What-If 0044: "High Throw"

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby peewee_RotA » Wed May 08, 2013 5:51 pm UTC

linearchaos wrote:Relevant: Matt Cain w/ Kari Byron & Tory Belleci from Mythbusters destroy things (with a baseball)

1:50 seconds of a pro pitcher destroying random objects, demonstrating just how good we can be at throwing, I would have thought this was made up if it weren't for the Mythbusters in attendance.

Since I can't add a url to this forum as a new member without spam, you'll have to google for "Matt Cain w/ Kari Byron"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_5XyMUwDMc

There ya go
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Xantix » Wed May 08, 2013 9:17 pm UTC

To see the Regal Horned Lizard in action, go to the following link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gEl6TXrkZnk

To lie down, assume a horizontal or resting position.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Moose Anus » Wed May 08, 2013 9:37 pm UTC

This what-if got a mention in the smithsonian magazine blog.
http://blogs.smithsonianmag.com/science ... -fastball/
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Angelastic » Wed May 08, 2013 10:20 pm UTC

I was just reviewing my footage of The Doubleclicks playing on JoCo Cruise Crazy 3, five minutes after Randall Munroe left the stage, and they actually sing that being able to squirt blood out of your eyes would be the worst superpower ever! :shock: I can only imagine Randall had to go lie down for the rest of the concert; it's a good thing he was on before them instead of after.
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby ijuin » Thu May 09, 2013 7:39 am UTC

allanfieldhouse wrote:I question the accuracy of this "What-If". The current record for "longest throw of an object without any velocity-aiding feature" is over a quarter mile using an aerobie. Why wouldn't he even compare the aerobie's maximum possible height? He clearly knows of their existence...

Wikipedia the aerobie world records for reference (the forum thinks my post is spam, so it won't let me post a link).


For the purposes of our what-if, I presume that the effects of wind and any updrafts or thermal lift would have to be excluded (i.e. the equivalent of "indoor conditions"), with the thrown object rising using only the energy imparted to it by the person throwing it.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Perilous_3D » Thu May 09, 2013 8:49 am UTC

did NOT read any of this thread, just came to say 'F***ing epic.' I love how Randall cuts through the BS with grace.

How high can a human throw something?

Where is Voyager?

Geez.

Like, a gazillion giraffes- with a little imagination.

hamjudo wrote:As of today, the record for highest throw goes to the Voyager 1 launch team. And it looks like they will be able to hold that title for at least another decade, probably more.


*ninja'd
Last edited by Perilous_3D on Thu May 09, 2013 9:04 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Perilous_3D » Thu May 09, 2013 8:55 am UTC

Xantix wrote:To see the Regal Horned Lizard in action, go to the following link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gEl6TXrkZnk

To lie down, assume a horizontal or resting position.



If there were a like button, I'd click and exit. How about a good What If like:

thought...

What physical evidence exists that the Big Bang is not a continuous phenomenon beyond the reach of the observable universe/How would a universe in which a continuously occurring Big Bang existed, appear to a human being (i.e. at a position they could survive)?

As the creator of the One True Comic he is eminently qualified to answer such a question and we ask him how high we can throw something!?

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Angelastic » Thu May 09, 2013 10:40 am UTC

allanfieldhouse wrote:
taemyr wrote:
allanfieldhouse wrote:I question the accuracy of this "What-If". The current record for "longest throw of an object without any velocity-aiding feature" is over a quarter mile using an aerobie. Why wouldn't he even compare the aerobie's maximum possible height? He clearly knows of their existence...

Wikipedia the aerobie world records for reference (the forum thinks my post is spam, so it won't let me post a link).


Aerobie can be thrown far due to the fact that iit generates lift. It will not do so if thrown straight close to straight up. Meaning the length you can throw an aerobie is irrelevant for how high you can throw it.


A different calculation, certainly. But not irrelevant. I'm not saying that the aerobie would necessarily be better than a golf ball, but it definitely deserves to be considered as a candidate.

Maybe he wants "highest throw of an object without any height-aiding feature", which would exclude the aerobie, going by what taemyr said.
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby peewee_RotA » Thu May 09, 2013 11:17 am UTC

Angelastic wrote:I was just reviewing my footage of The Doubleclicks playing on JoCo Cruise Crazy 3, five minutes after Randall Munroe left the stage, and they actually sing that being able to squirt blood out of your eyes would be the worst superpower ever! :shock: I can only imagine Randall had to go lie down for the rest of the concert; it's a good thing he was on before them instead of after.


