Delta T = ?

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dasada122
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Delta T = ?

Postby dasada122 » Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:36 am UTC

Okay, I've recently started working out, about three or four times a week. Each instance consists of a ten minute mile followed by about 30 minutes of random weight machines, with the weight set to about 75% of my maximum for that muscle group. (I.E I do speed bench presses at 25lbs, when I probably could handle 35)
I believe I use about as many calories as I eat, perhaps a bit more.
I am 19.
How long before I notice an increase in performance?

Victoria Maddison
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby Victoria Maddison » Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:05 am UTC

My comments are restricted to the lifting portion of your post as there are many people here more knowledgeable than I am about running. The only thing I will mention is that lifting should be performed before strenuous running so that you aren't lifting while fatigued.

dasada122 wrote:about 30 minutes of random weight machines, with the weight set to about 75% of my maximum for that muscle group. (I.E I do speed bench presses at 25lbs, when I probably could handle 35)

This is not a good way to train. Stay away from machines, light weights, speed work and unstructured programming.

dasada122 wrote:How long before I notice an increase in performance?

Immediately, if you switch to a solid program. I recommend Starting Strength by Mark Rippetoe. It's simple and works. Performance increases are noticed each workout as you are lifting more than the previous.

Here is the progress of two XKCD members:

Celandine, Female, 5 Months:
Squat .......... 35 lbs -> 165 lbs (+371%)
Bench Press .. 35 lbs -> 95 lbs (+171%)
Press ........... 35 lbs -> 65 lbs (+86%)
Deadlift ....... 55 lbs -> 215 lbs (+290%) [at 250 lbs as of a few weeks ago]

Mobikwa, Male, 7 Weeks:
Squat .......... 165 lbs -> 230 lbs (+39%)
Bench Press .. 165 lbs -> 190 lbs (+15%)
Press ........... 105 lbs -> 130 lbs (+24%)
Deadlift ....... 195 lbs -> 265 lbs (+36%)

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Nath
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby Nath » Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:16 am UTC

dasada122 wrote:How long before I notice an increase in performance?

Performance at what? Do you have specific training goals?

baultista
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby baultista » Fri Aug 14, 2009 6:48 pm UTC

dasada122 wrote:Okay, I've recently started working out, about three or four times a week. Each instance consists of a ten minute mile followed by about 30 minutes of random weight machines, with the weight set to about 75% of my maximum for that muscle group. (I.E I do speed bench presses at 25lbs, when I probably could handle 35)
I believe I use about as many calories as I eat, perhaps a bit more.
I am 19.
How long before I notice an increase in performance?

You need to take a more structured approach.

I would gun for 2 miles at a pace of 8:30 per mile.

Instead of doing "random weight machines", why not figure out which muscles you want/need to train and which machines/movements allow you to do it?

Since you're only benching about 25-35 pounds, I'd recommend doing a bodyweight resistance program. Do sets of pushups, situps/crunches (Actually, there are tons of things you could do), jumping squats (great for your legs) and pullups (for the back muscles).
Could God write a program so long that not even he himself would have the memory to compile it in a single pass? -- Hamish Campbell

dasada122
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby dasada122 » Fri Aug 14, 2009 6:55 pm UTC

Well, when I say I bench 25, that doesn't mean that I max out there. I set the machine to 25 and do lots of little lifts- about 30 a minute for 2 minutes. I could bench probably 90-100, but it wouldn't be sustainable.

One other thing: If, when doing sit-ups, my lower back hurts more than my abdomen, does that mean I'm doing them wrong?

shocklocks
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby shocklocks » Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:43 pm UTC

Well, when I say I bench 25, that doesn't mean that I max out there. I set the machine to 25 and do lots of little lifts- about 30 a minute for 2 minutes. I could bench probably 90-100, but it wouldn't be sustainable

That sounds like a weird high intensity cardio exercise... You're not going to see any mass or strength gains training like that.

One other thing: If, when doing sit-ups, my lower back hurts more than my abdomen, does that mean I'm doing them wrong?

Sit ups are just a shitty exercise. Try reverse crunches/planks if you really feel like you need to do isolated core work. Honestly though, at this stage you really don't need it.

Vincent91
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby Vincent91 » Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:55 pm UTC

Let me hijack this seemingly dying topic for a moment and ask a related question.

I read what you had to say about Rippetoe's program and I am quite interested. I've been training for some time at the pool, swimming 3x1000m every time, but now I realize that this cardio is probably not going to get me any muscles. I'd like to try something like Rippetoe's, especially after looking at the results for Celandine and Mobikwa.

I am 17 years old, nearly 6'2" and probably around 145lbs. My goal would be to lift my own weight, first, and then get to 200 pounds on all 4 of those exercises. Right now, I don't think I can bench press 35lbs (slightly embarassing, I must say).

My 2 questions are the following:
-How long would it take me to reach that kind of objective using a program like Rippetoe's?
-Could I keep swimming like I am or would that hinder my strength training?

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Nath
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby Nath » Mon Aug 17, 2009 7:27 pm UTC

It's hard to predict how long someone will take to reach some objective, because of variations in body type, diet and so on. However, the Exrx standards can give you a ballpark idea how much you can expect to lift at various stages of your training. The short version is: the 200lb squat and deadlift should be doable, but don't hold your breath for a 200lb press. :)

Swimming will slow down your strength progress, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's a bad idea. It is possible to benefit from a Starting Strength-inspired program while doing some other type of training; there's a thread on this with some advice that I've found useful.

Victoria Maddison
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Re: Delta T = ?

Postby Victoria Maddison » Mon Aug 17, 2009 11:28 pm UTC

Vincent91 wrote:How long would it take me to reach that kind of objective using a program like Rippetoe's?

It wouldn't take long at all for you to be able to lift your own body weight, you'd be deadlifting that within a month. In my opinion to bring all your lifts (except for the press) up to 200 lbs would be 9-12 months worst case scenario, probably more like 6-9 with your swimming.

As to the press you'd need to gain weight and train for a couple years to be able to press 200 lbs. It's about on the same level as a 300 lbs bench press. Something to shoot for long term.

Vincent91 wrote:Could I keep swimming like I am or would that hinder my strength training?

It would add additional training stress to the equation which would affect your ability to recover between workouts. If your body is conditioned, you eat properly, and sleep 8 hours per night every night, then you may be just fine doing both. The quickest path to your goals however is to temporarily suspend/change the swimming. If you did stop the swimming and focused entirely on lifting (and eating) then I would imagine that you could reach/exceed your goals within 3-6 months.

Why all this concern about time frame though? Everyone should do the novice progression regardless of their sport because strength and power are so fundamental to athletic performance. No weight gain is necessary. I have a feeling though that once you get into it you won't care how long it takes, or will actually wish that you could prolong the novice phase because when you're adding 5 lbs to the bar every time you train you'll have a notebook filled with personal records.


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