0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

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0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby Qaanol » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:00 am UTC

Image
http://xkcd.com/820/
Title: “Dear Wiccan readers: I understand modern Wiccans are not usually all about the curses and hexes. But Darth Vader was recently converted from Episcopalianism and he's still figuring it all out.”

These are pretty good, especially considering. I hope things work out okay for Randall. I especially like the Blacklightsaber.
Last edited by Qaanol on Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:08 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby LucasBrown » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:00 am UTC

<Duplicate content removed>

GOOMHR--I've had the Imperial March in my head for the past three days... but the associated mental images involved Vader on a diving board.

EDIT: Thread-ninja'd
Last edited by LucasBrown on Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:12 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby glasnt » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:02 am UTC

Winning thread! HI JOEE!



<3 Blacklight Saber :D

And the Glowing. And Trick or Treat. And Bailout.

So much goodness <3

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby solarion » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:04 am UTC

Okay, unlike yesterday's I don't think any of these are quite filled in enough to be regular strips.

This however does not make them particularly less awesome. I'm going to have all my food-related events dramatised like this in my Made-for-TV life story.

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby QuiteJaughty » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:04 am UTC

HI GLASNT!
Okay, yes, someone seriously needs to explain what's up with that.
I also declare this the winning thread.
Does anyone else find these five-minute comics to actually be incredibly witty?

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby Atrus » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:05 am UTC

Posting to say that I laughed embarrassingly hard at "Bail out!" Randall is pretty good when he's off the cuff, though I hope his family situation improves.

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby black_hat_guy » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:06 am UTC

Darth Vader was Episcopal?
Billy was a chemist.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby Eternal Density » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:11 am UTC

I liked the 'bail out' one. It burnt my cheese.

I thought it was the Presbyterian Church...
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=backs ... ian+church
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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby eleniy86 » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:13 am UTC

QuiteJaughty wrote:Does anyone else find these five-minute comics to actually be incredibly witty?



i do! :D

the halloween one made me chuckle :)

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby cjmcjmcjmcjm » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:15 am UTC

HI JOEE!

Not as funny as part 1
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby cjmcjmcjmcjm » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:16 am UTC

Holy crap, backlights really suck if you're wearing black
frezik wrote:Anti-photons move at the speed of dark

DemonDeluxe wrote:Paying to have laws written that allow you to do what you want, is a lot cheaper than paying off the judge every time you want to get away with something shady.

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby black_hat_guy » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:18 am UTC

Ambrose Bierce wrote:Cogito cogito ergo cogito sum.
Billy was a chemist.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby DreadArchon » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:29 am UTC

Blacklightsaber and Halloween were great.

Would it be in bad taste to joke about lightly poisoning Randall's family members every time we want a change of pace?

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby Steve the Pocket » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:35 am UTC

Eternal Density wrote:I liked the 'bail out' one. It burnt my cheese.

I thought it was the Presbyterian Church...
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=backs ... ian+church

Well. It looks like somebody just won the thread.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby Kaijyuu » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:37 am UTC

I never knew babies go "plop" when they um, fall out.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby s0merand0mdude » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:41 am UTC

Is it weird that the sandwich strip is now my favorite comedic XKCD moment?
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby primetime » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:43 am UTC

we get it. someone is sick. how many times do you have to say it?

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby ysth » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:49 am UTC

Can someone explain Bailout?
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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby sugarhyped » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:55 am UTC

I laughed at the dramatization of sandwich making and the wiccan disclaimer.
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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby ElectronicFerret » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:04 am UTC

I laughed at the sandwich comic.

I'm not even sure why. I just lol'd. I think it's because I vaguely recall some youtube video with this premise.

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby H.H » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:13 am UTC

OK, I'll bite the bullet.



Reconstructed religion, anyone have any opinions about them?

Personally, I believe that religion is based on esoteric knowledge transmitted orally by the elite, alongside general community traditions. Meaning, modern Wicca is not a religion, any more than an atheistic form of Buddhism that renounces the cult of Siddhartha Gautama is a religion or the belief that democracy is the best political system of the present era is a religion.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby atomfullerene » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:24 am UTC

I mean, Mormonism is supposedly reconstructed true Christianity, and it is quite clearly a religion. So you can have reconstructed religions. My take is that something is a religion if enough people think of it as one. Also I think modern society lacks a category for things like "Life Philosophies"--things which share some characteristics with religions, but are different from them. Roman society had Stoicism and Epicurianism, to name a couple, and I think there is an increasing trend towards this sort of thing reappearing in the modern world. A suite of new age beliefs would be one example, the skeptical humanist bunch another. Some forms of Wicca might as well.

