Daredevil (Netflix)

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby ahammel » Fri May 01, 2015 12:06 am UTC

Mighty Jalapeno wrote:And my son made a casual observation that I'd never really thought about... if all of his senses are so crazy honed, so sensitive, so preternatural, and he can read ink on paper by detecting thermal differences in the ink's absorptive spectrum... does he feel pain ten times, a hundred times more intense? :shock:

I think that's canon in the comic books. It's hinted at with the throwaway line about cotton sheets hurting his skin.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Mighty Jalapeno » Fri May 01, 2015 2:09 am UTC

I've never read any of the comics, and only made it halfway through the movie, but yes, it was pretty obvious about the sheets line nonetheless.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Christo » Sat May 02, 2015 2:03 pm UTC

I just finished the series and appreciate this thread. I totally missed that...
Spoiler:
Gao could be a skrull


But I've got a lingering question:
Spoiler:
You know how Fisk is always going on about fixing the city? What exactly is he trying to do? I mean, he's doing an awful lot of immoral things, and if it's a matter of "the ends justifying the means," I'd like to know what ends he has in mind.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Thesh » Sat May 02, 2015 11:14 pm UTC

Christo wrote:But I've got a lingering question:
Spoiler:
You know how Fisk is always going on about fixing the city? What exactly is he trying to do? I mean, he's doing an awful lot of immoral things, and if it's a matter of "the ends justifying the means," I'd like to know what ends he has in mind.


Spoiler:
Gentrification. Buy up all the properties, tear them with and rebuild with properties that are expensive enough to keep the poor people out.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Mighty Jalapeno » Sat May 02, 2015 11:24 pm UTC

Spoiler:
Thus eliminating the specter of poverty forever. HOW IS THAT A BAD THING?!?!?!

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Christo » Sun May 03, 2015 11:17 am UTC

Thesh wrote:
Christo wrote:But I've got a lingering question:
Spoiler:
You know how Fisk is always going on about fixing the city? What exactly is he trying to do? I mean, he's doing an awful lot of immoral things, and if it's a matter of "the ends justifying the means," I'd like to know what ends he has in mind.


Spoiler:
Gentrification. Buy up all the properties, tear them with and rebuild with properties that are expensive enough to keep the poor people out.


Was that really it or are you being sarcastic?
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Angua » Sun May 03, 2015 11:33 am UTC

That was how I interpreted Fisk's plans as well.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby infernovia » Mon May 04, 2015 5:01 am UTC

This is an awesome show. Engrossing, violent, spectacular. This trumps every single movie Marvel has ever released, and it's not even close.

I am so glad the guy who created the fight scenes in The Raid can use it in a story that actually has this level of writing. Its really the best you could hope for.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Yakk » Mon May 04, 2015 10:42 am UTC

Fisk loves
Spoiler:
the *city*, while Murdock loves the people of the city. To Fisk, clearing out the poor to replace with rich is fixing the city. Well,

Spoiler:
Fisk *loved* the city.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby maybeagnostic » Mon May 04, 2015 11:43 am UTC

To me the weirdest thing about Fisk's plans
Spoiler:
was that he didn't seem to really care about any person or place in particular. He was going to push the people out, destroy the buildings and rebuild everything the way he likes it. So, yes, gentrification and control of where he grew up... maybe that's what he was really after?


About Gao:
Spoiler:
A friend who watched the show still believes she is human. Apparently the "home is much farther away than China" and "your world" comments she made didn't convince him she is an alien.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby clockworkmonk » Mon May 04, 2015 8:39 pm UTC

regarding Gao
Spoiler:
my friend who is really into The Immortal Iron Fist thinks Gao is involved in mystical stuff related to Iron Fist stories. This is also shown somehow by the dragon stamp on the heroin.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby maybeagnostic » Tue May 05, 2015 5:57 am UTC