So the only funny part in that clip was when she put on the ukulele. So I had to know why.

It had something to do with this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XN_IN7Lq8-8

Which makes absolutely no homage to Pockets... Either they're not nerdy enough to know the reference (fakes) or they didn't want to give credit for the idea (hacks). Either way their Lameness is over 9,000.
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby casanunda » Fri May 10, 2013 8:32 am UTC

I'd just like to say that, as a drummer, there'd be no chance of me dropping a chicken drumstick out of a window to hit the drum in time with the music.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby WriteBrainedJR » Fri May 10, 2013 4:16 pm UTC

Davidy wrote:Forgetting about giraffes, shooting blood and drumsticks for the time being, the question of throwing vertically has to be looked at from the human standpoint.

What-If postulates that a horizontal throw into a direction changing device is a reasonable way to approach the problem. I don't have the math to back it up but I'm pretty sure that much of the momentum of the thrown object would be dissipated by friction resulting in a vertical distance far less than a direct vertical throw.

That brings up another problem - the fact that human physiology is such that while it's easy to throw something horizontaly, it's hard to contort one's body in such a way as to acheive a truly vertical overhand throw. This leaves open the possibility of an underhand toss, which I believe is much less powerful than overhand.

I would think that modification of a fastpitch softball windup could deliver a ball vertically with significant power. Being a terrible pitcher in all bat-and-ball sports, I can't test this myself.

In fact, I think the fastpitch delivery might be an inherently superior answer to this question. Top pitchers in the sport can deliver the ball at 85 MPH, but they're throwing a ball that is larger and heavier, yet less dense, than a baseball. Plus, the fastest softball pitchers aren't the strongest throwing arms in the world; those people play baseball and cricket, which pay better. Teach one of those guys from birth to throw a golfball with a fastpitch motion, and I think you'd end up with a guy who throws quite a bit faster than Aroldis Chapman.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Anne E Moose » Sat May 11, 2013 4:19 am UTC

Hiferator wrote:Ah, dang it. I came here to ask, if the giraffe stack would converge to a Sierpinski triangle.

Any time you recursively reproduce an object following certain rules, it converges to a Sierpinski triangle. The convergence is easiest to see with vaguely triangular objects (such as giraffes), but anything will work.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby addams » Sun May 12, 2013 4:08 am UTC

ctdonath wrote:
YttriumOx wrote:this seems like a rather idiotic way of confusing predators and I'm sure the "foul taste" could also be achieved somewhat more elegantly. We have to assume that if there is a creator of the universe (as opposed to the far more reasonable competing theory) that he was blind drunk when he came up with this idea.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby rmsgrey » Tue May 14, 2013 5:18 pm UTC

Anne E Moose wrote:
Hiferator wrote:Ah, dang it. I came here to ask, if the giraffe stack would converge to a Sierpinski triangle.

Any time you recursively reproduce an object following certain rules, it converges to a Sierpinski triangle. The convergence is easiest to see with vaguely triangular objects (such as giraffes), but anything will work.


Yeah, the Sierpinski triangle is the result of the rules rather than the original image. Use a different set of rules, and you get the Barnsley fern, or the Sierpinski carpet, or...

The idea of encoding a detailed image as a simpler set of rules by describing similarities at different scales led to a successful lossy image compression technique used most notably in Microsoft's Encarta.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Angelastic » Wed May 15, 2013 6:06 pm UTC

peewee_RotA wrote:So the only funny part in that clip was when she put on the ukulele.

Okay, whether you found the song funny is a matter of taste, but would you care to explain what was so funny about her putting on a ukulele? I'm always looking for things to be amused by, but I unfortunately seem to have missed the humour in the uke donning.

peewee_RotA wrote:It had something to do with this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XN_IN7Lq8-8

Which makes absolutely no homage to Pockets... Either they're not nerdy enough to know the reference (fakes) or they didn't want to give credit for the idea (hacks). Either way their Lameness is over 9,000.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAg5KjnAhuU

Uh… first of all, it's ridiculous to claim someone isn't nerdy enough or that they're fakes because they haven't seen a particular YouTube clip (or movie, or book, or anything really. Perhaps their luckiness is over 10,000?) I hadn't seen that clip either (and to paraphrase another song, I have been a nerd since my first five-syllable word, and no TV series or YouTube changes that), and I don't even see what's so nerdy about it. Secondly, what idea do you claim they're using? Their song briefly references the Europe song that the person in that video is covering, yes, and they happen to be using a ukulele (though with a cello rather than a kazoo), but I really don't see how they're referencing that particular cover. It's not as if they stole the arrangement or anything; they don't work for Glee.

