps you push through your exalted.)
+2-3 Finest Hour (Amazing. Period. A bit expensive, but definitely fits the theme.)
+4? Lotus Cobra (Amazing, but not sure if you want it. It's definitely not BAD.)

SB some harms, Qasali Pridemage, counterspells, DoJ if you took it out, and the rest of your Dauntless escorts.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Azrael001 » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:02 pm UTC

Fin Archangel wrote:I'll assume no budget restrictions. If there are, tell.
You've got very, very little early game action. I'd say...
-1(or 2) Iona
-4 Battlegrace Angel (it's just not good enough, man.) I've already got the four of them, I'd replace them with Baneslayers (I've only got one) in an instant
-4 Journey to Nowhere (o-ring / path has got it covered.) You can never have too much removal.
-2 Oblivion Ring (too much removal.)
-1(or 2) Jenara, Asura of War (it's legendary. Plus, drawing one is usually enough anyway. Also, it dies to everything.) But with Rafiq it's a turn five win, and if it dies to everything, I can just play another.
-4 Wall of Denial (No.) Wall of denial is awesome, it's an early defender that is extremely hard to kill, and it buys time for the late game hammers.
-8 Borderposts (there are much, much better options.) Agreed, but I don't have them, and I do have the borderposts. Knight of the White Orchid should probably be thrown in, which would make the 'posts better.
-1-3 Day of Judgement (Creature heavy deck + Wrath effects don't go together very well. I'd personally keep it at 3.) Normally I'd agree, but with higher cost creatures that take longer to get out, there must be a strong answer to the zerg rush.

Additions:
+4 Baneslayer Angel (This guy needs no justification.) Agreed
+4 Rhox War Monk (Awesome card.) I'd rather have the walls
+2-4 Bant Charm (It's much better removal with a lot more versatility, and you can support the colors. It protects you from Doom Blade, which would otherwise wreck you.) I've never really seen it before, but I agree, it'd replace two O-rings and two Journeys
+4 Noble Hierarch (You NEED this guy. You NEED him.) Yes
+4 U/G Fetchland (Dunno what it's called. w/e.) Misty Rainforest, I've got one, and it would be better than the posts
+4 U/W and W/G M10 Dual (and replace all holes in your manabase with basics. These + fetch = good mana.) So would these
+2-4 Dauntless Escort (This guy is amazingly good on defense. It makes combat almost impossible for your opponent.) There isn't enough room in the deck for these extra creatures, they are all good, but would have to replace other, more important cards
+3-4 Jhessian Infiltrator (Helps you push through your exalted.)
+2-3 Finest Hour (Amazing. Period. A bit expensive, but definitely fits the theme.) It does indeed. I've seen a deck based on this an Rafiq, but it wasn't built quite right, and wasn't able to really go off.
+4? Lotus Cobra (Amazing, but not sure if you want it. It's definitely not BAD.) Again, there isn't really a lot of room, though I suppose it could replace a few lands...

SB some harms, Qasali Pridemage, counterspells, DoJ if you took it out, and the rest of your Dauntless escorts.


I did forget Bloom Tender, which makes the borderposts much more useful.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Klapaucius » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:27 pm UTC

This is what I want to make--my RGB deck, completely overhauled:

Voracious Dragon x4
Predatory Dragon x2
Broodmother Dragon x2
Charnelhoard Wyrm x2
Mycoloth x2
Scarland Thrinax x4
Sprouting Thrinax x4
Siege-Gang Commander x2
Caldera Hellion x2
Dragon Fodder x2
Mind Rot x2
Blackmail x2
Yoke of the Damned x2
Mark of Treason x4 (which is the one that gives +1/+1? Mark of Mutiny? If so, that one instead)

Something like this. The one I have now is full of the bog standard "if you have a green, this red creature gets this" permutations that don't really serve what should be a pure devour deck.
I have two Mark of Mutiny already--the idea is to take control of a monster, attack with it, and then get a Scarland Thrinax or something similar to devour it. Same thing with Yoke of the Damned.
The Mind Rot and Blackmail are there because devourers are weak to kill spells, and I need to keep them discarding to get rid of their Assassinates and Cancels.
And I could be more devious than this--there are better monsters with devour that I should include, and there are better ways to pump out goblins and saprolings than what I'm using. Then there are recursive sacrifice fodder cards like Bloodghast and Endless Cockroaches, as well as non-RGB token machines (my friend might give me his Nuisance Engine).
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Bulvox » Fri Oct 09, 2009 10:21 pm UTC