Spoiler:
That might be quite a revelation if I had any idea who the Iron Fist is. I guess I'll find out in due time.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby The Mighty Thesaurus » Tue May 05, 2015 6:25 am UTC

clockworkmonk wrote:regarding Gao
Spoiler:
my friend who is really into The Immortal Iron Fist thinks Gao is involved in mystical stuff related to Iron Fist stories. This is also shown somehow by the dragon stamp on the heroin.

viewtopic.php?p=3774211#p3774211
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby ahammel » Tue May 05, 2015 1:48 pm UTC

Do heroin distributers really brand their stock?
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Thesh » Tue May 05, 2015 2:03 pm UTC

Summum ius, summa iniuria.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby ahammel » Tue May 05, 2015 2:07 pm UTC


Huh. That does not seem like a good idea, but I guess they're the professionals.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Thesh » Tue May 05, 2015 2:12 pm UTC

I don't see why not. If you are a distributer, how else are you going to get people to look for your product rather than just anyone's product?
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby ahammel » Tue May 05, 2015 2:22 pm UTC

Thesh wrote:I don't see why not. If you are a distributer, how else are you going to get people to look for your product rather than just anyone's product?
Well, it also makes it really easy for law enforcement to recognise your product. Or make vigilantes, for that matter. But I suppose that if they manage to determine that you've been manufacturing any heroin, regardless of branding, you're hosed anyway.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Yakk » Tue May 05, 2015 2:49 pm UTC

The value of trade marks is high. I mean, you are buying a good that isn't regulated. And sometimes is toxic.

If you know that brand X doesn't suck, that is a hard earned lesson. Some new brand might be toxic. You'd much prefer brand X to the alternatives, and might even pay a premium for it.

Branding the drugs themselves keeps the evidence of "there are drugs for sale" on the thing that makes it obvious (the drugs).
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Christo » Wed May 06, 2015 12:58 pm UTC

maybeagnostic wrote:To me the weirdest thing about Fisk's plans
Spoiler:
was that he didn't seem to really care about any person or place in particular. He was going to push the people out, destroy the buildings and rebuild everything the way he likes it. So, yes, gentrification and control of where he grew up... maybe that's what he was really after?



I guess it's no stupider than the League of Shadow plan in Batman Begins. "Yes, some of those people are murderers, so we'll murder all of them to show that murder is wrong!"

Still, I would expect more from Marvel/Netflix. I would, at the very least, appreciate some specific insights into Fisk's plan.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Lucrece » Sun May 10, 2015 7:01 am UTC

Fisk just seemed like the least interesting/working aspect of the show. Another bad guy with daddy issues, typical violent yet infantile behemoth. The other villains were more interesting to be honest.

Also, please, shows, for the sake of native Spanish speakers, don't just hire actors who look "ethnic". Hispanic characters should speak fluent Spanish, not be some person who had a Spanish speaking family member some generations ago and suddenly they qualify as Hispanic despite speaking broken Spanish with obvious anglo accent. Miss Cardenas spoke Spanish with some thick as hell anglophone accent.

It's been annoying the shit out of me lately with all these entertainment industry stunts, sticking some mulatto/mestizo looking person and no matter how poorly they speak Spanish suddenly that's enough because all Americans see is the skin color while native Spanish speakers cover their ears in horror.

Homeland recently made a similar mistake in their second season, pretending a city was Venezuela when a lot of it was Puerto Rico, and then using Cuban and Puerto Rican actors speaking Spanish as if any Venezuelan or Latin American person for that matter wouldn't notice that these people weren't even Venezuelans and yet they were meant to portray them. Then you have Jane The Virgin, based on a Venezuelan soap opera, and they retool it as if she were Mexican because clearly you can do crap like switch an Irish background with a Scottish or Australian one and nobody would notice.In the red carpet they had their little trivia of Spanglish but it wasn't even Spanglish as the words they quizzed the actors on were exclusively Mexican slang not used in any other part of Latin America.