Edit: Considering the central importance of TEXTS to a number of religions, I'm not sure oral tradition is the defining characteristic of a religion.

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby JohnTheWysard » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:25 am UTC

ysth wrote:Can someone explain Bailout?


Like bailing the water out of a boat. Not a wordplay I'd ever thought of...

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby TanManDown » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:27 am UTC

ElectronicFerret wrote:I laughed at the sandwich comic.

I'm not even sure why. I just lol'd. I think it's because I vaguely recall some youtube video with this premise.


I don't know if this was the video you were thinking of, but I really hope it's the one that Randall was. Because that would be totally awesome.

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby ijuin » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:30 am UTC

ysth wrote:Can someone explain Bailout?


In aircraft terminology, "bailing out" is to jump out of a plane that is no longer flyable (though one uses the term "ejecting" if one employs ejection seats). However, in marine terminology, "bailing out" refers to using a bucket or pump to remove water that has entered your boat. Thus, the pun comes from the air crew bailing out their airplane as though it were a boat as opposed to abandoning it (the usual meaning of "bail out" for airplanes).

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby nqdp » Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:35 am UTC

That is not a dramatization. All sandwiches should be made with a vengeance. SMITE THE BREAD WITH A MIGHTY BLOW!

Anyways, back to my mundane life reading webcomics, the bailing one was great.

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby willpellmn » Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:03 am UTC

Part 1 kinda sucked, but Part 2 was awesome. I'd love to see some of these ideas revisited with Randal's usual high-quality artistic style :twisted: when he's no longer up to his crotch in harsh reality.

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby H.H » Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:06 am UTC

Your definition of religion, or rather the grey area the standard definition and the definition of philosophy, in particular in the realm of metaphysical belief system, might make the following statement true:

-Tolkienism is a religion.

For the mainstream academia, this will sound absurd. It will certainly sound absurd to Tolkien himself, who has created his now famous legendarium as an academic research into etymology and Germanic morpho-syntax following Saussurian principals, and with it infused plot elements from different mythical sagas, as well as original stories.

atomfullerene wrote:Considering the central importance of TEXTS to a number of religions, I'm not sure oral tradition is the defining characteristic of a religion.


Most religions in the history of humankind did not have a written tradition. Furthermore, ethnography can attest to the fact that even in the 20th century, most religions (disregarding community size) lacked written traditions.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby arjadre » Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:15 am UTC

Conjure has an e. How dare Randall not achieve perfect spelling in a 5-minute comic strip!

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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby sje46 » Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:22 am UTC

He's really clever on his feet. I think this should be a regular feature....every Friday he should do a bunch of five minute comics. Or something.
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Re: 0820: “Five-Minute Comics: Part 2”

Postby MicroFarad » Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:23 am UTC

Some of these are actually better than your regular XKCD. I want to see more crud out of his notebooks. What about you?

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby Stanistani » Wed Nov 17, 2010 7:51 am UTC

Thank you everyone.

I now can't stop thinking about reconstituted religions - just add holy water.

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby Ghona » Wed Nov 17, 2010 8:22 am UTC

Wait a second. The canonical sect corresponding to the Jedi is the Presbyterian church.

I think that Randall's going to feel a lot of backstroke because of this comic. A reaction he certainly do not want.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby NæturVindur » Wed Nov 17, 2010 8:59 am UTC

Dear Randall,

As a Wiccan who regularly reads your comic, I most thoroughly enjoyed your piece on Vader.

Then I read the title text, and quite possibly woke my neighbors with my laughter. I hope you don't mind, but I performed a small ceremony to return a bit of that happiness to you in your need. <3

-NæturVindur

p.s. H.H, you have an absolutely ridiculous definition of religion. That does not seem to be founded on anything other than a popular view on popular religions. I understand that it is a difficult thing to define as each separate culture tends to have their own definition of hat is and is not a religion. However there are some mostly universal commonalities; they are worldviews of a spiritual (or undetectable by normal senses/means) nature that makes distinctions between sacred and mundane things or ideas, try to describe some ultimate or grand truth, and thereby support a system of morals. This would mean that wicca is a religion, as is Tolkeinism (and the academics I've talked to would probably stand behind that) and Jedism (who have a remarkably strong following).

