1451: "Background Screens"

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Nexxo
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Nexxo » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:55 pm UTC

This is not me at all.

Honest.

obfpen
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby obfpen » Tue Nov 25, 2014 3:48 pm UTC

KnightExemplar wrote:The best example of "Background Code" is when "The Matrix: Revolution" used a Zero-Day SSH Exploit to hack into a system.

It's interesting that the examples of good on-screen code are productions worked on by the same person. Could Martin Crouch be the only one in showbusiness who actually knows how to appeal to nitpicky xkcd folks?

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby CharlieP » Tue Nov 25, 2014 3:58 pm UTC

mathmannix wrote:...pay them $1000 for the privilege to see their action/sci-fi/thriller/spy movie six months before almost anyone else, and find flaws in it?...

Rinse and repeat for each hobby or technical skill that your characters are supposed to know. Gandalf and Picard are playing chess? Bam, go on a chess forum to find a few chess nerds.


But even if your chess nerds do pick something up in the preview screening, it's probably going to cost more than is considered worth it to get everybody back to reshoot the scene. Unless you use CGI to virtually move the offending pieces.
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Pfhorrest
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Pfhorrest » Tue Nov 25, 2014 6:04 pm UTC

On a tangential note about nitpicky details, I think I noticed the first graphic design field blunder (as in, someone supposedly working in graphic design in-story making no sense, not someone messing up the graphic design for the production, which happens plenty often). Jim and Pam of The Office had this exchange:

Jim: "But I thought you were good at Flash?"
Pam: "I was, until they switched us to Acrobat right as I was learning Quark!"

As thought Acrobat and Quark were alternate programs for doing the same thing, and that thing that they did was called Flash…
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obfpen
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby obfpen » Tue Nov 25, 2014 7:18 pm UTC

The opening credits for Rubicon seem to have been designed with people who look for background details very much in mind. And it's the kind of thing where you almost have to wonder whether any of its mistakes aren't actually deliberate.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby rmsgrey » Wed Nov 26, 2014 1:02 am UTC

An example from another field: in Jane Austen adaptations, a lot of the action takes place during dances. A lot of the dances shown on screen are country dances, or at least dances in that style, which it's possible to argue about the appropriateness of - by the Regency period (1811-1820), country dancing was no longer fashionable, with continental dances dominating society events - country dancing was relegated to something done by the lower classes and as an unofficial continuation of events after the serious dancing was over - so diaries from the early 19th century will follow a detailed description of a ball with "and then we danced country dances for a couple of hours". Anyway, if you are familiar with country dances, particularly those found in Playford (published from 1651 to 1728) then when watching one of these adaptations, you'll often be able to identify one or two dances being done by the extras in the background while the stars are discussing something on the sidelines or in the garden, but once the stars are dancing, the dances are usually simpler than anything you'd see anyone dancing today - which is fair enough - the stars not only have to remember the dance, but also the dialogue, and remain in character, and, depending on lighting, sound and camera requirements, the choreography may need altering for that as well as for the capabilities of the cast.

Where this comic comes into play is with this example (from a vesrion of Emma): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gnh1U32wwYc - the dance (Mr Beveridge's Maggot) is danced through once correctly (or close enough) then changes into some confection of the choreographer's - even if you don't know anything about country dancing, you can tell when it happens - previously, the stars were dancing with just two other people in a group of four, and everyone else was doing the same things in their groups of four; suddenly, the stars are just dancing around each couple in turn, and all the other dancers are either waiting their turn, or sweeping around the edge of the hall to join on the end again.
For comparison, a version of Pride and Prejudice the previous year did: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUC4hmCyxZ0 - the same tune, though a different sequence of figures, but the main difference is that these dancers actually stuck with the dance and repeated the same set of figures with each new couple they met, reached the end of the dance, stood still for (most of) a turn through the dance - while chatting with an unwelcome bystander - and then danced a turn or two as the other couple, doing what the couples they were dancing with had done - so, while the fine details of the dance may have been wrong (though there are at least two "official" versions of that particular dance out there - it's a long story - but neither of them matches this particular choreography) the overall pattern of the dance is a lot more correct.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Eternal Density » Wed Nov 26, 2014 6:54 am UTC

peregrine_crow wrote:
Eternal Density wrote:Here's some code from the Replicators from Stargate:
I guess they must use Node.js.
(They don't. Seriously that code has nothing to do with Replicators whatsoever. Someone must have said "we need some code for the screen, make it look techy." Lazy.)


So what would you have want them to do, write a snippet of code that looks like it could plausibly come from a functioning AI? I mean, it isn't that hard, but it is still like half an hours work (or a lot more if you're not familiar with programming) for something that only a tiny percentage of your viewers will ever see and an even smaller percentage will be able to understand.

