Shakespeare Mafia III - Curtain Call

For your simulated organized crime needs.

Moderators: jestingrabbit, Moderators General, Prelates

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act II is going to need some adjustments

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 8:33 am UTC

^

SDK wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:
Sabrar wrote:Aside: figured out why some links were broken. If you sort by author then position of posts will change overtime and software won't find it. If you sort by date then this won't occur.


That's a nuisance. Thanks for the head's up.

I've got a fix for that. If you're searching by author and click a post link so you can copy the URL, switching it to a normal URL is easy. (Ignore the [] brackets going forward - I added them to made the URL not a link.)

[http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=122748&sk=a&start=520#p4201358]

That's what the linked post should look like in author view. See the "sk=a"? That's what's telling it to sort by author. We can get rid of the "start=520" thing too, since that's going to be different when we sort by date.

Sort by date is the default though, so all we need to do is direct the forum to the post in question. Copy the "p4201358" (that's the post number we want), and overwrite the "sk=a&start=520" with it, then add an = sign to make it "p=4201358" instead. That's it!

[http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=122748&p=4201358#p4201358]

Takes about five seconds to fix the problem, and you never have to flop back and forth between sort modes.


To make things even easier, use the little white icon right below the topic title next to "by [posters name]". That's a direct link to the right post number in sort-by-date. (I think I have a little arrow ^ pointing right at it in the upper left corner of this post but I can't see it in preview).
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act II is going to need some adjustments

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 8:33 am UTC

plytho wrote:What has changed since:
I realized that I know nothing about Bard and my usual conclusions may not apply.

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 9:16 am UTC

@plytho: if you had a Vig-shot who would you kill tonight?

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 9:26 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:@plytho: if you had a Vig-shot who would you kill tonight?

Do you mean right now, gun to my head or do I get to make my reads first?

Right now I'd probably target Madge or Bard.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 9:28 am UTC

Right now was what I meant, thanks. Why Madge?

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 9:39 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:Right now was what I meant, thanks. Why Madge?

She's been on the scummy end of my reads for most of the game which means I found some things scummy and she hasn't posted anything redeeming. She's generally been lurky. I think she might be the quiet third guild member or, if LaserBard is town, one of the supernaturals.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
DGames | Bard
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu May 11, 2017 5:01 am UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby DGames | Bard » Tue May 30, 2017 9:54 am UTC

My wincon is to win with Town. There is no strange caveat and I'm not SK/Super Natural/etc., you have my honest to goodness word.

Ok, bear with me, I -know- saying "I'm not scum" is not a great defense, but I don't really know the argument in favor of me being scum, so I'm not sure how to argue against it. There's a lot of FUD suggesting I'm of the supernatural squad, but I have no idea where that came from and it's hard to deny the possibility since, well, it's a possibility. Just about anyone here could be scum except for SirGabriel at this point, at least from my point of view.

Is there anything in specific you guys want me to answer?

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 9:59 am UTC

DGames | Bard wrote:Is there anything in specific you guys want me to answer?
Can you look for connections between YOLOSWAG and any other player or between 2 currently living players (preferably D1 when scum couldn't coordinate)? In other words, who is scum in your opinion and which team do they belong to?

User avatar
DGames | Bard
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu May 11, 2017 5:01 am UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby DGames | Bard » Tue May 30, 2017 10:19 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:Is there anything in specific you guys want me to answer?
Can you look for connections between YOLOSWAG and any other player or between 2 currently living players (preferably D1 when scum couldn't coordinate)? In other words, who is scum in your opinion and which team do they belong to?


Ok, I'll see what I can find. I'm tired (3am) and off my computer, but I will respond in the morning (can't be bothered for a full reread to find connections this late since I'm pretty sure I will pass out in the middle of it XD!!)

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 11:22 am UTC

@LaserGuy: if you're Town please convince me that your scummy play on D1, D2 major push on bessie plus defending YOLOSWAG D1 (and a bit D2) are somehow all just a coincidence.

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 12:40 pm UTC

Here's my read on Madge and why I think she's guild scum.

She's lurky: very low post count: 19 posts out of 690. There's no scumhunting except for one short bit, randomly on dimochka.

D1:
First big post.

Madge wrote:I agree that Dethstalker looks like a possible timewaster. Might be as good a place to put a lynch down as any. I'm personally suspecting the mystery vote is not related to dethstalker, but is a vote that is cast by someone's power. So if we lynch dethstalker there'll be someone else with a phantom vote! I hope it won't be me :( :( I like being here with you guys even if I only have a small part to play.

(OK, after reading more: Dethstalker is crossing the line from a bit scatterbrained to seemingly malicious. I'm happy to vote him to get him out of our hair, but I'd probably rather we get him replaced so someone can play his likely town [we are all likely town due to probability] role PROPERLY)

That last bit feels like trying too hard to say “DethStalker isn’t my scumbuddy”.

Madge wrote:Oh, speaking of changes to role PMs - my role PM makes it pretty clear that there are supernatural and non-supernatural (people, powers, or kills: one of those three gets categorised as such, probably) in this game. I think it's most likely that people are supernatural or not. I get the feeling that kills can be done by supernaturals or done by non-supernaturals. I suppose we'll see.

This made me doubt the guild angle a bit. I’m not sure they’d be told there are supernaturals beside their own faction. Of course this was posted on page 4 after a number of people already mentioned the presence of supernaturals.

Her reads list has Bard, SirG and Dethstalker on the scummy end but she calls dethstalker likely town and hopes for a replacement.

D2
In her next post of significance she volunteers a bunch of info about her action and ‘agrees’ with nobody that 2-2 scum is likely. Obviously it’s better for scum if town thinks there are only 2 guild scum (1 remaining at that point)

She does seem to be gunning for yolo in these posts

Based on very little. Which doesn’t really make all that much sense for a buddy at that point I think.
Votes SirG
Claims to have targeted SDK with her night action.

She switches to yolo right after that previous post.
At this point votals are 3 for Gopher and 4 for yolo. (Madge is the fifth vote on yolo)

Possibly she really did feel SirG was scummy but hadn’t really paid attention to the rest of the thread. She realised her buddy was in danger. Maybe felt that the Gopher wagon wasn’t going anywhere so she decided to bus to avoid suspicion?