Also, however much the fluffies would love to disagree, Wicca is not a reconstructed religion. Most of the religion is based on very new ideas of mythology, and the original works is based on various materials, that are of questionable factuality at best. Wicca is a very new religion.

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby SEE » Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:26 am UTC

Eternal Density wrote:I thought it was the Presbyterian Church...
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=backs ... ian+church


Nope, very definitely Episcopalian. He's even on an Episcopal cathedral: http://www.nationalcathedral.org/about/darthVader.shtml

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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby H.H » Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:30 am UTC

NæturVindur wrote:Dear Randall,

As a Wiccan who regularly reads your comic, I most thoroughly enjoyed your piece on Vader.

Then I read the title text, and quite possibly woke my neighbors with my laughter. I hope you don't mind, but I performed a small ceremony to return a bit of that happiness to you in your need. <3

-NæturVindur

p.s. H.H, you have an absolutely ridiculous definition of religion. That does not seem to be founded on anything other than a popular view on popular religions. I understand that it is a difficult thing to define as each separate culture tends to have their own definition of hat is and is not a religion. However there are some mostly universal commonalities; they are worldviews of a spiritual (or undetectable by normal senses/means) nature that makes distinctions between sacred and mundane things or ideas, try to describe some ultimate or grand truth, and thereby support a system of morals. This would mean that wicca is a religion, as is Tolkeinism (and the academics I've talked to would probably stand behind that) and Jedism (who have a remarkably strong following).

Also, however much the fluffies would love to disagree, Wicca is not a reconstructed religion. Most of the religion is based on very new ideas of mythology, and the original works is based on various materials, that are of questionable factuality at best. Wicca is a very new religion.


Most of my ideas, stated in a previous post, were the results of courses on anthropology, general comparative religion, world history, Roman history, Greek history, East-Asian history, Christianity, Philosophy (Ethics, Metaphysics, Ontology, etc).

As such, I specifically stated that I was referring to mainstream academia. Post modern views of religion (meaning, disregarding the environmental aspects) state that liberalism and communism, as well as the firm belief that one random individual is shorter than a second individual (even if proven by physical measurements to be the case), shared by a community over the course of more than a generation, are all defined as religions.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby NæturVindur » Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:54 am UTC

H.H wrote:Most of my ideas, stated in a previous post, were the results of courses on anthropology, general comparative religion, world history, Roman history, Greek history, East-Asian history, Christianity, Philosophy (Ethics, Metaphysics, Ontology, etc).

As such, I specifically stated that I was referring to mainstream academia. Post modern views of religion (meaning, disregarding the environmental aspects) state that liberalism and communism, as well as the firm belief that one random individual is shorter than a second individual (even if proven by physical measurements to be the case), shared by a community over the course of more than a generation, are all defined as religions.

Ah, so we have a somewhat similar academic background. My definition was primarily taken from Anthropological studies of religion, as part of working towards my degree in anthropology, and somewhat from my studies towards my psychology degree.

So, our definitions overlap in most places (sorry for being so strong in my previous post, debating at 3am is not really the best idea ever), except for the idea of specifically elite persons passing on the religion. While many religions have some form of authority figure, such as a priest, this is not the way that religions are passed on, especially in our present post-industrial society. Our worldviews are mostly influenced by our parents and peers, with authorities taking a minor role. Most people today in our culture, the out of which came wicca, is highly characterized by eclecticism, which is in direct contrast to the teachings of most religious authorities.

Beyond that I don't see how your definition excludes wicca as a religion. Wicca is a set of esoteric knowledge transmitted orally (and textually), along side the traditions of a certain community. While wicca may hold some traditions that are only shared by those of the pagan community, that is a community none the less. If you insist that the community must be on the large scale involving everyone in a large scale culture, 1) you run into problems defining the boundaries of your culture and 2) you would exclude practices such as Catholicism from being a religion, which would not mesh with mainstream academia.

ETA: Wait, even if we include the need for elit persons to pass on religions, wicca has them. We don;t have a centralized organization, but we certainly have elites. Most covens will have a high priest and/or priestess which act as the organizers and teachers of the coven. Also, we have culturally defined elites, those who have spoken loudly enough to get everyone to listen. They're not given official titles beyond a high priest/ess, but they do act as higher ups who got there specifically because they are passing on the religion. (These people include Laurie Cabot, Starhawk, and, sadly, Silver RavenWolf.) So, what is there left to exclude wicca as a religion?
Last edited by NæturVindur on Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:08 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby H.H » Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:06 am UTC

NæturVindur wrote:
H.H wrote:Most of my ideas, stated in a previous post, were the results of courses on anthropology, general comparative religion, world history, Roman history, Greek history, East-Asian history, Christianity, Philosophy (Ethics, Metaphysics, Ontology, etc).