I can fix this deck, but I need to know what you want to do with it. So, is it a Bant Aggro? or is it Bant Control? This actually makes a difference on what cards I take out and put in...well except for the land. Here's how you fix the land:
-8 Borderpost
-4 Plains

+4 Misty Rainforest
+4 Glacial Fortress
+4 Sunpetal Grove
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Azrael001 » Fri Oct 09, 2009 10:50 pm UTC

I don't see why it can't be a balance of both. I was a bit too lazy to research the lands I'd need, so I went with what I knew...
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Fin Archangel » Fri Oct 09, 2009 10:57 pm UTC

1) This isn't limited. You can DEFINITELY have too much removal, since not all decks are going to be creature-heavy. Or even have any creatures.
2) The thing about Jenara is the mana you need to pump to make her good, preventing you from playing important spells early game. She's really only good late game (and man, is she GOOD late game.) Want a quick win? Rafiq of the Many + Finest Hour by themselves is 5*2+7*2=24 damage. With Noble Hierarch, that's as early as turn 4.
3) The Monks are better than the wall. The wall tends to do nothing if you're winning and delay the inevitable a bit if you're losing. You already have a ton of removal. War Monk can gain you upwards of 8-12 life a turn with Rafiq or Finest Hour on the field.
(If you want to play a later, stall, bomby game, I suggest you sit solidly in blue/white, make green your splash, replace Noble Hierarch, add straight counters like Negate and Essence Scatter, Put lots of anything in, and play big bombs like Baneslayers, or Iona, etc. etc. Maybe even add Meddling Mage, or, since you have a ton of defense/wall, Luminarch Ascension)
4) Lotus Cobra > Bloom Tender. Nuff said.
5) Borderposts are fine, except they CIPT. That just kills them.
6) There's a whole class of deck called Bant Aggro-Control or Midrange Bant. Personally, I hate it, but you can go check. I get a lot of ideas from www.deckcheck.net.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Bulvox » Sat Oct 10, 2009 12:32 am UTC

Fin Archangel wrote:1) This isn't limited. You can DEFINITELY have too much removal, since not all decks are going to be creature-heavy. Or even have any creatures.
2) The thing about Jenara is the mana you need to pump to make her good, preventing you from playing important spells early game. She's really only good late game (and man, is she GOOD late game.) Want a quick win? Rafiq of the Many + Finest Hour by themselves is 5*2+7*2=24 damage. With Noble Hierarch, that's as early as turn 4.
3) The Monks are better than the wall. The wall tends to do nothing if you're winning and delay the inevitable a bit if you're losing. You already have a ton of removal. War Monk can gain you upwards of 8-12 life a turn with Rafiq or Finest Hour on the field.
(If you want to play a later, stall, bomby game, I suggest you sit solidly in blue/white, make green your splash, replace Noble Hierarch, add straight counters like Negate and Essence Scatter, Put lots of anything in, and play big bombs like Baneslayers, or Iona, etc. etc. Maybe even add Meddling Mage, or, since you have a ton of defense/wall, Luminarch Ascension)
4) Lotus Cobra > Bloom Tender. Nuff said.
5) Borderposts are fine, except they CIPT. That just kills them.
6) There's a whole class of deck called Bant Aggro-Control or Midrange Bant. Personally, I hate it, but you can go check. I get a lot of ideas from http://www.deckcheck.net.
1. O-ring isn't just creature removal, so stop treating it as such. You have to remember that it can remove any Nonland card. This is important, because that allows it to remove Planeswalksers, Artifacts, Enchantments, or Creatures.
2. I actually agree with you here for the most part. If this was a Bant Control Deck, I'd say use Jenara. As Az001 wants it to be Midrange, I don't think Jenara has a place in the deck. Also, Finest Hour is a bit expensive to be playing right now, so I'd limit it to one or two of.
3. I'd usually agree with you here, but that Wall and its brother are all that is really stopping Red decks from dominating the format. As for adding Meddling Mage, that's actually a good idea. It should definitely have a place in this deck.
4. Lotus Cobra is better than Bloom Tender, but Bloom Tender is no longer standard legal. Lotus Cobra doesn't have much of a place in a Midrange deck. It's better suited to Ramp decks and the like.
5. Whole heartedly agree here.
6. I checked and couldn't find what you're talking about, care to link me to a sample deck of Midrange Bant?