D3
Madge starts D3 with an attempt to minimize the significance of yolo’s lists. (She's on the side the guild is supposed to kill.)

She mentions her 2-2 theory in her next post(this time claiming it as her own). She also says she's going to look scummy if she has to claim.

Her last post:
Madge wrote:SirG was scummy on D1, then I realised that I had no reason to think SirG was scummy today, and I was actually composing an EBWOP saying "was jimbob killed in the night? Isn't that convenient if so? if it was jimbob who was killed then we should probably think about lynching YOLOSWAG" and then I realised I should actually just click over a couple of pages myself to check, and once I realised that we had someone claiming a roleblocker (the most scum-friendly claim to make), and roleblocking the person who was killed in the night (requiring no confirmation), I was like, that claim is the scummiest thing in the game, SirG having faulty logic was really not in the same ballpark, and I'm no doubt committing some sort of logical fallacy by "sticking" to SirG. So yeah, just kind of crystallised into place that YOLO's claim was stinky.

aside: probably roleblocked me N1, the nerve

other aside: realised i'm no longer roleplaying my character. i should get back onto it.


Seems like an overreaction to this question:
Gopher of Pern wrote:Madge, you briefly voted for SirGabriel. Why?


Maybe Madge has spent quite some time thinking about her switch to yoloswag and she had that in mind when Gopher asked why she was voting SirGabriel.

Also by saying she was probably roleblocked by yolo N1 she’s distancing herself from him. But it doesn’t make much sense to me for yolo to claim he roleblocked jimbob if he actually roleblocked Madge.

The only way there’s an advantage for yolo to claim he blocked jimbob is if he actually visited jimbob and could have been tracked or watched there. That way people could possibly confirm that part of his claim. If he had blocked madge he’d claim that. It’s not that hard to motivate. If someone else blocked madge they might counter claim yolo.
If Madge was aware of yolo’s roleblocking power it might explain why she was so surprised at being blocked that she felt the need to share it. (Maybe telling the other scum team to back off?)

I don't really see a connection to others. Madge doesn't seem to be hunting for scum today. Madge asks almost no questions. In fact, I count two actual game related questions from Madge:
Madge wrote: Was "two scum teams" a consensus early on? I don't know.

and
Madge wrote:Also upon reflection I think YOLO's claim is scummy AF. Roleblocker is very easy for scum to fake and targeting a dead townie is super convenient. Do you have a good explanation for why you chose jimbnob?

(Found by ctrl-effing for question marks.)

I have no idea what her town to scum would look like at this point (she only produced that crappy one D1). She doesn't feel townie at all. I think she's likely guild scum, less likely supernatural scum and unlikely town.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 1:27 pm UTC

Gopher of Pern wrote:To Sabrar re: lynching bessie / SDK (even though it's all moot now)

Yes, but you have still failed to demonstrate why lynching SDK is better than lynching bessie.
Spoiler:
Going by the original premise:

Lynch SDK - if SDK scum, no info on bessie. If SDK town, bessie town.
Lynch bessie - if bessie scum, SDK scum. If bessie town, no info on SDK.

Outcomes in order of preference (just from those results):
Lynch scum bessie (1 scum lynched, 1 scum outed)
Lynch scum SDK (1 scum outed)
Lynch town SDK (1 town lynched, 1 town outed)
Lynch town bessie (1 town lynched)

Greater risk/reward with lynching bessie, but I would say the difference between the bottom two results is less than the difference between the top two results. Hence why I thought lynching bessie would have been the greater benefit (obviously I would have been wrong.)

It's completely moot but I hate not having the last word. :D
I just like to play it safe, planning for worst case scenario, minimizing impact of mistake. If our course of action is correct then amount of advantage is less significant. If we're wrong then we need all the help we can get. Mislynching bessie gives us nothing, mislynching SDK provides info.

User avatar
SDK
Posts: 639
Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 7:40 pm UTC
Location: Canada

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby SDK » Tue May 30, 2017 2:19 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:All in all I think I would currently prefer to lynch Bard today even though it would definitely mean 2 kills tonight as well.

You've moved completely away from the 4+1 scenario (with LaserGuy and Bard being the last two Guild members)?

plytho wrote:She does seem to be gunning for yolo in these posts

Based on very little. Which doesn’t really make all that much sense for a buddy at that point I think.
Votes SirG
Claims to have targeted SDK with her night action.

She switches to yolo right after that previous post.

Decent case there, plytho. You missed the most interesting thing about this part though! Madge didn't switch to YOLO right after that post, she talks nonsense for a bit, then a day later later votes SirG. Four minutes after that she switches to YOLOSWAG. If we assume Madge can write at 60 WPM, that leaves her two minutes for the series of revelations that led her to voting YOLOSWAG. I think this is either staged, or she somehow thought, "Oh shit! What am I doing!?" maybe after finally reading her buddy's posts in more detail (and seeing his claim).

I'll do a read through myself, but it fits.
The biggest number (63 quintillion googols in debt)

User avatar
SDK
Posts: 639
Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 7:40 pm UTC
Location: Canada

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby SDK » Tue May 30, 2017 2:20 pm UTC

Oh yeah, and I meant to comment on the "She does seem to be gunning for yolo" bit as well. She's not gunning for YOLO, she's putting a buddy in a list alongside others after he started receiving attention. That's standard scum play and is very noncommittal, specifically around YOLO (since SirG is clearly preferred).
The biggest number (63 quintillion googols in debt)

User avatar
SirGabriel
Posts: 42
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:54 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby SirGabriel » Tue May 30, 2017 2:28 pm UTC

SDK wrote:
Sabrar wrote:All in all I think I would currently prefer to lynch Bard today even though it would definitely mean 2 kills tonight as well.

You've moved completely away from the 4+1 scenario (with LaserGuy and Bard being the last two Guild members)?

I'm not following you. If Bard and LaserGuy are on the same team (and I think we can safely say they are), no matter which team they're on, killing one of them would leave their partner alive and would leave any scum not aligned with them alive, so there would still be two kills.

