The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

A slow, analog alternative to the internet

Moderators: SecondTalon, Moderators General, Prelates

User avatar
Minerva
Posts: 947
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 2:58 pm UTC
Location: Australia
Contact:

The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Minerva » Mon Sep 07, 2009 3:54 pm UTC

New book by Richard Dawkins, expounding the evidence that evolution is a fact.

Has anyone read this yet? Is it good?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-QWv_0Mjq0
...suffer from the computer disease that anybody who works with computers now knows about. It's a very serious disease and it interferes completely with the work. The trouble with computers is you play with them. They are so wonderful. - Richard Feynman

User avatar
Jorpho
Posts: 6290
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:31 am UTC
Location: Canada

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Jorpho » Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:18 pm UTC

Has it not been demonstrated at this point that persuasive exposition and reasoned argument isn't going to change anyone's mind about evolution?

User avatar
Oort
Posts: 522
Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2006 10:18 pm UTC

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Oort » Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:14 am UTC

New Scientist gave an interesting review of it (http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg2 ... wkins.html).

User avatar
Jahoclave
sourmilk's moderator
Posts: 4790
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:34 pm UTC
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Jahoclave » Sat Sep 19, 2009 1:16 am UTC

Jorpho wrote:Has it not been demonstrated at this point that persuasive exposition and reasoned argument isn't going to change anyone's mind about evolution?

Seriously, I once had a creationist hand me a book that said, "Atheists believe that death is a celestial dirt nap." Next page, "did you know that an amazing 2/3rds of atheists believe in an afterlife?"

Really, when did anybody ever get the idea that logic was going to work on these people? You'd think scientists would have figured that one out and just started finding ways to "educate" with extreme prejudice.

User avatar
Minerva
Posts: 947
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 2:58 pm UTC
Location: Australia
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Minerva » Sat Sep 19, 2009 7:24 am UTC

Oort wrote:New Scientist gave an interesting review of it (http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg2 ... wkins.html).


Was this the same New Scientist that did that "Oh me yarm Darwin was wrong!!!" headline?

Sometimes I think they should change the title to FOX Science, or something,
...suffer from the computer disease that anybody who works with computers now knows about. It's a very serious disease and it interferes completely with the work. The trouble with computers is you play with them. They are so wonderful. - Richard Feynman

User avatar
Sir_Elderberry
Posts: 4206
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2007 6:50 pm UTC
Location: Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Sir_Elderberry » Sat Sep 19, 2009 4:13 pm UTC

To be fair, the actual article wasn't that evolution was untrue. It was about the finer points of taxonomy. (I can't remember exactly.)
http://www.geekyhumanist.blogspot.com -- Science and the Concerned Voter
Belial wrote:You are the coolest guy that ever cooled.

I reiterate. Coolest. Guy.

Well. You heard him.

User avatar
Mighty Jalapeno
Inne Juste 7 Dayes I Wille Make You A Hero!
Posts: 11265
Joined: Mon May 07, 2007 9:16 pm UTC
Location: Prince George In A Can
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Mighty Jalapeno » Sat Sep 19, 2009 4:34 pm UTC

Jahoclave wrote:You'd think scientists would have figured that one out and just started finding ways to "educate" with extreme prejudice.

Yah! Like camps! Camps for mandatory 're-education'! That's an AWESOME idea!

User avatar
Jahoclave
sourmilk's moderator
Posts: 4790
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 8:34 pm UTC
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Jahoclave » Sat Sep 19, 2009 7:10 pm UTC

Mighty Jalapeno wrote:
Jahoclave wrote:You'd think scientists would have figured that one out and just started finding ways to "educate" with extreme prejudice.

Yah! Like camps! Camps for mandatory 're-education'! That's an AWESOME idea!

