1190: "Time"

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby lmjb1964 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:50 pm UTC

One of the many awesomeful things that you made!

Oh dear, I'm pope. Well, I guess my decree is make to something awesomeful, here or on the Outside. The awesomefulness can be relative. You could make a really awesomeful sandwich, for instance.
Image

You helped Addams stay in her home, and gave her a better life. She thanks you, and so do I.
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That's a robot but it totally counts. Image

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby balthasar_s » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:19 pm UTC

lmjb1964 wrote:I'll go back for the ketchup later. Hi, everymolpy!
I recommend going back to the ketchup some time.
Otherwise you could miss some thinks.
Like this one about your name on a computer: http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?p=4466208#p4466208

lmjb1964 wrote:Preview note: The img and url tags apparently don't do the same thing.

Of course.
If they did,
why would we keep both of them?
[img]http://forums.xkcd.com/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif[/url]

<computery stuff> news:
  • The amiga 500 rev.8 mainboard arrived and it works.
    Now I have the required working computer to make the video converter.
    I wanted to exchange the Fat Agnus chip (which controls the RAM) between my new and old mainboard to check if the old one has the damage on the chip or on the board but I was not able to pull the chip out of the (plcc) socket on the new board and I didn't want to damage it, that would be stupid.

    I have a hard disk controller which can be attached to the computer by inserting it into the expansion port on the left side.
    But I shouldn't insert it too much, otherwise the computer will not detect it or will crash randomly. I think I will add some plastic plates to keep the required distance.

  • As I started thinking about coming back to the fpga video converter device which is an idea from 2013,
    I also started thinking about coming back to another fpga device idea from 2013:

    Some of you might have heard about a computer game called "Minecraft".
    In the years 2012-2014 I used to play it with my cousin and build some stuff in this game.

    We used a mod called Red Power 2.
    It adds some things to the game,
    What was very interesting to me, it adds some machines and things to build digital circuits which can control a lot of stuff in the game.
    I liked it very much.
    Even cooler, it added computers, which could, amongst other things, be connected to those digital circuits.
    And these are actual computers inside a game, yes, it actually is emulating a 65EL02 microprocessor inside a game, and you can program it in assembly language, (or you can an included FORTH interpreter). very cool.

    I had an idea.
    That it would be kind of cool to build a real life version of the computer from the game mod, in the real world.
    The 65EL02 is not a microprocessor that actually exists.
    It is a made up processor seen only in the game so far. It's an enhanced version of a 65C816 (which is real) which is an enhanced version of a 6502 (which is real too).

    But that's not a problem,
    I thought, I could implement the 65EL02 on an FPGA, to build a hardware-emulated version of this computer.

    I didn't start it yet,
    so far I'm trying to find out how realistic and how difficult it would be to make it.
    And when/if I do it it will not have very high priority, more of a side task, so it could take some time.

    There is almost no official documentation,
    only this and this.
    (there used to be some unofficial pages with some information but they disappeared from the internet.)
    But there exists an emulator (which used some original mod code for extra compatibility) which is a very helpful tool, and it has its source code freely available!

    I wrote some program, which is actually my first ever 65EL02 assembly program (and generally my first ever 6502 assembly program) which allows me to read or write arbitrary data to devices connected to the computer, by entering commands on the computer's terminal.
    I needed such a tool to investigate how the devices (terminal, disk drive, io expander) are behaving in some situations, because I believe that there could be some differences from how the emulator implemented it.

    I tried my program on the emulator and it was working fine.
    Then I put the program into the game.
    I inserted the disk and started the computer...
    ...and the computer started burning!
    Image

    I think there is a small difference in behavior.

    So what happened.
    Why was it running normally in the emulator,
    but burned the computer in the game?

    What was different?
    I found out.
    It's the bootloader.

    When the computer is started, 256 bytes of code, from a ROM image are stored at 0400 - 04ff.
    The cpu starts execution on 0400, so it runs the bootloader code.
    The bootloader reads data from a floppy disk, and stores it at 0500.
    Then it jumps to 0500, to execute the user's program loaded to the disk.

    The emulator used a different ROM image than the game (but I could change it back to the original for 100% compatibility)
    The "improved" bootloader from the emulator does something differently.

    The E flag.
    Apparenty, the 65C816 (and therefore also the 65EL02) has a thing called the "E flag"
    (in my situation it is more of an EE:EE:EE flag.)
    when it is set to 1, the processor is running in "emulation mode",
    in great simplification, it is kind of pretending to be a regular 6502, without the 16bit features.
    After start, the flag is on.