I can only assume you're making a subtle joke that I don't get, or perhaps you didn't realise the Kazookeylele song was a cover (I understand; I'm often surprised by the things I recognise on the radio in supermarkets because I didn't realise the songs I knew were parodies [ETA: rather than just ordinary comedy songs]), because I don't see how their song could seriously be linked to that particular cover of a different song.

Also (in case you are seriously interested in solving the mystery of why she put the ukulele on) that song came several songs later in the set; she actually put on the ukulele for this one and used it on and off for the rest of the show, switching to the guitar and back before doing The Final Countdown. :) Actually, now that I think about it, I suppose it is kind of funny that she seemed to switch between guitar and uke a lot rather than sticking to one instrument for half the set and then switching. But I guess they order their setlist by style or theme rather than instrument.
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Steve the Pocket » Fri May 17, 2013 6:36 am UTC

rmsgrey wrote:The idea of encoding a detailed image as a simpler set of rules by describing similarities at different scales led to a successful lossy image compression technique used most notably in Microsoft's Encarta.

Huh. I wonder how it stacks up to JPEG. Does this format have a name?
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Annirak » Fri May 17, 2013 7:14 am UTC

Now, why does the Horned Lizard get a mention, but the Bombardier Beetle get ignored? The Bombardier Beetle, which literally uses a rapid fire biocannon to shoot its enemies!?

The two reactant chemical compounds, hydroquinones and hydrogen peroxide, are secreted by specialized glands and are stored in separate reservoirs in the rear tip of its abdomen. When threatened, the beetle contracts muscles that open the valves of these reservoirs and force the two reactants into a thick-walled mixing chamber lined with cells that produce enzymes including catalases and peroxidases.
In the mixing chamber the enzymes rapidly break down the hydrogen peroxide, releasing free oxygen, and catalyze the oxidation of the hydroquinones into p-quinones. The reaction is very exothermic, and the released energy raises the temperature of the mixture to near 100 C, vaporizing about a fifth of it. The resultant pressure buildup forces the entrance valves from the reactant storage chambers to close, thus protecting the beetle's internal organs. The boiling, foul-smelling liquid partially becomes a gas by flash evaporation and is expelled explosively through an outlet valve, with a loud popping sound.
The flow of reactants into the reaction chamber and subsequent ejection occur in a series of about 70 pulses, at a rate of about 500 pulses per second. The whole sequence of events takes only a fraction of a second.
Typically the beetle turns its body so as to direct the jet towards whatever triggered the response. The gland openings of some African bombardier beetles can swivel through 270° and thrust between the insect's legs, discharging the fluid in a wide range of directions with considerable accuracy.
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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby PM 2Ring » Fri May 17, 2013 10:11 am UTC

Steve the Pocket wrote:
rmsgrey wrote:The idea of encoding a detailed image as a simpler set of rules by describing similarities at different scales led to a successful lossy image compression technique used most notably in Microsoft's Encarta.

Huh. I wonder how it stacks up to JPEG. Does this format have a name?


See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractal_compression.

FWIW, if you have Linux, you probably have fiascotopnm & pnmtofiasco, which convert images between NetPBM formats and the fractal FIASCO format.

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Re: What-If 0044: "High Throw"

Postby Someguy945 » Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:45 pm UTC

Maurits wrote:
Someguy945 wrote:Image

If you hover over this image in the What-If, it says "two more giraffes high and you've got a team"

What does that refer to? This doesn't appear to be a Sierpinski triangle unless I am completely misreading it.

There are currently 87 giraffes

1) How many more giraffes will be added to make this 2 giraffes higher?

2) How would the new number be a "team"? I can't think of any "teams" that have a specific number of members greater than 87.


The stack is sixteen giraffes high.

16 + 2 is 18 giraffes high.

If you don't know much about baseball, you might calculate that there are 18 members of a baseball team if you count 9 starters * (offense + defense).

(I'm not entirely convinced by this line of reasoning.)


It turns out to have apparently been a baseball reference after all. The caption has been changed to "one giraffe per tier plus Aroldis plus you makes a team"

Aroldis is not a common name and a quick Googling takes you to Cincinnati Reds pitcher Aroldis Chapman.

I still don't like the caption, because one of the best features about baseball is that you have the same 9 people on both offense and defense (except for the designated hitter rule). It's not 18 different people (or in this case, 16 giraffes, Aroldis, and you).

I do like to think that Randall saw this discussion and tried to fix the caption, though.


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