0856: "Trochee Fixation"

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby cjmcjmcjmcjm » Fri Feb 04, 2011 11:00 am UTC

I like the 7/8 rhythm of a trochee followed by a amphibrach and an iamb
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby etotheipi » Fri Feb 04, 2011 11:57 am UTC

I'm confused. Is "kitty" really a trochee?

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Joeldi » Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:01 pm UTC

Kitty is not a trochee in my accent/dialect/whatever........this is really bugging me.

EDIT: Hivemind.

Which, despite being a bisyllabic internet meme, is sadly not an example of the above.
I already have a hate thread. Necromancy > redundancy here, so post there.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Felstaff » Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:13 pm UTC

Project, record, and produce are trochees.

However, project, record, and produce are iambs.
Away, you scullion! you rampallion! You fustilarian! I'll tickle your catastrophe.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby etotheipi » Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:42 pm UTC

Well, then if kitty is not a trochee, maybe the patient is simulating?

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Account20151023 » Fri Feb 04, 2011 1:17 pm UTC

Felstaff wrote:Project, record, and produce are trochees.

However, project, record, and produce are iambs.


Very clever, Mr. Bond.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby SecondTalon » Fri Feb 04, 2011 1:53 pm UTC

alfa wrote:100000 posts... Congratulations XKCD forums!

You're four years too late, but thanks for trying.

... or did you mean the 100,000th post to the Individual Comic Forums? Because that's just a tiny subset of the Forums. Most people forget it's even here.
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby SpudTater » Fri Feb 04, 2011 1:53 pm UTC

Huffman coded random catchphrase!

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby mooncow » Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:17 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
alfa wrote:100000 posts... Congratulations XKCD forums!

You're four years too late, but thanks for trying.

... or did you mean the 100,000th post to the Individual Comic Forums? Because that's just a tiny subset of the Forums. Most people forget it's even here.


Yes, it was 100,000 posts to the individual threads: see Caffeine's reference a few posts earlier (99,997, I think!)

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby SpringLoaded12 » Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:13 pm UTC

Noun noun noun noun noun noun noun!
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby josiahstevenson » Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:26 pm UTC

tahrey wrote:I'm loving all this but I have to dispute a couple of points...

"Tee-NAGE Mew-TANT Nin-JA Turrr-DLES" (or for my fellow UK viewers, "Hee-RO Turrr-TLES") is clearly an iamb, at least the way it's sung in the title song. But it's still sort of within the bounds of this surprising and slightly disturbing trope (how many more can we spot?). The power rangers could go either way really ... perhaps they're more one of those Spondee things?



In the US, it's TEENage MUtant NINja TURTles. I wasn't aware that each of those words were pronounced backwards across the pond.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Spots » Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:52 pm UTC

LordBritish wrote:Anybody knows, if the greek word τροχός is a trochee or a iamb?


Iamb: http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/5164.htm. You can listen to it on Google Translate, it's the Greek word for wheel.
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Nergye » Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:56 pm UTC

josiahstevenson wrote:
tahrey wrote:I'm loving all this but I have to dispute a couple of points...

"Tee-NAGE Mew-TANT Nin-JA Turrr-DLES" (or for my fellow UK viewers, "Hee-RO Turrr-TLES") is clearly an iamb, at least the way it's sung in the title song. But it's still sort of within the bounds of this surprising and slightly disturbing trope (how many more can we spot?). The power rangers could go either way really ... perhaps they're more one of those Spondee things?



In the US, it's TEENage MUtant NINja TURTles. I wasn't aware that each of those words were pronounced backwards across the pond.


No, when spoken, they're pronounced just as you wrote it, in the UK. However, what I think tahrey meant was that, when sung along to the theme tune, the second syllable of each word is stressed, just by the nature of the tune. Similarly, the word "power" becomes monosyllabic in this context, because the phrase "turtle power" has to fit into 3 beats. :wink:

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby sircrayons » Fri Feb 04, 2011 5:22 pm UTC

I know this is the Internet, but any good dictionary will answer the "is X a trochee?" question.

Also . . .
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby nomplech » Fri Feb 04, 2011 5:28 pm UTC

Lucia wrote:
the breakfast I'm eating,

Toast? Cereal? Cornflakes? Porridge? Scrambled eggs? Jam? Marmalade? Muesli? At least the way I pronounce them, I can't think of any trochee-an breakfast foods. Except bacon. Are you eating bacon?

Donuts? Biscuits? Oatmeal?

Am I doing it right?

