0507: "Experimentation"

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Nasaniaru
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby Nasaniaru » Sat Nov 22, 2008 5:58 am UTC

For a reaction to the comic, I was so involved in the logistics of what was going on, I felt that either I was too dumber than the comics intended audience or it just didn't work. I trust in Randall enough that I'm willing to side with the former rather than the later.

As for my reaction to the reactions that this comic has sparked, I believe that this girl was experimenting with her sexuality in a way that totally denies any hard feelings between the two parties so if she wanted to experiment with the entire school population, go for it.

Be prepared to be offended:
Spoiler:
And seriously, homophobia in the xkcd fandom, I thought this comic was aimed at an enlightened bunch of people who value logic over the uneasiness of the unknown. If you fear what you don't understand, than apply the Scientific Method until you do understand and if you never understand it, then at least you'll be a better person for it.
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby phlip » Sat Nov 22, 2008 6:15 am UTC

... Aside from the one obvious troll, I haven't seen any homophobia in the thread...

Some "sexually active women is eww", unfortunately yes, but no homophobia.

Code: Select all

enum ಠ_ಠ {°□°╰=1, °Д°╰, ಠ益ಠ╰};
void ┻━┻︵​╰(ಠ_ಠ ⚠) {exit((int)⚠);}
[he/him/his]

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby Nasaniaru » Sat Nov 22, 2008 6:32 am UTC

Yeah, that was probably a reference to the troll. I was sort of lazy and didn't go back to re-read the posts before I submitted my post. I apologize.
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby nescalona » Sat Nov 22, 2008 10:09 am UTC

nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.


Kalos wrote:Obvious trolling is obvious.


Lord Aurora wrote:
neurosci_queen wrote:What's wrong with either?


OH DEAR GOD DON'T FEED THE TROLLS



OH NOOOOOO TOO LAAAAAAAAAAAAATE


ARRRRGHHHHHHHHH


Because anyone who believes homosexuality is wrong is automatically a troll? WTF?
Disagree with me, but don't label me and dismiss me. To an extent I expected irritated responses, but not this.

I just wish Randall would lay off the culture war, if he can't take the right side.

@Lord Aurora: LORD FORBID someone discuss opinions contrary to yours!

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby nescalona » Sat Nov 22, 2008 10:17 am UTC

phlip wrote:... Aside from the one obvious troll, I haven't seen any homophobia in the thread...

Some "sexually active women is eww", unfortunately yes, but no homophobia.


Believing that homosexuality is aberrant is not homophobia.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby yaPete » Sat Nov 22, 2008 11:16 am UTC

nescalona wrote:
phlip wrote:... Aside from the one obvious troll, I haven't seen any homophobia in the thread...


Believing that homosexuality is aberrant is not homophobia.


I saw the results the other day of a YouGov survey into a wide range of topics[1], one of which related to homosexuality. In general, the results by age-band were what you might expect, with tolerance decreasing with age. However, I was surprised at first to see the youngest age-bracket was *less* tolerant than the next one up. I put it down to many people treating the thing as an abstract, not yet having actually, y'know, *met* a happy, stable, and above all *normal* couple who just happen to be gay.

Nick's profile says he's 16. Just sayin'.

Pete

[1] It was one of their occasional surveys where they ask their respondent panel to suggest questions, so it's a bit of a random collection of themes and is not commissioned by any particular group or cause.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby ThemePark » Sat Nov 22, 2008 12:12 pm UTC

neurosci_queen wrote:
william wrote:
nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.

Homosexuality is faster than light?


Homosexuality isn't, but some of the guys are, if you know what I mean. ;-)

Aaaaaaaaaaand neurosci_queen wins the thread! :D
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby Cynical Idealist » Sat Nov 22, 2008 11:47 pm UTC

neurosci_queen wrote:
nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.


What's wrong with either?

They're going faster than light, and we just can't have that.

nescalona wrote:I just wish Randall would lay off the culture war, if he can't take the right side.

@Lord Aurora: LORD FORBID someone discuss opinions contrary to yours!