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Klapaucius wrote:This is what I want to make--my RGB deck, completely overhauled:

Voracious Dragon x4
Predatory Dragon x2
Broodmother Dragon x2
Charnelhoard Wyrm x2
Mycoloth x2
Scarland Thrinax x4
Sprouting Thrinax x4
Siege-Gang Commander x2
Caldera Hellion x2
Dragon Fodder x2
Mind Rot x2
Blackmail x2
Yoke of the Damned x2
Mark of Treason x4 (which is the one that gives +1/+1? Mark of Mutiny? If so, that one instead)

Something like this. The one I have now is full of the bog standard "if you have a green, this red creature gets this" permutations that don't really serve what should be a pure devour deck.
I have two Mark of Mutiny already--the idea is to take control of a monster, attack with it, and then get a Scarland Thrinax or something similar to devour it. Same thing with Yoke of the Damned.
The Mind Rot and Blackmail are there because devourers are weak to kill spells, and I need to keep them discarding to get rid of their Assassinates and Cancels.
And I could be more devious than this--there are better monsters with devour that I should include, and there are better ways to pump out goblins and saprolings than what I'm using. Then there are recursive sacrifice fodder cards like Bloodghast and Endless Cockroaches, as well as non-RGB token machines (my friend might give me his Nuisance Engine).

This deck might be good...in casual. In anything else, it's horrible. You need to replace those Blackmails with Duress and Mind Rot with Mind Shatter, if you can get your hands on them. It's Act of Treason, not Mark of Treason, and yeah, Mark of Mutiny is better. Replace Yoke of the Damned with Terror or Doom Blade and take out Voracious Dragon and Charnelhoard Wyrm completely. Maybe replace the worm with Verdant Force/Embrace. Add in some Caldera Hellions and/or Skullmunchers. Also, what does the mana base for this deck look like?
Last edited by Bulvox on Sat Oct 10, 2009 1:25 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Azrael001 » Sat Oct 10, 2009 12:44 am UTC

Do you think that playing Magic live using webcams would work? I think it might be worth a try...

For some reason I thought that Bloom Tender was in the Alara block. How irritating.
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MTG decks.

Postby MildCore » Sat Oct 10, 2009 6:43 am UTC

(Searched, found nothing along these lines. Feel free to do with this as you wish, mods. :))

So, judging by the existence of the "Create a Card" thread, I'd say a good number of you play MTG. What I wanted to do was post deck builds, discuss them, give advice, criticize, etc. I play casually with just a few friends, and only a few of them have been playing for as many years as I have. You can imagine the disputes we get into over rules, and I was just hoping for general feedback from other (hopefully) experienced players.

Anyway, I'll start by posting my current mono-color White deck.

Plains - 22x
Whitemane Lion - 4x
Mistral Charger - 2x
Beacon Hawk - 2x
Outrider en-Kor - 2x
Calciderm - 2x
Serra Angel - 2x
Stonecloaker - 2x
Knight of Sursi - 2x
Platinum Angel - 2x
Honor of the Pure - 3x
Righteousness - 2x
Safe Passage - 2x
Disenchant - 2x
Glorious Charge - 2x
Pacifism - 2x
Holy Strength - 2x
Indestructibility - 2x
Worship - 1x

I didn't really have a theme in mind when I built it (didn't expand a lot on the vanishing/return to hand combo; been meaning to do that, seeing as how it works rather well most of the time). A lot of duplicates, Worship being the only card I have less than two of. The Platinum Angels were actually kind of filler at the time I put them in, but they sure do come in handy in a pinch. If I stall/survive long enough to get the 7 mana needed to play 'em, it's usually worth it. It's worked out well so far. Very few games lost. I usually use it in team games, though, and I often have to utilize Worship to keep myself alive. Any suggestions or comments are appreciated, and please do post your decks as well.
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Re: MTG decks.

Postby d0nk3y_k0n9 » Sat Oct 10, 2009 3:14 pm UTC

Looks decent. As you said, it isn't super focused on any one thing. If you were to focus it on a particular strategy, it might work better overall. My two choices would be to either focus more on the "white weenie" aspect of it or more on the "return things to hand so they don't vanish" strategy. A combination of the two where fast, efficient creatures with vanishing along with ways to return them could work very well. Some of your creatures aren't the best or most efficient for what you're using them for, but, if you're just playing with what you have instead of buying specific cards, then this makes sense and they're certainly adequate. The most obvious of these is Serra Angel. Baneslayer is pretty much strictly better, but much more expensive to buy if you don't already have it.

