Glee

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Glee

Postby Amora » Wed Sep 30, 2009 2:48 am UTC

So I started watching the series on Hulu after an NPR interview with Matthew Morrison, the main character of the series.

The show focuses on a High School's glee club, a group based around show choir, weaving (very well done) remakes of current and classic songs into the clubs performances and, in true musical fashion, in situations where busting out into song is completely called for. The kids in the club have already tackled songs from Journey's Don't Stop Believin' to Kanye West's Golddigger, and in the most recent episode, had the entire football team perform Beyonce's Single Ladies during a game.

Although somewhat predictable, it is a lot of fun to watch, and is an all around good piece of television. I'd give a very sincere recommendation for it. It airs Wednesdays on Fox at 9/8c.

So, has anyone else had the pleasure of watching it yet?
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Re: Glee

Postby apricity » Wed Sep 30, 2009 5:59 am UTC

Hah, I just ranted about this show. I adore the singing and hate the show. I watched the first 4 episodes to give it a real shot, but It reinforces stereotypes WAY too much, and I'm not comfortable watching it. The white girl and boy are always the main event, and the black girl, the Asian girl, the gay guy, and the guy in the wheelchair are the tokens in the background. Even though IMO Mercedes' voice is every bit as good as Rachel's, in an extremely different way, and I don't think Finn's voice is very good at all. The cheerleaders are ditzy and the jocks are assholes... it's unoriginal and predictable.

My breaking point was how they handled
Spoiler:
Kurt coming out to his dad. "I knew since you were 3, when you asked for sensible heels for Christmas"?? Could they be more stereotypical? I was all excited when he said he was straight, because at least that would subvert a stereotype, but then they had to go and take it back.
Anyway, I'm going to Youtube the actual singing, because I am in love with the voices of Lea Michele (Rachel) and Matthew Morrison (Mr. Schuester), and the performances have all been amazing. But I can't watch the show.
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Re: Glee

Postby axilog14 » Wed Sep 30, 2009 4:24 pm UTC

I love the music, but I also secretly keep hoping the story would take on a more interesting direction aside from all the formulaic teen drama we've seen so far. (So far I'm still up to the episode where Mercedes breaks Kurt's window during the bikini car wash.)

I have to admit I'm curious as to how the series would provide a non-contrived way for Will to end up with Emma. I'm also looking forward to a future episode focusing on Tina, I keep having this feeling there's something more to her character than what the clumsy writing has shown us so far. (That's probably just runaway optimism on my part though :? )
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Re: Glee

Postby clockworkmonk » Wed Sep 30, 2009 4:32 pm UTC

Well, I enjoy the show for what it is. In a word, fun. Sure, its very predictable, with a commonly rehashed story, but look at what Scooby Doo did with that? Sure, as its currently going, its not going to be the most original series ever, but thats OK, Sometimes its alright to tell the same stereotypical story with the same stereotypical characters if you manage to tell it in a way that amuses. and I think Glee definitely amuses.
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Re: Glee

Postby steewi » Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:46 am UTC

clockworkmonk wrote:Well, I enjoy the show for what it is. In a word, fun. Sure, its very predictable, with a commonly rehashed story, but look at what Scooby Doo did with that? Sure, as its currently going, its not going to be the most original series ever, but thats OK, Sometimes its alright to tell the same stereotypical story with the same stereotypical characters if you manage to tell it in a way that amuses. and I think Glee definitely amuses.

That's pretty much where I'm at. It's fun, and it's stereotypical, but it's worth the watching because it's just amusing. And I'm really enjoying the music. I have a secret liking for Take A Bow and Gold Digger (ssshhh... don't tell anyone), so I was happy to hear and watch them in a different light. Plus fun choreography. OK, so I'm a Broadway geek. :)

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Re: Glee

Postby Mo0man » Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:06 am UTC

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Re: Glee

Postby ameretrifle » Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:31 am UTC

lanicita wrote:Hah, I just ranted about this show. I adore the singing and hate the show. I watched the first 4 episodes to give it a real shot, but It reinforces stereotypes WAY too much, and I'm not comfortable watching it. The white girl and boy are always the main event, and the black girl, the Asian girl, the gay guy, and the guy in the wheelchair are the tokens in the background. Even though IMO Mercedes' voice is every bit as good as Rachel's, in an extremely different way, and I don't think Finn's voice is very good at all. The cheerleaders are ditzy and the jocks are assholes... it's unoriginal and predictable.

