Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Of the Tabletop, and other, lesser varieties.

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Princess Marzipan » Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:58 am UTC

Endless Mike wrote:I don't like levelling systems that breed identical characters, which gets rid of 7, 8, 10, and 12.


To be fair, 10 and 12 only build identical characters if you're the type of jackass that builds identical characters.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Zohar » Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:07 am UTC

Nougatrocity wrote:
Endless Mike wrote:I don't like levelling systems that breed identical characters, which gets rid of 7, 8, 10, and 12.


To be fair, 10 and 12 only build identical characters if you're the type of jackass that builds identical characters.


I disagree. I don't think 8 was much different than 12. If anything, 8 had more specialized characters because of the different limit breaks. 12 was the first FF since 7 to have limit breaks only devoted to causing damage. 7 had what I would call specialized characters because of that as well, because the character growth wasn't as controlled by the player as 8/10/12's and also due to the different weapon ranges. While it's true that in 10 you can make identical characters, it's not really worth the effort at the beginning. Only closer to the endgame do characters become truly identical. When that happened, the decided factor for me was the various overdrives.

And of course, those aren't the only FFs to have equally-levelled characters. The complete list of FFs where the characters were truly different includes only FFs 4, 6 and 9 (and, I suppose, Mystic Quest). It's much more common to have versatile characters in the franchise.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby MFHodge » Mon Feb 11, 2008 2:46 pm UTC

If I ever do a second play through of 12, I am going to try it with making very specialized characters. I did a little by giving a couple more magic and a couple more weapons, but I really did even everybody out pretty quickly. I was also too leveled for most of the game from exploring and doing hunts. I will probably try to just push through the story with focused characters next time.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby mosc » Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:44 pm UTC

10 the characters are far from identical. Early game, they all have their own grids and are physically locked from going into somebody else's. Endgame, you might be able to move from one to another but unless you level grind endlessly, you're a long long way from getting everyone through everyone's grid. Even if you did that though, everyone has different celestial weapons and everyone has different limit breaks.

Almost all the games the characters become fairly similar all the way back to FF3 which first gave us the job system and blurred the line between characters. FF4 might be the one exception but 3, 5, 6, etc everyone becomes fairly similar if you take things to the extreme. That said, they do have SOME differences.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby UtopiaNH » Mon Feb 18, 2008 3:23 pm UTC

I don't get people who complain about "identical" characters, when most of the games allow you to specialize your characters however you like. FFXII I have 6 completely unique characters each with their own function (I have a paladin, a warrior, a barbarian, an archer/black mage, a white mage, and a ninja/thief). While yes, everyone has access to some of the basic spells, they aren't gambitted to use them and act completely different due to the way their gear and gambits are set up.

FF10, if you didn't want identical characters, don't overlevel; you can beat the game before you get very far out of each character's grid.

...

Anyway, in general I like the flexibility allowed in later FF growth systems; they keep things a little more interesting than typical level systems. Heck, my characters in the later FFs are far more unique than FFV/VI (VI characters only differed in their one special ability, overall they could all use any magic you taught them, and there's no incentive to specialize).
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby LauraSakura » Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:34 pm UTC

I'm playing 6 right now because I <3 It.
Emotionally, I got really caught up in 10.
7 was OK... but I'm one of the rare ones who actually liked 8 better.
Ones like 3 and 5 were fun for the job classes and stuff, but storyline was kinda absent.

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby mosc » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:00 pm UTC

LauraSakura wrote:I'm playing 6 right now because I <3 It.
Emotionally, I got really caught up in 10.
7 was OK... but I'm one of the rare ones who actually liked 8 better.
Ones like 3 and 5 were fun for the job classes and stuff, but storyline was kinda absent.

got a GBA/DS? pick up 4A... You'll love it.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby LauraSakura » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:12 pm UTC

mosc wrote:got a GBA/DS? pick up 4A... You'll love it.


Yep, I think I'm gonna borrow it from a friend once I finish FF6. However... I can't just beat the game, i gotta get all the secret stuff too, thats just how i am :mrgreen:

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby segmentation fault » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:49 pm UTC

i just picked up a ds, and ff3.

i have to say i loved ff3 on NES, and this is alot better. the job system has always been fun.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Stief » Mon Feb 25, 2008 1:47 pm UTC

I've just ordered Tactics for the GBA :P

Anyone else played this?

is it any good?
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:07 pm UTC

Stief wrote:I've just ordered Tactics for the GBA :P Anyone else played this? is it any good?