The irony here is staggering.
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby nescalona » Sat Nov 22, 2008 11:49 pm UTC

So first I'm called a troll, but now that's cleared up, and we need to dig around in my profile to shoot the messenger?

It's an interesting point, demographically, but it doesn't have much to do with anything I've said.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby nescalona » Sat Nov 22, 2008 11:58 pm UTC

@Cynical Idealist: You're right, you caught me, I didn't even see that. In responding to Lord Aurora I was trying to pretend I saw the two sides to the topic as equivalent opinions for the purposes of that comment, though I don't consider them equal.

But if you think about it this way: Lord Aurora is probably more of a relativist than I, in the sense of "You might think it's wrong, but it's right for them. There's not really any such thing as truth." In that way, I was simply showing the contradiction in that ideology.

I realize that's kind of weak, but what I said earlier came from irritation, that someone would use caps lock to call me a troll and express anguish that I had even been responded to. I support open discussion of the two sides here, but a webcomic is not a forum for discussion: the pro-homosexuality side chosen is simply displayed as fact for all to see.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby 4=5 » Sun Nov 23, 2008 12:12 am UTC

You were called a troll because you quacked like a troll, and may or may not be lighter than a troll. (and not to be rude but double posting isn't encouraged)

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby dean.menezes » Sun Nov 23, 2008 1:15 am UTC

4=5 wrote:You were called a troll because you quacked like a troll, and may or may not be lighter than a troll. (and not to be rude but double posting isn't encouraged)

They were replies to different posts. There was one reply to each post.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby SocialSceneRepairman » Sun Nov 23, 2008 1:33 am UTC

Frankly, I still think you're a troll, although you've improved in subtlety since your first post, and I should say why.

A: With all the gay jokes and allusions in XKCD, you still chose this strip to call Randall out, and act surprised that the strip takes the position it's taken for years.
B: Your use of the phrase "culture wars," which has long since been appropriated by the left as a term of derision.
C: Expecting an ally in the "culture wars" from a webcomic set in Cambridge. Honestly. Have you ever read a right-wing editorial?
D: The obvious contradiction - moral relativism or no - in saying the "pro-homosexual side is stated as fact," when, throughout, providing no argument whatsoever for your side.

In short, being unconvinced you mean what you say, I don't plan to acknowledge you further, and I would discourage others from doing so (even by responding openly to this post...well, unless you disagree with the thesis, of course).

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby aggrav8d » Sun Nov 23, 2008 7:25 am UTC

nothing is faster than light. not even torturing royalty. but maybe homosexuality is similar to light in other ways. this may explain the "gay rainbow" effect.

Personally, I prefer a girl with experience. Don't have to be all lovey and patient and teach her to get over herself. Just have fun!

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby Handie » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:34 am UTC

I loved this cartoon.
I too never had any problem with my girfriends past lesbian experiments...
I say "had" because she did ultimately leave me for another girl...
C'est la vie.

I disagree with some of the sentiment stated about "homosexuality FTL".
I am a firm believer in "what ever makes you happy".
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby setzer777 » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:40 am UTC

nescalona wrote:
nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.


Kalos wrote:Obvious trolling is obvious.


Lord Aurora wrote:
neurosci_queen wrote:What's wrong with either?


OH DEAR GOD DON'T FEED THE TROLLS



OH NOOOOOO TOO LAAAAAAAAAAAAATE


ARRRRGHHHHHHHHH


Because anyone who believes homosexuality is wrong is automatically a troll? WTF?
Disagree with me, but don't label me and dismiss me. To an extent I expected irritated responses, but not this.

I just wish Randall would lay off the culture war, if he can't take the right side.



Even given that stance, this hardly seems like the individual comic to push back against. I mean it isn't exactly some sort of strong endorsement of homosexuality or condemnation of those who oppose it, it's just telling a joke. Do you find homosexuality so abhorrent that featuring it in a joke that doesn't condemn it is a problem? I'm especially confused when you mention the promiscuity - the whole point of the joke is that it makes the guy uncomfortable, and that's presented as a normal reaction - how is that some sort of endorsement in the "culture war"?