My breaking point was how they handled
Spoiler:
Kurt coming out to his dad. "I knew since you were 3, when you asked for sensible heels for Christmas"?? Could they be more stereotypical? I was all excited when he said he was straight, because at least that would subvert a stereotype, but then they had to go and take it back.
Anyway, I'm going to Youtube the actual singing, because I am in love with the voices of Lea Michele (Rachel) and Matthew Morrison (Mr. Schuester), and the performances have all been amazing. But I can't watch the show.

clockworkmonk wrote:Well, I enjoy the show for what it is. In a word, fun. Sure, its very predictable, with a commonly rehashed story, but look at what Scooby Doo did with that? Sure, as its currently going, its not going to be the most original series ever, but thats OK, Sometimes its alright to tell the same stereotypical story with the same stereotypical characters if you manage to tell it in a way that amuses. and I think Glee definitely amuses.
I agree with every word of both of these posts, actually. Depending a little on mood. As long as it stays entertaining, at least, I'm willing to keep watching it-- the stereotypes so far bother me, and I think it's a huge missed opportunity, but it's not quite a dealbreaker. But if it stops being entertaining, then I'm going to be gone pretty fast. I didn't like tonight's episode... something about Kristen Chenowith's voice just bothers me, always has, and singing doesn't help.

More specific things I'm not a fan of:
Spoiler:
The fact that both of the pregnant women are blithely lying about it to their innocent, befuddled partners is getting a bit grating. >_> And yeah, I kind of wanted Kurt to turn out straight, too. I agree about Finn's voice, and the whole "Oh me yarm THIS ONE PERSON IS THE LINCHPIN OF OUR WHOLE SHOW WHAT DO WE DO WITHOUT RACHEL" thing is getting pretty unbelievable. I mean, what the hell kind of club is that? Besides, they keep insisting on disproving the theory themselves. Mercedes?/Asian Girl Whose Name I Don't Know Because They Won't Goddamn Show Her was perfectly damn good on that song from West Side Story, and I say that as someone who thinks Simon Cowell can really be way too lenient with those American Idol contestants. And they had to have Rachel on Somebody to Love? Hey, what about the girl who belted out that last line, why couldn't she have picked up a couple more verses? God.
I did think they took some creative risks in the second episode. They need to keep on that, and also remember that a show choir is a show choir. If they use more of their supporting cast in less expected ways, the show will be better and funnier, simple as that.

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Re: Glee

Postby Lucrece » Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:58 am UTC

God, the episode's rendition of Maybe This Time was auditory orgasm for me. So sultry and elegant and bashful.

I like the show. This is black comedy; black comedy lives on stereotypes and over the top characters. I do think many of the cast are underused. Kurt? Has he sung a single piece? Equally ignored are the Asian, black, and disabled kids. In an interview, Ryan Murphy states that he created the character with self-reference, so it is important to know that the stereotypes actually exist. There are fussy, superficial, effeminate gay kids; I can say I've met a lot of obnoxious gay men who think they're the fashion police; they jack off to Stacy and London from What Not To Wear, I suspect.*

I love the show; and, my god, more shirtless Puck, please. That man is so fine. What a sexy swagger.

*With that said, Ryan Murphy is not exempt from criticism for being a gay man. This is the same man who created atrocious gay male characters on Niptuck, including a man who realized he was gay because he liked what he felt while being raped. Or the bisexual, psychopathic surgeon.
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Re: Glee

Postby smw543 » Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:17 am UTC

About stereotypes (and high school sitcom clichés in general): I only watched the first episode (in fact, this point is why I didn't continue), but I was fairly annoyed by the way that they would occasionally present them in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way, as if mocking them, then go right back to copypasta'ing from The Beginner's Guide to Writing Stupid Television1. I remember starting the premier with the expectation of some level of satire (not sure where I got this idea from; probably the commercials but I can't be bothered to check) and was very disappointed.

