League of Legends

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The Utilitarian
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Re: League of Legends

Postby The Utilitarian » Thu Sep 23, 2010 3:20 am UTC

BlackSails wrote:If your team doesnt stick some sort of melee carry, like Xin or Akali with sona, then they are a very special team.

Sadly not all of us are so fortunate as to have regular 5 man teams and have to make do with mostly Pug teams. I just happen to play, usually, with one other person in a lane pair and he's really into Sona. I suppose I do have Xin unlocked and I do enjoy him. It's weird tho I got really bored of Xin really fast. He's just kinda bland.

I'm still convinced Udyr could work. He builds dps carry well and his extra durability fits the metagame well right now.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby BlackSails » Thu Sep 23, 2010 3:25 am UTC

I play random, I WISH I had a regular team.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby The Utilitarian » Thu Sep 23, 2010 3:37 am UTC

BlackSails wrote:I play random, I WISH I had a regular team.

Hehe, I hear ya. I actually do have an almost complete full team I play with semi-regularily but a lot of the team is still a little new and tends to follow my lead. We've had some great games but it's becoming clear that I need to play a tank/initiator type champ. When I tried more mobile assassin type characters we really lost direction.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby skeptical scientist » Thu Sep 23, 2010 4:57 am UTC

Gelsamel wrote:Oh great, the game that I'm loading right now. Ashe says just before we go in "I'm trying out AP Ashe" I hope she's trollin'.

Clearly trolling. My guess is she wanted to play Sona, and then was hoping for a dodge.
Last edited by skeptical scientist on Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:05 am UTC, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:00 am UTC

skeptical scientist wrote:
Gelsamel wrote:Oh great, the game that I'm loading right now. Ashe says just before we go in "I'm trying out AP Ashe" I hope she's trollin'.

Clearly trolling. My guess is she wanted to play Sona, and then was hoping for a dodge.


Nope, she played AP Ashe, as I mentioned in the next few posts she was doing exactly no damage.

Edit: I don't have a problem with people trying out joke builds, but do it in practice, especially if it's your first try doing the build... it's what practice is for.

Edit2: Yeah sure, my in game handle is Adelle.
Last edited by Gelsamel on Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:06 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby skeptical scientist » Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:06 am UTC

Well, the fact that she actually played the champ doesn't necessarily mean she wasn't still trolling. She was just... taking it a little further. :P

Then again, I thought my friend was trolling when he said he wanted to try AP yi, except he still seems to think that AP yi is a good champion. I vehemently disagree (although he does seem to be decent in ARAM).

Gelsamel wrote:Even in the games I was losing (except that one with 13 deaths, which I didn't get a mejais in since I was going bad) I got upto 20 stacks or very close to it. It's 180 AP + 20% CDR for cheap and easy (personally I think she way she gets assists should be nerfed -- it's too easy).

The alternative is not giving her an assist when her speed boost allows a teammate to catch up and get the kill, or a heal makes a teammate win a fight they would otherwise have lost, etc. IMO that's far worse than giving her free assists when she was simply there and didn't really contribute anything.

* * *


So, I think it would be cool to get an xkcd group together, assuming we have enough people. I tried adding phrozt and pandemic21 - those were the only people I saw who posted usernames. (Phrozt, I think I may have added you before, but then never played a game and removed you because I couldn't remember who you were - let's try to avoid that this time.)

Is there anyone else I should add? I'm althai, by the way. Gelsamel, do you play on North America? If you are, would you be interested in trying to get an xkcd group together, and if so what is your username?

Edit: Conversations between two people who like to go back and edit their posts to fix/add things can get rather amusing, when they're reading the same thread at the same time.
Last edited by skeptical scientist on Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:10 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:08 am UTC

Oh man our orders are gettin' all screwed up!

Anyway yeah she could have still been trollin' I guess. My brother played Magewick and went like 11-3-8 in a normal game was kinda funny. Anyway yeah I might not be up for much gamin' the next few days as I've got a whole bunch of Uni work to do at the moment.

Edit: Indeed they can.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Thu Sep 23, 2010 7:08 am UTC

I'm up for a xkcd group if there's a spot going, chuck a friend request at "Sokh". A late reply but @ Utilitarian, I wouldn't recommend Udyr in a lane as he does infinitely better in the jungle. His bear stance just lends to ganks from the jungle so amazingly well. I grab lizard buff at level 3, which levels me to 4 after and grab bear stance. From there you can set up a gank a lot of the time. Ghost+bear stance out of a bush can sometimes get a kill even if they're at full health as long as they're extended enough to chase them down and there's one of your dps in the lane. Also I generally build him as a tank (and from what I can see most high elo players do too) since you need to be in the thick of the fight stunning and aoeing with phoenix stance, and his abilities scale poorly anyway. The only dps items I get are my madreds razors which I sometimes possibly build into blood razors if there's a lot of high health on the other team but more often than not I build it into a wriggles lantern. If we get an xkcd group going I'll probably end up playing jungle Udyr since I do most times, can compare the two styles.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby TheGreatMeh » Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:55 pm UTC

skeptical scientist wrote:T
Then again, I thought my friend was trolling when he said he wanted to try AP yi, except he still seems to think that AP yi is a good champion. I vehemently disagree (although he does seem to be decent in ARAM).



