The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Bacon Workshop

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby An Enraged Platypus » Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:53 pm UTC

I just discovered something great. When you pick up a pot/basket or whatever and hold it in front of you, it can block arrows and spells. So on a low level Argonian I have been successfully closing to range with archers by dropping the basket in my inventory, holding it out as a shield, and dropping it to deliver a power attack. Pick it up when the enemy is dead or shooting at you from far away again, repeat.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby gmalivuk » Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:56 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:
gmalivuk wrote:And lockpicking does get better at higher levels, even without perks.

Just like all of the skill trees.
Enchanting and smithing are kinda useless without perks though.
Smithing especially, since you can't even make most stuff without perks. But my point was that the actual stats of things you make or improve go up as your skill level goes up, even without getting any perks at all. And for damage-related skills the damage goes up on its own, and magic stuff gets more powerful on its own, and thieving-related skills get easier on their own.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Koa » Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:58 pm UTC

How can feigning ever work if every vaguely humanoid being in the world does it? Even the Draugrs do it, and they're supposed to be immortal and restless. Some of them even have "restless" in their name, and yet there they are, on their knees.

I'm not sure about the technical explanation but I don't see why companions can't have their own AI routines. It's either deliberate, lazy, or a bug.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Jahoclave » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:00 pm UTC

An Enraged Platypus wrote:I just discovered something great. When you pick up a pot/basket or whatever and hold it in front of you, it can block arrows and spells. So on a low level Argonian I have been successfully closing to range with archers by dropping the basket in my inventory, holding it out as a shield, and dropping it to deliver a power attack. Pick it up when the enemy is dead or shooting at you from far away again, repeat.

So wicker is the ultimate armor then...


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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Vaniver » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:33 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote: that island in Morrowind (but according to people in Skyrim it asploded), etc.
Solstheim, the Nord-themed island, is still around. Vvardenfell is supposedly in-game (the terrain, at least), though it takes some doing to get there.

CorruptUser wrote:I'd love if the entire continent available, but it's hard enough to design just 1 province.
Have you played Arena? It was the first Elder Scrolls game, and set in the entirety of Tamriel. Most of the content was procedurally generated; they've moved in the direction of handcrafting since and I don't think that's going to change.

SecondTalon wrote:Technically speaking - as near as I can figure all NPC Humanoids follow the same behavior that makes AIs drop the aggro on them. This is so your followers don't die in two seconds.
I find this highly unlikely. Your followers are protected against any damage (except that you deal), including a giant launching them into space.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Adam H » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:39 pm UTC

I think it's likely that they fooled around with having some NPCs flee or perma-surrender rather than fake-surrender, but it was too annoying/bug-infested so they just took the lazy way out. My wife thinks I'm a horrible, horrible person because the sounds coming out of the computer room is an endless stream of "Don't attack! I sur-AAAGHHHHH!!!"
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Vaniver » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:45 pm UTC

Adam H wrote:My wife thinks I'm a horrible, horrible person because the sounds coming out of the computer room is an endless stream of "Don't attack! I sur-AAAGHHHHH!!!"
I thought I was a horrible person. It took me about ten attempts to let them surrender before I realized it wasn't going to work.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Koa » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:48 pm UTC

Vaniver wrote:Vvardenfell is supposedly in-game (the terrain, at least), though it takes some doing to get there.

Skyrim has Vvardenfell terrain?

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:56 pm UTC

Adam H wrote:My wife thinks I'm a horrible, horrible person because the sounds coming out of the computer room is an endless stream of "Don't attack! I sur-AAAGHHHHH!!!"


What, for killing people who 5 seconds ago were trying to kill you, and not for
Spoiler:
the cannibalism or murdering a woman on her wedding day, or just about everything else in the game
?
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Vaniver » Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:58 pm UTC

Koa wrote:Skyrim has Vvardenfell terrain?
Sort of.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SirBryghtside » Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:15 pm UTC

Adam H wrote:My wife thinks I'm a horrible, horrible person because the sounds coming out of the computer room is an endless stream of "Don't attack! I sur-AAAGHHHHH!!!"

Every time I kill someone as my warrior, they say things like 'what's the hurry?' and 'stop that!'

It's surreal :P
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Shivahn » Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:39 pm UTC

When I kill people it usually goes like this.

"Where'd you go?"

*SPLSCH* as I do the execution animation where I stab them in the chest with my dagger

"I found you!"

...yes, in that order. The game starts playing the audio file right as the execution animation starts, so there are a lot of impaled people gloating at having found me.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Koa » Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:00 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:
Koa wrote:Skyrim has Vvardenfell terrain?
Sort of.