I think that it would be better to try to kill the last member of whichever scum team has only one remaining member, and leave Bard alone for now, to reduce the number of scum-controlled nightkills. If anyone has a cop/vig/something else that might be useful, maybe they should target Bard tonight.

User avatar
SDK
Posts: 639
Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 7:40 pm UTC
Location: Canada

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby SDK » Tue May 30, 2017 2:31 pm UTC

SirGabriel wrote:I'm not following you. If Bard and LaserGuy are on the same team (and I think we can safely say they are), no matter which team they're on, killing one of them would leave their partner alive and would leave any scum not aligned with them alive, so there would still be two kills.

Oh, duh, yes of course.
The biggest number (63 quintillion googols in debt)

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 2:34 pm UTC

SDK wrote:
Sabrar wrote:All in all I think I would currently prefer to lynch Bard today even though it would definitely mean 2 kills tonight as well.

You've moved completely away from the 4+1 scenario (with LaserGuy and Bard being the last two Guild members)?
Nope, the above covers it as well. I'm not sure I understand your point here.

SirGabriel wrote:I'm not following you. If Bard and LaserGuy are on the same team (and I think we can safely say they are), no matter which team they're on, killing one of them would leave their partner alive and would leave any scum not aligned with them alive, so there would still be two kills.
Completely true, that's why I commented about the 2 kills tonight.

SirGabriel wrote:I think that it would be better to try to kill the last member of whichever scum team has only one remaining member, and leave Bard alone for now, to reduce the number of scum-controlled nightkills. If anyone has a cop/vig/something else that might be useful, maybe they should target Bard tonight.
I think gunning for the single remaining team-member is more difficult, especially since we don't know if we're looking for SK or last Guild. If we're reasonably sure that we can hit scum then we should do that, no matter which team they belong to.

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 2:35 pm UTC

Next up: kalira, has 15 posts so far, less than Madge but also has one less Day of play so kalira is actually more active than Madge.

Starts the game with two big posts analysing D1. I’m pretty sure she covers everyone in those posts. They’re solid analysis and she gets a scumread on YOLO as a result.
I particularly like the part where she points out people who read Sabrar as town D1 as suspicious. Probably because Sabrar was scum in my first game (diablo) and had a very townie meta D1 so I’m suspicious of him D1.

After those posts she prods Sabrar and LaserGuy

Not kalira specific thoughts behind spoiler.
Spoiler:
I noticed this:
kalira wrote:Possibly important: now that I think of it, Bard doesn’t actually say we shouldn’t lynch LG because he is town there; he just says he has “good reasons” not to lynch LG. He only later puts himself and LG in a “town bros” category together. Not sure if that is important or not, just wanted to note it.

Actually, Bard did call LaserGuy town in that post.
DGames | Bard wrote:Can only make quick hits today, so I'll respond to Jim in a bit.

But more importantly, and for reasons I can't really explain, Laserguy should not be a play today. I have verrrrrry good reasons for saying this. I know I'm pulling an SDK here somewhat, but yeah.

I'll compromise to Dethstalker if need be, but I will vehemently have to stand behind Laserguy as being Town, contrary to what seems like scummy behavior according to a few.

But there’s quite a difference between ‘LaserGuy should not be a play today’ and ‘I have to stand behind LaserGuy as being town’. So it’s kinda weird to have both statements in the same post.

When I said I was going to read some specific people I was almost ready to buy Bard’s claim but I’m going to spend some time trying to read him later instead of SirG (after dimochka).


Kalira has only one post D3

I’m not really seeing any scumminess so far. While Madge was pinging me left and right, kalira doesn't at all. This is the first time I'm in a game with kalira so she might just have a solid townie meta and I'm missing scum tells but in that case I assume others would have picked up on those.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 2:35 pm UTC

EBWOP: Ok, I see confusion was cleared up and the first part of SirGabriel's post was not addressed to me.

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 2:43 pm UTC

SDK wrote:
plytho wrote:She does seem to be gunning for yolo in these posts

Based on very little. Which doesn’t really make all that much sense for a buddy at that point I think.
Votes SirG
Claims to have targeted SDK with her night action.

She switches to yolo right after that previous post.

Decent case there, plytho. You missed the most interesting thing about this part though! Madge didn't switch to YOLO right after that post, she talks nonsense for a bit, then a day later later votes SirG. Four minutes after that she switches to YOLOSWAG. If we assume Madge can write at 60 WPM, that leaves her two minutes for the series of revelations that led her to voting YOLOSWAG. I think this is either staged, or she somehow thought, "Oh shit! What am I doing!?" maybe after finally reading her buddy's posts in more detail (and seeing his claim).

I'll do a read through myself, but it fits.

Thanks. I did mean that she voted for YOLO right after she voted for SirG. I noticed they were close but I didn't really realize how close. I probably spent more than 4 minutes on this post.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 3:44 pm UTC

Whatever, butting in. Not going to do Madge's whole work for her but I was right about BoomFrog and I think I'm right here as well.

plytho wrote:and ‘agrees’ with nobody that 2-2 scum is likely.
That nobody is bessie who speculated about 2-2 here.

SDK wrote:If we assume Madge can write at 60 WPM, that leaves her two minutes for the series of revelations that led her to voting YOLOSWAG. I think this is either staged, or she somehow thought, "Oh shit! What am I doing!?" maybe after finally reading her buddy's posts in more detail (and seeing his claim).
I don't understand you here. You think she wrote the first post, then took the time to read YOLOSWAG's claim, process it and write out the subsequent post in 4 minutes?

PS: this post will look ridiculous in hindsight.

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 4:05 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:Whatever, butting in. Not going to do Madge's whole work for her but I was right about BoomFrog and I think I'm right here as well.

plytho wrote:and ‘agrees’ with nobody that 2-2 scum is likely.
That nobody is bessie who speculated about 2-2 here.

Thanks, you're right. I think I remembered someone pointing this out but I don't remember it being corrected and I didn't bother checking myself :oops:
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
kalira
Posts: 45
Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2013 5:03 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby kalira » Tue May 30, 2017 4:08 pm UTC

plytho wrote:While Madge was pinging me left and right, kalira doesn't at all. This is the first time I'm in a game with kalira so she might just have a solid townie meta and I'm missing scum tells but in that case I assume others would have picked up on those.