They certainly wouldn't try this stunt grabbing a Japanese guy and pass him off as Chinese or Korean without some controversy.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Thesh » Sun May 10, 2015 7:34 am UTC

That's not unique to people with Hispanic accents, a lot of Americans find people with heavy foreign accents difficult to understand, so with all foreigners in most American TV and movies they tend to look for actors with weaker accents.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Lucrece » Sun May 10, 2015 6:09 pm UTC

But that wasn't what I was talking about. They made the actress for Miss Cardenas fake a heavy accent when speaking English, but the pretense falls apart with spanish speaking people because she obviously is a native English speaker who can barely speak Spanish.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby rmsgrey » Sun May 10, 2015 10:22 pm UTC

Lucrece wrote:Fisk just seemed like the least interesting/working aspect of the show. Another bad guy with daddy issues, typical violent yet infantile behemoth. The other villains were more interesting to be honest.

Also, please, shows, for the sake of native Spanish speakers, don't just hire actors who look "ethnic". Hispanic characters should speak fluent Spanish, not be some person who had a Spanish speaking family member some generations ago and suddenly they qualify as Hispanic despite speaking broken Spanish with obvious anglo accent. Miss Cardenas spoke Spanish with some thick as hell anglophone accent.

It's been annoying the shit out of me lately with all these entertainment industry stunts, sticking some mulatto/mestizo looking person and no matter how poorly they speak Spanish suddenly that's enough because all Americans see is the skin color while native Spanish speakers cover their ears in horror.

Homeland recently made a similar mistake in their second season, pretending a city was Venezuela when a lot of it was Puerto Rico, and then using Cuban and Puerto Rican actors speaking Spanish as if any Venezuelan or Latin American person for that matter wouldn't notice that these people weren't even Venezuelans and yet they were meant to portray them. Then you have Jane The Virgin, based on a Venezuelan soap opera, and they retool it as if she were Mexican because clearly you can do crap like switch an Irish background with a Scottish or Australian one and nobody would notice.In the red carpet they had their little trivia of Spanglish but it wasn't even Spanglish as the words they quizzed the actors on were exclusively Mexican slang not used in any other part of Latin America.

They certainly wouldn't try this stunt grabbing a Japanese guy and pass him off as Chinese or Korean without some controversy.


And they'd definitely never do a movie about an immortal Scotsman where the Scot is played by a Frenchman and the only Scottish actor plays a Spaniard (with a thick Scottish accent). But, hey, they got Queen to do the soundtrack, so who cares!

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Lucrece » Mon May 11, 2015 4:51 am UTC

And in that era Mel Gibson was a working actor despite the shit that would come out of his mouth (not the anti-semite breakdown, way before that when he would be quoted in print telling a gay group to fuck themselves over his homophobic movie, Braveheart). Thus the "without controversy" part in my post.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby maybeagnostic » Mon May 11, 2015 6:19 am UTC

Lucrece wrote:But that wasn't what I was talking about. They made the actress for Miss Cardenas fake a heavy accent when speaking English, but the pretense falls apart with spanish speaking people because she obviously is a native English speaker who can barely speak Spanish.


At least she speaks enough Spanish to fool someone who's studied a bit of Spanish but isn't fluent. I've noticed several shows and movies in the last few years that included people speaking "Russian" but it was painfully obvious someone just typed out the thing phonetically in English (or as close as they could get which isn't very) and the actor never heard any native speaker pronounce it. Bonus points for conversations where one person is clearly a fluent speaker and the other is doing this bullshit so I can understand everything one side says but have to read the subtitles because they are just spouting gibberish. Allegiance was a pleasant surprise since nearly all the supposed native Russian speakers were actually fluent. Too bad the few who weren't were main characters but at least they were born and raised in the US so that kind of made sense.

Lucrece wrote:Fisk just seemed like the least interesting/working aspect of the show. Another bad guy with daddy issues, typical violent yet infantile behemoth. The other villains were more interesting to be honest.