Maybe grab some fairly cryptic C++ from somewhere (like an obfuscation challenge) rather than some client-side website code that's clearly part of a graphical user inferface.
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby peregrine_crow » Wed Nov 26, 2014 12:06 pm UTC

Eternal Density wrote:
peregrine_crow wrote:
Eternal Density wrote:Here's some code from the Replicators from Stargate:
I guess they must use Node.js.
(They don't. Seriously that code has nothing to do with Replicators whatsoever. Someone must have said "we need some code for the screen, make it look techy." Lazy.)


So what would you have want them to do, write a snippet of code that looks like it could plausibly come from a functioning AI? I mean, it isn't that hard, but it is still like half an hours work (or a lot more if you're not familiar with programming) for something that only a tiny percentage of your viewers will ever see and an even smaller percentage will be able to understand.

Maybe grab some fairly cryptic C++ from somewhere (like an obfuscation challenge) rather than some client-side website code that's clearly part of a graphical user inferface.


That would work. You would still have to know where to find such code snippets like that, but then again, you would have the get the crappy GUI code from somewhere as well.

I don't think that would that stop the kind of people that this comic is about from noticing that the code is bullshit. though. I mean, it would definitely score them bonus points for effort and it would be a nice puzzle, but it would still be fairly obvious it isn't part of the code for an advanced alien AI (due to it being written in a human programming language for starters).
Ignorance killed the cat, curiosity was framed.

rmsgrey
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby rmsgrey » Wed Nov 26, 2014 3:12 pm UTC

peregrine_crow wrote:I don't think that would that stop the kind of people that this comic is about from noticing that the code is bullshit. though. I mean, it would definitely score them bonus points for effort and it would be a nice puzzle, but it would still be fairly obvious it isn't part of the code for an advanced alien AI (due to it being written in a human programming language for starters).


I defy anyone to identify the language of:
"k10t<A6mYZNh!g&a2^j" "!^hOZb!&]bd(]TuqI]#iepZc/XdX(Z X4a!dgpc>0q;]^7p`q*AtqC1j,'#_on tp"


It's a line chosen from (spoilered for size):
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

               #include\
          <stdio.h>//
        #define Y(\
      _)_##char
    #define \
   _ [9<<9],
  #define j\
 L;fread(&\
 L,4,1,f);u
 #define P\
 &4**(int*\
 )"   ")% \
 3901%31///
  #define q\
   Z[F++]=*E
    #define $\
      for("IOCCC"
          #include\
              <stdlib.h>










int   *Q,u,i,c,k,B,r=0,w,n,F=0,x,J,u,m,p,s=0,v,e,r,L,a,z,y,D,o,g;   Y(       )*
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"Zd&o+"                                                            "pf^cM"  "cbac\
J_VHMF_"                                                           "BkaEg^" "x`i_i\
us%d]oWG:"                                                          "r`IZ.6_]H3ec]_\
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                       ])?q*0+c:(q++,  q--));$;K[F];K[F++]-=p
                    );c=fseek((f=fopen(*++t,"rb"))?f:(exit(1)
                   ,f),10,r);j;n=j=j=j;i=j;F=a=fseek(f,n,c);
                  Q=calloc(z=i--*u,4);$;a^z;fread(a+++Q,L>>
                  19,1,f));$;F++<i;r=n){$,n=0,B=u;B;n|=*Q^Q
                  [u*(i-F)+--B]);$,n&&Y(!r&&(D=F-J,J=F);
                 !n&&r;r=x=!put)(10))$;B^u;B++,c=p){$,p=
                0,s=J;s^F;p|=*Q^Q[B+u*(i-s++)]);$;p&&!c;
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              put)(           10),D=95;D--;D[M]=0);$;main(
               ++D?B:           F,w=a=g=0),!D;);$;x=K[o++]-
                 27;M             [x]*M[K[o++]    -27]>0&&(M
                                    [x]=s));$;     ++c^L;M[c]
                                      >s&&(s=M[       x=c]));$;
                                       3^d||printf      (K+--o,(
                                          *Q P,(e P),      D*!(c+~x);
                                               w++)$,o=     '~';-~o;)$
                                                 [w]Y(^--     o||put)(D=
                                                   o);0;);c     =Y(~o&&!
                                                    put)(*K+     x);}}}}}


Which is an OCR program that reads handwritten characters from bitmap files under certain, (more-or-less) reasonable conditions.

CharlieBing
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby CharlieBing » Wed Nov 26, 2014 3:28 pm UTC

SimonMoon5 wrote:
sotanaht wrote:It should probably be an alien language and therefor not recognizable at all to viewers.