If it is a GOOD AP yi, they can carry harder than a AD one, but from a friend of mine who can play AP yi, it is hard to do well and when it fails it fails hard.

BlackSails wrote:If your team doesnt stick some sort of melee carry, like Xin or Akali with sona, then they are a very special team.


I bought sona when she came out, and i've discovered i like laning with a ranged carry like Miss Fortune or Ashe, it lets me save my mana for when i really need it and we can harass freely.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby setzer777 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 10:10 pm UTC

I just bought Karthus and all I can say is "wow"! I don't know how he holds up at high-elo, but at my level he seems to melt face pretty easily. His passive is insane for team fights, especially since it guarantees that you get your ult off. I can go into a team fight and use the wall + aoe to do a good amount of damage and then ult if they take me down - usually guarantees at least 1 kill and/or a few assists.

Also, I finally learned that when building a new rune page, it is better to fill it up with tier 1 runes and then replace those with tier 3, rather than buy a few tier 3 and leave the rest blank (or off-spec runes). Tier 3 is like about 10 times more expensive than tier 1, but only twice as effective. So until your page is actually full, tier 1 give much more for the cost.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby BurningLed » Fri Sep 24, 2010 10:14 pm UTC

Runes don't really matter much to begin with though, and I feel when you're starting off, the IP is better spent on favorite champions :P They only make a big difference when you're either jungling or are really dependent on your laning-phase farm. Still, I do love my 15% CDR off the bat.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby setzer777 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 10:28 pm UTC

BurningLed wrote:Runes don't really matter much to begin with though, and I feel when you're starting off, the IP is better spent on favorite champions :P They only make a big difference when you're either jungling or are really dependent on your laning-phase farm. Still, I do love my 15% CDR off the bat.


Yeah, I don't really mind spending RP on champs, since I usually have spare money. I was amazed that for like 900 IP I could get tier 1 CD glyphs and Quints for 8% CDR, which goes up to 17% when you add masteries.
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The Utilitarian
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Re: League of Legends

Postby The Utilitarian » Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:44 pm UTC

My handle is Utilitarian, feel free to add me.

AP Yi can be viable but he's entirely out-classed by AD Yi. AP is really just a one trick pony where the idea is to wait in the wings for someone to get low. Highlander in there and slam them with a massive Alpha strike to finish them off. This resets Highlander AND alpha strike, and hopefully reduces a second champ to the danger zone. Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Pentakill. (if you're lucky).

In practice it never works so easily and AD Yi will destroy people far better and with greater survivability thanks to lifesteal.

Gone back to playing with Katarina, can't decide whether I like her AD or AP more. AD has better harass and farming, plus decent auto attacks, but AP has better suprise burst through shunpo, harder hitting ultimate and more item synergy with Ryalis and Zhonyas. Ultimately with most AD items you end up wasting a lot of their power since you're not able to use crit or aspeed or lifesteal with your usual playstyle.

I think it's going to have to be AP, though I'll miss what is easily the game's most effective lane harass.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby skeptical scientist » Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:17 am UTC

The Utilitarian wrote:AP Yi can be viable but he's entirely out-classed by AD Yi. AP is really just a one trick pony where the idea is to wait in the wings for someone to get low. Highlander in there and slam them with a massive Alpha strike to finish them off. This resets Highlander AND alpha strike, and hopefully reduces a second champ to the danger zone. Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Pentakill. (if you're lucky).

Yeah, that's basically how I feel. One thing you forgot to mention: one of AD Yi's big advantages is his ability to instantly melt towers. He's great at one-man pushing a side lane when the rest of the team holds a stalemate in mid, for instance, counterpushing when the rest of the team is dead to make sure they lose an inhibitor as well, or quickly backdooring after an ace. AP Yi completely gives this up, and doesn't really get anything in exchange.