I never have solid townie meta. Just for reference. My meta (to my mind) is "I'm like bessie but more people are suspicious of me." Don't let that stop you from trying to figure me out though, lol.

plytho wrote:Actually, Bard did call LaserGuy town in that post.
So he did. Must have been skimming past it too quickly. I'll withdraw my speculation on that then, which is okay because I hadn't pondered anything out about it yet anyway.

Gopher of Pern wrote:Bard scum, Laserguy scum. Unlikely. But is a big blow to scum if Laserguy is lynched, if Bard is telling the truth.

Remember, though, that we're dealing with two scum factions. General question: given the randomization of the game, does anyone think it possible that mpolo would have allowed an unreciprocated lover relationship between scum of opposing factions? Scum on the same faction would be bad news bears from a modding standpoint as it could completely destabilize one faction, but if they're on opposing factions, it would be less of a game-destroying piece of setup.

Side question (meta): Are lovers here generally told the faction of their lover? I can't remember any games here that had that off the top of my head, but I could be misremembering (or just not knowing because it was in role PMs I didn't see).

I said this earlier:
If both Bard and LG are scum, I don’t think they are on opposing teams (else LG could have called out Bard and gotten one of his enemies destroyed) – unless of course that whole bit where scum!LG was flicking the lights for the other scum to work with his scumteam was actually a thing.
but to be honest, I'm not sure if I still agree with myself. If they are both scum and Bard is not lying about his unreciprocated loverhood, I don't know that they can be on the same scum team (destabilizing mentioned above).

DGames | Bard wrote:Hrmm, I haven't interacted with you much as of yet (actually not at all except for saying that I would consider compromising to your slot since it was pretty inactive via freezeblade). Who in your general opinion is scum/town at this point?


Yes, I remember. You called me "freezeblade's replacement." Slightly miffed I didn't deserve a name. As of beginning of D3, my best lead on scum is LaserGuy. I'm still picking my way through D3.
plytho wrote:Isn't bowling just a subcategory of pottery?

User avatar
SDK
Posts: 639
Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 7:40 pm UTC
Location: Canada

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby SDK » Tue May 30, 2017 4:26 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
SDK wrote:If we assume Madge can write at 60 WPM, that leaves her two minutes for the series of revelations that led her to voting YOLOSWAG. I think this is either staged, or she somehow thought, "Oh shit! What am I doing!?" maybe after finally reading her buddy's posts in more detail (and seeing his claim).
I don't understand you here. You think she wrote the first post, then took the time to read YOLOSWAG's claim, process it and write out the subsequent post in 4 minutes?

Or it was staged, like I said. Whereas, what, you think she's town and did exactly what you find so unbelievable?

Sabrar wrote:PS: this post will look ridiculous in hindsight.

That links to GoJoe. Explain.
The biggest number (63 quintillion googols in debt)

User avatar
mpolo
Posts: 18
Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:24 pm UTC
Location: Germany

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby mpolo » Tue May 30, 2017 4:28 pm UTC

dimochka has been prodded and promises to come back
Image <-- Evil experiment

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 4:38 pm UTC

Dimochka has 18 posts, even less than Madge, they're of better quality than Madge's though

He starts with a+ roleplaying. But he does seem to arrive late every day.

His first proper D1 post looks solid. I like how he called SDK being a lyncher possible.

Has a decent reads list and town to scum.
His top 3 townies are now confirmed town and in his top three scum reads are two confirmed scum (+ SDK). If dimochka has a scumbuddy they’re somewhere in the middle. He doesn’t seem to interact too much with anybody D1. He’s one of multiple people trying to give DethStalker advice but it doesn’t feel off.

D2
First big post of D2.
Not that great, I feel it looks like there’s more content than there actually is. There is a bit of scumhunting in this post. But there’s also an unfulfilled promise of more hunting in that post.

This is dimochka’s last post without the promised reads.

I’m not really seeing any connections to Yolo or DethStalker here. He wasn’t voting for either. But he did have both of them near the bottom of his first list. He seems generally disinterested and hasn’t posted anything D3 yet. So I'm not really getting pinged by anything specific from dimochka but I do feel his content is lacking.

This concludes my look at the lurkers. SirG was excluded because of his mason claim. I'm going to try to figure out Bard and his connection to LaserGuy tomorrow.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 7:00 pm UTC

SDK wrote:Or it was staged, like I said.
That doesn't answer my question. Why did you include that possibility? What were you thinking there?

SDK wrote:Whereas, what, you think she's town and did exactly what you find so unbelievable?
I find it unbelievable that she would realize that as scum. I think it's possible she did it as town.

SDK wrote:That links to GoJoe. Explain.
It would only ruin the joke, I was having fun at my own expense. But if you really think it has significance I will let you know.

User avatar
LaserGuy
Posts: 4549
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:33 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby LaserGuy » Tue May 30, 2017 7:05 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:@LaserGuy: if you're Town please convince me that your scummy play on D1, D2 major push on bessie plus defending YOLOSWAG D1 (and a bit D2) are somehow all just a coincidence.


For D1: I have a posting restriction called "chatterbox". This restriction requires me to make my posts as long as possible, even if it means adding empty content. So, my main interest in D1 was producing giant walls of text. Anything that I saw interesting in the thread, I'd write about. Weird voting powers? Great put that in a post. Speculation about two scumteams? Another giant wall of text. SDK claiming bessie is town? Interesting! Another wall of text. Several, actually. And, FWIW, I correctly identified that SDK's motivation for outing bessie was he trying to get bessie killed. I misidentified that as him being scum, though these speculations aren't too far off the mark:
LaserGuy wrote:I feel that there is virtually no circumstance under which Town!SDK would make such a statement about a confirmed townie at this point in the game. Were you in danger of the lynch, I can imagine him putting such a claim forward, but at this point in time, it only benefits scum to know that there is a confirmed townie in the game, and who that person is--doubly so if there are two scum teams in opposition to each other. This essentially, in my mind, puts SDK in the pool of scum/anti-town indies, or perhaps, at very best, a townie with an extremely scummy wincon, as he seemed to be suggesting. I suppose I must add that there is some non-trivial possibility that SDK simply invented this information, but in many respects I would consider this an even more anti-town play than revealing the truth. In any event, this disclosure does not paint SDK in a good light whatsoever.