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby CorruptUser » Fri Feb 04, 2011 5:58 pm UTC

TEEnage MUtant NINja TURtles?

I'm creating LAser RObot PIrate MONkeys. Or maybe HINdu JETpack COWboy HAMsters...


Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys
Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys
Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys
Heroes with a half-tail
Monkey power!

They're the world's most fearsome fighting team (We're really fly!)
They're heroes with a half-tail and they can't be seen (Hey - Sigh!)
When the evil Slicer starts a fight!
These Monkey boys will bite!

Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys
Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys

Hangnail built them to be laser robots (He's a bodacious bird!)
Maxwell leads, Newton does machines (The best you heard!)
Tesla is cool but crude (Knock it off!)
Faraday is a party dude (Don't Hassle the Hoff?)

Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys
Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys
Laser Robot Pirate Monkeys
Heroes with a half-tail
Monkey power!

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby michaelbecker » Fri Feb 04, 2011 6:12 pm UTC

It's true that English speakers love trochees, but they also love iambs. For example, shortening "ridiculous" to "ridic" creates an iamb.
See my slides here (pdf):
ttp://becker.phonologist.org/papers/becker_wamu_slides.pdf

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby dummy account » Fri Feb 04, 2011 6:34 pm UTC

Tyrannosaur wrote:pankakes, bacon, cornflakes (isnt it a trochee?), yogurt, (isnt porridge one too?), french-toast, waffles... I have to admit I usually skip breakfast, even though I know it is dreadfully non-healthy...

Pancakes, cornflakes, and french toast are all spondaic (two long syllables).

LordBritish wrote:in German, "trochäus" is a iamb. Anybody knows, if the greek word τροχός is a trochee or a iamb?

In ancient Greek, by itself τροχός is neither: two short syllables, but it can become iambic when inflected or by position if the next word begins with a consonant. In modern Greek, with a stress accent rather than tonal, it is iambic.

SpudTater wrote:Huffman coded random catchphrase!

Catchphrase is also spondaic.

PS:
KeithIrwin wrote:However, I do have to argue with the mouse-over text because I believe that it lacks historical context. If one were to look at alt.non.sequitur back in the mid-nineties, it really was genuinely random. I was always very impressed with it. A few years later the spam started and AOLers got on it and things generally went downhill, but up until a certain point it was very good. I've dug up a sample from Google groups. This seems to be representative, and I found it by just changing the starting post index until it got back to the mid-nineties. https://groups.google.com/group/alt.non ... 15000&sa=N (you'll have to forgive that the URL is non-clickable, but I only post when I have something worthwhile to say, so I haven't build up an adequate post-count to be able to use the URL tag).

Looking at those posts, they remind me an awful lot of the auto-generated spam emails I get now. "Increase your s1ze for doorway geometric cookbook!"

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby beslayed » Fri Feb 04, 2011 6:52 pm UTC

I think it should be "trocheeectomy" (trochee-ectomy) and not "trocheeotomy". See http://staefcraeft.blogspot.com/2011/02/trocheeotomy.html

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby GhostlyKarliion » Fri Feb 04, 2011 7:29 pm UTC

This comic tops the list as one of the best that Randall has ever done IMO.

Partially because I recently prepared and delivered a speech on the downfall of civilization because of the disintegration of language.

Partly because last night I had the best dream I have ever had, one of those dreams that makes you wonder if maybe this is really the dream and that the reality, and I am still mesmerized by the awe and wonder of it and that is tainting my perception of this comic.

Either way, timely and wonderful Randall, thank you.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby BigglesPiP » Fri Feb 04, 2011 7:41 pm UTC

I too felt good that I didn't need to look up Huffman Coding on Wikipedia.

Huffman Coding does make Morse Code look like crap, but then that was written on a boat well over 100 years prior.

Morse should be replaced with a Huffman Code based on a large sample of telegraphs ASAP.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby neoliminal » Fri Feb 04, 2011 8:17 pm UTC

Chat bots would benefit greatly from this research.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0073YYXRC
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Re: Big Deal

Postby bigdumbface » Fri Feb 04, 2011 8:23 pm UTC

jc wrote:Uh, the overwhelming majority of English words have initial stress, and 2-syllable words are extremely common. So lots of trochees is what you'd expect in random English text. Any other stress pattern is less common. Well, except for a string of single-syllable words. ;-)

English common random English pattern common

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby 1800yolk » Fri Feb 04, 2011 8:38 pm UTC

tl;dr

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby unus vox » Fri Feb 04, 2011 8:59 pm UTC

My username shall be "HookerBobcatScrapple"
Spoiler:
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby theeagle » Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:08 pm UTC

Some ancient trochaic (mainly) stuff:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMYN4djSq7o

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby RabbitWho » Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:34 pm UTC

?