Some recommendations. I'm not a fan of cards like Righteousness; I'd rather play real creature removal (Path to Exile, Journey to Nowhere, or Oblivion Ring) than a very situational card like Righteousness. Also, I don't like Holy Strength or Indestructibility, since they both create card disadvantage if your opponent can find a way to remove your creature. Also, they don't play well with cards that have vanishing or return to your hand, since then you're forcing yourself into losing the aura: either you lose it and the creature that vanishes, or you lose the aura when the creature returns to your hand. In my opinion, the benefit of the aura just isn't worth it unless it's a very, very powerful aura (like Armored Ascension).


Now for my decks. First, my mono-red burn deck. This deck relies more or less exclusively on one-time use creatures and instants to burn the opponent to death as quickly as possible. It has a severe problem with running out of steam in the late game, and I'm mostly looking for solutions to this problem. Also, Lightning Axe needs to go, as I misread the card and thought it could target players when I bought it. This deck is primarily a budget deck, built out of what I had plus cheap cards that I could buy.
Spoiler:
4 Raging Goblin
4 Spark Elemental
4 Blood Knight
4 Hellspark Elemental
4 Keldon Marauders
2 Zo-Zu the Punisher
4 Shock
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Seal of Fire
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Axe
18 Mountain


Second, a standard legal mono-black vampire deck I'm thinking about building. This deck, which I'll probably never build because it'll cost to much, is not budget at all.
Spoiler:
4 Vampire Lacerator
4 Bloodghast
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
4 Vampire Hexmage
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Vampire Nocturnus
2 Malakir Bloodwitch
4 Duress
4 Disfigure
4 Feast in Blood
22 Swamp

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Plasma Man
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Plasma Man » Sat Oct 10, 2009 3:15 pm UTC

So, I went along to my first booster draft yesterday. I liked it, even if I didn't do very well (I placed 7th out of 9). I'm pretty happy with that for a first effort, a couple of the games came down to luck of the cards and could easily have gone my way instead. I played:
Spoiler:
1x Oran-Rief Survivalist
1x Grazing Gladeheart (probably wouldn't make the cut in constructed, but was pretty useful)
1x Baloth Woodcrasher
2x Timbermaw Larva (very useful, and one of them is shiny)
1x Kazuul Warlord
1x Bladtusk Boar
2x Goblin Shortcutter (were pretty useful)
1x Tuktuk Grunts
1x Plated Geopede (really handy, liked it a lot)
1x Goblin Ruinblaster (only useful because of haste)
1x Highland Berserker

1x Beastmaster Ascension (was in my first pack, made me decide to go aggro for my strategy)
1x Savage Silhouette
1x Beast Hunt
1x Harrow (anyone who's been playing Zendikar won't need me to tell them how useful this can be)
1x Cobra Trap (I don't rate this, would not play again)
1x Predatory Urge (good, but I misplayed it. It still managed to be useful)
1x Burst Lightning
2x Quest for Pure Flame (useful, and they won me a game. I like these.)
1x Carnage Altar (I shoved this in as a late pick, but it turned out to be quite useful)

2x Teetering Peaks
7x Mountain
8x Forest
In retrospect, I think I had a few too many expensive things in there. I could have done with some cheaper creatures instead of Tuktuk Grunts, Bladtusk Boar & Kazuul Warlord. I should also have picked a few less creatures in favour of more removal. Still, I'm quite pleased with my first effort, I won a game and I look forward to trying it again next week.
Please note that despite the lovely avatar Sungura gave me, I am not a medical doctor.

Possibly my proudest moment on the fora.

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telcontar42
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Re: MTG decks.

Postby telcontar42 » Sat Oct 10, 2009 5:31 pm UTC

d0nk3y_k0n9 wrote:Some recommendations. I'm not a fan of cards like Righteousness; I'd rather play real creature removal (Path to Exile, Journey to Nowhere, or Oblivion Ring) than a very situational card like Righteousness. Also, I don't like Holy Strength or Indestructibility, since they both create card disadvantage if your opponent can find a way to remove your creature. Also, they don't play well with cards that have vanishing or return to your hand, since then you're forcing yourself into losing the aura: either you lose it and the creature that vanishes, or you lose the aura when the creature returns to your hand. In my opinion, the benefit of the aura just isn't worth it unless it's a very, very powerful aura (like Armored Ascension).


