CONSOLE WARS!!!

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Nintendo
129
56%
Microsoft
60
26%
Sony
41
18%
 
Total votes: 230

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Vanguard » Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:02 pm UTC

pieaholicx wrote:
Vanguard wrote:I don't keep track of what company makes what console. Only the consoles.
Can someone give me a quit text chart of who makes what?

o.O

And again for emphasis, o.O

How do you avoid keeping track of who makes consoles? Or for that matter how can you not have just memorized it off-hand?

Nintendo made the NES, SNES, Nintendo 64, Gamecube, and Wii.
Microsoft made the Xbox, and Xbox 360.
Sony made the PlayStation, PlayStation 2, and PlayStation3.


Because I don't CARE. I'm a casual gamer. I don't purposely avoid it, but I just pay attention to the console names.
Thanks for the little "chart" though. Now I can vote.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Amnesiasoft » Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:25 pm UTC

Vanguard wrote:Because I don't CARE. I'm a casual gamer. I don't purposely avoid it, but I just pay attention to the console names.
Thanks for the little "chart" though. Now I can vote.

I find that hard to believe when every company in the world believes that plastering their logo over every product they make is the solution to all of lifes problems.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Vanguard » Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:26 pm UTC

Truth. I just start-jump to the game and begin playing.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby bigglesworth » Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:21 pm UTC

A (stolen) metaphor.

Xbox360: The girl next door. You want some, and she'll give it to you.

PS3: The high class girl in town. A bit high maintenance, but she'll wear those dresses baby. And her older sister is a lot of fun to be with.

Wii: Your little sister's best friend. Hot, fun, and has everything that matters but...
Generation Y. I don't remember the First Gulf War, but do remember floppy disks.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Cheese » Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:28 pm UTC

I've loved pretty much every nintendo console... just got SSBM, and probably won't let the Gamecube to get cold for a month.

Microsoft's Xbox and 360 are quite good, with some great games, but just not the most innovative of consoles.

The PS1 was FTW, the PS2 is still FTW, but the PS3 is overpriced and undersupported, which is a shame. Sony's other consoles lasted well (and are still lasting, in the case of the PS2).

And I also expected this to be about commands, &c...
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Fri Nov 23, 2007 4:54 am UTC

I'd just like to point out that the PS2 was anything but FTW when it was released, and for a long time afterwards, it took awhile to get going, but eventually, it became a given. I'm not saying the PS3 is GOOD or that you should buy it (Lord no!) I'm just saying, Sony has the capability to bounce back, let's see if they have the savvy.

bigglesworth wrote:A (stolen) metaphor.

Xbox360: The girl next door. You want some, and she'll give it to you.

PS3: The high class girl in town. A bit high maintenance, but she'll wear those dresses baby. And her older sister is a lot of fun to be with.

Wii: Your little sister's best friend. Hot, fun, and has everything that matters but...

(First, forget the metaphor, this a complaint against the final word, I don't care about the metaphor as a whole, and am not suporting paedophilia)
I'm so sick of that "but..."

What? Are you scared some frat boy's going to come over to your house and mock your Genitalia?! Because, frankly, let's face it, fear of the Wii is a guy thing, you think it's "Kiddy" and there's no tuff games on it. First off
Metroid Prime 3,
Far Cry,
Metal Slug.

If these games are not "Tuff", nothing is.

Second off, if you like playing Elebits, there's nothing wrong with you, enjoying products intended for children is absolutely nothing to be ashamed of, and the sooner fucktards around the world learn that the sooner I'll stop punching them in the face, screaming "PIIIKMIIIIN!"
Games are for FUN NOT testosterone. (I hope that's how it's spelt)

(That was not necessarily a rant against you, but anyone who has no games on their comp except Steam and Halo, Anyone who's never played a Mario franchise game, that kind of thing)
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Amnesiasoft » Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:13 am UTC

Maseiken wrote:I'd just like to point out that the PS2 was anything but FTW when it was released, and for a long time afterwards, it took awhile to get going, but eventually, it became a given. I'm not saying the PS3 is GOOD or that you should buy it (Lord no!) I'm just saying, Sony has the capability to bounce back, let's see if they have the savvy.