They can do atheist crafts! :wink:

User avatar
podbaydoor
Posts: 7548
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 4:16 am UTC
Location: spaceship somewhere out there

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby podbaydoor » Sun Sep 20, 2009 2:43 am UTC

Can we sing atheist hymns? Have atheist revivals? Speak in atheist tongues?
tenet |ˈtenit|
noun
a principle or belief, esp. one of the main principles of a religion or philosophy : the tenets of classical liberalism.
tenant |ˈtenənt|
noun
a person who occupies land or property rented from a landlord.

User avatar
Oort
Posts: 522
Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2006 10:18 pm UTC

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Oort » Sun Sep 20, 2009 5:52 am UTC

Minerva wrote:
Oort wrote:New Scientist gave an interesting review of it (http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg2 ... wkins.html).


Was this the same New Scientist that did that "Oh me yarm Darwin was wrong!!!" headline?

Sometimes I think they should change the title to FOX Science, or something,


I don't recall that headline, but could be. But they're friendly towards evolution though.

Kaiveron
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Sep 20, 2009 6:21 am UTC

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Kaiveron » Sun Sep 20, 2009 10:20 am UTC

I haven't been as giddy for a book as I am for this one in a long time. I pretty much know whats in the book, but I think it is because it is a little piece of Dawkins in book form. And also that this book will make a bunch of waves and only bring more attention to evolution and atrocities like the Texas Board of Education.

User avatar
Sorroth
Posts: 60
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:42 pm UTC
Location: London, UK

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Sorroth » Sun Sep 20, 2009 1:20 pm UTC

The New Scientist article was about how Darwin's ideas about evolution were overly simplistic, given what we now know about haploidism and hybridism and things, not that evolution was false. They even lampshaded the false conclusions people would jump to in the editorial. For what is otherwise a rather decent science magazine, they do tend to be a little sensationalist with their cover stories, giving them overblown titles, and they tend to have at least one "New Theory of Everything" cover story a month.

As for Dawkins' book, it seems sort of pointless to me. I mean, I agree with Dawkins on many topics, but I find his rampant polemics irritating, and you would have thought he'd caught on by now to the fact that, if people are convinced that evolution is wrong, his book is not going to change their minds. If a creationist is on their way to believing in evolution anyway, then they'll make their own way there, and sure, the book might help. But yelling in the ears of those who choose to deafen themselves isn't going to get anyone anywhere.
</streamofconsciousness>

Ralith The Third
Don't Ask About His Nephews
Posts: 782
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 5:21 pm UTC

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Ralith The Third » Sun Sep 20, 2009 2:42 pm UTC

-removed, spawned by *rage*-
Last edited by Ralith The Third on Sun Sep 20, 2009 3:00 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
Omni.

User avatar
Mighty Jalapeno
Inne Juste 7 Dayes I Wille Make You A Hero!
Posts: 11265
Joined: Mon May 07, 2007 9:16 pm UTC
Location: Prince George In A Can
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Mighty Jalapeno » Sun Sep 20, 2009 2:50 pm UTC

This isn't so much about religious conservatives as it is about people who think Giant Invisible Skyman poofed the animals into their present shapes (or at the very least poofed them to become their present shapes). This is a small subset of the "religious conservative" group, and it's one that has rammed a stick so far up Dawkins' ass that this is what comes out of him.

User avatar
Jorpho
Posts: 6290
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:31 am UTC
Location: Canada

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Jorpho » Sun Sep 20, 2009 6:06 pm UTC

Kaiveron wrote:And also that this book will make a bunch of waves and only bring more attention to evolution and atrocities like the Texas Board of Education.
A book that brings attention to atrocities like the Texas Board of Education ought to be about the Texas Board of Education.

User avatar
SecondTalon
SexyTalon
Posts: 26528
Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 2:10 pm UTC
Location: Louisville, Kentucky, USA, Mars. HA!
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Sep 21, 2009 12:33 pm UTC

podbaydoor wrote:Can we sing atheist hymns? Have atheist revivals? Speak in atheist tongues?
Like, what.. a crazy mixed-up manufactured language like Esperanto or English?
heuristically_alone wrote:I want to write a DnD campaign and play it by myself and DM it myself.
heuristically_alone wrote:I have been informed that this is called writing a book.