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby Kyo » Sun Nov 23, 2008 8:06 pm UTC

I didn't think this one was all that funny, but it's ok.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby Kalos » Sun Nov 23, 2008 8:28 pm UTC

nescalona wrote:Because anyone who believes homosexuality is wrong is automatically a troll? WTF?
Disagree with me, but don't label me and dismiss me. To an extent I expected irritated responses, but not this.

No, somebody who posts something in order to create hostility or drama (along with the txt-speak abbreviations) without any real care of discussion and then keeps up some butthurt whining of playing the victim after making a statement that would easily offend any promiscuous or homosexual individual is a troll. And since my assessment of what you're statement was going to do happened in full, I would say that my original hypothesis of obvious troll being obvious was obviously correct.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby Flesh_Of_The_Fallen_Angel » Mon Nov 24, 2008 1:38 am UTC

Jongpil Yun wrote:That would seriously creep me out. Does she have a table of the penis size / cup size for all of her samples? That'd be interesting to see.

All those penises and breasts or the chart? . . . if you say the chart . . . wow . . . that would make me pay attention in class whenever there are charts on the board . . . :mrgreen:

Jongpil Yun wrote:Similar to the earlier comic with the "I have licked your daughter's nipples" quip, I get an "another man has ejaculated in this orifice" reaction at inopportune moments. I don't even like letting other people borrow my stuff. :evil:

another man has ejaculated in this orifice? . . . what? Recently? As in, its still there? . . . If not, you need to go and stop being such a . . . what's the word? . . . normal person? . . . Yeah! Stop being such a normal person! :P :mrgreen:

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby HeartOfFocus » Mon Nov 24, 2008 4:23 am UTC

AHAHAHAHAHA.

Personal fave.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby vodka.cobra » Mon Nov 24, 2008 7:51 am UTC

vodka.cobra wrote:Yeah. You say that now, but then we'll have 30 pages of people bickering over California's Proposition 8.

Well, I was wrong.
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby BrainMagMo » Mon Nov 24, 2008 8:12 am UTC

rwald wrote:
phlip wrote:
glasnt wrote:I'm worried if they do any quality checks on the subjects interaction.

I'm more worried about whether she did any double-blind trials.

My thoughts exactly...I mean, c'mon, this is harder to blind than an acupuncture study*. That is, unless dildo technology has advanced far beyond my own knowledge of the field...

*Not just a study which seeks to find if the specific points are important, but a study which looks at whether putting needles anywhere has any effect.

But double blind studies would not be effective in this case, since we are testing for the scientist's bias.
However, even single blind studies would be hard thus.

Also, "the entire sophomore class" = biased sample much?

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby wasp » Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:26 am UTC

nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.


I utterly disagree with and have no respect for your point of view, but your comment, along with my homework about AIDS, made me think of the untold side of this story.

What are the chances that guy is free from any STDs? Pretty bleak, I'd say.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby TheKrikkitWars » Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:58 am UTC

RockoTDF wrote:And also the captionthingy says "low sigma" which is a phrase never used when discussing error in psychology or sociology, although it means the same thing.


In pure (and unadulterated) statistics*, a phrase such as "low sigma" or "small sigma value" is normally used.

*which is maths really
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby abehrens » Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:32 pm UTC

nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.

Homosexuality is "for the lads"? For the lasses too, clearly.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby fresh » Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:46 pm UTC

neurosci_queen wrote:
fresh wrote:
neurosci_queen wrote:
Diadem wrote:This one definitely brought a smile to my face.


Though one has to wonder exactly what the guy's problem with it is. It's only good if she's that experienced, isn' it?


Not really. Men (not that I"m one of them, but I have noticed that they) tend to want innocence and stuff in girls. Men like in XKCD don't want whoreish girls, and besides, woudln't it be kind of weird to think of all the girls AND guys in your school, and in your year, have slept/experimented with your girlfriend? I dunno, I'd find it kind of creepy. And I think he did too.

Though we all have to admit, girl on girl action in XKCD is hawt. :P

yeah I agree. it doesn't matter how "cool" you want to be with a girls' sexual history, or how open-minded you are, it's still something that can bug you when it's right in your face. I think a lot of guys don't talk about it because it seems judgmental, but it's not like you choose to feel weirded out by it.