I'm guessing you mean Final Fantasy Tactics Advance? (Though, on a quick look, I see no evidence of anything that would run on a GBA that's got Final Fantasy Tactics in the name)

A lot of things were simplified from the original. Letsee.. the original basically used humans and had two gender-specific classes for a total of 19-20 (Depending on if you count the gender specific classes as a "pair" and only once, or if you count them individually) , FFTA has I don't want to count how many classes, so I'll just say probably 10 more, but since classes are race specific, it seems as though there are fewer classes. The madness of birthsigns is gone, replaced by the lunacy of laws. You cannot capture monsters and then use them as soldiers.. instead you capture them for use as forms by your Morpher, should you choose to get one. Rather than gaining job experience and buying abilities that way, you instead learn them from your weaponry...which kinda sucks when you finally decide you want this soldier to be an archer and they've got to start out with a shitty bow to get a couple of the basic abilities.

Overall, though, it's a good game.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby pieaholicx » Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:12 pm UTC

Tactics advance was actually pretty easy, and the story's okay. My suggestion if you want a good challenge, don't use an Assassin. I had one Assassin who only had like 3 moves, but one of them was instant KO, and the other was instant petrify. Needless to say, it's really OP when you realize that they have a good movement range as well.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby wery67564 » Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:48 pm UTC

VII and XII ftw.

Can't wait to see the VII remake, makes me happy deep down inside!
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Aleril » Mon Feb 25, 2008 3:32 pm UTC

I found IX to be my favorite for it's story and character development and X for its leveling up system.

Also Zidane is my favorite character in FF because he is the only one that isnt brooding and goth.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby wery67564 » Mon Feb 25, 2008 3:34 pm UTC

Brooding and goth? But you have Aries, shes so happy, right until massive bleeding and drowning ended it all!
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby pieaholicx » Mon Feb 25, 2008 4:57 pm UTC

Aleril wrote:Also Zidane is my favorite character in FF because he is the only one that isnt brooding and goth.

I seriously don't think Zell quite fits that description.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:55 pm UTC

pieaholicx wrote:
Aleril wrote:Also Zidane is my favorite character in FF because he is the only one that isnt brooding and goth.

I seriously don't think Zell quite fits that description.

He's also barely a main character and you never have to use him if you don't want.

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby pieaholicx » Mon Feb 25, 2008 7:15 pm UTC

Endless Mike wrote:
pieaholicx wrote:
Aleril wrote:Also Zidane is my favorite character in FF because he is the only one that isnt brooding and goth.

I seriously don't think Zell quite fits that description.

He's also barely a main character and you never have to use him if you don't want.

Ah, but Aleril didn't say main character, just character.

Either way, I liked Zell and actually used him. Also, I'm pretty sure that you have to use him in that one part where you're in jail, since he's the only one who still has his "weapon".
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:32 pm UTC

It's been a long time since I played it, and I don't know if I got that far since the story went from bad to DEAR GOD DID SOMEONE ACTUALLY WRITE THIS TRIPE? when they realized they grew up in the same orphange but forgot. I liked the Laguna sections, though, and think Squeenix should make Final Fantasy 8: Laguna and Crew Shoot Things instead of endless terrible FF7 spinoffs.

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Izawwlgood » Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:35 pm UTC

My favorites are American FF3, FF7, gameboys FF1-3, FFX and FF12. i couldn't get into any of the others.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Lumpy » Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:46 pm UTC

I thought FFIX and FFX were best. I stopped playing XII at the point where you were on that floating island going into the mines with the bridge of rotting skeletons. The storyline felt lacking in comparison to its predecessors. For VII, it was mostly gameplay and graphics, combined with a hint of "Darth Vader is Luke's father" things I already knew that would have otherwise been better.

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:43 pm UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:My favorites are American FF3, FF7, gameboys FF1-3, FFX and FF12. i couldn't get into any of the others.

The Gameboy "Legends" games weren't actually FF games. They were SaGa games. they just renamed them for North America to cash in on the FF name.

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby mosc » Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:59 pm UTC

I own the PSX and GBA versions of tactics but I have never really played it much. Which should I try out? I'm partial to the GBA copy unless somebody tells me otherwise.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:38 am UTC

The GBA one has more hand-holding than the PSX one, and as a whole doesn't seem quite as deep. Can't mount Chocobos in Battle, and the jobs don't seem to have nearly as many abilities, though in some cases (The Dragoon, for example) that works out for the best... having 12 versions of Jump to buy is kinda.. silly. So, really..though it came out later, I'd recommend starting with the GBA one, then graduating (and accepting a couple of regressions, like having to teach your characters how to use a goddamn potion) back to the PSX one.

And.. maybe it's just me, but combat seems to be a hell of a lot faster in the GBA one.

Saying they're versions is kinda a misnomer.. like saying A Link to the Past is the SNES version of The Legend of Zelda. They're different games, different stories, different maps, etc. The PSX sports an all human cast (And apparently you can match birth signs and faith levels and such to who should fight who and who's good at magic versus hard to hurt with magic and so forth) while the GBA one has five races, with their own race specific classes. Only a couple of bleedover classes among them.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Izawwlgood » Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:02 am UTC

SeGa games? What series is that? I didn't know that, although FFadventures had more of a secret of mana storyline.