Damn, it's not the full map by any means. I'd love to see a vague idea of what the entire world looks like ingame.
Shivahn wrote:...yes, in that order. The game starts playing the audio file right as the execution animation starts, so there are a lot of impaled people gloating at having found me.

I've had someone start whistling a song as I slit their throat. They continued whistling for a second or so after their body hit the ground. That's not the first time I've seen that happen in a game but it's always amusing.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Weeks » Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:45 am UTC

gmalivuk wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:
gmalivuk wrote:And lockpicking does get better at higher levels, even without perks.

Just like all of the skill trees.
Enchanting and smithing are kinda useless without perks though.
Smithing especially, since you can't even make most stuff without perks. But my point was that the actual stats of things you make or improve go up as your skill level goes up, even without getting any perks at all. And for damage-related skills the damage goes up on its own, and magic stuff gets more powerful on its own, and thieving-related skills get easier on their own.
It was considerably easier to pick any kind of lock once I got to 50 lockpicking. After about 60 I never had less than 100 lockpicks.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Jan 04, 2012 6:25 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:
SexyTalon wrote:Technically speaking - as near as I can figure all NPC Humanoids follow the same behavior that makes AIs drop the aggro on them. This is so your followers don't die in two seconds.
I find this highly unlikely. Your followers are protected against any damage (except that you deal), including a giant launching them into space.

disagree. I've had followers die to poisons, enemy wall spells, fireballs, and dragon breath. Enemies drop aggro, but can still do damage and kill.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Shivahn » Wed Jan 04, 2012 7:50 am UTC

I've never found any of that happen - my followers have only ever died if they were taking damage from me at the time. That does mean that if it's a spell like flames that does damage over time, they can be hit by an enemy and die from the residual damage.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby big boss » Wed Jan 04, 2012 8:34 am UTC

I have had to get rid of my followers because they always get in the way of my aoe spells and get cleaved down. I turned ff off for a bit and wasn't having a problem then I felt like I was cheating and turned it off.

So I have tried all three major character types (mage, thief/assassain, and warrior) and feel that the game is easily broken for every class. Around level 35 or so I was able to get pretty close to max armor rating (for the mage I got a high armor rating through a combination of spells and the stone) and pretty high magic resists through passives and enchantments and tanked literally everything I came across and rarely had to use a potion or healing spell on master difficulty. I didn't use any glitches or that trick where you use smithing, enchanting, and alchemy to create fortify smithing and alchemy gear to boost your stats. I didn't even try that hard to make my character godly, he just became godly as a biproduct of me leveling my skills. I made the game not challenging and boring by simply doing what everyone's goal is in an RPG, make your toon the biggest badass possible. It seems like the devs spent no effort in trying to balance the game, the fact that you can dip into every tree allows you to get all the best possible perks from every character type. In response to people who say that I shouldn't wear the epic gear I crafted to make the game more difficult; when I play a RPG (and this holds true for many people), I want to make my character as powerful as he can be (thats the point of the game after all, to learn and master you abilities and become the hero of the land who has the BIGGEST NUMBERS (dps, health, magika pool etc)), within the limits of the game and the game. I shouldn't need to make the game harder for myself by wearing weaker gear, its the game designers job to make the game challenging not mine.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Jan 04, 2012 8:43 am UTC

big boss wrote: within the limits of the game and the game.

The Elder Scrolls Series does not believe in limits. That's where you went wrong. Your mission is not complete until you are capable of more dps than the combined branches of the US Military--including the nuclear arsenal.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby EdgarJPublius » Wed Jan 04, 2012 10:28 am UTC

In at least a couple of the games, you actually kill one or more gods.
Having the power to slay gods kinda precludes most things from being too challenging.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby emceng » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:20 pm UTC

I don't entirely understand smithing. Last night found some ebony armor. Figured it would replace my orcish. Nope! Exquisite orcish was better. So go to improve the ebony. My smithing had improved, so now can do flawless orcish, but only exquisite ebony. And the Orcish is still better. Dangit, I want cool armor!

Also, kind of accidentally

Spoiler:
became a werewolf. I'd heard about it(maybe in this thread). But all of a sudden hit that quest with the companions. So no longer a vampire, now a werewolf.

Not sure how much I like it. No rest bonus is super annoying for crafting skills. Beast form is ok, but takes forever to cast and you can get killed during the animation. Couple that with no way to heal and having to put your armor back on each time...It is definitely cool, just probably not something I'll use that much.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:27 pm UTC

What Smithing Perks do you have? Because it sounds like you have the Orcish perk, but not the Ebony perk.

Re: Your spoiler...
Spoiler:
You can also heal as a Werewolf. Eat the dead. Lack of a rest bonus is the only single mechanic downside, and to be frank, it's not much of a downside unless you're leveling Alchemy.