Probably has something to do with evolution. If you're the only one who's having sexwith the girl, and only one who ever has, you have a better chance that that girl will have your offspring, and not some other bloke's.

But then, men are supposed to copulate and reproduce often, so that they can "spread their seed", so to speak, and have as many little versions of themselves as they can.

Probably why, even in today's society, it's ok for a guy to be a " playa' ", but a girl is considered a skank or a whore.

Though it's kind of a win-lose scenario, because if girls are chaste, who do the guys reproduce with? XD

could be. my hypothesis is that:

1. the negative feeling towards a girl's past is based in morality
2. morals evolved because we survive better living in tribes
3. women couldn't be providers and caretakers if they were fucking all the time and neglecting their children/producing too many children, etc.

but of course men still have the sexual predator inside them, which probably predates tribal living. so we don't have negative emotions associated with our own promiscuity. fortunately most of us are aware that our feelings of right and wrong don't always correlate with what is actually right and wrong.

but no, I haven't thought about this at all... :wink:

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby setzer777 » Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:50 pm UTC

fresh wrote:
1. the negative feeling towards a girl's past is based in morality
2. morals evolved because we survive better living in tribes
3. women couldn't be providers and caretakers if they were fucking all the time and neglecting their children/producing too many children, etc.

but of course men still have the sexual predator inside them, which probably predates tribal living. so we don't have negative emotions associated with our own promiscuity. fortunately most of us are aware that our feelings of right and wrong don't always correlate with what is actually right and wrong.

but no, I haven't thought about this at all... :wink:


Hm...makes sense. Though it doesn't seem nearly as universally ingrained as a lot of morality. I don't care at all about a woman's past promiscuity, and it seems like there are a lot of guys who don't either. I wonder why some people care about it so much more than others. Is the difference just in upbringing?
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby skatcat31 » Tue Nov 25, 2008 2:19 am UTC

Since control group can only be aware of another control group, there are four possibilities for control groups:
Gay girls control group(hot)
Gay Guys control group(Hot for some, not me, except for rule 643y(ghey)of the internet)
Straight Guys control group
Straight Girls control group

So of these possibilities she belongs to two, gay girls only, straight girls only.
In essence, this test would require around 4!/(4-1)! groups, so in other words, it would be the 24/6, or four possibilities of groups she could ACTUALLY belong too(assume SRS), in which she can be gay, bi, striaght, or straight (include herms as straight or bi, either or, doesn't change the experiment). So she has a fifty percent chance of being straight, a 25% chance of being gay, and a 25% chance of being bi. So in this, we must also assume she has a 150% chance of being a hermaphrodite(50%+25%+25%+50%). And.... And....

CONGRATULATIONS!!!! You are dating a lesbian!!!!!! NO MATTER HOW YOU LOOK AT IT!!!... Or you are BHG(take your pick, see otehr post here: http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=30682&start=120

Congratulations, the mobius strip that is the internets strikes again!
I think, without a doubt, I have proven that XKCD is a ghey tranvestite that isalso straight, but a hermaphrodite. Congratulations internets, your mobiusstrip strikes again.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby SocialSceneRepairman » Tue Nov 25, 2008 5:30 pm UTC

I'm going to guess there wasn't a "gay guys" or "straight girls" control group. Or a "gay girls" control group, for that matter. It's possible control groups A and B differed in the emotional intimacy of the relationship? It'd have to be blind for the A-group, though...

And, oh yeah...huh?

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby skatcat31 » Tue Nov 25, 2008 6:16 pm UTC

SocialSceneRepairman wrote:I'm going to guess there wasn't a "gay guys" or "straight girls" control group. Or a "gay girls" control group, for that matter. It's possible control groups A and B differed in the emotional intimacy of the relationship? It'd have to be blind for the A-group, though...

And, oh yeah...huh?

Ah but that for an SRS would phail hard, for you aren't testing all control group possibilities, only a few. And since it's gay experimentation, it would also have to be assumed that the entire group would be of one gender. Otherwise it wouldn't be gay experimentation, just a huge SRS orgy. And then you would have hte mixed groups, lesb/straightfem, gay/straightmen and see how those groups would react differently as apposed to the other controls.