Except that after a certain point, all aliens in Stargate speak English. Sure, they have some language difficulties with the first alien races they meet, but after that, everybody speaks English. It isn't until Stargate: Universe where they start to have some difficulty communicating with aliens again, but those aliens aren't just in another galaxy, they're in a really far away galaxy.

And as far as I know (though I may have missed something), Stargate doesn't have "universal translators" (like in Star Trek) or TARDIS telepathic circuits (like in Doctor Who) for the easy translation of alien languages.

So, it's just a weird coincidence that most aliens speak English.


More likely they all have Babel fish in their ears.

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Yablo
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Yablo » Wed Nov 26, 2014 8:51 pm UTC

Hollywood needs more nerds of all forms on the payrolls.
If you like Call of Cthulhu and modern government conspiracy, check out my Delta Green thread.
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Kit.
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Kit. » Fri Nov 28, 2014 12:34 am UTC

rmsgrey wrote:I defy anyone to identify the language of:
"k10t<A6mYZNh!g&a2^j" "!^hOZb!&]bd(]TuqI]#iepZc/XdX(Z X4a!dgpc>0q;]^7p`q*AtqC1j,'#_on tp"


But it's not code. It's string data that is valid in several languages - all that use " as a string literal quote and whitespace as a string (or string literal) concatenation operator.

Malbolge is nice as a completely alien language, but you won't find long enough programs in it.

But the real programming language that is both alien enough for Hollywood and an eye candy for a hacker test guru is TECO.

Spoiler:

Code: Select all

! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!     Responder to TECO commands      !
!        !!TECO.TEC V01.00!!      !
!                  !
!   Last edit on 10-Apr-79 by MHB      !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Switches recognized by commands:   !
!     /FI-ND       TECO      !
!     /IN-SPECT       TECO      !
!     /NOI-NI       TECO,MAKE,MUNG   !
!     /NOM-EMORY       TECO,MAKE   !
!     /VT-EDIT       TECO,MAKE   !
!     /VT-EDIT:H-OLD    TECO,MAKE   !
!     /VT-EDIT:H-OLD:S-EEALL TECO,MAKE   !
!     /VT-EDIT:S-EEALL    TECO,MAKE   !
!     /VT-EDIT:S-EEALL:H-OLD TECO,MAKE   !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Entry conditions:         !
!       Q-reg 1            !
!       0 => Try for private TECO.TEC   !
!      -1 => EITECO$ already tried   !
!       This macro (see ** notes)      !
!      Active EI -or-         !
!      Q-reg Y            !
!       DCL/CCL/MCR command         !
!      Text buffer -or-      !
!      Q-reg Z (if text buffer empty)   !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Q-register usage:         !
!     0 % Scratch            !
!     0 $ Scratch            !
!     1 % Bit encoded flags (see below)   !
!     1 $ Top level directory specification   !
!     9 % Bit flags from initializer   !
!     9 $ File specification for memory   !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Bit encoded flags (in Q-reg 1)      !
!     Load VTEDIT          +1      !
!     Inspect file          +2      !
!     Don't use memory       +4      !
!     Find position marker       +8      !
!     Use VTEDIT SEEALL mode   +16      !
!     Use VTEDIT hold mode      +32      !
!     Force memory write    +8192      !
!     Announce file used   +16384      !
!     Memory used      +32768      !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Set up our operating environment   !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Shut ourselves off (** deleted if we're in Y)   !
@EI%%
! Remove old copy (** deleted if we're in Y)   !
0,0XY
! Save old context; set our context      !
[9 0,0X9
[0 0,0X0
10U0 [0 ^D
^XU0 [0 0^X
EDU0 [0 ED&4ED
EUU0 [0 -1EU
ESU0 [0 0ES
ETU0 [0 32768#32#8#1,0ET
Q1U0 0U1 [1 0,0X1
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Try for private command decoder      !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Do EITECO$ if not already tried      !
Q0"E :@EI%TECO%"S ]1 -1U1 [1 @O!DONE! ' '
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Do initial set up         !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Get command into text buffer if not already   !
Z"E GZ 0,0XZ '
! Fix up spacing on command         !
J ::@FS%^ES%%^[
ZJ < -Z; -1A-32"N -1A-9"N 0; ' ' -D >
! Just quit if no command at all      !
Z"E @O!DONE! '
! Default all bit encoded flags to off      !
0U1
! Default directory specification to null   !
0,0X1
! Default memory file specification to null   !
0,0X9
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Handle private initializers      !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Parse /NOINI if present         !
J :@FS%^ES/NOI%%"S @O!/NOINI! '
J :@FS%/NOI%%"S !/NOINI!
::@FS%N%%"S ::@FS%I%%^[ '
::@FS%^ES%%"S 0A"A @I% % ' ' |
! Start of private initializer processing   !
HX0 HK EP EA EF
! Use built in "INI" and "MEM" if available   !
:@EG%INI%"S G* J ::@S%$%"S .,ZX1
:@ER%^EQ1%"S HK Y HX1 HK EC G1 ' ' 0,0X1 |
! Else form default directory specification   !
0,0X1 -1EJ-5"E @EN%*.*% :@EN%%"S G*
J @S%[% R 0K @FS%.%]% J @S%]% 0,.X1 HK ' '
! Try for initialization from TECO.INI      !
:@ER%^EQ1TECO.INI%"S Y HX9 HK EC G9 0,0X9 ' '
! Form file specification of memory      !
G1 ^YX9 ^YK :@^U9%TECF%
0EJ+100\ .-2,.:X9 -3D :@^U9%.TMP%
-1EJ-4"E :@^U9%<60>/MODE:#3000% |
-1EJ-7"N :@^U9%;1/-CR% ' '
! Use private initializer code if any      !
@ER%% @EW%% Z"N :@^U9%=% G0 ^Y:X9 ^YK
]1
]0 Q0ET
]0 Q0ES
]0 Q0EU
]0 Q0ED
]0 Q0^X
]0 Q0^R
HX0 HK G9 J @S%=% 0,.-1X9 0,.K M0+0U9
0,0X0
10U0 [0 ^D
^XU0 [0 0^X
EDU0 [0 ED&4ED
EUU0 [0 -1EU
ESU0 [0 0ES
ETU0 [0 32768#32#8#1,0ET
[1
J G9 .U0 -@S%TECF^ED^ED.TMP% 0,.-10X1 0,Q0K
! Set initializer defaulted bit encoded flags   !
Q9U1
! Fix up spacing on command again      !
J ::@FS%^ES%%^[
ZJ < -Z; -1A-32"N -1A-9"N 0; ' ' -D >
! Is there any command there at all?      !
Z"E @O!VTEDIT! '
! End of private initializer processing      !
| G0 ' '
! "TECO @file" is "MUNG file" if not RSTS/E   !
-1EJ-4"N J ::@S%TE%"S < 0A"A C > ' ::@S%^ES@%"S
0K @I%MUNG % ' ' '
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Decode MUNG command         !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Is the command 'MUNG' ?         !
J ::@FS%MU%%"S
! Yes, it is 'MUNG', do correct thing      !
< 0A"A D > ' ::@FS%^ES%%^[
! Isolate the file to MUNG and argument string   !
HX0 ZU0 J :@S%,%"S R .U1
Q1J -:@S%[%"S :@S%]%"S .-Q1"G %1^[ ' ' |
Q1J -:@S%<%"S :@S%>%"S .-Q1"G %1^[ ' ' |
Q1J -:@S%(%"S :@S%)%"S .-Q1"G %1^[ ' ' ' ' '
Q1J :@S%,%"S < -D -.; -1A-32"N -1A-9"N 0; ' ' >
0,.X0 ::@S%^ES%^[ .U0 ' ' 0,Q0K
:Q0"E @^A/?How can I MUNG nothing?
/ ^C^C '
@EI%^EQ0% @O!DONE!
! End of 'MUNG' command processing      !
'
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Decode common command switches      !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Parse /VTEDIT if present         !
J :@FS%^ES/VT%%"S @O!/VTEDIT! '
J :@FS%/VT%%"S !/VTEDIT!
::@FS%E%%"S ::@FS%D%%"S ::@FS%I%%"S ::@FS%T%%^[ ' ' '
! Sub-parse :HOLD if present         !
::@FS%:H%%"S
::@FS%O%%"S ::@FS%L%%"S ::@FS%D%%^[ ' '
Q1#32U1 '
! Sub-parse :SEEALL if present         !