I am not saying he's the most original villain ever created but I can't think of anyone else who fits all of those criteria off the top of my head. Could you elaborate a bit on that? Also, all the other villains seemed like the laziest stereotypes to me. The Japanese businessman-ninja, the mystical Chinese wisewoman (at least it wasn't a man so a bit of stereotype breaking there) speaking in riddles and smirking all the time, the sleazy and cowardly Wall street banker... The "Russians" actually had a nice bit of backstory but I expect it would have been lost on much of the Western audience.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby ArgonV » Mon May 11, 2015 10:23 am UTC

Lucrece wrote:But that wasn't what I was talking about. They made the actress for Miss Cardenas fake a heavy accent when speaking English, but the pretense falls apart with spanish speaking people because she obviously is a native English speaker who can barely speak Spanish.


Same with German. I'm not a native speaker, but I live right next to Germany and have grown up with German TV and radio, as well as plenty of Germans in our city; so I can understand German. When Americans speak German, I need subtitles to realize what they're saying, since they mangle the language. Except for Sarah Chalke on Scrubs.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Mighty Jalapeno » Mon May 11, 2015 4:28 pm UTC

Finished it this morning. Less than impressed with the Kingpin character as a representation of the archetypal Marvel villain, but... I really liked him as a character in this show. I'm especially sort of amused that he seemed to have been propped up almost as a figurehead by Gao, Owlsley, Wesley, and everyone else. They did all the work, he just sort of... yelled, and provided money. Which makes you wonder how he got that much power. It doesn't seem he was really capable of doing anything by himself. He just feels incomplete.

Regarding the end of Episode 13...
Spoiler:
I am a little annoyed that Matt suddenly felt the need to throw Hollywood capoeira into every single motion as soon as he had his own fancy suit. A lot of those kicks and spins and leaps actually REMOVED force from his blows and speed from his motions. I had admired the practicality of the fighting so far, but now he's just a horny freestyle gymnast.


Still looking forward to seeing more.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby infernovia » Thu May 21, 2015 5:24 am UTC

They really should have made him more psychopathic and charming. I still think he had the brutality needed to be a crime king, but he definitely needed more scenes where he was in charge.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Moo » Thu May 21, 2015 2:10 pm UTC

Lucrece wrote:And in that era Mel Gibson was a working actor despite the shit that would come out of his mouth (not the anti-semite breakdown, way before that when he would be quoted in print telling a gay group to fuck themselves over his homophobic movie, Braveheart). Thus the "without controversy" part in my post.
(You do realise he was talking about Highlander, right?)

Also, actual contribution: I really wanted to be blown away by this. I really, really wasn't. I enjoyed The Flash a lot more, and even Scorpion (despite the way googling Walter O'Brien almost spoiled it for me). I mention these because they're what I've been watching recently, as well as Daredevil.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Whizbang » Thu May 21, 2015 2:36 pm UTC

Wait.

You like Scorpion? That shit is like nails on a chalkboard to me.

Sorry. Continue with the Daredevil talk.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Moo » Thu May 21, 2015 2:48 pm UTC

My getting-science-wrong-on-tv standards have become lower and lower the more TV I watch, I guess. I like the Homeland Security guy (Cabe? aka melty terminator man) and the actor playing Walter is a hottie. Meh. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone but I enjoy it like a guilty pleasure.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Lucrece » Fri May 22, 2015 8:15 am UTC

Moo wrote:
Lucrece wrote:And in that era Mel Gibson was a working actor despite the shit that would come out of his mouth (not the anti-semite breakdown, way before that when he would be quoted in print telling a gay group to fuck themselves over his homophobic movie, Braveheart). Thus the "without controversy" part in my post.
(You do realise he was talking about Highlander, right?)

Also, actual contribution: I really wanted to be blown away by this. I really, really wasn't. I enjoyed The Flash a lot more, and even Scorpion (despite the way googling Walter O'Brien almost spoiled it for me). I mention these because they're what I've been watching recently, as well as Daredevil.