    The original bootloader clears this flag at the beginning, but restores it just before booting user code.
    The new bootloader does not restore the flag at the end.

    So that's the difference.
    In my program I did not clear the E flag at the beginning
    because I didn't know that it exists.

    How it is problematic?
    There are 2 other flags, the X and M flag.
    they are used for switching between 8bit and 16bit modes.

    And in 8bit modes some instructions are 1 byte shorter than in 16 bit modes,
    Which means that if the processor is in 8bit mode but it is running code written for 16bit mode it will interpret the extra bytes as additional extra instructions and execute them.

    And if the E flag is on, then the X and M flags have no meaning.
    The processor is always in 8bit mode.

    In my program I switched to 16 bit mode in the beginning. but because of the E flag not cleared it had no effect.
    Some of the bytes were interpreted as additional instructions and executed.
    One of such bytes has a value of 0xDB, which is the code for the "STP" instruction.
    And according to the instruction table, the definition of STP:
    http://www.eloraam.com/nonwp/redcpu.php wrote:STP - Halt and Catch Fire
    And that's exactly what it did.

    The lesson learned,
    Be careful when programming computers,
    you could accidentally catch fire burn down your house.

Redundant
Spoiler:
rpc8e_on_fire.png


By the way, "halt and catch fire" is an actual thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halt_and_Catch_Fire
BSTA
Good luck, my blitzing friends!
BTTBAA:1023 # Mustard? Use the mirror! Blitzing? Also use the mirror! And here's why. # OTT facebug copy
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ZoomanSP » Fri Jul 12, 2019 3:56 pm UTC

New OtherComic.

For decree: I made an awesomeful choice in picking the dinner place4 tonight.
Wait on.

Image
Spoiler:
Kieryn wrote:They have a culture involving hat wearing. What kind of a collective would come up with such a thing!?
BlitzGirl wrote:I'll get the razor and finish off Occam while we're at it.
ucim / Megan wrote:"It can do whatever it wants. It's the OTT."

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Rule110 » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:05 am UTC

I don't have my old graphics programs set up like I had back in Time. If I did, I'd do an othercomic manip of 2175, changing the final panel to show the flag on a flagpole tilted to the right, on top of a sandcastle tower, like a close-up from timeframe 970 (penultimate frame of the Fading). With the caption, "ZANCLEAN FLOOD. RUN!"

-----

Sciscitor, you did indeed and, and yes it is still awesomeful.

-----

Speaking of awesomeful, I live by a river now. A real river. The river is small, but it's bigger than me. The river has tides; it rises and falls twice every day. The river has awesomeful things in it and on it, including these folks:

Image

(That's my hand. The picture was taken from my own yard. Yes, I still have all my fingers. No, I'm not feeding them a square of white plastic; that's the space between the swantor's wings.)

Nature takes her course here, though. I'm no longer six cygnet certified as in the picture. In the two mips since then two have disappeared. (It might have been howlpies, or any of several other hazards.) The other four have been eagerly growing through their "ugly duckling" stage (though believe it or not they're bigger than full-grown quacktors already). I need to take an updated photo.

redundant
Spoiler:
six-cygnet-02.jpg
river_sunset_small.jpeg
Yes. There are other rivers.
If you're lost you can look--and you will find me
Time after Time...

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ucim » Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:17 am UTC

Rule110 wrote:Yes. There are other rivers.
Oooh! Wingish! (the raptors and the sunset)

Did you notice any chocolate fish in your new river? ZoomanSP was on pun patrol a newpage back, a task which must have weighed heavily on xim, because while bringing me to justice, xe climbed new heights of colloquistic frolic.

BlitzGirl herself showed appreciation for this quelching of such lexical abuse, while letting the embedded peccadilloes slide. I've yet to find a suitable... reward. :)

Jose
Order of the Sillies, Honoris Causam - bestowed by charlie_grumbles on NP 859 * OTTscar winner: Wordsmith - bestowed by yappobiscuts and the OTT on NP 1832 * Ecclesiastical Calendar of the Order of the Holy Contradiction * Heartfelt thanks from addams and from me - you really made a difference.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ZoomanSP » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:38 am UTC

For decree: I made an awesomeful, RELATED discovery today:
Spoiler:
Image
RSIR:
Spoiler:
YotR.jpg
YotR.jpg (91.59 KiB) Viewed 4286 times
Wait on.