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Re: Glee

Postby ameretrifle » Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:54 am UTC

They seemed to write her off in this one episode, but I can't be sure. I was kind of in a bad mood tonight, so maybe that's why I didn't like it as much...?

(meh, who'm I kidding, I'm doomed to be heterodox in my cultural opinions forever. Ask the Doctor Who thread. :D)

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Re: Glee

Postby netcrusher88 » Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:59 am UTC

I tried to like this show. Hell, I tried to watch it. I couldn't make it through even one episode of one-dimensional caricatures of assorted stereotypes, from the dumb lazy blonde, to the dumb OCD blonde, to the overachieving outcast myspace camwhore, to the bitchy cheerleading coach (yep, make me hate all the badly stereotyped female characters - good start, guys), to the dumb fat football coach or whatever the hell he is, to the flamboyant gay pedophile.

It offends and insults me in a way I don't quite understand. Probably comes of being that sub-basement caste.

I'm told it improves in later episodes. Maybe I'll try starting with a different one.
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Re: Glee

Postby Mo0man » Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:50 pm UTC

smw543 wrote:About stereotypes (and high school sitcom clichés in general): I only watched the first episode (in fact, this point is why I didn't continue), but I was fairly annoyed by the way that they would occasionally present them in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way, as if mocking them, then go right back to copypasta'ing from The Beginner's Guide to Writing Stupid Television1. I remember starting the premier with the expectation of some level of satire (not sure where I got this idea from; probably the commercials but I can't be bothered to check) and was very disappointed.

I got the whole feeling they were mocking them just from having the cheerleading coach in this one
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Re: Glee

Postby netcrusher88 » Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:37 pm UTC

Someone I know on a different forum nicely put how I felt differently and succinctly:
Its less celebrating the different groups that exist and more celebrating the fact that if you are pretty or popular you can fit in with the not pretty or popular. That bothers me.
I'd go so far as to say it's more celebrating the fact that the different groups exist and some are "better" than others. Maybe that's just what I get from the cheerleading coach's little tirade (read: hate speech), which felt unnecessary and like it was only there to reinforce that idea.
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Re: Glee

Postby cephalopod9 » Sat Oct 03, 2009 12:16 am UTC

But the cheer leading coach is so clearly and unapologetically a villain. To a ridiculous, "pro-littering" extent. She's as much a caricature as all the other characters on the show, and they are all caricatures to one extent or another. Which I think makes the show a satire on "teen drama" in itself. At the same time, I don't think any of them are one dimensional.
Even the insane wife, who is one of the least developed, clearly comes from an insane family and has an insane logic to what she is doing.
I don't think the writers ever take the approach of labeling character Y as stereotype X and leaving it at that, rather, I think the point was to start with stereotype X and develop an interesting if not empathetic character Y.
Rachel, for example, doesn't ever stop being the fame crazed, gold star, attention seeking over achiever, or being written as such, but we definitely see many other sides to her personality. It might not be the best or most nuanced writing approach, but I think for the most part, it gets by with how funny the black comedy has been.
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Re: Glee

Postby Xeio » Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:57 am UTC

Ooooo, so the shit hit the fan quite nicely. Almost too nicely...

*wonders what will happen next season*

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Re: Glee

Postby Lucrece » Fri Dec 11, 2009 7:51 am UTC

Idina Menzel will be cast as Will's rival from Vocal Adrenaline.

The show could not get any better! My beloved Idina was just what it needed.

I also liked how Finn blew off Puck when he asked him if everything was OK between them now. It avoided one big cliche. Finn is still my least liked character in the series (disgustingly immature and incompetent).

If I have one wish for next season, it's that they include the other singers more. Lea is a wonderful singer, as is Amber; but, really, Jenna needs more exposure, as do the other boys and girls.