I would highly recommend avoiding GBA's FFtactics, as it is a derivative childish and overall dull game. I brought i along an international flight and ended up falling asleep every half hour or so I was sloughing through it.
PSX tactics is by far one of the best games I've ever played, and I apologize for not putting it in my list. Its just very non-FF
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby pieaholicx » Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:20 am UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:SeGa games? What series is that? I didn't know that, although FFadventures had more of a secret of mana storyline.


SaGa is another RPG series by Square.

Izawwlgood wrote:PSX tactics is by far one of the best games I've ever played, and I apologize for not putting it in my list. Its just very non-FF

I posted about this before, and am being too lazy to repost it so you get a link to the old post.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Feb 26, 2008 3:32 am UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:I would highly recommend avoiding GBA's FFtactics, as it is a derivative childish and overall dull game. I brought i along an international flight and ended up falling asleep every half hour or so I was sloughing through it.

I was going to go into some argument about how while the combat isn't quite as deep, it's essentially the same game. Then I remembered that most people don't play those games like I do.. which usually consists of mashing the "Shut the hell up" button whenever any character opens their damned mouth, and getting on with the tactical strategy.

So.. yeah, I'm not too clear on the story, honestly.. something about crystals and some made up fantasy land with a white-haired redhead or something?
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Kag » Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:21 am UTC

The story is...just horrible. The only character who isn't a completely selfish jerkass is Cid (Marche Bastard does technically end up making everyone's lives better in the long run, but he's still a total dick).
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:32 am UTC

Oh, Marche is the main character.. I always did the classic RPG thing, and named him Bastard.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Izawwlgood » Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:50 am UTC

They're kids. Not teens, but kids. The game felt age appropriate. I hated the concept of learning a skill by using an item, as if to imply that individuals don't matter, just their gear.

FFtactics for PSX had one of the craziest plot-within-plot storylines I've seen. Subterfuge and backstabbing... Church vs. State and technology vs. religion, greater good vs. moral ambiguity. Also, the job system was great.


I dunno Talon, I read everything pretty closely, perhaps overly critically, but was simply left bored and stupified at the boring plot and boring dialog in FFtactics for GBA. Oh no, in this new world we're super powerful and we're going to try and stop the schoolyard bully who's now a judge? Waa waa waa.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Feb 26, 2008 6:13 am UTC

Well, like I said.. I don't play Final Fantasy games for the story. I pretty much play the Tactics games for.. tactical warfare.

Much like how I really just do random battles in Advance Wars.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Kag » Tue Feb 26, 2008 6:14 am UTC

SecondTalon wrote:Oh, Marche is the main character.. I always did the classic RPG thing, and named him Bastard.


Hmm, good point.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Endless Mike » Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:06 pm UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:SeGa games? What series is that? I didn't know that, although FFadventures had more of a secret of mana storyline.

PSX tactics is by far one of the best games I've ever played, and I apologize for not putting it in my list. Its just very non-FF
Spoiler:
(but you can get Cloud Strife, and he kicks ass!)

As mentioned, SaGa is another series by Square. We've gotten some later games with their actual titles (SaGa Frontier, Unlimited SaGa, maybe some others). FF Adventure was ALSO renamed, but it was renamed from Seiken Densetsu (I'll pretend that's spelled right), the sequel to which (Seiken Densetsu 2) was an SNES game that we got as Secret of Mana. They've maintained the Mana name for later non-Japanese releases in the series.

FFT doesn't feel like an FF since Square just bought the developers of Ogre Battle and Tactics Ogre and basically told them to make a game with some FF feel to it (Job system, Chocobos, etc.). If you play Tactics Ogre, you'll find them very, very similar in many respects.

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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Izawwlgood » Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:10 pm UTC

I got FF12 for DS, and was pretty disappointed. The game basically consists of telling your guys to go attack something, and making sure they don't get stuck along the walk. It has one of the stupidest crafting systems I've ever seen in a videogame. Say you want to make a Wind Sword. You need a handful of components found throughout levels, which you ultimately get regardless of whether or not you spend the time to go out of your way and gather them (thats fine), and then you answer a series of questions. The following is an example of the questions asked (remember, we're forging a WIND SWORD [for example])

1. Do you like Penelo? (yes, no, I'm not sure!)
2. Is Penelo a good dancer? (She's great! She's horrid! I won't say!)
3. Would you dance with Penelo? (I'm a bad dancer! I'd love to! I like milk!)

And so on. How you answer these questions actually affects the final stats of your forged product, and there are already charts online you can find that break down the stat affects for each question. I.e., requires a buttload of trial and error.

Stay away from this lame game.