Image
Spoiler:
Kieryn wrote:They have a culture involving hat wearing. What kind of a collective would come up with such a thing!?
BlitzGirl wrote:I'll get the razor and finish off Occam while we're at it.
ucim / Megan wrote:"It can do whatever it wants. It's the OTT."

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Re: 1190: "Time is a construct"

Postby Eternal Density » Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:51 am UTC

Boababs, Zooman!

Ooops I just remembered that I haven't looked at any othercomics in a few mips.
Play the game of Time! castle.chirpingmustard.com Hotdog Vending Supplier But what is this?
In the Marvel vs. DC film-making war, we're all winners.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby svenman » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:13 pm UTC

AlludUNG:
Image
Spoiler:
Wait for it.
(Colorization by Whizbang.)

Edit:

ConfirmUNG:
Image
Spoiler:
Wait for it.

Next, I guess, Michelson's and Morley's other experiment of the following year?

[Edit: Linkfix.]
Last edited by svenman on Mon Jul 15, 2019 6:50 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
Apart from Forum Games, mostly active on the One True Thread.
If you need help understanding what's going on there, the xkcd Time Wiki may be useful.

Addams thanks all of us who helped. Her life is much better now.

Randallspeed to all blitzers on the One True Thread!

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ZoomanSP » Mon Jul 15, 2019 4:49 am UTC

ENHANCE!

Image

RSIR:
Spoiler:
phys-0111_enhanced.png
Wait on.

Image
Spoiler:
Kieryn wrote:They have a culture involving hat wearing. What kind of a collective would come up with such a thing!?
BlitzGirl wrote:I'll get the razor and finish off Occam while we're at it.
ucim / Megan wrote:"It can do whatever it wants. It's the OTT."

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby moody7277 » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:18 pm UTC

So, it took about three wips to get to where I figured we were headed. Also, I've always heard that the Michelson-Morley experiment was the final nail for the "no aether" idea.
The story of my life in xkcdmafia:

Tigerlion wrote:Well, I imagine as the game progresses, various people will be getting moody.


BoomFrog wrote:I still have no idea what town moody really looks like.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby svenman » Mon Jul 15, 2019 6:39 pm UTC

moody7277 wrote:So, it took about three wips to get to where I figured we were headed. Also, I've always heard that the Michelson-Morley experiment was the final nail for the "no aether" idea.

What you're thinking of is what I described above, admittedly in a somewhat cryptic fashion, as "Michelson's and Morley's other experiment of the following year", i.e. 1887. That is the one which became famous under the name of "Michelson–Morley experiment".

However, the experiment which phys-111 refers to is Michelson's and Morley's 1886 improved repetition of Fizeau's experiment of 1851 (note the illustration!). This one appeared to confirm the then current idea of partial aether dragging, while the results of the 1887 experiment decidedly were at odds with it.

(Until a few days ago, I too was unaware that there was more than one significant experiment which Michelson and Morley collaborated on.)

Edit:

ExclaimUNG:
Image
Spoiler:
Wait for it.
(Colorization by adnapemit.)
Apart from Forum Games, mostly active on the One True Thread.
If you need help understanding what's going on there, the xkcd Time Wiki may be useful.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ZoomanSP » Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:36 am UTC

Wait on.

Image
Spoiler:
Kieryn wrote:They have a culture involving hat wearing. What kind of a collective would come up with such a thing!?
BlitzGirl wrote:I'll get the razor and finish off Occam while we're at it.
ucim / Megan wrote:"It can do whatever it wants. It's the OTT."

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Ketchup

Postby BlitzGirl » Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:58 am UTC

Image Welcome forward, Rule110! Molpish photo; I love the expression on the swantor you're feeding.
Rule110 wrote:I think I spend the ~4 mips (um, that's months, right? I'm going to have to use mostly English, sorry) of Time (the OTC, right? some of it's coming back) in a different mental state.

It was a strange and wonderful Time indeed. I've also encountered pastposts that I don't remember creating; it's a weird sort of Time-nesia, I guess. And of course particular words and OTTish phrases often bring up memories I didn't even know I remembered, like standards (ni ni ni chupacabra cygnet crowd) or The river is small!
Spoiler:
ZoomanSP wrote:Image
Image
lmjb1964 wrote:Well, I guess my decree is make to something awesomeful, here or on the Outside.

I think I mustarded my decree-following because I'm making something awfulsome instead: way too much mucus. But I guess that could be construed as a molpish thing because my immune system is working industriously.

Eternal Density wrote:Ooops I just remembered that I haven't looked at any othercomics in a few mips.