Also, make Kurt less obnoxious? Petty gay man sniping at aesthetically and vocally superior female is a path I wouldn't like to see trod upon too much. If I were Rachel I would've already kicked his teeth in.
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Re: Glee

Postby Xeio » Fri Dec 11, 2009 9:33 am UTC

It's odd, but I started skipping a lot of the actual singing in recent episodes, though I watched the sectionals and stuff, but a lot of the other singing just started to annoy me. :P

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Re: Glee

Postby Joeldi » Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:45 pm UTC

steewi wrote:I have a secret liking for Take A Bow and Gold Digger (ssshhh... don't tell anyone


Heh, I thought you meant Muse's Take a Bow, and I thought "God damn, a glee club version, I MUST HEAR THIS" Colour me disappointed.
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Re: Glee

Postby apricity » Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:40 pm UTC

Lucrece wrote:Idina Menzel will be cast as Will's rival from Vocal Adrenaline.
That is AWESOME! I love her so much! I might actually have to watch that episode rather than just Youtubing the music because the plot pisses me off.
Xeio wrote:It's odd, but I started skipping a lot of the actual singing in recent episodes, though I watched the sectionals and stuff, but a lot of the other singing just started to annoy me. :P
I have liked most of the singing most of the time, and the absolute best lately was Mercedes' "And I am telling you I'm not going," which gave me shivers. But the final song, which was Lea Michele and Finn (with backup from the rest of the singers) singing Kelly Clarkson's "My life would suck without you," was awful. I thought "Kidz Bop" immediately, and a ton of commenters on Youtube said the same thing. But the bottom line is that Lea Michele has a Broadway voice, and Kelly Clarkson has a pop-rock voice, and Lea did not pull it off at all. And I say this as a huge fan of both Lea and Kelly. If they want their Broadwayish singers to do covers of pop songs, they HAVE to change the arrangement or else it will sound bad. Hence why the songs from musicals ("And I am telling you," "Maybe this time," "I could have danced all night") have been my favorite ones on the show.
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Re: Glee

Postby Lucrece » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:48 pm UTC

Emma's rendition of "I Could Have Danced All Night" was gorgeous. I can only imagine if Idina might sneak in a Rent song next season ;D. I'm sure just by looking at her I'll faint and miss the performance, though.
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Re: Glee

Postby ameretrifle » Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:43 am UTC

One of the things I've been kind of ambivalent about in this show, I recently realized, was the way they keep wrapping up the plot threads so damn quickly. In the second episode, it was cool and unexpected-- "Wait, they already went there? This isn't going to go on all season?! YES!" Part of me still likes that strategy. But on the other hand, it's starting to leave me pretty unsatisfied sometimes. Like
Spoiler:
when he FINALLY finds the pregnancy pad and walks out-- that was an odd scene. Intense and actually pretty frightening... and so short. I guess I kind of pictured there being a big musical number or something... felt a bit anticlimatic. That's not the only instance, or the best one, just the only one I can actually remember.

And I still wish they'd use the rest of the cast more. And the way they wrapped up that one Kurt episode was kind of disturbing--
Spoiler:
he gave up what he wanted to protect his dad from being crank-called by some asshole, and that was okay. Now, first, like the assholes are really gonna stop calling, because he seems so much less gay when he's not singing Broadway. Second, even if that were actually the assholes' issue, giving in wouldn't be likely to solve much. Third, yeah, kids should sacrifice things too, but this was sacrificing something he really wanted so that his dad wouldn't get phone calls. His dad should've at least protested a lot more. It was weird. Not much of a moral.

As to the final song-- my problem with it was that it just wasn't good enough. I wouldn't call "My Life Would Suck Without You" a bad song, myself, but there's just... nothing even remotely special about it. It's a decent enough song, but it's not memorable, doesn't say anything, and just didn't relate to the scene very well. For what was happening during that scene, the song should've been better, and mainly more relevant. There had to be something else they could've sung. "Starlight"? Ah, I dunno...