For meta reasons as well, I find this statement most troubling. SDK does not reveal information voluntarily, especially in D1, regardless of his alignment. I feel we must assume that his decision to release this information was deliberate and planned, and, as I allude to above, I do not feel that there are many circumstances under which this is a desirable play for town. The fact that he has since been extremely laconic about his reasons for choosing to release this information does not enhance my confidence in the situation. On the whole, I felt entirely justified both in voicing my suspicions of SDK's play, and in placing an initial vote on him. I may return it at a later point, but recent content points me more in other directions at this time.

SDK's move was, as he's admitted, anti-town. I don't think my concerns were misplaced given the information I had available at the time.

After this post, where I came to the conclusion that I was probably going to get lynched, I more or less resolved to drop the chatterboxing (though I still produce walls of text when needed, I'm just not going out of my way to do it).

I'm not sure about where you think I was defending YOLOSWAG. I put him as townie partway through D1 because he seemed fairly active and engaged and was producing decent content. I didn't have much else to go on, and half the players still had barely posted. Nothing that he had written had pinged me, so I was comfortable marking him as town. I wasn't the only one reading him as townie at this point in the game. In D2, I picked out the weirdness of his post-flip commentary that you seemed to agree with. When I reread him later in D2, I found his content had degraded significantly. I did ask you and BoomFrog about what you thought of the roleblocker immune person being on the same team, because it was something that came up that piqued my interest--and both you and BoomFrog had talked about YOLO since that post, but neither commented on it. I felt it prudent to have your reactions on record pre-flip in the event YOLO did flip town. I didn't care for your reaction to that--still don't--and may come back to this later. But I think the claim that I was defending him is a stretch.

On bessie, I don't think I have much to add that I didn't discuss in my reaction here. I found her scummy because her behaviour was significantly different from my meta read of her, and a number of her posts had pinged me. Some of her reactions to my case against her I found to be evasive or overly defensive, so I kept pushing to see if anything fell out.

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 7:31 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:For D1: I have a posting restriction called "chatterbox".
Your amount of posts was totally not the reason. Your content was.

LaserGuy wrote:What do you think of YOLO's explanations and his roleclaim?
LaserGuy wrote:Who in your mind do you see as probable scummates for YOLO?
LaserGuy wrote:Which scumteam do you think YOLO is on?
LaserGuy wrote:And why do you think the roleblocker would be on the same team as the person with roleblock immunity?

After the actual wagon starts on YOLOSWAG you never comment on him, instead you ask endless questions trying to poke a hole in the case against him. It might be a stretch to call this defending him but it definitely feels like it.

User avatar
SDK
Posts: 639
Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 7:40 pm UTC
Location: Canada

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby SDK » Tue May 30, 2017 7:37 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
SDK wrote:Or it was staged, like I said.
That doesn't answer my question. Why did you include that possibility? What were you thinking there?

SDK wrote:Whereas, what, you think she's town and did exactly what you find so unbelievable?
I find it unbelievable that she would realize that as scum. I think it's possible she did it as town.

Ah, I see. Difference in behavior. But if you look at those two posts and how they're written... Okay, sure. I had written a couple sentences getting my head around this, and I agree with you actually. I think this points to town more than to scum. Scum would have had to actually read something, consider what that meant, probably look at the wagon and decide to bus, then get down to actually writing the post. Scatterbrain town could have easily written that, probably just looking back at one post after thinking, "Wait, didn't YOLO claim something!?", especially considering that she's already in the middle of an EBWODP and clearly hit submit on the first post before fully thinking through what she was saying.

I'll retract the staged theory as well. That seems very unlikely given how those posts are written. I don't know why scumMadge would choose to stage that anyway. Should make sure I don't tunnel on this one when I get around to doing my reads. That will probably have to be tomorrow morning at this point.

To fully answer your question, I was considering the fact that scum often pay less attention to the posts of their buddies than to those of the town. I was thinking scumMadge could have skipped those YOLO posts and gone back to read them after laying her vote (since there were other reasons to lay the vote, namely that she's apparently trying to appear townie as she says in that same post). After she reads them, she realizes that YOLO's claim is garbage and changes her mind. Like I said though, I agree that would take longer than 4 minutes to rationalize and write.
The biggest number (63 quintillion googols in debt)

User avatar
dimochka
Posts: 77
Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2011 6:25 pm UTC
Location: A few different places->NYC->LA->NYC. He/Him/His please.

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby dimochka » Tue May 30, 2017 7:38 pm UTC

Hi everyone, apologies for missing the first part of the play; I had Memorial Day events the last 1.5 days. I'm sure nothing important happened anyways, since you can't do the play without its biggest star.

vote dimochka

I have one minor piece of news from the night I can report on, though it's not very helpful at this point. Once I re-read this day, I'll consider sharing (for what it's worth, I don't think it's detrimental either, but it would help to see if I can catch a liar in the posts so far). Meanwhile, are there any specific questions towards me? I also think we should have claims for most people either today or D4 at the latest. I also want to make the point that I was 100% supportive of Yolo lynch, as I had noted before, and simply did not want to put him at L-1. I know I promised to have a vote and did not at the end, so I have no problem making sure that I have one down today (provided my restriction is satisfied).
If you're curious about the origin of my avatar, google "Cheburashka".

User avatar
DGames | Bard
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu May 11, 2017 5:01 am UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby DGames | Bard » Tue May 30, 2017 7:52 pm UTC

plytho wrote:
Actually, Bard did call LaserGuy town in that post.

DGames | Bard wrote:Can only make quick hits today, so I'll respond to Jim in a bit.

But more importantly, and for reasons I can't really explain, Laserguy should not be a play today. I have verrrrrry good reasons for saying this. I know I'm pulling an SDK here somewhat, but yeah.

I'll compromise to Dethstalker if need be, but I will vehemently have to stand behind Laserguy as being Town, contrary to what seems like scummy behavior according to a few.

But there’s quite a difference between ‘LaserGuy should not be a play today’ and ‘I have to stand behind LaserGuy as being town’. So it’s kinda weird to have both statements in the same post.