Outside happens. Image

ZoomanSP wrote:ENHANCE!
Spoiler:
Image

It's a redunda...! Um, redunda...? I'm not sure what is speaking there. But it's definitely a redundasomething.

Oh MegUNG, you shouldn't rely on such a relative comparison. I thought the Sandcastle was very seaish and fine, and definitely far more seaish than any castle I've ever constructed...
Image

Eternal Density wrote:I love how it's never too late for anyone to drop into the needle-pulled thing :D

At the edge of the needle-pulled thing, where the pastpages turn present, exists an eternal Now — where such temporal constructions as "sooner" and "later" fade next to the sharp brightness of never**ding creation.
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Spoiler:
Image
Image
Image<Profile
~.Image~.FAQ->Image

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby addams » Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:27 am UTC

Outside happens. Image
That is so cute, Blitzgirl.

And; True.
Outside does happen. Image
Beware the 3 for 5 tomato plant!

I have a Jungle!
They were little babies.
I put them in what I thought were large pots.

They keep throwing tantrums, like Toddlers.
They Scream and throw themselves on their sides.

Bigger Pots.
They demand Bigger Pots.

Okay, Okay, Okay!
The last one has been given a larger pot.

I'll wait
Spoiler:
It is highly unusual to grow and harvest tomatoes on the Pacific Coast.
These demanding Toddler Tomatoes are within sight of the Ocean.

Weird.
Wonderful in its own way;
Still...Weird.

I have a Jungle.
Another weird thing from the Garden:
(beware; It's a Spider.)
Spoiler:
Image
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby balthasar_s » Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:40 pm UTC

addams wrote:(beware; It's a Spider.)

At first I read:
"beware; It's a Spoiler."
And it was.
(with a spider too)

kxa wrote:Do you know how mobile networks actually work?
Do you?
BSTA
Good luck, my blitzing friends!
BTTBAA:1023 # Mustard? Use the mirror! Blitzing? Also use the mirror! And here's why. # OTT facebug copy
that's a robot so it doesn't countImage
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ZoomanSP » Thu Jul 18, 2019 1:01 am UTC

Wait on.

Image
Spoiler:
Kieryn wrote:They have a culture involving hat wearing. What kind of a collective would come up with such a thing!?
BlitzGirl wrote:I'll get the razor and finish off Occam while we're at it.
ucim / Megan wrote:"It can do whatever it wants. It's the OTT."

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Pfhorrest » Thu Jul 18, 2019 6:43 am UTC

qong
(A Note On Ethics)
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The Codex Quaerendae (my philosophy) - The Chronicles of Quelouva (my fiction)

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby BlitzGirl » Thu Jul 18, 2019 7:01 am UTC

balthasar_s wrote:
addams wrote:(beware; It's a Spider.)

At first I read:
"beware; It's a Spoiler."
And it was.
(with a spider too)

It's a Spoidler!
Spoiler:
Image
Image:
Spoiler:
Image


Spoidler.png
Spoidler.png (17.72 KiB) Viewed 355 times



Keywords: spoiler spider spoidler spoider spiler BGUM redundaspoidlerkitty beware
RedundaSpoidlerKitty.png
RedundaSpoidlerKitty.png (145.93 KiB) Viewed 355 times
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Spoiler:
Image
Image
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Re: 1190: Time for Physics – phys-0112

Postby SilentTimer » Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:26 pm UTC

I HAVE REPORTED YOU TO THE SECOND SCRIBE_S FOR STEALONG NEEDLE-PULLED THINGS AS IT IS A CRIME -- ongomome
Image
Spoiler:
Wait for it.

-- posted by SilentBot Image

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ZoomanSP » Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:52 pm UTC

ENHANCE!

Image

There's also a new message from GLR:

GLR wrote:Going to San Diego Comic Con this week? I'll see you there!

There was another new message (directed to the British readers) earlier which I could only see on my MTA, but when I tried to post it from my MTA, it logged me out every time.
Spoiler:
Wait for it.
ETA: Here it is:
GLR wrote:ImageI'll be in the UK for a How To book tour in October, with an event in London at the Royal Festival Hall on Monday, Oct 7th. Tickets are available here. More UK tour dates coming soon!

RSIR:
Spoiler:
phys-0112_enhanced.png
uk_tour.png
Wait on.

Image
Spoiler:
Kieryn wrote:They have a culture involving hat wearing. What kind of a collective would come up with such a thing!?
BlitzGirl wrote:I'll get the razor and finish off Occam while we're at it.
ucim / Megan wrote:"It can do whatever it wants. It's the OTT."


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