As such, I specifically stated that I was referring to mainstream academia. Post modern views of religion (meaning, disregarding the environmental aspects) state that liberalism and communism, as well as the firm belief that one random individual is shorter than a second individual (even if proven by physical measurements to be the case), shared by a community over the course of more than a generation, are all defined as religions.

Ah, so we have a somewhat similar academic background. My definition was primarily taken from Anthropological studies of religion, as part of working towards my degree in anthropology, and somewhat from my studies towards my psychology degree.

So, our definitions overlap in most places (sorry for being so strong in my previous post, debating at 3am is not really the best idea ever), except for the idea of specifically elite persons passing on the religion. While many religions have some form of authority figure, such as a priest, this is not the way that religions are passed on, especially in our present post-industrial society. Our worldviews are mostly influenced by our parents and peers, with authorities taking a minor role. Most people today in our culture, the out of which came wicca, is highly characterized by eclecticism, which is in direct contrast to the teachings of most religious authorities.

Beyond that I don't see how your definition excludes wicca as a religion. Wicca is a set of esoteric knowledge transmitted orally (and textually), along side the traditions of a certain community. While wicca may hold some traditions that are only shared by those of the pagan community, that is a community none the less. If you insist that the community must be on the large scale involving everyone in a large scale culture, 1) you run into problems defining the boundaries of your culture and 2) you would exclude practices such as Catholicism from being a religion, which would not mesh with mainstream academia.



First of all, I must say my knowledge of Wicca comes mainly from online sources, most of them not academic in nature (or even very reliable), so I apologize if my tone seemed aggressive, as opposed to genuinely curious.
If indeed Wicca is almost entirely a new religion (in the sense that it is not reconstructed), what canonical texts do you use, if any? How "grassroots" (in the political sense, if you know what I mean) is it? How much do rituals constitute a part of your daily lives, and if that varies greatly among believers, is there something parallel to "sacraments" allowing you directly communicate with animistic or deity-like forces?
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby Pfhorrest » Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:27 am UTC

Just reasoning a priori, I would argue that the defining characteristic of a religion (as opposed to an ethic, a philosophy, a worldview, a lifestance, etc) is fideism: the view that some beliefs can be justified by faith. That is more than simply holding beliefs without justification, which may be one sense of believing something "on faith" (and one I have no quarrel with, since the problem of infinite regress pretty much necessitates that some beliefs be held on that tentative kind of faith). It is instead holding firm to the belief as the correct truth, not just tentatively, as though it were justified, i.e. as though you had reasons or evidence for holding it, while admitting that you have no reason or evidence for holding it.

Any belief held solely on someone else's authority is thus likewise fideistic (as you are taking their word on faith), as is any belief in anything supernatural (as the supernatural is, by its nature, beyond the capacity to be evidenced, so whatever belief you hold about it must necessarily be held without evidence). But neither authoritarianism nor supernaturalism are necessary for something to be a religion; those are only sufficient criteria. A 'secular' (naturalistic) philosophy adhered to solely on authoritarian grounds would also count as a religion; as would any supernatural or 'metaphysical' system anyone comes up with on their own; and even something like a firm conviction held for no reason (but arrived at on one's own, without any authority's input) that Russell's Teapot exists (which is nothing supernatural, just something very unlikely and hard to verify), would still count as a religion.

But a firm conviction that, e.g., a particular person is 6'2" tall and weighs 220lbs, held because that person has been measured to be that height and weight, would not; nor would any philosophy, ethic, worldview, lifestance, which is held merely tentatively, i.e. which just "seems about right to me, all things considered, but feel free to prove me wrong", even if that belief was held on someone else's word or involves something not supernatural.

Thing which I will happily argue are not necessary or sufficient conditions for a religion: belief in god (not necessary, but sufficient), or moral beliefs (neither necessary nor sufficient). Also, more the point that started this thread of discussion: any particular kind of history or degree of popular support. But I'll leave that argument for later if anyone else wants to dig into it.
Last edited by Pfhorrest on Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:31 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 0820: "Five-Minute Comics: Part 2"

Postby littlelj » Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:30 am UTC

Some of my favourite comics ever are in today's set. In particular, "Plop" and "Bail Out".
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