When I said I was going to read some specific people I was almost ready to buy Bard’s claim but I’m going to spend some time trying to read him later instead of SirG (after dimochka).


Bolded seems kinda nit-picky; it's implied that I think he's Town if "I feel he shouldn't be a play and that I have good reasons for saying this", right? Reiterating how I feel about him was my way of trying to reinforce how serious I was being about it.

kalira wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:Hrmm, I haven't interacted with you much as of yet (actually not at all except for saying that I would consider compromising to your slot since it was pretty inactive via freezeblade). Who in your general opinion is scum/town at this point?


Yes, I remember. You called me "freezeblade's replacement." Slightly miffed I didn't deserve a name. As of beginning of D3, my best lead on scum is LaserGuy. I'm still picking my way through D3.


Oh no!!! I didn't mean it that way; I was posting from my phone while pretty busy and it's time consuming to go back and check names while already in the middle of formatting a post (it took me like 3 minutes to remember the original names of the players that were in the game since I am still new-ish here).

Maybe I should just stop posting from my phone in general. So much more difficult to multi-quote, check back for things, etc.

You already know my opinion on Laserbro, so I will give you the stink eye in response to you telling me that you indirectly think I may be scum. D:<

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 8:06 pm UTC

DGames | Bard wrote:
plytho wrote:
Actually, Bard did call LaserGuy town in that post.

DGames | Bard wrote:Can only make quick hits today, so I'll respond to Jim in a bit.

But more importantly, and for reasons I can't really explain, Laserguy should not be a play today. I have verrrrrry good reasons for saying this. I know I'm pulling an SDK here somewhat, but yeah.

I'll compromise to Dethstalker if need be, but I will vehemently have to stand behind Laserguy as being Town, contrary to what seems like scummy behavior according to a few.

But there’s quite a difference between ‘LaserGuy should not be a play today’ and ‘I have to stand behind LaserGuy as being town’. So it’s kinda weird to have both statements in the same post.

When I said I was going to read some specific people I was almost ready to buy Bard’s claim but I’m going to spend some time trying to read him later instead of SirG (after dimochka).


Bolded seems kinda nit-picky; it's implied that I think he's Town if "I feel he shouldn't be a play and that I have good reasons for saying this", right? Reiterating how I feel about him was my way of trying to reinforce how serious I was being about it.

I guess I'm kind of a nitpicker. But I also feel there is a difference between' LaserGuy shouldn't be a play' and 'LaserGuy shouldn't be a play today' as the latter implies he could be a play later on.
This is a small point and not necessarily a slip but I'll keep it in mind tomorrow when I reread.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
DGames | Bard
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu May 11, 2017 5:01 am UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby DGames | Bard » Tue May 30, 2017 8:38 pm UTC

I've been thinking about it, but just how likely is it that a Supernatural SK has a lover win condition? It's hard enough as it is for SKs to win (in my personal experience with them, anyway), do SKs come generally handicapped on xkcd? Trying to dispell the FUD regarding my potential as a supernatural gentleman since, well, I'm not supernatural!!

Anyway, here's my general opinion on things:

Spoiler:
Madge, Dimochka, and Kalira are blanks to me, but I am starting to like Kalira (even though she is slowly approaching me with a comfortable looking slab of metal).

Anyway, some say they have meta on these players, but I don't, so...I don't understand why some of the aforementioned players are getting free passes from the perspectives of certain slots except that these certain slots are very confident that the aforementioned are playing to exactly par for the time being.

I am, at this point, tunneling Gopher and probably will until the end of the game. I think I said it earlier, but if I'm wrong about him, then I will apologize profusely afterwards. I AM NOT SOME CRAZY LYNCHER!

*ahem*

I feel good about Plytho/Sir Gabriel (despite both of them juggling my life in their hands at the moment; Gabriel is basically town confirmed at this point so he's a non-issue.)

Sabrar has been pretty pro-town, I feel that he is one of the better, more experienced players (certainly has been a bane for the Guild; the Guild killed him once, only to be hunted down by him again upon replacing back in...unfortunate). It's really safe to say he's not Guild at least.

SDK is some form of lyncher that was trying to get Bessie killed in order to achieve his win con (which seems to be Town-sided based upon a role pm from the last Shakespeare game that Sabrar brought up). There isn't a whole lot of reason to not believe him at this point I think.

LaserGuy is confirmed Town to me.

My scum pool is probably Dimochka/Madge/GoP. Dimochka, is heavily disconnected and will be a blank for the rest of the game unless he can be cleared (unless we go by meta reasoning and assume that he is Town for his playstyle, but I think this is a pretty unsafe thing to do). My scumdar is shooting rockets all over the place for GoP but no one wants to go for him :<. I don't really have a great opinion on Madge, but I can understand where people are coming from regarding her.

Based on all the interpersonal relations in this game so far, I almost think that the Supernatural may be an SK of sorts/acting alone. It's possible that there is a second scum team in my pool, perhaps.


plytho wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:
plytho wrote:
Actually, Bard did call LaserGuy town in that post.

DGames | Bard wrote:Can only make quick hits today, so I'll respond to Jim in a bit.

But more importantly, and for reasons I can't really explain, Laserguy should not be a play today. I have verrrrrry good reasons for saying this. I know I'm pulling an SDK here somewhat, but yeah.

I'll compromise to Dethstalker if need be, but I will vehemently have to stand behind Laserguy as being Town, contrary to what seems like scummy behavior according to a few.

But there’s quite a difference between ‘LaserGuy should not be a play today’ and ‘I have to stand behind LaserGuy as being town’. So it’s kinda weird to have both statements in the same post.

When I said I was going to read some specific people I was almost ready to buy Bard’s claim but I’m going to spend some time trying to read him later instead of SirG (after dimochka).


Bolded seems kinda nit-picky; it's implied that I think he's Town if "I feel he shouldn't be a play and that I have good reasons for saying this", right? Reiterating how I feel about him was my way of trying to reinforce how serious I was being about it.

I guess I'm kind of a nitpicker. But I also feel there is a difference between' LaserGuy shouldn't be a play' and 'LaserGuy shouldn't be a play today' as the latter implies he could be a play later on.
This is a small point and not necessarily a slip but I'll keep it in mind tomorrow when I reread.