This is partly why AP yi is relatively much better in ARAM. Most of these options are gone, so taking out turrets effectively isn't so important, the ability to harass effectively with alpha strike is much more important, and total damage output in teamfights is close enough to AD yi that the harassment ability more than makes up for it.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Goldstein » Sat Sep 25, 2010 5:44 pm UTC

Can you.. Can you stop saying ARAM or tell me what it means? :( Please.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Sat Sep 25, 2010 6:40 pm UTC

ARAM = All random all mid. Everyone gets a random char picked for them and then you all have to stay in mid lane. Just a single lane push from there, its pretty fun but I have the worst luck ever on them. Think I've won 2 out of like 10 I've played. Other team always gets stupidly awesome champs and my team are tards >.>

Speaking of which I've had nothing but baddies today, the sort that run in at stupid times, focus tanks and generally do nothing useful what so ever. Seriously considering switching game for a while or just only playing when I have a 5man pre made of decent people D:

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Goldstein » Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:04 pm UTC

Haha, that sounds great. I gather you'd need ten people to agree to it advance, but I think a 5v5 map with only one lane would be a good laugh.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby TheGreatMeh » Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:10 pm UTC

skeptical scientist wrote:
The Utilitarian wrote:AP Yi can be viable but he's entirely out-classed by AD Yi. AP is really just a one trick pony where the idea is to wait in the wings for someone to get low. Highlander in there and slam them with a massive Alpha strike to finish them off. This resets Highlander AND alpha strike, and hopefully reduces a second champ to the danger zone. Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Pentakill. (if you're lucky).

Yeah, that's basically how I feel. One thing you forgot to mention: one of AD Yi's big advantages is his ability to instantly melt towers. He's great at one-man pushing a side lane when the rest of the team holds a stalemate in mid, for instance, counterpushing when the rest of the team is dead to make sure they lose an inhibitor as well, or quickly backdooring after an ace. AP Yi completely gives this up, and doesn't really get anything in exchange.

This is partly why AP yi is relatively much better in ARAM. Most of these options are gone, so taking out turrets effectively isn't so important, the ability to harass effectively with alpha strike is much more important, and total damage output in teamfights is close enough to AD yi that the harassment ability more than makes up for it.


AP yi can jump in as soon as they blow all of their stuns with a highlander into an alpha strike, then meditate for all of his health back then alpha strike again, and by that point he would have done (with the decent number of 400 ap) 1400 damage to each person his alpha strikes hit(before reduction from MR) and if he has a lich bane and uses its proc after every spell that is an extra 1600 damage to a single target not counting his base damage or a LB proc from wu-ju style. Also, 40% of AP is applied as damage to towers and buildings so with highlander AP yi can backdoor almost as well as AD yi.

I'm not trying to say that AP yi is better than AD yi, but i would much rather have a good AP yi on my team than a good AD yi

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Sun Sep 26, 2010 3:27 am UTC

So, I wanted to try out Kassadin in a game. I go 6/2/3 and they give up at 25minutes with all their towers up... It kinda sucks becuase I wanted to see how good he was but they gave up before the game began.

Maybe 'cause our Nasus was 7/0/1 and our Olaf 4/3/7.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:38 am UTC

Ah Nasus, he's such a beast. Haven't played him in ages though. Been meaning to learn Kassadin myself, either him or Akali. So many random teams where they don't focus the carry, would be cool to be able to port in drop them and port out, plus Akali snowballs like a champ if you get a decent early game.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:54 am UTC

Yeah Poppy is a great anti-carry too. I mean she can almost literally 1 hit any champ regardless of HP.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:03 am UTC

Poppy got something off a buff as well last patch when they upped the sheen and trinity force damage bonus. Her Q with trinity force was already a devastating blow to enemies (pun entirely intended) imagine the damage now will be ridiculous.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:51 am UTC

Personally I like Lichbane on her, Deathfires already hitting huge then a huge AP bonus hit on top and a devastate to follow...
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Sun Sep 26, 2010 6:19 am UTC

Yea if I build AP on her I normally go Sheen -> DFG -> LB maybe pick up Rylai's if it's still not over, Q slows for 2 seconds on a roughly 3 second CD.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Sun Sep 26, 2010 6:30 am UTC

Sokh wrote:Yea if I build AP on her I normally go Sheen -> DFG -> LB maybe pick up Rylai's if it's still not over, Q slows for 2 seconds on a roughly 3 second CD.


Yeah she is pretty awesome and people really overlook her imho. Although she is more of a counterpick type hero, destroys Kogmaw.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby skeptical scientist » Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:49 am UTC

Goldstein wrote:Haha, that sounds great. I gather you'd need ten people to agree to it advance, but I think a 5v5 map with only one lane would be a good laugh.

Yes, but it's not really hard finding players. There are usually a few of them being hosted in the practice game list at any given time.