But it is something you decide to use *before* you enter a fort or whatever. Park your companion outside the cave, enter, activate Beast mode, take everything out like it's Easy mode.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Telchar » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:57 pm UTC

Best way I've found to level smithing: Whiterun Iron Dagger making. Cost me ~5k gold but leveled me up 8 times and brought my BS all the way to 100. Daedric armor is sexytime.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Vaniver » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:59 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:disagree. I've had followers die to poisons, enemy wall spells, fireballs, and dragon breath. Enemies drop aggro, but can still do damage and kill.
Ah, I see what it is. Any attack that would kill a follower just incapacitates them, but they can still take damage while incapacitated, and that can kill them.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby emceng » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:05 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:What Smithing Perks do you have? Because it sounds like you have the Orcish perk, but not the Ebony perk.

Re: Your spoiler...
Spoiler:
You can also heal as a Werewolf. Eat the dead. Lack of a rest bonus is the only single mechanic downside, and to be frank, it's not much of a downside unless you're leveling Alchemy.

But it is something you decide to use *before* you enter a fort or whatever. Park your companion outside the cave, enter, activate Beast mode, take everything out like it's Easy mode.


Yeah, my smithing isn't high enough to have the ebony perk.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:07 pm UTC

Vaniver wrote:
SexyTalon wrote:disagree. I've had followers die to poisons, enemy wall spells, fireballs, and dragon breath. Enemies drop aggro, but can still do damage and kill.
Ah, I see what it is. Any attack that would kill a follower just incapacitates them, but they can still take damage while incapacitated, and that can kill them.
Yup. Though apparently Mjoll is bugged somehow, and completely immortal? I've heard Rumors.

I think I'll test this evening. Once I complete the Worthless Item Challenge of filling Dragonsreach.


Protip : When there's a shitload of stuff in a pile and you try to move through it, collision detection gets wonky and you sink through it like a ball pit. The problem is, you also sink through the floor.

emceng wrote:Yeah, my smithing isn't high enough to have the ebony perk.

That explains it, then. The perk doesn't exactly half the skill needed, but without the perk, you need 100 skill just to make something Flawless (and 168 to make it Legendary). WITH the perk, you only need 57 to make something Flawless, and 91 to make it Legendary.

So your smithing is.. what, in the mid 70s? Best you can do on a non-perk material is make it Exquisite (which is a +10 to armor) to Flawless's +13 or even Epic's +17 at 74 skill.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby CorruptUser » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:11 pm UTC

Telchar wrote:@Companions: The only one I run around with is the super annoying dog from the Clavicus Vile quest and that's because he can't take damage.


Mjoll the Lioness. 'Nuff said.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby gmalivuk » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:20 pm UTC

Telchar wrote:Best way I've found to level smithing: Whiterun Iron Dagger making.
Leather bracers take the least amount of least rare materials, I think, and all smithed items increase your level by the same amount.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:23 pm UTC

Unrelated to the current threads but related to companions... Ordering them to do stuff is... kinda broken.

I'd expect your thieving rogue types to be able to open locks, but... both Lydia and Borgakh the Steel Heart (Melee Heavy Armor Mace to the Face types) can open Master locks in the time it takes me to tell them to unlock them.

So...

Why is there a Lockpicking skill?
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby gmalivuk » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:43 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:So...

Why is there a Lockpicking skill?
Because some of us didn't know until just now that they could do that?
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby CorruptUser » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:47 pm UTC

And those of us that want the extra levels, even though it makes enemies tougher and lockpicking doesn't help you deal with them? Extra perk may help though.

TBH I cheated and added some of the lockpick perks through the console, as well as the heavy side of smithing. You mean just becuse I like light armor I can't upgrade my daedric dagger as far? Only fair for the noncombat perks, since the skills often make it harder to survive. Try getting 100 speech, lockpicking, and pickpocketing, and see if that character has an easier time surviving than just your basic level 1. Maybe if you could speak to bandits and persuade them that you are not worth their time. Actually, yeah, that needs to be in game for most humanoid enemies.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:52 pm UTC

gmalivuk wrote:
SexyTalon wrote:So...

Why is there a Lockpicking skill?
Because some of us didn't know until just now that they could do that?

After some Wikireading on the subject, apparently NPC followers can only unlock chests, and cannot unlock doors.

...

So, minor inconvenience, I guess.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby CorruptUser » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:57 pm UTC

Pity that you can't use a mace as a 'skeleton key'. Imagine someone smashing into your home with the unholy weapon of Molag Bal, decked out in armor made from the skins of eldritch abominations. Yeah, threaten to call the guards, I dare you.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Lostdreams » Wed Jan 04, 2012 5:03 pm UTC

gmalivuk wrote:
Telchar wrote:Best way I've found to level smithing: Whiterun Iron Dagger making.
Leather bracers take the least amount of least rare materials, I think, and all smithed items increase your level by the same amount.