::@FS%:S%%"S
::@FS%E%%"S ::@FS%E%%"S ::@FS%A%%"S ::@FS%L%%"S ::@FS%L%%^[ ' ' ' '
Q1#16U1 '
! Sub-parse :HOLD again if present      !
::@FS%:H%%"S
::@FS%O%%"S ::@FS%L%%"S ::@FS%D%%^[ ' '
Q1#32U1 '
::@FS%^ES%%"S 0A"A @I% % ' ' Q1#1U1 '
! Parse /NOMEMORY if present         !
J :@FS%^ES/NOM%%"S @O!/NOMEMORY! '
J :@FS%/NOM%%"S !/NOMEMORY!
::@FS%E%%"S ::@FS%M%%"S ::@FS%O%%"S ::@FS%R%%"S ::@FS%Y%%^[ ' ' ' '
::@FS%^ES%%"S 0A"A @I% % ' ' Q1#4U1 '
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Decode TECO command         !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Is the command 'TECO' ?         !
J ::@FS%TE%%"S
! Yes, it is 'TECO', do correct thing      !
< 0A"A D > ' ::@FS%^ES%%^[
! Parse /INSPECT if present         !
J :@FS%^ES/IN%%"S @O!/INSPECT! '
J :@FS%/IN%%"S !/INSPECT!
::@FS%S%%"S ::@FS%P%%"S ::@FS%E%%"S ::@FS%C%%"S ::@FS%T%%^[ ' ' ' '
::@FS%^ES%%"S 0A"A @I% % ' ' Q1#2U1 '
! Parse /FIND if present         !
J :@FS%^ES/FI%%"S @O!/FIND! '
J :@FS%/FI%%"S !/FIND!
::@FS%N%%"S ::@FS%D%%^[ '
::@FS%^ES%%"S 0A"A @I% % ' ' Q1#8U1 '
! Now we can strip out all spaces/tabs      !
J < @FS%^ES%%; >
! Default file if none and not /NOMEMORY   !
Q1&4#Z"E :@EG%MEM%"S G* |
! Form default directory specification if none   !
:Q1"E -1EJ-5"E @EN%*.*% :@EN%%"S G*
J @S%[% R 0K @FS%.%]% J @S%]% 0,.X1 HK ' ' '
! Form file specification of memory if none   !
:Q9"E 0EJ+100\ J D G1 @I%TECF% ZJ @I%.TMP%
-1EJ-4"E @I%<60>/MODE:#3000% |
-1EJ-7"N @I%;1/-CR% ' ' HX9 HK '
! Try to read the memory file         !
EP EA EF :@ER%^EQ9%"S Y HX0 HK EC G0 0,0X0 '
@ER%% @EW%% '
! Strip out all spaces/tabs from memory      !
J < @FS%^ES%%; >
! Parse /FIND on memory if present      !
J :@FS%/FI%%"S
::@FS%N%%"S ::@FS%D%%^[ '
Q1#8192#8U1 '
! Say memory used if we found something      !
Z"N Q1#32768#16384U1 ' '
! Announce the file if requested      !
Q1&16384"N Q1&2"E @^A/Edi/ | @^A/Inspec/ '
@^A/ting file "/ HT @^A/"
/ '
! Exit or error if no file         !
Z"E Q1&2"E @O!VTEDIT! '
@^A/?How can I inspect nothing?
/ ^C^C '
! Check for output=input format         !
Q1&2"E J :@S%=%"S 0,.-1X0 0,.K ZU0 [0 HX0 HK
:Q0"N :@ER%^EQ0%"U G0 ]0 HX0 HK @O!NOTFND! ' '
]0 :Q0"N @EW%^EQ0% ' Q0"N Y ' @O!REMEM! ' '
! Check for editing file         !
HX0 HK Q1&2"E :@EB%^EQ0%"S Y @O!REMEM! '
@^A/%Can't find file "/ :G0 @^A/"
/ Q1&32768"E @^A/%Creating new file
/ @O!CREATE! | @^A/%Ignoring TECO's memory
/ Q1#8192U1 0,0X0 @O!REMEM! ' '
! It must be inspect file by now...      !
:@ER%^EQ0%"S Y @O!VTEDIT! '
! File not found type error, so say so      !
!NOTFND!
@^A/?Can't find file "/ :G0 @^A/"?
/ ^C^C
! End of 'TECO' command processing      !
'
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Decode MAKE command         !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Is the command 'MAKE' ?         !
J ::@FS%MA%%"S
! Yes, it is 'MAKE', do correct thing      !
< 0A"A D > ' ::@FS%^ES%%^[
! Now we can strip out all spaces/tabs      !
J < @FS%^ES%%; >
! Check for null and fancy messages...      !
Z"E @^A/?How can I MAKE nothing?
/ ^C^C '
Z-4"E J ::@S%LOVE%"S @^A/Not war?
/ ' '
! Set file for creation            !
HX0 HK
! Do file creation            !
!CREATE!
@EW%^EQ0% @O!REMEM!
! End of 'MAKE' command processing      !
'
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   We couldn't recognize the command   !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! We could not recognize this command      !
@^A/%Unrecognized command "/ HT HK @^A/"
/ @O!VTEDIT!
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Write TECO's memory         !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! Remember the file name in Q0 if desired   !
!REMEM!
Q1&8192"N @O!WRITE! '
Q1&(32768#4)"N @O!VTEDIT! '
:Q0"E @O!VTEDIT! '
! Write the memory            !
!WRITE!
:@EG%MEM ^EQ0%"U
! Form default directory specification if none   !
:Q1"E -1EJ-5"E @EN%*.*% :@EN%%"S ZJ .U0 G* Q0J
@S%[% R Q0,.K @FS%.%]% Q0J @S%]% Q0,.X1 Q0,ZK ' ' '
! Form file specification of memory if none   !
:Q9"E G1 ^YX9 ^YK :@^U9%TECF%
0EJ+100\ .-2,.:X9 -3D :@^U9%.TMP%
-1EJ-4"E :@^U9%<60>/MODE:#3000% |
-1EJ-7"N :@^U9%;1/-CR% ' ' '
! Write the memory file            !
EA :@EW%^EQ9%"S G0 ^YPW ^YK ' EF @EW%% '
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Invoke VTEDIT            !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! If /VTEDIT specified, set up scope modes   !
!VTEDIT!
Q1&1"N ET&512"E @^A/%Your terminal is not an interactive scope.
/ | 0,3:W^[ Q1&16"N -1,3:W^[ '
0,5:W^[ Q1&32"N -1,5:W^[ '
! Form default directory specification if none   !
:Q1"E -1EJ-5"E @EN%*.*% :@EN%%"S ZJ .U0 G* Q0J
@S%[% R Q0,.K @FS%.%]% Q0J @S%]% Q0,.X1 Q0,ZK ' ' '
! Try to get the VTEDIT macro         !
:@EI%^EQ1VTEDIT%"U
-1EJ-4"E @^U1%$% ' -1EJ-7"E @^U1%SY:% '
-1EJ-5"E @^U1%SYS$LIBRARY:% ' :@EI%^EQ1VTEDIT%"U
@^A/%The VTEDIT macro is not available.
/ ' ' ' '
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Find position marker         !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! If /FIND specified, find the ~~/\~~      !
!FIND!
Q1&8"N @^A/Finding position marker...
/ @EW%% G* ^YX0 ^YK -1^X
:Q0"N :@FN%~~/\~~
%%U0 | :@F_%~~/\~~
%%U0 ' 0^X
Q0"U @^A/?Position marker not found?
/ ^C^C ' '
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
!   Restore caller's operating environment   !
! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - !
! All finished, restore context         !
!DONE!
J
]1
]0 Q0ET
]0 Q0ES
]0 Q0EU
]0 Q0ED
]0 Q0^X
]0 Q0^R
]0
]9
! 0,0XY (** added if we're in Y)      !
! Final double ESCape (** deleted if we're in Y)!