There are a few additional rules usually, all self-enforced:
  1. No going back to buy or heal. You can only buy when you die.
  2. No snowball items (Mejai's/Sword of the Occult/Leviathan)
  3. No guardian angel

It can be very susceptible to random luck - certain matchups are just about unwinnable. But for a just for fun mode, that's not a big deal, and it is frequently pretty hilarious.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby BurningLed » Sun Sep 26, 2010 7:10 pm UTC

If the enemy team gets Soraka/Sona though, be prepared to lose.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Sun Sep 26, 2010 7:36 pm UTC

Blitzcrank is the king of ARAM tbh, all it takes is a successful grab and you've got a kill. Also Janna, her Ult is win.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Goldstein » Sun Sep 26, 2010 8:01 pm UTC

I found one earlier today and ended up as Veigar, which was surely a good pick. They did have Sona and we spent most of the game with one less player, but our combined AoE with Anivia and Fortune tore through them.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby The Utilitarian » Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:35 pm UTC

With the change to Lichbane/Sheen/Triforce AD Poppy now clearly out-classes AP Poppy. While AP poppy used to be able to abuse Lichbane to get tons of use out of her AP (Heroic Charge Lichbane Diplomatic Immunity Lichbane Paragon of Demacia Lichbane Devastating Blow Lichbane), with the hard 2s cap on procs she's really only getting the benefit on devastating blow. AD Poppy, conversely, still has a massive Devastating Blow, and it's not even harder hitting than before, plus she has much more significant damage in between devastatings.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Mon Sep 27, 2010 9:46 am UTC

I donno, I think DI Bonus + DFG w/ decent AP is too good a combo to give up along with devastate. My brother never really used Lich Bane to it's fullest (ie, waiting for a hit after each spell use) and yet he still 1 hit pretty much everyone that wasn't 5k Hp.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Mon Sep 27, 2010 10:50 am UTC

The awesome thing about DFG is that 30% is already a sizeable amount of health to do in one hit, but thats boosted another 40% by DI as well as all your AP. And then devastating blow is a percentage of HP which again is boosted by DI so regardless of the target health you've normally dropped them incredibly low which you can probably finish with an ignite since its true damage and does around 600-700 damage with DI up (may be slightly off here, haven't got access to any LoL data from work).

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Mon Sep 27, 2010 10:59 am UTC

If there was a custom reskin of Poppy that made her into Presea from Tales of Symphonia she would be my favourite character ever EVER.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Mon Sep 27, 2010 11:10 am UTC

Don't know if there's any like that but look up "white knight poppy" on league craft. That skin is so awesome it hurts. There's a fair chance it'll be added in as a retail skin sometime as well since they did that for the creators bilgewater Katarina skin.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Mon Sep 27, 2010 11:29 am UTC

Sokh wrote:Don't know if there's any like that but look up "white knight poppy" on league craft. That skin is so awesome it hurts. There's a fair chance it'll be added in as a retail skin sometime as well since they did that for the creators bilgewater Katarina skin.


Yeah I've seen that, it is amazing. I'm not even sure if you can do reskins with totally different animations, like a Presea Poppy who uses a 2 handed axe rather than a 1 handed mace. Presea is just too awesome, her EX-Skill Suppress is essentially Poppy's innate.
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Mon Sep 27, 2010 12:34 pm UTC

All the custom skins I've seen are just that, skins. I think the actual animations are incredibly difficult or even impossible to change since they generally require a lot of work. Otherwise I would so have a custom Sona that head banged when you sonnet shifted.

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:06 pm UTC

Sokh wrote:All the custom skins I've seen are just that, skins. I think the actual animations are incredibly difficult or even impossible to change since they generally require a lot of work. Otherwise I would so have a custom Sona that head banged when you sonnet shifted.


I've seen a morg skin without wings, so maybe they should just remove the shield and make the hammer an axe, or a pico hammer.
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Sokh
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Sokh » Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:10 pm UTC

Would be doable, but then her hand would still be positioned as if she had a shield and she'd be holding a 2 handed axe in one hand. On second thoughts that sounds pretty awesome, could go for the anime style and have the axe about twice the size of her :P

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Gelsamel
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Re: League of Legends

Postby Gelsamel » Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:16 pm UTC

Yeah that would be amazing... too bad I can't skin for crap.
"Give up here?"
- > No
"Do you accept defeat?"
- > No
"Do you think games are silly little things?"
- > No
"Is it all pointless?"
- > No
"Do you admit there is no meaning to this world?"
- > No

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Re: League of Legends

Postby Goldstein » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:15 pm UTC

I've not actually seen it in game, but surely Annie in Wonderland is a remodel, and I think there are a few others that would be hard to re-image with just a skin.
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