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Re: Glee

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:57 pm UTC

I started watching this late when I heard it had the same creator as Nip/Tuck (caught up with it using interwebs) and I'm surprised by how much I like it. It's not the best show ever, but it's a pretty smart satire of typical high school shows. Jane Lynch's character is absolutely fantastic and she works the hell out of it. I'm not too happy with the singing since it's auto-tune all over the place and, as everyone's said, they focus too much on Rachel and Finn.

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Re: Glee

Postby DeltaOne » Sat Jan 30, 2010 8:27 pm UTC

I am fairly certain that I am the only male in my school to watch Glee. I love it though, and I'm not afraid to admit that I own season 1 and have the soundtrack on my iPod.

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Re: Glee

Postby Lucrece » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:48 am UTC

Anything with the word "musical" in it will instantly turn off the average male. It's just deemed "gay as fuck".

I personally can't stop listening to Amber's rendition of "And I Am Telling You I'm Not Going". It's brilliant. "I Could Have Danced All Night" is another one stuck in my head at the moment, as is "Defying Gravity".

When they come back they're gonna do a Madonna episode that I'm thrilled to watch.
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Re: Glee

Postby Xeio » Sun Jan 31, 2010 10:41 am UTC

Lucrece wrote:Anything with the word "musical" in it will instantly turn off the average male. It's just deemed "gay as fuck".
Luckily you can skip most of the singing in Glee and not miss any story. :mrgreen:

(Also, I hate musicals)

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Re: Glee

Postby charliepanayi » Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:18 am UTC

Watching Glee and skipping most of the songs seems to rather defeat the point of watching it. I think the songs are by far the best part, apart from Jane Lynch being brilliant anytime she's on screen. The rest of the show I'm still not sure about, it feels a little too slick and stuffed full of Important Life Lessons at times. But the songs are great.

As are (some) musicals.
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Re: Glee

Postby Malice » Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:36 am UTC

The essential problem with Glee is that it can't decide whether it wants to be sincere or satirical; in trying to have it both ways, it ends up being too prosaic to really succeed as satire (and too sincere to even attempt parody) and too cliched to succeed as sincere drama. Most of the individual scenes work because the show is only ever trying to do one of those at once; but each episode as a whole doesn't really hold a coherent tone. I laugh at some of the funny bits, enjoy some of the songs, and despair at the glacial pace of the overarching plot... I enjoy it enough to watch it (hell, I watched most of it in three days) but its inconsistency still holds it back from being great.
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Re: Glee

Postby casiguapa » Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:48 pm UTC

I feel the need to just say that whilst Amber Riley (Mercedes) does indeed have an AMAZING voice, some of the songs given to her to sing this half of the season have just been too big for her. She did an amazing job on Bust Your Windows but I Am Telling You? Not so much and it was the same for Hate On Me, Jill Scott's version is just on a different planet.

Lea Michele however, I think is being "pimped" out so much singing wise because her voice is the most versatile though Jenna Ushkowitz has a good voice also, it's not as strong as Lea's so she wins out.

On the male front, I totally agree that Finn actually has the weakest voice in terms of technical ability, but I think it's a question of versatility again. Mark Salling has a beautiful voice though (Puck) and Kevin McHale was in a boyband! so I'd love to see more Artie/Puck solos.

I don't know about anyone else but I think it would've been more stereotypical had Kurt's dad flown off the handle when Kurt came out and whilst the "sensible heels line" may not have been the best way to go about it, I think it showed that even for someone like Kurt's dad who seems to be your stereotypical narrow-minded jerk, the love of your child should trump however you feel about their sexual orientation.
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Re: Glee

Postby Lucrece » Sun Jan 31, 2010 10:22 pm UTC

Ryan Murphy (creater) already stated that Kurt is portrayed with similarities to himself, and that the dad/son relationship was right on spot with his experience and what he wanted to portray. The "heels" joke is cringeworthy, yes, but it's actually not lacking reality; most straight people DO have certain schemas regarding gay people.