It just doesn't feel right to say "he shouldn't ever be a play" since I have pretty much no idea what the set up looks like or what could possibly happen going into the future.

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 8:43 pm UTC

DGames | Bard wrote:I've been thinking about it, but just how likely is it that a Supernatural SK has a lover win condition? It's hard enough as it is for SKs to win (in my personal experience with them, anyway), do SKs come generally handicapped on xkcd? Trying to dispell the FUD regarding my potential as a supernatural gentleman since, well, I'm not supernatural!!
We have only your word that you're a lover. Why should we believe that?

DGames | Bard wrote:It just doesn't feel right to say "he shouldn't ever be a play" since I have pretty much no idea what the set up looks like or what could possibly happen going into the future.
If you're truly his lover then from your pov he should never ever be the play regardless of circumstances. Does not compute.

User avatar
plytho
¡This cheese is burning me!
Posts: 156
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 6:23 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby plytho » Tue May 30, 2017 8:49 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:It just doesn't feel right to say "he shouldn't ever be a play" since I have pretty much no idea what the set up looks like or what could possibly happen going into the future.
If you're truly his lover then from your pov he should never ever be the play regardless of circumstances. Does not compute.

Exactly.
Pronouns: he him his
Avatar: The High Frontier by Angus McKie

User avatar
LaserGuy
Posts: 4549
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:33 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby LaserGuy » Tue May 30, 2017 9:21 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:For D1: I have a posting restriction called "chatterbox".


Your amount of posts was totally not the reason. Your content was.


Fine, let's look at those reads:
jimbob1:
LaserGuy: Spends most of his time talking about the setup and vote abilities, with no opinions on individual players so far, apart from his comment about SDK and his early claim of town!bessie. I'm really confused by his "Unvote Znirk" when he was voting for SDK at the time, but I assume he meant "Vote Znirk", in which case, I want to know why he meant that, given that his only comment was on Znirk's (presumed) mistake saying that SDK said that Madge is town, which was fairly clearly meant to be about bessie. As stated previously, I found his question asking me if I had reason to believe other than a two-scum team to be role-fishing. If I had information to share that I thought would be valuable to share at this point, I'd have shared it. Scummy, and this time not because of lack of posts.

This was posted a third of the way through page 4. My most recent post from there was two days earlier at the top of page 3. At that point in the discussion everyone was still talking about setup, SDK/bessie, and voting powers. I'm not sure why he thought my question was rolefishing. He asked why I thought there were two scumteams; I asked him why he thought there was one + SK.


jimbob2:
LaserGuy - (14th, scummy): I've already made comments about LaserGuy and how I don't like a lot of what he's said up to now. The thing that's bothering me the most is his accusations against SDK. He really isn't trying very hard to think of why town!SDK might confirm bessie as town. That all being said, a number of his opinions do match my own, and his response to SDK's recent question feels like it would have been hard to manufacture as scum. I still think he is scum, but I'm not 100% confident in it. Possibly an anti-town indie?

My accusations against SDK were well-founded. Yes, there might have been the odd townie role that might have had a townie reason to reveal this, but there's very few that fit. Even the ones mentioned like Guardian Angel, etc. don't make sense to be revealing their target like SDK did. I feel like a lot of people were looking for low-probability explanations for what SDK was doing here, rather than the most likely, straightforward, and, as it turns out, correct one: SDK wanted to kill bessie.


SDK:
LaserGuy - He's talked about basically nothing other than me - and came down on the wrong side of the fence for the wrong reasons there.

At this point in the thread, I had posted twice more than in jimbob1. One of those posts was answering questions directed at me. In the second, I'm answering questions, explaining my unvote on Znirk, and posted a full reads list for good measure. The first part of SDK's comment here is actually kind of weird, since in the first of the aforementioned posts, I'm responding to a point by bessie where she said that I hadn't talked about SDK at all except to say that I shared suspicions of him with Gopher.


bessie:
jimbobmacdoodle as an Officer - Same feeling as previous game: focused on things I see as secondary, noncommittal on things that matter. Scum lean.

LaserGuy as the King of France - Same feeling as jimbobmacdoodle.

jimbob is town.


BoomFrog:
Doesn't say why he's reading me that way so it's hard to comment. On page 3 he said this, FWIW:
LaserGuy as the King of France - Enthusiastic examination of excrement is still the work of scum.

A common theme in all of these comments is the amount of time I spent talking about setup, SDK/bessie, voting powers, etc., which, yeah, I did. I didn't have a huge number of posts when a lot of these were written, but they were big posts where I expounded on all of these topics at length. As I said, this was deliberate, and a result of my posting restriction. Take that all away, and what's left in these comments that's concerning to you?


Sabrar wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:What do you think of YOLO's explanations and his roleclaim?

Okay, so now I'm kind of getting suspicious that you're just setting me up. I especially like how you deliberately hid the context to make it look scummier. Here's the relevant context:
LaserGuy wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:I really want Yoloswag to come clean and explain himself a bit more, as well as answer my earlier question.


What do you think of YOLO's explanations and his roleclaim?

The quote from Bard is posted here. I'm responding to Bard here. In the intervening period, YOLO fullclaimed. So I wanted to know what he thought of YOLO's claim. Bard basically hadn't talked about any other player besides Gopher at this point, so I wanted to draw him out and find out what his opinions were.

Sabrar wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:Which scumteam do you think YOLO is on?

No context again. You didn't even include the full quotation this time. Here's what was actually said:
LaserGuy wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:@Laserguy - My King! I'm not really a fan of Sir Yoloswag's play style; I can't say I get his suspicions of me this game because he hasn't really explained them to me. He kinda asserts himself in a way that isn't very transparent with his intentions, i.e. he says my posts are "disgusting," but he doesn't say what is "disgusting" about them. Another example that comes to mind is when he says I should be in the lynch pool, but doesn't really go in depth with the why. I'm not sure how he expects me to trust him in this type of situation. On that note, I wonder how he feels about me going for Gopher as a priority before putting him further on the chopping block.


Who in your mind do you see as probable scummates for YOLO? What about Gopher?