Yes, I'm aware. I said Mel Gibson was working in that same time period, meaning bringing up a time period like that where cultural ignorance was the expectation (hell, some movies of that time would get the Huckleberry Finn treatment) as a comparable example to treating Hispanics as interchangeable, much less having "pretend Hispanic" people in TV series in 2015 was not exactly a convincing reply.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Moo » Mon May 25, 2015 12:16 pm UTC

Lucrece wrote:Yes, I'm aware. I said Mel Gibson was working in that same time period, meaning bringing up a time period like that where cultural ignorance was the expectation (hell, some movies of that time would get the Huckleberry Finn treatment) as a comparable example to treating Hispanics as interchangeable, much less having "pretend Hispanic" people in TV series in 2015 was not exactly a convincing reply.
Having just watched Avengers: Age of Ultron yesterday, and speaking of "pretend <culture>" in media, I am afraid it'll take me a while to get over what Andy Serkis did. Andy frigging Serkis! How could he!?
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Lucrece » Mon May 25, 2015 5:33 pm UTC

Haven't seen it yet ;(
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Christo » Tue May 26, 2015 2:54 am UTC

ArgonV wrote:
Lucrece wrote:But that wasn't what I was talking about. They made the actress for Miss Cardenas fake a heavy accent when speaking English, but the pretense falls apart with spanish speaking people because she obviously is a native English speaker who can barely speak Spanish.


Same with German. I'm not a native speaker, but I live right next to Germany and have grown up with German TV and radio, as well as plenty of Germans in our city; so I can understand German. When Americans speak German, I need subtitles to realize what they're saying, since they mangle the language. Except for Sarah Chalke on Scrubs.


I was just in New Orleans. Turns out it's not pronounced Nawlins'. And no one sounded anything like Scott Bakula on NCIS.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby ahammel » Tue May 26, 2015 3:14 am UTC

Christo wrote:I was just in New Orleans. Turns out it's not pronounced Nawlins'.
neWARlins, I'm told.
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Whizbang » Tue May 26, 2015 1:14 pm UTC

Just started watching this series with my wife. She was reluctant to watch yet another superhero show/movie. But she enjoyed it a lot and is hooked. It helps that the summer season has started and we have nothing to watch at night. But still, we're both very impressed with the show so far. The second episode was especially good, where he is found in the dumpster with broken ribs, stab wounds, and generally beat up, then he goes on to kick a bunch of guys' asses at the end.

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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby Whizbang » Tue Jun 09, 2015 6:37 pm UTC

Just finished episode 5.

Spoiler:
Man, Fisk's girl there was just playing coy when she was upset after their first date. I bet she had to take a long bath after that, just to calm down. She was way too interested in watching those buildings burn on their second date. She totally has a bad-boy fetish.

Then there is DD's girlfriend, the nurse lady. They really hammered you with the parallels between DD and Fisk in this episode.


Also,

Spoiler:
Excited to see how DD gets away from the cops, there at the end. I am guessing Stick shows up to bail him out. I guess he could just do some ninja spin move and dodge the bullets and disappear in a shadow, a la Batman, but it definitely seemed like he was fucked without some help.


Oh, and,

Spoiler:
I hoped they would prolong the "Russians think DD killed that guy's brother" story. It seemed good for at least a season's worth of DD catching heat for things Fisk does, until DD somehow manages to make the Russians realize that they've been manipulated and then they hit Fisk, who has to frantically backpedal. It'd show the resilliance and cleverness of both DD and Fisk pretty well, I'd think. Oh well. Big explosions throughout the city are also fun.

The Mighty Thesaurus
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Re: Daredevil (Netflix)

Postby The Mighty Thesaurus » Tue Jun 09, 2015 9:02 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote: the only Scottish actor plays a Spaniard (with a thick Scottish accent)

https://youtu.be/Cc9CAxX4Y-8?t=57s
LE4dGOLEM wrote:your ability to tell things from things remains one of your skills.
Weeks wrote:Not only can you tell things from things, you can recognize when a thing is a thing

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam


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