I can't make a judgement on Jenna-- for all we know, she could be as competent as Lea-- partly because she's so underexposed. They need to give her more parts; a couple of harmonic songs won't cut it.

Artie, however, has a fantastic voice, and Puck's is beautiful. I'm just partial to Artie's because I am biased for thunderous voices, not necessarily smooth ones. The exception was Emma, whose "I Could Have Danced All Night" was just right in subtlety and vulnerability. But, yeah, in general I just like voices that can blow and auditorium on its head. Chennoweth's episode was spectacular for me.

It's good that Murphy brought musicals back into the forefront of TV culture. It had been more than a decade since a series dedicated to the musical style had achieved widespread popularity.
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Re: Glee

Postby mercutio_stencil » Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:44 am UTC

Malice wrote:The essential problem with Glee is that it can't decide whether it wants to be sincere or satirical; in trying to have it both ways, it ends up being too prosaic to really succeed as satire (and too sincere to even attempt parody) and too cliched to succeed as sincere drama.

I think I agree with you entirely, except for the part where you claim it's a problem. I think the real essence of the show is how finely it tows the line, and how it manages to be a satire of itself. Not all satire has to be a blatant lampoon, subtle can be nice sometimes.

My main problem is Neil Patrick Harris hasn't had a guest appearance yet. This show is made for him.

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Re: Glee

Postby Phill » Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:23 am UTC

Malice wrote:The essential problem with Glee is that it can't decide whether it wants to be sincere or satirical; in trying to have it both ways, it ends up being too prosaic to really succeed as satire (and too sincere to even attempt parody) and too cliched to succeed as sincere drama.


I agree with this. I find that Sue Sylvester's character is way overdone. She's like the stereotypical Big Bad Movie Villain (TM) with few (if any) redeeming qualities. Despite various scenes which are supposed to raise our opinion of her. I don't know, if the show is supposed to be a comedy it should be funnier, and if it's supposed to be a drama it should be more serious.

I don't know if any of you have seen the UK comedy 'Green Wing' but it has a few similarites with Glee - it's not at all musical but it has characters doing at times what are totally bizarre things. But for some reason I can buy that whereas I can't buy Glee.

The other thing I didn't like about Glee was the whole Will and Emma story. Terri is mental, yes, but she was portrayed too sympathetically for me to be glad that Will was leaving her. And it seems that Will actually behaved pretty badly, really, especially when he actually thought that Terri was having a baby. Just didn't sit right with me, especially for a show which is supposed to have 'morals' (and others have already pointed out a few problems in this respect).

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Re: Glee

Postby apricity » Thu Apr 15, 2010 5:04 am UTC

I was ready to give Glee another chance since it just started up again. Then they had a drawn-out scene where the "joke" was that the cheerleading coach date-raped the principal. I'm done with it again.
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Re: Glee

Postby Lucrece » Thu Apr 15, 2010 5:14 am UTC

She didn't sleep with him; she just made him think he did.

With that said, the comeback episode was mediocre at best. It meandered, the musical performances were either weak or auto-tune fest, and I'm just bothered that all the emphasis is always on Emma/Will and Rachel/Finn. They've worked those characters to death.
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Re: Glee

Postby apricity » Thu Apr 15, 2010 5:38 am UTC

Well, I guess joking about using a date-rape drug to get someone in bed to take compromising pictures of them is slightly better than joking about date-rape.
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Re: Glee

Postby Xeio » Thu Apr 15, 2010 5:51 am UTC

lanicita wrote:Well, I guess joking about using a date-rape drug to get someone in bed to take compromising pictures of them is slightly better than joking about date-rape.
I'm not sure what you expected from Sue. She's nuts. She manipulates kids into doing who knows what, blackmails half the staff at the school she works at...

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Re: Glee

Postby ameretrifle » Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:22 am UTC

Xeio wrote:
lanicita wrote:Well, I guess joking about using a date-rape drug to get someone in bed to take compromising pictures of them is slightly better than joking about date-rape.
I'm not sure what you expected from Sue. She's nuts. She manipulates kids into doing who knows what, blackmails half the staff at the school she works at...
And? Just 'cause it makes sense for the character doesn't mean it's not objectionable. Plus, it being an inherent part of her character is all the more reason to not watch the show if you don't like that.