Iron daggers (1 iron ingot, 1 leather strip) are the best, followed by hide/leather bracers(1 leather, 2 leather strips).

If you are on a budget, iron ore is 1/3 the cost of iron ingots and leather is cheaper than 4 strips so, if you don't mind smelting or breaking down the leather, it's a better option. If you go to Whiterun, all of the smithing devices are right next to the entrance and the blacksmith outside, as well as the shopkeeper inside, have smithing supplies for sale. Occasionally, the general store will have them in small quantities as well.

CorruptUser wrote:TBH I cheated and added some of the lockpick perks through the console, as well as the heavy side of smithing. You mean just becuse I like light armor I can't upgrade my daedric dagger as far?


A better question is why there are no dragonbone weapons...

CorruptUser wrote:Pity that you can't use a mace as a 'skeleton key'. Imagine someone smashing into your home with the unholy weapon of Molag Bal, decked out in armor made from the skins of eldritch abominations. Yeah, threaten to call the guards, I dare you.


There's a If it does everything else, why is there no Thu'um for that?!
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Jan 04, 2012 5:12 pm UTC

Lostdreams wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:TBH I cheated and added some of the lockpick perks through the console, as well as the heavy side of smithing. You mean just becuse I like light armor I can't upgrade my daedric dagger as far?


A better question is why there are no dragonbone weapons...
...there's a mod for that...
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Mumpy » Wed Jan 04, 2012 5:15 pm UTC

Lostdreams wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:Pity that you can't use a mace as a 'skeleton key'. Imagine someone smashing into your home with the unholy weapon of Molag Bal, decked out in armor made from the skins of eldritch abominations. Yeah, threaten to call the guards, I dare you.


There's a If it does everything else, why is there no Thu'um for that?!
There was a mod for oblivion where locks were breakable for those with high enough strength. I guess the same could be applied to one/two handed. I kinda want to leave skyrim alone until the dlc has come out. Just so that the mods I get don't make the game explode upon startup.

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Koa
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Koa » Wed Jan 04, 2012 5:50 pm UTC

Telchar wrote:Best way I've found to level smithing: Whiterun Iron Dagger making.

You can also transmute iron into gold to make jewelry. I'd mine a bunch of iron, transmute it all before I made it back to a city, and would make some very expensive enchanted jewelry. It levels blacksmithing, enchanting, and nets you a lot of money without weighing you down too much.

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An Enraged Platypus
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby An Enraged Platypus » Wed Jan 04, 2012 6:11 pm UTC

Koa wrote:
Telchar wrote:Best way I've found to level smithing: Whiterun Iron Dagger making.

You can also transmute iron into gold to make jewelry. I'd mine a bunch of iron, transmute it all before I made it back to a city, and would make some very expensive enchanted jewelry. It levels blacksmithing, enchanting, and nets you a lot of money without weighing you down too much.


Transmute <3, shame you can't buy it in the shops. For all you kids out there wondering, it's in Ansilvund Excavation, Eastmarch. Nearest town is Shor's Stone, to the south.
We consider every day a plus/To spend it with a platypus/We're always so ecstatic/'Cause he's semi-aquatic!

- Phineas & Ferb

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emceng
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby emceng » Wed Jan 04, 2012 6:38 pm UTC

Hmmm, is that the only place? I picked it up someplace, but that doesn't sound familiar. Then again pretty much all I've done the past 15 levels is wander around and clear dungeons with no quest telling me to. Again, don't want to know, but wondering when I will get more powerful shouts. I keep finding new ones, but want to improve what I have. Ice form is awesome though! I've got...6-8 shouts already, only really use 1-2. Should do it more, but I'm so forgetful.
When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up. - CS Lewis

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Lostdreams
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Lostdreams » Wed Jan 04, 2012 6:54 pm UTC

Half of the time I don't even remember to shoutas the shouts aren't really that great. There are only a few people seem to really use and the rest are just there for entertainment value.

Marked for death seems to work pretty well for me and I could see why people use the attack speed one(whose name I forget) and maybe even etherial form for escapes but the rest seem kind of lacking or very situational.
The Mighty Thesaurus wrote:
TrlstanC wrote:But, I'm still curious, did no one else ever learn about creationism in science class at some point, at least those who went to public school?

Sorry, we just learned science.

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emceng
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby emceng » Wed Jan 04, 2012 7:49 pm UTC

Ok question time: are they always in the same place? Will you always get that pushback one in the first quest dungeon? or
Spoiler:
I think I got either disarm or the whisper(locate life) one in Voldunruud last night.
When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up. - CS Lewis


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