I would agree with him here. I would replace the righteounesses and the pacifisms with 4 oblivion rings, if you can get them. Compared to a pacifism, it costs one more but it can target any permanent, making it much more versatile, and it will remove the creature from the game rather than preventing attacking and blocking so the abilities of the creature are removed as well. If you had 4 oblivion rings, you could also consider taking out the disenchants, as they could serve that purpose too. Also, don't play holy strength for the reasons stated above. Indestructibility is a bit better because it makes the creature harder to remove, but you could consider switching it out.

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Turtle_
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Turtle_ » Sat Oct 10, 2009 6:07 pm UTC

So, my mom bought a bunch of old Magic cards at an estate sale, and there were some interesting things in there, such as a a Revised Edition Taiga. I was wondering what the best way to go about selling them would be, because I'm not really interested in the old cards. Should I bring them to my local card shop, or put them on ebay, or do something else from the tons of options?

Interesting things:
Taiga - Revised Edition
Land Tax - Fourth Edition
Strip Mine - Fourth Edition
Aladdin - Arabian Nights
"Sometimes lies were more dependable than the truth." ~ Ender's Game
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge." ~ Charles Darwin

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Re: MTG decks.

Postby MildCore » Sat Oct 10, 2009 7:26 pm UTC

telcontar42 wrote:
d0nk3y_k0n9 wrote:Some recommendations. I'm not a fan of cards like Righteousness; I'd rather play real creature removal (Path to Exile, Journey to Nowhere, or Oblivion Ring) than a very situational card like Righteousness. Also, I don't like Holy Strength or Indestructibility, since they both create card disadvantage if your opponent can find a way to remove your creature. Also, they don't play well with cards that have vanishing or return to your hand, since then you're forcing yourself into losing the aura: either you lose it and the creature that vanishes, or you lose the aura when the creature returns to your hand. In my opinion, the benefit of the aura just isn't worth it unless it's a very, very powerful aura (like Armored Ascension).


I would agree with him here. I would replace the righteounesses and the pacifisms with 4 oblivion rings, if you can get them. Compared to a pacifism, it costs one more but it can target any permanent, making it much more versatile, and it will remove the creature from the game rather than preventing attacking and blocking so the abilities of the creature are removed as well. If you had 4 oblivion rings, you could also consider taking out the disenchants, as they could serve that purpose too. Also, don't play holy strength for the reasons stated above. Indestructibility is a bit better because it makes the creature harder to remove, but you could consider switching it out.


Yes, both Righteousness and Pacifism have proven to be massively situational. The Pacifisms, I can definitely do without, and replace with something more effective, but I'm playing with what I've got. I didn't buy any cards specifically for this deck. However, I just like the idea of Righteousness. It may not be great, but it's fun. I like killing a 6/6 with a Beacon Hawk for one mana, haha. But I can definitely get the oblivion rings. It's common, so the only thing to worry about with ordering online is S&H. Holy Strength is a very "opening hand" kind of card for me. If I can get a cheap creature out and turn it into a bit of a defender with +1/+2, then I'm satisfied. I'm sure I could find something to replace them, but they're working well at the moment. As for Indestructibility, what sold it for me is that it can enchant any permanent, not just creatures. The only creature I ever use it on is Platinum Angel, which means I may want to take one of them out. I use it on Worship, though, and that invariably pisses people off.

Anyway, Black and White drainer:

Spoiler:
Swamp - 10x
Plains - 7x
Orzhov Basilica - 3x
Hypnotic Specter - 2x
Agent of Masks - 3x
Souls of the Faultless - 2x
Nightsky Mimic - 2x
Thoughtpicker Witch - 2x
Skulking Knight - 3x
Vectis Dominator - 2x
Blind Hunter - 2x
Sanguine Bond - 1x
Hissing Miasma - 4x
Tainted Sigil - 2x
Marble Chalice - 1x
Onyx Goblet - 1x
Unholy Strength - 2x
Pillory of the Sleepless - 2x
Fear - 2x
Castigate - 3x
Beckon Apparition - 2x
Strands of Undeath - 2x

Some cards I'm actively looking to replace: Strands of Undeath, Skulking Knight, Unholy Strength. They don't work very well given the purpose of the deck, but I've got nothing at the moment that would fill the gap well enough. I was thinking about putting another Sanguine Bond in, to increase frequency and hopefully get two out at once.