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Re: Glee

Postby Malice » Thu Apr 15, 2010 9:55 am UTC

This show's major problem is that's incredibly predictable, in every scene, in every way. There was precisely one unexpected part of this new episode--the arrival of a new love interest for Rachel. After that it was predictable that the character would be duplicated for Will; and it was predictable how everyone would react to it, in every way.

Also, the arcs are simply role reversals from the first season (or half-season), so we pretty much know what's going to go on there, too.

Plus, all the opposition to the Glee club is the same shit we've seen before. Sue vows to destroy them, they have to win the next round or it's all over (what a brilliant way to sap alllllll the tension out of the narrative), etc. We've also seen the "character has to choose between Glee club and something else" about 6 times already.

It's clear that the writers are simply out of ideas, their characters are so 1-dimensional they haven't the ability to act in a surprising fashion, and the show is trapped in an infinite loop of steady singing advancement towards a pre-determined victory while the adults and the students trade romantic partners back and forth like musical chairs.

And there wasn't enough Kurt.

I'm still going to watch--after all, the show is still occasionally enjoyable in certain moments, and I suppose the new episodes are slightly different from just watching the old ones again--but I'm quickly becoming bored. They're telling the same stories with the same characters in the same way at the same glacial pace, twice each episode (students and teachers). The great mystery is how a show so seemingly new and exciting in form could be inhabited by such stultifying, mind-numbingly boring and prosaic and repetitive content.
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Re: Glee

Postby rnbguru » Fri Apr 16, 2010 5:08 pm UTC

Having stumbled upon this show after Idol, I know the show is stupid. It's incredibly predictable, the characters are very stereotypical. But still... I found myself enthralled. And I will now probably watch it every week. DOH

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Re: Glee

Postby InfamousAnarchist » Wed Apr 21, 2010 12:25 am UTC

malice wrote:And there wasn't enough Kurt.

This is my main issue with the show.
He has had one real solo song (Mr. Cellophane) in the first episode and one duet (Defying Gravity). I hear that he does 4 Minutes in tonight's show with Mercedes (in fact, I know -- It's on youtube.)

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Re: Glee

Postby H.E.L.e.N. » Mon Apr 26, 2010 11:01 pm UTC

cephalopod9 wrote:But the cheer leading coach is so clearly and unapologetically a villain. To a ridiculous, "pro-littering" extent. She's as much a caricature as all the other characters on the show, and they are all caricatures to one extent or another. Which I think makes the show a satire on "teen drama" in itself. At the same time, I don't think any of them are one dimensional. ...I don't think the writers ever take the approach of labeling character Y as stereotype X and leaving it at that, rather, I think the point was to start with stereotype X and develop an interesting if not empathetic character Y.


This is basically how I feel about it. And I started watching in middle, was impressed with how much was going on and liked the tone, and just started watching from the beginning.

'Musical' is a format that is inherently ridiculous and over-the-top and requires lots and lots of suspension of disbelief. I kind of love that it's set among High School Drama Kids who are of *course* going to think everything is Super Important and Super Dramatic and then need to Burst Into Song. And the inherent silliness of Bursting Into Song in those moments, I think, makes it self-aware in a really cool way. (At one point Finn goes, "do you want to talk about it? Or...sing about it?")

And I do think it has some stupid, problematic humor (there was a LOL THIS GUY'S DEAF bit that went on way too long) but that's far from being the gist of the show. From the beginning, I think it's been somewhat blatantly pursuing a theme of busting stereotypes. It's the villain in the first few episodes who says oh no, you can't recruit cheerleader/football kids, children like their hierarchies. And the villain does everything she can to enforce those hierarchies, and it's the kids who keep busting them up. Thinking that's cool might give me away as someone who doesn't watch much tv and basically can't stand the genre, but I see it as a show that keeps saying dare to be more of a nerd, and that's hot.


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