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby thebrain » Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:44 pm UTC

Did you ever notice that the brain in the top right of this comic looks a lot like Australia?
http://www.australientiger.de/australia_rel99.jpg

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Tobu » Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:49 pm UTC

Has anyone recorded themselves sounding those out?
Non-native English speaker here, who has been spoiled by the internet.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby sportsracer48 » Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:57 pm UTC

Holy shit! I literally just finished reading snowcrash!

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"Trochee Fixation"

Postby mric » Fri Feb 04, 2011 10:24 pm UTC

It's interesting that the word "trochee" seems to demand a clumsy in-strip explanation of its meaning. I thought intolerance of ignorance was an XKCD trademark.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby TectonInd » Fri Feb 04, 2011 11:16 pm UTC

RAP-tor

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Maurog » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:00 am UTC

Felstaff wrote:I love the language-based xkcd strips, and this one is no different.

It explains how this image became conveniently shortened to a simple trochee.

Wait, that's not a trochee, is it? I was under the impression that the stress is on the WUT...
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Midnight » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:48 am UTC

wait, people pronounce kitty "kih-TEE"? not "KIH-tee"?
uhhhh fuck.

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby mxyzptlk » Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:14 am UTC

I could be wrong but I think this is the first xkcd comic that I flat out do not get. Not even a little bit. This is just way, way over my head :(

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby mattcoz » Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:39 am UTC

sportsracer48 wrote:Holy shit! I literally just finished reading snowcrash!

I read it a couple months ago, one of my favorites now. Doesn't it feel nice to get the little references in these comics? :P

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Joeldi » Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:57 am UTC

Midnight wrote:wait, people pronounce kitty "kih-TEE"? not "KIH-tee"?


It seems to me it's two short syllables of the same length. Maybe slight stress on the first, but nothing like robot vampire horses from foreign planets.
I already have a hate thread. Necromancy > redundancy here, so post there.

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"i hav teh dissentors brb""¡This cheese is burning me! u pwnd them bff""thx ur cool 2"

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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby squareroot » Sat Feb 05, 2011 2:56 am UTC

I personally say "kitty" with a strong accent on the first syllable, but that might be because I'm just so very affectionate/enthusiastic towards cats...
"lolwut" I pronounce as one syllable, no joke. Sort of like "laout"... if I do pronounce it with two syllables, it's a trochee; the t is almost entirely silent.
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby Steeler » Sat Feb 05, 2011 3:00 am UTC

jwwells wrote:First-person gamers, on the other hand, prefer one-syllable words. If two syllables must be used, it should be in the relatively rare spondee meter. If three syllables are used, at least two should be accented.

Single syllable:
DOOM
Quake
Thief
Strife
Myst
Blood
F.E.A.R.
SiN

Spondee:
Half-Life
Dead Space
Blake Stone
Outlaws (The second syllable is somewhere between stressed and unstressed)
Starsiege

Three syllables:
DEus EX (can be read as spondee)
GEARS of WAR
SYStem SHOCK
DARK FORces
TEAM FORtress
STARSIEGE: TRIBES (Three stressed syllables in a row!)

Exception: Halo and Hexen are trochaic, as is Portal. Marathon is dactyllic, as is Heretic. Wolfenstein 3-D starts with a dactyl, but pulls the stressed syllable count up with "3D". The entire Battlefield series has to be considered a big exception.

Good rule: The higher the proportion of stressed to unstressed syllables in a title, the more likely you are to be shooting stuff. Blame Doom.

I don't believe that this is just an artifact of selective sampling, especially given the huge dominance of trochees and iambs in everyday speech, and even in movie titles!

Punchy titles with stressed syllables = testosterone. Now excuse me, because I am going to see The KING'S SPEECH and I will be disappointed if stuff doesn't get blown up.
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Re: 0856: "Trochee Fixation"

Postby The Scyphozoa » Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:03 am UTC

mxyzptlk wrote:I could be wrong but I think this is the first xkcd comic that I flat out do not get. Not even a little bit. This is just way, way over my head :(

I'm afraid you're looking for a deeper meaning that just isn't there. Her head is full of two-syllable words with the accent on the first syllable, most of which relate to the internet. They try to erase it, but it just fills in with more of these words.
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