This one works well enough. I've usually got a sizable life total and decent number of creatures by the end of games. It's kind of slow, however, so it usually takes more than a few turns before I can do anything particularly useful.
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"From what, the 1800's? Do they even make those anymore?"
"Sigh..."

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telcontar42
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby telcontar42 » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:21 pm UTC

The problem with the holy strength is that it really does give you card disadvantage. You can get a 1/1 with +1/+2 on the second turn, but then on your opponents third or fourth turn, if they play any creature removal or a bigger creature then you have spent two cards, they have spent one, and you haven't gained any advantage. The mana cost of holy strength is low, but you have to consider that the full cost is 1 mana and 1 card, and that's just too much for +1/+2.

As for this deck, the chalice and the goblet are pretty terrible cards IMO, so I would drop those. Also, I would get rid of the vectis dominator. Letting your opponent choose what happens makes it a really weak card. Also, I would agree that you should take out the unholy strengths for the same reasons as the holy strength. Other than that, a bit more removal might be nice. Also, it is a pretty low mana cost deck but also looks like a fairly slow deck. I know cost is probably an issue, but a few big nasty drops for later in the game could help.

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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby mchainmail » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:49 pm UTC

Turtle_ wrote:So, my mom bought a bunch of old Magic cards at an estate sale, and there were some interesting things in there, such as a a Revised Edition Taiga. I was wondering what the best way to go about selling them would be, because I'm not really interested in the old cards. Should I bring them to my local card shop, or put them on ebay, or do something else from the tons of options?

Interesting things:
Taiga - Revised Edition
Land Tax - Fourth Edition
Strip Mine - Fourth Edition
Aladdin - Arabian Nights


I'd be interested in buying them. Card shops will give you half of what it's worth, and ebay will take $10 off in fees...

Is the Aladdin Black Border or White Border?

PM me and maybe we could work out a deal.

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Bulvox
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Re: MTG decks.

Postby Bulvox » Sat Oct 10, 2009 9:32 pm UTC

d0nk3y_k0n9 wrote:Now for my decks. First, my mono-red burn deck. This deck relies more or less exclusively on one-time use creatures and instants to burn the opponent to death as quickly as possible. It has a severe problem with running out of steam in the late game, and I'm mostly looking for solutions to this problem. Also, Lightning Axe needs to go, as I misread the card and thought it could target players when I bought it. This deck is primarily a budget deck, built out of what I had plus cheap cards that I could buy.
Spoiler:
4 Raging Goblin
4 Spark Elemental
4 Blood Knight
4 Hellspark Elemental
4 Keldon Marauders
2 Zo-Zu the Punisher
4 Shock
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Seal of Fire
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Axe
18 Mountain
It looks semi-solid. Here's my advice:
-4 Raging Goblin (better cards for the same mana cost)
-4 Blood Knight (this card should be relegated to sideboard, and even then, there are better sideboard cards vs. white)
-2 Zo-Zu the Punisher (not worth the mana you use to play him)
-4 Shock (better burns spells)
-4 Lightning Axe (you know why)

+4 Hell's Thunder (budget rare that hits for 4 and can come back) or +4 Tattermunge Maniac (much better 1 drop goblin)
+3 Magus of the Scroll (this deck looks to be more burn oriented, this guy will be great if all you have is multiples of the same card, or just one card in hand)
+4 Flame Javelin (Best 3 mc burn spell)
+4 Rift Bolt (hits for 3)
+2 Ghitu Encampment
+3 Volcanic Fallout or Sulfurous Blast (you need a board sweeper, and these two just happen to be the best ones)
Second, a standard legal mono-black vampire deck I'm thinking about building. This deck, which I'll probably never build because it'll cost to much, is not budget at all.
Spoiler:
4 Vampire Lacerator
4 Bloodghast
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
4 Vampire Hexmage
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Vampire Nocturnus
2 Malakir Bloodwitch
4 Duress
4 Disfigure
4 Feast in Blood
22 Swamp
Boy, vamps sure are popular these days. I also designed a Vamp deck, but it deals with one card that yours doesn't, Great Sable Stag. Here's mine in comparison to yours:

15 Swamps
4 Akuom Refuge
1 Mountain

4 Bloodghast
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
4 Vampire Aristocrat
4 Vampire Hexmage
4 Vampire Lacerator
3 Vampire Nocturnous
2 Malakir Bloodwitch

4 Doom Blade
4 Sign in Blood
3 Tendrils of Corruption
4 Lightning Bolt

SB:
1 Malakir Bloodwitch
1 Tendrils of Corruption
4 Deathmark
3 Disfigure
3 Ravenous Trap
3 Infest
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RetSpline
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby RetSpline » Sat Oct 10, 2009 9:36 pm UTC

Looking between some cards between a friend and I, I came up with this interestig
combo. It doesn't really have a purpose besides being a +1/+1 token factory, and it's a bit weak in that at the bare minimum it requires 6 cards on the field to work at all, and is kinda slow to get started.