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Coyoty
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Coyoty » Mon Dec 01, 2014 9:20 pm UTC

English is the language equivalent of Ginen Tahnek or Swedish Meatballs. Each planet has some version of it.

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.DL
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby .DL » Tue Dec 02, 2014 8:15 pm UTC

Coyoty wrote:English is the language equivalent of Ginen Tahnek or Swedish Meatballs. Each planet has some version of it.

We need to look harder if so. I can't imagine the uproar in the scientific community if we found Mars's Swedish meatball. equivalent!

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Coyoty
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Coyoty » Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:15 pm UTC

.DL wrote:
Coyoty wrote:English is the language equivalent of Ginen Tahnek or Swedish Meatballs. Each planet has some version of it.

We need to look harder if so. I can't imagine the uproar in the scientific community if we found Mars's Swedish meatball. equivalent!


I should have said each planet with an intelligent species. Or maybe not. These things may not be signs of intelligence, but warning signs.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby drazen » Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:37 pm UTC

Imagine if a human introduced himself as high commander of the Earth fleet, and those aliens thereafter referred to our species, not our planet, as "the Earth"; like, four of us show up and they're like "four Earth are here to visit us". That's how stupid calling those aliens "the Asgard" are. They should be the goddamn Aesir goddamnit, and their planet or galaxy or somewhere should be called Asgard. But no, some stupid writer read Thor's lines from that first episode and thought "Asgard" was the name of their species and now we're stuck with it.


Well, the Asgard haven't been known to hide their annoyance with their human friends/allies. Hermoid and Kvasir come to mind as not being quite so patient as Thor was. Maybe what you say is one reason why?

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Neil_Boekend » Mon Dec 15, 2014 3:05 pm UTC

.DL wrote:
Coyoty wrote:English is the language equivalent of Ginen Tahnek or Swedish Meatballs. Each planet has some version of it.

We need to look harder if so. I can't imagine the uproar in the scientific community if we found Mars's Swedish meatball. equivalent!

That would just define it as a planet. However, imagine the uproar if we found them on Pluto?
Mikeski wrote:A "What If" update is never late. Nor is it early. It is posted precisely when it should be.

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he/him/his

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Coyoty » Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:57 pm UTC

Neil_Boekend wrote:
.DL wrote:
Coyoty wrote:English is the language equivalent of Ginen Tahnek or Swedish Meatballs. Each planet has some version of it.

We need to look harder if so. I can't imagine the uproar in the scientific community if we found Mars's Swedish meatball. equivalent!

That would just define it as a planet. However, imagine the uproar if we found them on Pluto?


No one expects the Swedish imposition.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Tyndmyr » Mon Dec 15, 2014 11:35 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote:Isn't this just a special case of the generic "Hollywood is full of people whose specialisations are in things like movie-making rather than the things they're making movies about, so the movies end up full of glaring inaccuracies that any expert in a vaguely related field could spot"?

What gets to me are the times when they have an expert on staff (or at least in the credits) and still screw things up...


Eh. With the chess example, even a non-expert should catch it. I do not play chess in any sort of serious capacity. I haven't played it in maybe five or ten years at ALL. I hate chess, in fact. But I'm not going to set up a chess board with an illegal state, because I know the rules to chess, and the initial board state. This isn't even hard.

I don't expect everything to fool absolutely everyone, but if I'm catching errors that are well outside of my specialties, then yeah, others are likely noticing them too.

And yeah, this is something you'd want to do BEFORE shooting. Set design, etc. Really, you just need one solid geek with a few relevant interests and the curiousity to google the rest.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Pfhorrest » Mon Dec 15, 2014 11:55 pm UTC

drazen wrote:
Imagine if a human introduced himself as high commander of the Earth fleet, and those aliens thereafter referred to our species, not our planet, as "the Earth"; like, four of us show up and they're like "four Earth are here to visit us". That's how stupid calling those aliens "the Asgard" are. They should be the goddamn Aesir goddamnit, and their planet or galaxy or somewhere should be called Asgard. But no, some stupid writer read Thor's lines from that first episode and thought "Asgard" was the name of their species and now we're stuck with it.

Well, the Asgard haven't been known to hide their annoyance with their human friends/allies. Hermoid and Kvasir come to mind as not being quite so patient as Thor was. Maybe what you say is one reason why?

I like that theory, but I'd have liked it more if it had been canonized; ok, the second Asgard-episode writer screwed up and had humans call them "Asgard" instead of "Aesir", but surely someone pointed out that mistake, and the next little grey man besides Thor to show up on screen could have corrected the humans, and given Thor a funny look — and Thor could explain that he didn't want to belittle us or seem condescending by harping on our mistakes, or something. We are, as the Nox like to say, "very young", after all.

Instead they just ignored it the whole time and now it's too late to fix it.
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby drazen » Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:58 am UTC

Pfhorrest wrote:
drazen wrote:
Imagine if a human introduced himself as high commander of the Earth fleet, and those aliens thereafter referred to our species, not our planet, as "the Earth"; like, four of us show up and they're like "four Earth are here to visit us". That's how stupid calling those aliens "the Asgard" are. They should be the goddamn Aesir goddamnit, and their planet or galaxy or somewhere should be called Asgard. But no, some stupid writer read Thor's lines from that first episode and thought "Asgard" was the name of their species and now we're stuck with it.

Well, the Asgard haven't been known to hide their annoyance with their human friends/allies. Hermoid and Kvasir come to mind as not being quite so patient as Thor was. Maybe what you say is one reason why?

I like that theory, but I'd have liked it more if it had been canonized; ok, the second Asgard-episode writer screwed up and had humans call them "Asgard" instead of "Aesir", but surely someone pointed out that mistake, and the next little grey man besides Thor to show up on screen could have corrected the humans, and given Thor a funny look — and Thor could explain that he didn't want to belittle us or seem condescending by harping on our mistakes, or something. We are, as the Nox like to say, "very young", after all.

Instead they just ignored it the whole time and now it's too late to fix it.


Agreed, although the Asgard galaxy in SG1/Atlantis was the Ida Galaxy, I think.

Now they're all dead
Spoiler:
other than the less ethical "Lost Tribe" in Pegasus
, so perhaps the show is based on "Wormhole X-Treme" type cataloguing of events. Or it happened off screen when the aliens argued about whether to ally with a species that couldn't bother to get their name right. It maybe it was a lost in translation thing. The "Asgard" had their own whisper language that was really just English sentences Michael Shanks spoke played backwards.

I do agree -- lost opportunity for getting it right and a bit of anthropological humor.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Coyoty » Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:36 pm UTC

"Thor tells me you keep calling us the Asgard..."
"Baldur, don't."
"You should be calling us the Aesir."
"The Eyesore?"
"No, Aesir."
"Icers?"
"AESIR."
"Erasers?"
"...Asgard is fine."
"I warned you."

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Pfhorrest » Thu Dec 18, 2014 2:42 am UTC

Actually, that raises an interesting point. The "ae" (really I should be writing "æ") in "Æsir" is pronounced the same as the "a" in "Asgard" (which should also really be written "Æsgard"), which is to say like the "a" in "at" or, well... "ass". Which is also what a singular æsir is called… an æs. Maybe the SG1 writers just didn't want all the humans to be calling Thor an ass all the time. Though honestly, that seems like humor right up their alley… they made great work with "Yu", "Ba'al", and so on.

So two clones and Thor beam into a Goa'uld stronghold, and suddenly Yu's got two Ba'als and an æs to deal with…
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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby orthogon » Thu Dec 18, 2014 9:35 am UTC

Tyndmyr wrote:
rmsgrey wrote:Isn't this just a special case of the generic "Hollywood is full of people whose specialisations are in things like movie-making rather than the things they're making movies about, so the movies end up full of glaring inaccuracies that any expert in a vaguely related field could spot"?

What gets to me are the times when they have an expert on staff (or at least in the credits) and still screw things up...


Eh. With the chess example, even a non-expert should catch it. I do not play chess in any sort of serious capacity. I haven't played it in maybe five or ten years at ALL. I hate chess, in fact. But I'm not going to set up a chess board with an illegal state, because I know the rules to chess, and the initial board state. This isn't even hard.

I don't expect everything to fool absolutely everyone, but if I'm catching errors that are well outside of my specialties, then yeah, others are likely noticing them too.

And yeah, this is something you'd want to do BEFORE shooting. Set design, etc. Really, you just need one solid geek with a few relevant interests and the curiousity to google the rest.

I finally got around to seeing The Imitation Game last night, and there's this scene where Keira Knightley suggests they use "Yooler's equation". Mathematicians: is there such a thing? Or is it possible that the script said "Euler's equation"?
xtifr wrote:... and orthogon merely sounds undecided.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby brenok » Thu Dec 18, 2014 11:39 am UTC

orthogon wrote:I finally got around to seeing The Imitation Game last night, and there's this scene where Keira Knightley suggests they use "Yooler's equation". Mathematicians: is there such a thing? Or is it possible that the script said "Euler's equation"?

Is that a question or a rhetorical question?

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby orthogon » Thu Dec 18, 2014 12:03 pm UTC

brenok wrote:
orthogon wrote:I finally got around to seeing The Imitation Game last night, and there's this scene where Keira Knightley suggests they use "Yooler's equation". Mathematicians: is there such a thing? Or is it possible that the script said "Euler's equation"?

Is that a question or a rhetorical question?

Which question? The first was genuine: I didn't want to assume that, just because I, a mere engineer, hadn't heard of Yooler's equation, that didn't mean that there was no such equation. The second, as I phrased it, I guess was rhetorical, in that there's clearly a non-zero possibility that the script said "Euler's", that Knightley pronounced it wrong, and that nobody on set or at the pre-screening noticed this. I should have said "is it in fact the case that...", though that's not a question that mathematicians in general could address.
xtifr wrote:... and orthogon merely sounds undecided.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby rmsgrey » Thu Dec 18, 2014 1:21 pm UTC

orthogon wrote:
brenok wrote:
orthogon wrote:I finally got around to seeing The Imitation Game last night, and there's this scene where Keira Knightley suggests they use "Yooler's equation". Mathematicians: is there such a thing? Or is it possible that the script said "Euler's equation"?

Is that a question or a rhetorical question?

Which question? The first was genuine: I didn't want to assume that, just because I, a mere engineer, hadn't heard of Yooler's equation, that didn't mean that there was no such equation. The second, as I phrased it, I guess was rhetorical, in that there's clearly a non-zero possibility that the script said "Euler's", that Knightley pronounced it wrong, and that nobody on set or at the pre-screening noticed this. I should have said "is it in fact the case that...", though that's not a question that mathematicians in general could address.

Euler's equation would make sense in context. It is, of course, possible that an anglicised (mis-)pronunciation of Euler's name was current at the time, and Keira was actually being more authentic than if she'd said "Oiler's equation".

On the other hand, it seems more plausible that it's just another detail they didn't bother to get right rather than that they researched that one fact while ignoring/distorting so many others...

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby Andries » Sun Feb 01, 2015 8:43 am UTC

I am not allowed to post links yet(it's my first post (hi there!)), but ... there is an excellent blog called Typeset in the Future which obsessively analyses the background screens in Alien, Moon and 2001. They actually seem to have been done carefully and with attention to the plot details. Check it out. 8-)
Last edited by Andries on Sun Feb 01, 2015 7:23 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1451: "Background Screens"

Postby da Doctah » Sun Feb 01, 2015 4:37 pm UTC

orthogon wrote:I finally got around to seeing The Imitation Game last night, and there's this scene where Keira Knightley suggests they use "Yooler's equation". Mathematicians: is there such a thing? Or is it possible that the script said "Euler's equation"?


She'd probably just finished reading Oyclid's Elements.


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