Hey, Bard has opinions on two people now! Let's see if I can get him to talk about somebody else. (He doesn't). I'm really curious as to why you would read these questions as defending YOLO, rather than trying to engage Bard. I'm also curious as to why you didn't bother to include the relevant context into these questions.

Sabrar wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:Which scumteam do you think YOLO is on?
LaserGuy wrote:And why do you think the roleblocker would be on the same team as the person with roleblock immunity?

The second question was the one that I was interested in. But it was moot if you believed that he was on the supernatural team, so I asked about that first. BoomFrog had already posted that he thought YOLO was Guild, so I figured I'd get both of you to respond at once.

Speaking of which, how about we follow up on this? In response to the first question, you said that YOLO being Guild was just a hunch. Which is fine. When I proposed the second question, your response was this:
Sabrar wrote:1. Because there are duplicate roles.
2. Because YOLOSWAG is lying about being RB.
Take your pick.


What about 3. YOLO is supernatural? You said it was "just a hunch" that he was Guild five posts earlier. What changed in the intervening period that made you so certain he was Guild?

User avatar
LaserGuy
Posts: 4549
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:33 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby LaserGuy » Tue May 30, 2017 9:34 pm UTC

EBWOP: I see I've mixed up the quotes on the section here:
No context again. You didn't even include the full quotation this time. Here's what was actually said:

This is what I wrote to Bard:
Who in your mind do you see as probable scummates for YOLO? What about Gopher?

This is what Sabrar said I wrote:
Who in your mind do you see as probable scummates for YOLO?

User avatar
Sabrar
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 6:29 pm UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby Sabrar » Tue May 30, 2017 9:39 pm UTC

Phone post before bed so I'll be brief.
You ask me why I think RB is on same team as Strongman. Then you ask me why in my answer I discard the possibility of supernatural YOLOSWAG when DethStalker was normal scum. Does this make sense to you???

User avatar
DGames | Bard
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu May 11, 2017 5:01 am UTC

Re: Shakespeare Mafia III - Act III opens in chaos

Postby DGames | Bard » Tue May 30, 2017 9:49 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:I've been thinking about it, but just how likely is it that a Supernatural SK has a lover win condition? It's hard enough as it is for SKs to win (in my personal experience with them, anyway), do SKs come generally handicapped on xkcd? Trying to dispell the FUD regarding my potential as a supernatural gentleman since, well, I'm not supernatural!!
We have only your word that you're a lover. Why should we believe that?



Ok, this is kinda self-meta-ish, but if I were scum, I would not voluntarily put myself in the line of fire and connect myself to someone for the rest of the game if it could compromise my win condition (which it most certainly would in this case). That being said, I will still entertain the hypothetical of "what if this was all a gamble and Bard is just full of poop."

~ahem~

Think about it: a fake lover claim would be such a crazy gamble that, frankly, it's just too bizarre and unsafe to do in a game where scum factions can cross kill. I mean, I would have to jump completely blind and in the dark to claim an unreciprocated lover that has town confirmed information. And to choose Laserguy, whom has been depicted by many as scummy in this game, which has effectively dragged down my own slot in terms of potential scumminess? I would never put myself in that kind of position if I had a choice in the matter (again, with the self-meta, I know).

Anyway, lets entertain the hypothetical scenarios and ascertain risk.

Guild Fake-claim possibilities
1. If I am guild and Laserguy is my scum mate, I heavily jeopardize our faction by making such a bold claim ("laserguy is town and should not be a play") right from the start. We are forever connected at that point. If he is killed during the night by a supernatural, I will be automatically lynched the following day. I also would have willingly ensured Dethstalker's death as his mate, since Laserguy was the only other potential wagon at the time.

2. If Laserguy is the Supernatural Chatterbox King of the Underworld and I am guild, then it would be the best case scenario for me since Guild wouldn't kill him in order to not jeopardize my claim, and no one else would kill Laserguy since he is the other faction barring Vigilantes (in other words, it would have to be completely blind luck for me to choose him as the Underworld dude).

3. If I am guild and Laserguy is town, this is not a bad situation for me to be in, but if that was my aim from the start, I would not have chosen someone that was being wagoned on and being depicted as scummy while Dethstalker's lynch was a possibility. Regardless, lets say I had reasons to think Laserguy was Town despite people wagoning him; I'm still taking a big risk and hoping he is not the Supernatural warlord of doom.

Town Fake-claim possibilities:
1. If I am Town and I die, then I could see myself getting forever banned for game-throwing if my gamble was wrong regarding Laserguy (I mean, seriously, that's just not a cool thing to do).

Supernatural Fake-claim possibilities:
1. If I am super natural, and I choose a guild member, this is a good situation because there will not be any crossfire. However, if that guild member is caught by unclaimed role in potentially existence (Cop, Watcher, Vigilante), I am screwed.

2. If I am super natural and I choose Town,that's a good situation to be in, but it's still a big risk; at this point, Guild can kill Laserguy, and if I have the ability to vote on the following day phase, I'm all sorts of doomed.

I'm sure there's probably a handful of things I didn't account for, but the long and short of it is that this is all one completely unnecessary big risk if the claim is fake. I would have sooner chosen someone more townie when it was still theoretically possible to play off my "bread-crumbing as role play."

Sabrar wrote:
DGames | Bard wrote:It just doesn't feel right to say "he shouldn't ever be a play" since I have pretty much no idea what the set up looks like or what could possibly happen going into the future.
If you're truly his lover then from your pov he should never ever be the play regardless of circumstances. Does not compute.


As far as the "he should never ever be a play" comment is concerned, what if there was a cult (actually not sure if this is possible; didn't quite read the role-specific rules at the start of the game), or some kind of crazy mechanic that made him some anti-town deterrent? Possible alignment changes? I dunno! Gosh, this is my first time here, I don't know all the roles you guys have. If he did become scum/anti-town somehow, I think it would be the townie thing to do to resign myself to an inevitable death barring context if it ultimately means winning the game. That's the same reasoning I used to resign myself to a lynch earlier before Laserguy; it just doesn't make sense to kill off two Townies at the same time.

Anyway, I'll be back tomorrow and let others say their piece.


Return to “Mafia”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: BoomFrog, freezeblade and 9 guests