Conspiracy (Zombie) + 4 Undead Warchief + Arcbound Crusher + Pentavus + Corpse Harvester + Gravespawn Sovereign

Undead warchiefs aren't really needed, but they make all of the creatures cheaper, and you're going to want some way to keep the Pentavus for dying when you use all of its counters to make Pentavites.

Approximate turn order when it's all set up: (parenthesis denote mana cost for that action)
1) Make 5 Pentavites (5) putting  +5/+5 on Arcbound Crusher
2) Sacrifice Arcbound Crusher (2) to Corpse Harvester getting a Zombie and a Swamp, putting +6/+6 on Pentavus
3) Tap 5 Pentavites to revive Arcbound Crusher through Gravespawn Sovereign
4) Make 6 Pentavites (6) putting  +6/+6 on Arcbound Crusher
-etc.-

Some cards to make it even better:
Serum Tank. You'll never run out of charge counters, and I think I saw a Mirrodin card that can turn charge counters into +1/+1's. Or maybe I have that backwards
Blackmarket. If, instead of keeping the pentavites around, you sacrifice them to whatever, you'd end up with a simply absurd amount of mana just from the Blackmarket, allowing you to make exponentially more Pentavites, which you'd sacrifice, increasing the mana gained through Blackmarkets... Etc.
Door of Destinies. Combined with the Blackmarket, you have an exponentially increasing number of tokens with exponentially increasing power/toughness.
Darksteel Forge. Throw down another Conspiracy, choosing Artifact this time, and all of your creatures are now indestructible

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Fin Archangel
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Re: MTG decks.

Postby Fin Archangel » Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:59 am UTC

Bulvox wrote:15 Swamps
4 Akuom Refuge
1 Mountain

4 Bloodghast
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
4 Vampire Aristocrat
4 Vampire Hexmage
4 Vampire Lacerator
3 Vampire Nocturnous
2 Malakir Bloodwitch

4 Doom Blade
4 Sign in Blood
3 Tendrils of Corruption
4 Lightning Bolt

SB:
1 Malakir Bloodwitch
1 Tendrils of Corruption
4 Deathmark
3 Disfigure
3 Ravenous Trap
3 Infest


...ehm...you have 5 copies of Gatekeeper.

Personally I prefer 2 Hexmage / 3 Bloodwitch / 4 Nocturnus.
Spoiler:
Image

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Bulvox
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Re: MTG decks.

Postby Bulvox » Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:49 am UTC

Fin Archangel wrote:
Bulvox wrote:15 Swamps
4 Akuom Refuge
1 Mountain

4 Bloodghast
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
4 Vampire Aristocrat
4 Vampire Hexmage
4 Vampire Lacerator
3 Vampire Nocturnous
2 Malakir Bloodwitch

4 Doom Blade
4 Sign in Blood
3 Tendrils of Corruption
4 Lightning Bolt

SB:
1 Malakir Bloodwitch
1 Tendrils of Corruption
4 Deathmark
3 Disfigure
3 Ravenous Trap
3 Infest


...ehm...you have 5 copies of Gatekeeper.

Personally I prefer 2 Hexmage / 3 Bloodwitch / 4 Nocturnus.
...where's the fifth?

I would do 4 Nocturnus, but the early turns are crucial, and that first strike is amazing. Also, he kills planeswalkers.
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Fin Archangel
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Fin Archangel » Sun Oct 11, 2009 2:01 am UTC

Oh. Nevermind. Total misread.

My apologies.
Spoiler:
Image

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Fin Archangel
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Re: magic cards dumped; general magic discussion ensues

Postby Fin Archangel » Sun Oct 11, 2009 2:05 am UTC

Also: Bant Aggro-Control: http://www.deckcheck.net/deck.php?id=23480

(oops, it's a extended/legacy format. Oh well.)
Spoiler:
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