On a completely related note, the PS3 has sold just as well its first year as the Xbox 360 did, and that is without any "super awesome must have games." Though I imagine a large portion of those sales are because if you're looking for a Blu-Ray player, PS3 is the best choice.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Fri Nov 23, 2007 12:28 pm UTC

Zigackly, after the PS2 everyone started shouting "Doom!" and confidently started bootling about with Halo. Suddenly, BAM a whole bunch of games, it just took the developers time to adapt to the new system although... the Wii doesn't seem to have much of a problem in that department, as so many of Nintendo's games are by developers close to it's heart. (Someone is going to say something about the graphics, and I'm going to have to tell them that I don't care about the graphics, just gameplay, and it'll just turn into a huge Flamewar which I'd rather not have, so just right up front;
"I don't care abut Graphics and I don't care what your opinion on that is"
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby davean » Fri Nov 23, 2007 2:25 pm UTC

Maseiken wrote:"I don't care abut Graphics and I don't care what your opinion on that is"


I don't care if it even *has* graphics.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby bigglesworth » Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:26 pm UTC

Maseiken wrote:(That was not necessarily a rant against you, but anyone who has no games on their comp except Steam and Halo, Anyone who's never played a Mario franchise game, that kind of thing)


Thing is, my favourite games on PS2 were Ratchet and Clank and the Jak series. I liked the gameboy mario games.

But I don't really see much on the wii that I'd enjoy playing. A lot of the fun things are also on the internet for free. And the control seems gimmicky to me, just wrist movements replacing buttons.
Generation Y. I don't remember the First Gulf War, but do remember floppy disks.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Cheese » Fri Nov 23, 2007 6:49 pm UTC

davean wrote:
Maseiken wrote:"I don't care abut Graphics and I don't care what your opinion on that is"


I don't care if it even *has* graphics.

You're talking about an ultra-high fidelity audio console? It'd be interesting, without the need for a TV (just a couple of good speakers)...

Controls become a bit difficult, though.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby bigglesworth » Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:00 pm UTC

Generation Y. I don't remember the First Gulf War, but do remember floppy disks.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Sat Nov 24, 2007 12:13 am UTC

bigglesworth wrote:
Maseiken wrote:(That was not necessarily a rant against you, but anyone who has no games on their comp except Steam and Halo, Anyone who's never played a Mario franchise game, that kind of thing)


Thing is, my favourite games on PS2 were Ratchet and Clank and the Jak series. I liked the gameboy mario games.

But I don't really see much on the wii that I'd enjoy playing. A lot of the fun things are also on the internet for free. And the control seems gimmicky to me, just wrist movements replacing buttons.

Just try it, find a friend who has it and try it, will that kill you? It's not gimmicky dangit!
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Amnesiasoft » Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:36 am UTC

Maseiken wrote:Just try it, find a friend who has it and try it, will that kill you? It's not gimmicky dangit!

I have tried it. It is gimmicky. Just like the DS.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Malice » Sat Nov 24, 2007 2:11 am UTC

Let's see...

Xbox360: A very well-designed console (not physically, but otherwise), with just the right amount of bells and whistles I want as a gamer. It also happens to have a large number of great, often innovative games. (A short list: Gears of War, Dead Rising, Assassin's Creed, Mass Effect, Bioshock, Viva Pinata!...)

Wii: Innovative, but game-poor. Like most Nintendo consoles, it has a few major first-party releases--your Zelda, your Metroid, your Mario--but suffers from a general dearth of good 3rd-party games. Then you get the flood of games based tied in with movies, cartoons, and toys, and the console gets a "kiddy" reputation--which is only a problem because it later prevents people from changing that reputation by releasing games aimed at adults. The Wii is great for casual gaming, for parties, for children; but it's hard to see that innovation getting used for a truly revolutionary, artistic game. Where's the Wii's Bioshock?
Furthermore, sales figures show two things: consoles flying off the shelves, and games not going anywhere. People either aren't using their Wiis, or are using them solely for the arcade or for Wii Sports--which doesn't bode well for future 3rd-party development.

PS3: Well, it has problems. It's horrendously overpriced. Its maker, Sony, has committed one marketing blunder after another, from slaughtering a goat for God of War 2 to setting up fake blogs lauding themselves. The system has the strongest graphics of the three, which easily leads to bad games in a number of ways. (Examples? Games with powerful graphics are more expensive to develop, so games have to be shorter and/or more expensive; there's a larger focus on graphics instead of gameplay and story; cameras are designed around showing off the graphics instead of letting the player see what they need to see; and there's the inclination to let great graphics take the place of imaginative art design.) End result? So far, there are few good games for the platform. For me, only three--the new Ratchet and Clank, Heavenly Sword, and the arcade game "Everyday Shooter". Sony hopes to make up for these things by making the PS3 the "big media box"--where you go for your music, your Blu-Ray movies, etc.... Unfortunately, studies show less than half of PS3 owners even realize there's a Blu-Ray player in it. Again, bad tidings.