User avatar
Kizyr
Posts: 2070
Joined: Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:16 am UTC
Location: Virginia
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Kizyr » Mon Sep 21, 2009 9:15 pm UTC

Jorpho wrote:Has it not been demonstrated at this point that persuasive exposition and reasoned argument isn't going to change anyone's mind about evolution?

I strongly disagree here. You're not going to convince an adult ardent creationist, no. But there are plenty of people in between on the spectrum that are receptive to exposition of facts and reason. I'm talking about folks who never really thought about it (not everyone particularly cares about biology), kids who are in a school district that doesn't teach evolution (that was me), folks who would be receptive to argumentation in general but are just getting the weird creationist side of it all (and subsequently aren't even aware of what the theory of evolution is in the first place).

All these groups, particularly the latter, aren't the folks who are confident enough in their belief in creationism (or may not even have a belief regarding creationism) to actually argue on the subject of evolution. So you're not going to hear them speaking up. That doesn't mean that laying out evidence and facts has no effect on them. KF
~Kizyr
Image

User avatar
Sir_Elderberry
Posts: 4206
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2007 6:50 pm UTC
Location: Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
Contact:

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby Sir_Elderberry » Mon Sep 21, 2009 9:21 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
podbaydoor wrote:Can we sing atheist hymns? Have atheist revivals? Speak in atheist tongues?
Like, what.. a crazy mixed-up manufactured language like Esperanto or English?

Lobjan, of course.
http://www.geekyhumanist.blogspot.com -- Science and the Concerned Voter
Belial wrote:You are the coolest guy that ever cooled.

I reiterate. Coolest. Guy.

Well. You heard him.

sje46
Posts: 4730
Joined: Wed May 14, 2008 4:41 am UTC
Location: New Hampshire

Re: The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution

Postby sje46 » Mon Sep 21, 2009 9:24 pm UTC

Kizyr wrote:
Jorpho wrote:Has it not been demonstrated at this point that persuasive exposition and reasoned argument isn't going to change anyone's mind about evolution?

I strongly disagree here. You're not going to convince an adult ardent creationist, no. But there are plenty of people in between on the spectrum that are receptive to exposition of facts and reason. I'm talking about folks who never really thought about it (not everyone particularly cares about biology), kids who are in a school district that doesn't teach evolution (that was me), folks who would be receptive to argumentation in general but are just getting the weird creationist side of it all (and subsequently aren't even aware of what the theory of evolution is in the first place).

All these groups, particularly the latter, aren't the folks who are confident enough in their belief in creationism (or may not even have a belief regarding creationism) to actually argue on the subject of evolution. So you're not going to hear them speaking up. That doesn't mean that laying out evidence and facts has no effect on them. KF

Hey, you beat me to it. Plenty of people are on the fence about it. Also, it is very true, if rare, that even fundamentalist Christian adults, who have been indoctrinated their entire lives, can change their minds, and this book actually helps them.

Nate Phelps (Fred's son)
As I dove into that project, she came home one day with a book entitled The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins. Reading it I was struck once again by how these arguments resonated in me. For years, all these thoughts and ideas had been floating around in my head, battling with the demons of my past, but they were disorganized and incomplete, locked in a stalemate between my past and my present. In Dawkins’ book, these thoughts and ideas finally coalesced and took form, and I was able to move forward. The End of Faith by Sam Harris & God is Not Great by Christopher Hitchens soon followed. I couldn’t get enough. Combined with the supportive atmosphere provided in my new surroundings, I was making progress.

It's very difficult, but it does happen. http://www.atheistnexus.org/page/nate-phelps-2009-aa-speech

Also, it helps you argue against those wacky fundamentalists, and you just learn more about evolution.
General_Norris: Taking pride in your nation is taking pride in the division of humanity.
Pirate.Bondage: Let's get married. Right now.


Return to “Books”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests