Help with loosing weight

The Food Forum's Evil Twin. Trying to lose weight or get in shape? Tips, encouragement, status reports, and so forth go here.
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LakatosIstvan
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Help with loosing weight

Postby LakatosIstvan » Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:55 pm UTC

First of all, I would like to apologize for only using the metric system when I write :P

With school being over and the summer coming I decided that I will finally create a plan for myself for the summer and finally loose some weight, Currently I am 180cm high and weigh around 95 kg. My plan is to get bellow 80, but I'm having problems with finding myself a proper diet and even an exercise to practice throughout the summer.
My problem is with finding myself a diet. I'm a male, and fore some reason (maybe I just see it that way), all the diet books, sites, guides, etc. seem to have only women in mind, and require special products, exotic fruits and vegetables, and crazy machines to help out with burning calories...
So I came here to this haven of rational minded people to ask for your advise. I want a couple of diet tips which don't require fancy-smancy stuff, is accessible to anyone throughout the world (I live in Eastern Europe), and which actually works.
Also, a couple of sport suggestions would be great too. I was thinking of taking up running in the morning, but I'm not very sure if it will help out at loosing weight.
Sir_Elderberry wrote:Cords are not just bendy cylinders. They are flexible, animate beings possessed by spirits whose intentions are beyond our ken. They are Cthulu's tentacles intruding on our reality.

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Solt
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby Solt » Sun Jun 13, 2010 12:48 am UTC

LakatosIstvan wrote:Also, a couple of sport suggestions would be great too. I was thinking of taking up running in the morning, but I'm not very sure if it will help out at loosing weight.


It will help a little bit but diet is far more important. It only works if you don't start eating more because you think you deserve to cheat because you worked so hard. For example, just 8 ounces (1 cup) of orange juice will totally negate 10 minutes of running. And if you're like me I bet you drink a lot more than 1 cup at a time.

That said, I've seen a lot of people have a lot of success losing weight by starting a weight training program.


But nothing will happen unless you take control of your diet. Starvation is counter productive (tells your body to store fat) so eat often. However, eat small, healthy meals. NO fried food. I don't know what the typical Eastern European junk food diet is, but that means no chips, no instant noodles (practically made of saturated fat), NOTHING that was ever submerged in hot oil. No dairy unless it is low fat or fat free, including ice cream, milk, and cheese (yes there is such a thing as fat free cheese). No fruit juice. No excessive sugar or fatty food (for example, pie or salad dressing). No white grains (rice, bread, pasta- white is much easier for your body to turn into fat/energy), only brown. You should eat plenty of fruits and vegetables (minimal oil if cooked), whole grains, and plenty of LEAN meat such as chicken, tuna, and low fat cuts of beef (such as sirloin). Eggs whites are great but try to skip the yellow.

It's ironic how losing weight requires you buy *less* stuff, never more. The only problem is since it's hard to find a variety of food prepared in a way to minimize calories, you'll probably have to spend at least some time preparing your own. And possibly more money to buy ingredients raw (depending on how prevalent fast food is in your diet).
"Welding was faster, cheaper and, in theory,
produced a more reliable product. But sailors do
not float on theory, and the welded tankers had a
most annoying habit of splitting in two."
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ottifant
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby ottifant » Sun Jun 13, 2010 12:26 pm UTC

Running will definitely help you, if you do it on a regular basis. Of course it won't do anything good if you run only one time a week until you drop. Continuity is important, like three times a week for half an hour. The other thing is that sport not only does help you with loosing weight, but it also increases your endurance and/or strength, depending on what you do. Finally (but maybe its just me) it's quite satisfying to finally be able to reach a goal you know you could not have reached half a year ago or something.

After all, thats just my personal experiences. I never managed to change my behaviours concerning food, but i still lost some weight by "only" doing some exercises. In combination, you should be able to archive some results.

psyck0
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby psyck0 » Mon Jun 14, 2010 6:22 am UTC

Copy pasta from the thread above (now below, I suppose) yours, which I read first.

Search function.

There is no working weight-loss product. There is no shortcut. The only "trick" is to eat less and get at least moderate exercise- nothing extreme in either of them. Eat food you have cooked yourself and avoid prepackaged meals. Eat out no more than twice a week, including lunch. Pack yourself a health lunch and some snacks, if you need them. Don't drink pop or juice- dropping those alone has helped many people lose 10-20 lbs. If you're a big drinker, moderate your alcohol intake. The only things you should be drinking are milk and water. Eat complex carbohydrates in moderate quantities- oatmeal, yams, peas and carrots, whole grain bread (although many commercial "whole grain" breads are practically packaged lies) and limit your starch intake (potatoes). Have 3 pieces of fruit a day and consume at least 1 cup of leafy green vegetables, including lettuce, spinach, broccoli and asparagus, with both lunch and dinner.

A reasonable meal plan is something like this:

Breakfast: 2 eggs, 1 piece of toast or half cup oatmeal, milk, piece of fruit
Snack (optional): half cup nuts or yoghurt, something without much carbs/sugars (plain yoghurt with a bit of fruit in it is much better than flavoured yoghurt- that stuff is FULL of sugar)
Lunch: sandwhich, leftovers, etc. Get your veggies in with this meal, and a piece of fruit.
Snack (you should eat this one). Same as before, with a piece of fruit.
Dinner: Nothing too heavy in carbs- avoid pastas, burgers (buns are awful) and the like most nights. Include your veggies! Dessert no more than twice a week, and no bingeing on it when you have it!

Since you are at XKCD, I will do you the honour of assuming you are an intelligent and well educated young adult like most of us here. You likely know, then, that there is no shortcut to academic success- only hard work. The same is true of health and fitness. If there were an easy way, no one would be obese, but you can plainly see that the meal plan I have described is not overly restrictive, especially if you can avoid buying foods which tempt you in the first place. I am having a very difficult time sticking to my plan while temporarily back at home because my mother persists in buying cookies and chocolate-covered almonds, which I managed to avoid entirely for the preceding 8 months by simply not purchasing. The biggest change for most people is to drop juice and pop (arguably the most important improvement you can make), and then to reduce carb consumption to more moderate levels.

Exercise should be whatever you enjoy doing and can be as simple as walking your dog (or your partner!). It is not necessary for weight-loss, but it will improve your health. For myself, I have taken up powerlifting and find that I greatly enjoy lifting 400 lbs off the ground and grunting a lot.

Important edit: I just really noticed the word "permanently". It is even more true that no product or trick will make you lose weight permanently (except perhaps a stomach stapling operation). Permanent weight loss is really a lifestyle change; try to think of it as such. You are not trying to lose 20 lbs for the rest of your life, you are trying to change the way you live and become a healthier individual. In doing so, you will lose the weight, but that is not the primary aim. This mindset makes it easier to see and understand the necessity of following your meal plan, whatever you make it out to be, and will help you stick to it once you have reached your weight-loss goals, rather than abandoning it and simply regaining all the weight you lost, as people do when they regard the program as a temporary diet.

caje
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby caje » Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:13 am UTC

First is diet. Eat meat and vegetables only, including eggs (whole eggs not just egg whites). (Potatoes and corn are NOT vegetables) At the beginning don't worry about calories too much, you will crave the carbs HARD the first week and when you do put some meat/veggies down. Doing this diet will NOT be easy but it will work. Make sure you get a good amount of fat in (just not transfat) which means eat fatty cuts of meat along with the chicken breast/turkey/etc. If you have the stomach for it I'd suggest eating canned salmon that has the skin/bones still. It has tons of protein/calcium/VitaminD/Omega 3's, it is also very convenient and cheap.

As far as exercise do high intensity low volume stuff. Weight lifting (pick up "starting strength") and tabata interval type cardio.

Lioness
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby Lioness » Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:37 am UTC

Simple concept, really. Expend more energy than you consume.

Exercise is a good way to help this. So is diet. Diet-wise, what other people have said. However, I disagree with the statement that diet is the most important. Really, it depends on your metabolism. I know people who go to the gym three times a week for an hour, eat what they want, and remain skinny. If you've got a metabolism like that, can I borrow it?

Running will definitely help, but only for prolonged periods of time - I heard somewhere (no, I don't have a source, so feel free to dump a large amount of salt on this) that you need to keep up cardio work for more than about 30-40 minutes for it to be effective.

Diet is important though...Cut out soft drink (soda), junk foods, and try to eat home-prepared meals. You don't need to starve yourself or anything though.

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Solt
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby Solt » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:04 am UTC

Lioness wrote:I know people who go to the gym three times a week for an hour, eat what they want, and remain skinny. If you've got a metabolism like that, can I borrow it?


As one of these people, yes, I can eat whatever the hell I want and not gain anything, but the fact is I don't want to eat much. I can't eat much. I fill up quickly, and I don't get too hungry between meals. It's pretty annoying when you're trying to gain weight. I can't really accomplish weight gain without supplements.

Point is, it really does come down to calories. These so called magical skinny people everyone keeps talking about really just have bodies that don't demand that much food.
"Welding was faster, cheaper and, in theory,

produced a more reliable product. But sailors do

not float on theory, and the welded tankers had a

most annoying habit of splitting in two."

-J.W. Morris

elsanto
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby elsanto » Tue Jun 15, 2010 11:00 am UTC

hello
1)i read everybody's views ad noticed that almost everyone said that you should not go fr starvation. i want to ask why ? i only know of 2 drawbacks which are loss of appetite and less of vitamins and nutrients in the body
2)also i would like to that do all agree with the diet chart posted above?
3) why cant we eat what we want and remain healthy i think the principle that burn more than you consume does permit this
4)another question for exercising can we do it our own or should we go to gym in presence of trainers?

lastly i would like to tell me personal experience- when i was 15 years old in one vacation i went on starvation for around 3 days or so and from the third started playing a lot and the result was noticeable in my appearance (though not very large but was there) and now i am 17 and have again gained weight so i decided to do the same so again 3 days starvation (skipping a lot of meals) and i lost 10 kgs which is approx 20 pounds but when i started my normal diet i gained the same weight in 2 days though at this time i didnt do any exercise .now all the experts and experienced and rest people -what do you conclude from this?

caje
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby caje » Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:10 am UTC

1. Starvation creates a drastically reduced metabolism so when you start eating again your body will want to store food as fat instead of burn it

2. What diet chart?

3. It's a hard balance when eating things high in carbs and more specifically sugar. Especially because of the insulin spiking that occurs. It also can create short-term problems that when happen over and over cause long term problems, even if you remain non-fat.

4. I'd suggest picking up a copy of starting strength for weight training and doing low volume high intensity for cardio if you want to do cardio, which all can be done with no trainer. If you can motivate yourself a trainer is a huge waste of time and money and often do not know very much.

Your last paragraph is a little confusing, but I'm reading that when you where 17 you fasted then when you started eating again you gained all the weight back?

elsanto
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby elsanto » Thu Jun 17, 2010 6:15 am UTC

psyck0 wrote:A reasonable meal plan is something like this:

Breakfast: 2 eggs, 1 piece of toast or half cup oatmeal, milk, piece of fruit
Snack (optional): half cup nuts or yoghurt, something without much carbs/sugars (plain yoghurt with a bit of fruit in it is much better than flavoured yoghurt- that stuff is FULL of sugar)
Lunch: sandwhich, leftovers, etc. Get your veggies in with this meal, and a piece of fruit.
Snack (you should eat this one). Same as before, with a piece of fruit.
Dinner: Nothing too heavy in carbs- avoid pastas, burgers (buns are awful) and the like most nights. Include your veggies! Dessert no more than twice a week, and no bingeing on it when you have it!

this diet chart
1. drastically reduced metabolism -can u explain more( coz as i told i have tried it and my metabolism is same , i guess )
4. i am a mere beginner so i dont know what cardio includes so can someone explain that too
and as per my story caje what didnt u get- i said that when i was 15 i tried fsting ) for 3 days only , mind that) and some playing and lost fats quickly , but then i gained again due to bad habits this year ( iam now 17) and wheni tried again i did lost around 10kgs but when i went on normal eating i gained it back

Tomo
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby Tomo » Thu Jun 17, 2010 11:25 am UTC

elsanto wrote:1. drastically reduced metabolism -can u explain more( coz as i told i have tried it and my metabolism is same , i guess )
4. i am a mere beginner so i dont know what cardio includes so can someone explain that too
and as per my story caje what didnt u get- i said that when i was 15 i tried fsting ) for 3 days only , mind that) and some playing and lost fats quickly , but then i gained again due to bad habits this year ( iam now 17) and wheni tried again i did lost around 10kgs but when i went on normal eating i gained it back


Basically (and I've tried to explain very very basically), your metabolism is the amount of calories you burn during a normal day, while resting and not exercising. For a normal person this will be around 2000 calories.

Unfortunately, your body is smart, so if you eat a lot less than your metabolism - like by starving yourself and eating 0 calories, your body will try to adjust so you actually don't starve to death. So say you eat 0 calories, in the first day your metabolism is 2000, so you lose 2000 calories worth of fat.

After a week, your metabolism drops to 500, so now you only lose 500 calories of weight a day.

But if you then go back to normal eating of 2000 calories a day, you immediately put on 1500 calories every day, and the weight comes straight back.

The ideal solution is to eat about 500 calories under your metabolism - so probably around 1500-2000 calories. That way you will drop 500 calories of weight a day, and your metabolism won't change.

Also, some exercises - weight lifting or HIIT in particular increase your metabolism. Google the tabata method or starting strength for more details.
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elsanto
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby elsanto » Thu Jun 17, 2010 12:14 pm UTC

Tomo wrote:Unfortunately, your body is smart, so if you eat a lot less than your metabolism - like by starving yourself and eating 0 calories, your body will try to adjust so you actually don't starve to death. So say you eat 0 calories, in the first day your metabolism is 2000, so you lose 2000 calories worth of fat.

you are tallking in general or is it for me??

Tomo
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Re: Help with loosing weight

Postby Tomo » Thu Jun 17, 2010 4:25 pm UTC

elsanto wrote:you are tallking in general or is it for me??


In general - though the amounts of calories are rough and change for every person, the basic idea is the same.

For you, starvation is almost certainly a bad thing. Just eat healthily and lift weights, and go running regularly.
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