Also did someone edit my post? Cause it said man instead of lesbian...
I think, without a doubt, I have proven that XKCD is a ghey tranvestite that isalso straight, but a hermaphrodite. Congratulations internets, your mobiusstrip strikes again.

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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby neurosci_queen » Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:33 pm UTC

nescalona wrote:
nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.


Kalos wrote:Obvious trolling is obvious.


Lord Aurora wrote:
neurosci_queen wrote:What's wrong with either?


OH DEAR GOD DON'T FEED THE TROLLS



OH NOOOOOO TOO LAAAAAAAAAAAAATE


ARRRRGHHHHHHHHH


Because anyone who believes homosexuality is wrong is automatically a troll? WTF?
Disagree with me, but don't label me and dismiss me. To an extent I expected irritated responses, but not this.

I just wish Randall would lay off the culture war, if he can't take the right side.

@Lord Aurora: LORD FORBID someone discuss opinions contrary to yours!


How do you define "the right side"? Just because it's your side? That's a little egocentric. There is no empirical way to determine the "right side" of any debate if you're in the middle of it. I understand, of course, that you're going to automatically think you are right, but you should not assume that just because you take that for granted, the rest of us do.
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Re: "Experimentation" Discussion

Postby skatcat31 » Wed Nov 26, 2008 5:56 am UTC

neurosci_queen wrote:
nescalona wrote:
nescalona wrote:Not funny. Homosexuality FTL. Also promiscuity in general FTL even more.


Kalos wrote:Obvious trolling is obvious.


Lord Aurora wrote:
neurosci_queen wrote:What's wrong with either?


OH DEAR GOD DON'T FEED THE TROLLS



OH NOOOOOO TOO LAAAAAAAAAAAAATE


ARRRRGHHHHHHHHH


Because anyone who believes homosexuality is wrong is automatically a troll? WTF?
Disagree with me, but don't label me and dismiss me. To an extent I expected irritated responses, but not this.

I just wish Randall would lay off the culture war, if he can't take the right side.

@Lord Aurora: LORD FORBID someone discuss opinions contrary to yours!


How do you define "the right side"? Just because it's your side? That's a little egocentric. There is no empirical way to determine the "right side" of any debate if you're in the middle of it. I understand, of course, that you're going to automatically think you are right, but you should not assume that just because you take that for granted, the rest of us do.

He most likely stands on a biblical upbringing. You probably were a little more laxly brought up. What his belief is is his belief, it does not make him right, or wrong. And it's protected by the first ammendmant. I don't care what anyone's beliefs are, just that they hold them. So if his belief is to think homosexuality is wrong, hurray for him. I don't agree. But let's also wonder how many people believe being a furry is wrong. Should I point the obvious reference to the comic? They like what they like. If we don't, THEN STFU! you can't change a person's beliefs, even if you disagree with them. If you ask me, this USA presidential election was a complete crockery of BS. You don't like it? Tough. This election was about change. But were we ever told what the change would be? Not really.. I mean we kinda have an idea... But then why is Clinton's cabinet in there? And is anyone else afraid of Obama's shadow cabinet other then just me? I mean come on, anti american wife, anti-american backers, terrorist backers(or whatever the fuck they were), I don't care, I don't like them. Granted palin isn't much better. What did she do extrodinary? She told Russia to go fuck itself instead of getting it to lower oil prices by delaying offshore drilling for awhile. And also, Russia is like the USA's phucking neighbor right?

So wow, I have my belief. You're going ot tell me I'm wrong about that too eh? Well should I also inform you of my hate of beaners? (Not mexicans, mexicans are cool.) Should I tell you my other beliefs so that, because of your conflicting beliefs i believe are wrong, you're going ot tell me my beliefs are wrong? Mobius strips anyone? The internet feels really good when anonymity is rammed up your friggin ass.
</endrant>
EDIT: sorry not wrong, but egocentric for holding them.
I think, without a doubt, I have proven that XKCD is a ghey tranvestite that isalso straight, but a hermaphrodite. Congratulations internets, your mobiusstrip strikes again.


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