Its a shame, because FF12 had a fantastic and frantic combat system.
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby UtopiaNH » Wed Feb 27, 2008 5:46 am UTC

Endless Mike wrote:
Izawwlgood wrote:SeGa games? What series is that? I didn't know that, although FFadventures had more of a secret of mana storyline.

PSX tactics is by far one of the best games I've ever played, and I apologize for not putting it in my list. Its just very non-FF
Spoiler:
(but you can get Cloud Strife, and he kicks ass!)

As mentioned, SaGa is another series by Square. We've gotten some later games with their actual titles (SaGa Frontier, Unlimited SaGa, maybe some others). FF Adventure was ALSO renamed, but it was renamed from Seiken Densetsu (I'll pretend that's spelled right), the sequel to which (Seiken Densetsu 2) was an SNES game that we got as Secret of Mana. They've maintained the Mana name for later non-Japanese releases in the series.



The SaGa series is as follows:

Makai Toushi SaGa: released on the GB, retitled for the US as Final Fantasy Legend, and remade on the Wonderswan Colour
SaGa 2: Released on the GB, retitled for the US as Final Fantasy Legend II
SaGa 3: Released on the GB, retitled for the US as Final Fantasy Legend III
Romancing SaGa: Released on the Super Famicon (SNES), never released in the US in it's original format, Completely Remade for the PS2 and called the same.
Romancing SaGa 2: Released on the Super Famicon (SNES), never released in the US
Romancing SaGa 3: Released on the Super Famicon (SNES), never released in the US
SaGa Frontier: Released on the PSX in the US under the same title
SaGa Frontier 2: Released on the PSX in all territories
Unlimited Saga: Released on the PS2 in all territories - for some strange reason this is the only title in the series to not have a capital G in the SaGa.

Technically it's received nine titles, but a few of them are not available in english. Despite Romancing SaGa PS2 being a "remake", it is genuinely a completely different game using a new combat system evolved further within the series and only taking character names and some story elements from the original. There is a translation patch available for Romancing SaGa 3, although 1 & 2 have not been translated (last I checked). Some of the games follow multiple character plots, while others follow a generational storyline. Combat features many common elements like a Life Point system (used differently in each game), "Inspiration" for learning new abilities (from the SNES onward), an A-typical leveling system based on your actions in combat, and frequently some kind of party combination/tactical system. They generally drop the player into the game world with little explanation of how the game works, or where to go, and can be frustrating for a newcomber. If you are going to try to breach into the series the two PSX titles are generally a good place to start; SF features probably the easiest overall combat system to pick up and learn, while SF2 features the most direction (extremely linear), and storytelling in the series. The two PS2 titles are perhaps the hardest to grasp if you have no played a prior title in the series, particularly Unlimited which is extremely different from even the other titles within (and is by no means a bad game, but will put off a majority of people who try to play it and fail to understand how the game mechanics work).

Dark Ragnarok
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Dark Ragnarok » Wed Feb 27, 2008 11:52 am UTC

I just want to say. I want to hug everyone who liked/loved FF9 for various reasons.

Thank You.

People do have taste! I love Zidane for being perverted here and there. He also reminds me of myself a lot. But eh. The story was really well done. Love it. Sweet ending too.

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Endless Mike
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Endless Mike » Wed Feb 27, 2008 2:22 pm UTC

I liked Zidane because (barring a small portion of the game), he wasn't whiny and brooding, and was actually quite happy and exciting. Hell, his initial motivation was that he wanted to hook up with Garnet.

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Torvaun
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Torvaun » Wed Feb 27, 2008 2:31 pm UTC

I liked IX not just because of upbeat characters, but also (especially) because of internally consistent technology. In VIII, the only characters that made any sense whatsoever were Zell and Irvine. In every other case, we have characters that, while supposedly elite mercenary types, have chosen paths that are substandard on both damage output and resources. Sniper rifles are effective, and clearly an acceptable path. Fists require no external resources, and are also clearly acceptable. A sword is unacceptable, due to being bulky and extremely short range. Even if you weld it to a pistol, something which is historically accurate, but, oddly enough, stopped being used once guns became reasonably effective, as they apparently are in VIII.

Don't even get me started on VII.
Hawknc wrote:I don't know if you've never heard of trolling, or if you're just very good at it.

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Endless Mike
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Endless Mike » Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:21 pm UTC

Hehe, the gunblades aren't even useable as guns. Essentially, they have a "bullet" in them that fires and adds some kinetic energy to your strike, but doesn't actually leave the gunblade.

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Izawwlgood
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Re: Final Fantasy series.... favorites?

Postby Izawwlgood » Wed Feb 27, 2008 4:05 pm UTC

I'm sorry, are you trying to legitimize the gunblade? Are you going to imply that their hairstyles increase their ability to run next?
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