Currently, I think the 360 is the best console out there. The PS3 isn't going anywhere without significant price cuts--and the graphics problem is essentially unsolvable. The Wii, on the other hand, will get better over time as its library expands, but it needs the rate of new good games (especially 3rd party) to increase, which will only happen if people start buying games.

In other words: Microsoft rules, Sony and Nintendo drool!
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Amnesiasoft » Sat Nov 24, 2007 2:37 am UTC

Malice wrote:Unfortunately, studies show less than half of PS3 owners even realize there's a Blu-Ray player in it. Again, bad tidings.

Well, that throws my theory that most of those sales that have it selling as well as the 360 are the result of it being a blu-ray player...whether that is a good thing or bad thing, I'm not sure.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:49 am UTC

Yeah, Blur-ray isn't actually a very strong selling point. It's not really a "Dvd-Killer" so far as it's a great deal of expense for not that much increase in quality. I can see little to no point in it's integration into a console, to me it just seems like tacking on cost for no real reason, that's just me though. Maybe people who, like Midas, and some kind of golden touch and can put their money in a pile big enoguh to reach the moon itself will be overjoyed as they watch movies from their space-mansion in space. I however, do not have moon-level money, and cannot be bothered buying Blu-ray in the form of a console or otherwise.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Amnesiasoft » Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:12 am UTC

Maseiken wrote:Yeah, Blur-ray isn't actually a very strong selling point.

I was talking more the point that Blu-Ray players cost about $500+ on average, meaning you might as well buy a PS3 instead of a Blu-Ray player. Same price, more functions.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:36 am UTC

I'm just skeptical about Blu-ray in general.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby bigglesworth » Sat Nov 24, 2007 12:54 pm UTC

Maseiken wrote:Just try it, find a friend who has it and try it, will that kill you? It's not gimmicky dangit!


I don't actually know anyone who owns one. But if I did, what games are fun enough to spend a few hours on?
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:30 pm UTC

Mario Strikers,
Wii Sports and Play,
Wario Ware (I would assume)
It depends by what you mean by "A few hours"
Metroid Prime 3 is great, but it requires some commitment.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby sebbeklang » Sat Nov 24, 2007 2:45 pm UTC

wario ware kept me entertained for like two hours. then i got rid of it.

wii sports or play though, are great fun. not all of the games/sports though, at least not right away.

in wii sports, i find the bowling most appealing for first time users and the tennis next.
in wii play i really only liked the tank and bull games. at least that i can think of right away.

not as fun to play alone though.
but games which my grandma volunteer to play and my parents can beat me in must be something extraordinary.

also if you have a mac you can download wiisaber. that kept me entertained for half an hour.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby bigglesworth » Sat Nov 24, 2007 4:45 pm UTC

See, none of that sounds fun to me. I dislike sports games, and I have an eyetoy.
Generation Y. I don't remember the First Gulf War, but do remember floppy disks.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:45 pm UTC

I wouldn't file them with Sports games....
I have absolutly no opinion on the eyetoy whatsoever.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby ASmileWithoutACat » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:28 am UTC

Hmmm... I think Nintendo's ahead right now, as a company and in my personal opinion.

I did like Sony, last generation... or at least I liked my PS2... but now- well, as far as I've seen, their marketing department has gone insane (or else the rest of the company is determined to undermine them). The feeling I get from them is, "Alright, we've got the market share, now, and they're loyal to us... let's see just how far we can push that." It's insulting, and I don't think (ok, I hope) the market won't allow them to keep this BS up.

Anyway, the XBox is... interesting. There is a light in which the accomplishment here is impressive- MS has gotten a good deal of the market share within one or two generations; they've proved they can adapt well and quickly. On the other hand...

It's. Micro. Soft.

Yeah, I personally dislike the company and all works thereof; however, even leaving that aside- there was a disturbing article (Wired, I think) about the development of Halo 3. MS had effectively built the game once, then tested.. When they had all the stats, they rebuilt the game and adjusted everything according to that. This isn't just seeing how the public will respond; this isn't like a movie screening, or a gameplay demo. This gives the impression of building a game by statistics.

That scares me, because I see games as a form of art. It is a communication between the player and the designers, and in that development model, the designers become not much better than glorified statisticians. I wouldn't rehearse a play with the audience in the theatre; I wouldn't shoot a movie and take every passerby's suggestion; I wouldn't write a book and stop every paragraph to get opinions. Why follow the same approach with game development?

That's why I like Nintendo. I always have the feeling with Nintendo that at least some of their people care more about whether the game is fun than what statistical analysis says is the best way to design a game, or what approach will sell the most copies.

Fun is a difficult quality, but I don't think you can totally capture it analytically. There has to be a place for inspiration in this and any other form of art.

It's late and I'm running on... and on... and on... sorry, this is way too long for a third post, I know... but meh... I am tired enough not to be worried about it. Anyway, it just ran away on its own, honest- I was just trying to keep up.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby JayDee » Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:18 am UTC

I like to think that the Wii is Nintendo's way of getting out of the console war. The actual fighting would be between MS and Sony, for the hardcore gamers. Nintendo are saying screw that, we're doing our own thing.

So, it's scary. I almost want Microsoft to win. I feel guilty about that. Even so, I haven't yet sullied my hands by touching an XBox. The XBox Live Arcade type stuff strikes me as really cool, though.

Best console though, has to be the DS. Seriously, all the numbers that seem to pop up everywhere have the DS outselling everything else, half the time the DS sells more than the other consoles combined. That's just crazy.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby pointfivenine » Wed Nov 28, 2007 12:58 pm UTC

Sony has really messed up imo, but the other companies have just ****** up -less-
Thats about it.
What?

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Vanguard » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:07 pm UTC

I've been around Microsoft my entire life (seriously, since birth my dad had me on his lap fiddling with keyboards) so I kind of see past all the errors and screwups and just <3 my Microsoft products like Windows and Xbox's.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby keozen » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:25 pm UTC

I have owned the following consoles:

NES
Sega Master System
SNES
Sega Mega Drive (Genesis)
Sega Saturn
N64
Playstation
Playstation 2
Gamecube
Wii

My favorite console ever would have to be the SNES, I just LOVED that thing when it came out. I must say I am enjoying the Wii at the moment (especially for galaxy, Oh me yarm it's good) having said that I would also get a 360 if I could afford one at the moment. The PS3 holds no interest with me at all, it's WAY too expensive and i see no games that constitute a reason to even think of buying one yet, and I don't want a blue ray player that looks like a George forman grill ;)
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Malice » Wed Nov 28, 2007 4:12 pm UTC

ASmileWithoutACat wrote:Yeah, I personally dislike the company and all works thereof; however, even leaving that aside- there was a disturbing article (Wired, I think) about the development of Halo 3. MS had effectively built the game once, then tested.. When they had all the stats, they rebuilt the game and adjusted everything according to that. This isn't just seeing how the public will respond; this isn't like a movie screening, or a gameplay demo. This gives the impression of building a game by statistics.

That scares me, because I see games as a form of art. It is a communication between the player and the designers, and in that development model, the designers become not much better than glorified statisticians. I wouldn't rehearse a play with the audience in the theatre; I wouldn't shoot a movie and take every passerby's suggestion; I wouldn't write a book and stop every paragraph to get opinions. Why follow the same approach with game development?


Funny you should mention it: but they do exactly that with movies. Once they've finished, they'll do preview screenings for test audiences. Afterwards the audiences fill out cards with questions like "Was this too long? When, if ever, were you bored? What do you think of the ending? Would you rather the ending be happier?" and so on and so forth. It is, in fact, standard operating procedure.

The impression of building a game with "statistics" is there simply because they were doing play-testing on a large (and detailed) scale. Halo's design is dedicated to creating a very seamless experience, and if you find that 35% of players get stuck for an hour trying to find the drop point for a mission, it's important to change that mission to prevent that. A game is communication between the player and the developer; so it helps to have the developer say, "Can you hear me now?" from time to time.

Not to mention Halo is supposed to be a mass appeal game. You don't get mass appeal without checking with the masses to make sure that they understand and enjoy your game.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby EvanED » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:52 pm UTC

And, in fact, they often make pretty large changes to movies based on said feedback. They also do this with playtesting and video games. Listen to the developer commentary in one of the HL2 Episodes or in Portal. The very first commentary node in Episode 2 is talking about how there used to be a different beginning for the game but after lots of playtesters fell to their deaths repeatedly in the first five minutes, they changed it. Portal has a *ton* of commentary nodes that talk about how they changed the games based on playtesting. Blizzard put Starcraft through *tons* of playtesting so that they could balance the different races.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Maseiken » Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:13 pm UTC

keozen wrote:I have owned the following consoles:

NES
Sega Master System
SNES
Sega Mega Drive (Genesis)
Sega Saturn
N64
Playstation
Playstation 2
Gamecube
Wii

My favorite console ever would have to be the SNES, I just LOVED that thing when it came out. I must say I am enjoying the Wii at the moment (especially for galaxy, Oh me yarm it's good) having said that I would also get a 360 if I could afford one at the moment. The PS3 holds no interest with me at all, it's WAY too expensive and i see no games that constitute a reason to even think of buying one yet, and I don't want a blue ray player that looks like a George forman grill ;)

That is a All-Star list, too bad you didn't have a DC. Then it would just be a long list of Awesome.
I'm willing to accept that Sony makes a lean-mean-gaming-machine. That's what PS2 and 3 are about, I respect that. I'm just not gonna buy 'em.

Mega-Drive is a good addition there, that thing MADE Sonic.
Did you ever have a game called "North and South" on the NES?
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby zenten » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:14 pm UTC

JayDee wrote:I like to think that the Wii is Nintendo's way of getting out of the console war. The actual fighting would be between MS and Sony, for the hardcore gamers. Nintendo are saying screw that, we're doing our own thing.


Sort of.

I think they figured out that the standard market for consoles wasn't growing, so they just made their own.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Endless Mike » Thu Dec 06, 2007 3:56 pm UTC

I abstain because competition is good thing and intend to have all three in the near future (only need a PS3 to complete the trifecta).

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Endless Mike » Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:14 pm UTC

ASmileWithoutACat wrote:Yeah, I personally dislike the company and all works thereof; however, even leaving that aside- there was a disturbing article (Wired, I think) about the development of Halo 3. MS had effectively built the game once, then tested.. When they had all the stats, they rebuilt the game and adjusted everything according to that. This isn't just seeing how the public will respond; this isn't like a movie screening, or a gameplay demo. This gives the impression of building a game by statistics.

That scares me, because I see games as a form of art. It is a communication between the player and the designers, and in that development model, the designers become not much better than glorified statisticians. I wouldn't rehearse a play with the audience in the theatre; I wouldn't shoot a movie and take every passerby's suggestion; I wouldn't write a book and stop every paragraph to get opinions. Why follow the same approach with game development?

That's why I like Nintendo. I always have the feeling with Nintendo that at least some of their people care more about whether the game is fun than what statistical analysis says is the best way to design a game, or what approach will sell the most copies.

Fun is a difficult quality, but I don't think you can totally capture it analytically. There has to be a place for inspiration in this and any other form of art.

I read that same article and thought it was very, very interesting. What Bungie (the actual developers who have been fairly autonomous as a now-former MS second party, much like Blizzard is/was as part of Vivendi) did is called "good game design." They had an intended way for the game to be played (30 seconds on, 30 seconds off? I forget the exact quote), and tailored the experience to meet that. With testing they found people were getting stuck in certain areas and redesigned it to avoid that as much as possible. I can promise you Nintendo does the same thing for their big releases; maybe not so much their small ones, though. They're just not as open about it. It's NOT fun to run around in circles in the same area for five minutes, especially if there's nothing to do/see there. The fact that they took the time to polish the game, knowing that it would sell a billion copies ANYWAY, is far more indicative of their desire to release a good game than anything.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby bigglesworth » Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:50 pm UTC

Fun does not equal art.

There's lots of art that is not very fun.
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Endless Mike » Thu Dec 06, 2007 6:15 pm UTC

bigglesworth wrote:Fun does not equal art.

There's lots of art that is not very fun.

I agree. And having a player run around in circles because you poorly designed a level isn't art, either. I would also say that Bungie in no way was attempting to make art. They were making a fun game (don't argue with this, that is their intent regardless of personal feelings; I haven't even played it since I didn't care much for the first two)

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby enk » Thu Dec 06, 2007 7:34 pm UTC

I'm not a console gamer, but I'd like to share this PS3 vs. Wii vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFoyp71xw3w (NSFW, I guess :P )
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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby Sollos » Sat Jan 05, 2008 8:49 pm UTC

I hate the Wii, and love Xbox Live and Xbox games. I like the Dualshock 2/SIXAXIS, but just wished they'd weight a little more.

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Re: CONSOLE WARS!!!

Postby segmentation fault » Sun Jan 06, 2008 5:08 pm UTC

keozen wrote:My favorite console ever would have to be the SNES


well yeah the SNES was pretty much the golden era of gaming.
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