1057: "Klout"

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ctdonath
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby ctdonath » Fri May 18, 2012 1:35 pm UTC

Yup, turns out you can opt out. Don't forget to deauthorize Klout (and others that snuck in) from Twitter and other services.

Giving you a "score" and pandering to your innate desire to raise it remains a powerful motivator to participate & reveal more. Think of opting out as joining the hip leading edge of people who take pride in NOT participating in the flood of social media providers (kinda like those of us who declare "I don't watch TV! haven't for years!" at every opportunity).
Last edited by ctdonath on Fri May 18, 2012 1:47 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

psu256
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Re: Why Klout?

Postby psu256 » Fri May 18, 2012 1:38 pm UTC

ctdonath wrote:Google may crawl most of the web, but it can't get behind the IDs and passwords of many millions of users; a simple "give us access and watch your score go up!" model persuades those millions to fling open what they held private against Google et al.


See, that's why I don't care... I figure if it is something that I'd want to "hold private", it has no business being on the internet at all. I feel trying to keep anything private on the internet is a fool's errand. I do use things like DNT+, NoScript, ABP, etc. because I don't want to be gratuitously sharing everything, but I mostly just stay private by not posting anything particularly important.

MaximumLength_ThirtyCharacters
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby MaximumLength_ThirtyCharacters » Fri May 18, 2012 1:55 pm UTC

This has got to be the worst idea yet.

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pkcommando
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby pkcommando » Fri May 18, 2012 1:57 pm UTC

In another forum I once made a similar request involving me and shopping malls once they turn into a garish orgy of Christmas festivity w/ endless carols blaring from the speakers. Actually, mine was granting any of them permission to shoot me, but still....

Incidentally, Googled Klout after reading this and got Wikipedia's article on the second link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klout

As you read it, note the Criticism section:
Randall Munroe made Klout the subject of the xkcd online comic on May 18, 2012. In comic # 1057, Randall requested to be punched in the face if he ever joined. Ironically, just like snakes on a plane, this introduced many readers of the comic to Klout who would never have heard of it otherwise.


:D

Fire Brns
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Fire Brns » Fri May 18, 2012 2:01 pm UTC

^"just like snakes on a plane"

lolwat?
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evac156
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby evac156 » Fri May 18, 2012 2:29 pm UTC

CLAVDIVS wrote:Is there a way I can find out what they know about me without logging in or registering? And how the hell do I opt out of this nightmare?


I also have no idea what "Klout" is, and I'm afraid to look it up. Perhaps there's a Wikipedia entry? Do I dare look, or is it like watching the videotape in "The Ring"?

But okay, I'm really just responding to your post because I cracked up over your screen name. Loved the series, but after our first look at the opening credits, my ex- and I always referred to the show as I, Clavdivs (pronouncing the "v" character as a "v" and not as the intended "u").

Edit/Addendum: Okay, just looked at the Wikipedia entry. Nearly snorted coffee out my nose. Wow, dumbest thing I've ever heard of as a metric. So all those clowns who friend 500 random people just to have a bigger mafia in Mafia Wars are considered to be having a social impact?

As another who uses neither Facebook nor Twitter, I'm a proud owner of a zero Klout score. Unless it also considers LinkedIn.

Geekoid
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Geekoid » Fri May 18, 2012 3:00 pm UTC

Why is it bad? measure the impact someone has on social media seems like it would be interesting.

You can see the influence someone vs. there knowledge in the area they are influencing.

Sure, some people could use it as an ego score, but so what?

no, I had never heard of them before today.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby debruine » Fri May 18, 2012 3:41 pm UTC

Ardee wrote:"I always hear 'punch me in the face' when you're speaking, but it's usually subtext..."


I'm pretty sure Sherlock wouldn't be caught dead on Klout, either.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby tesseraktik » Fri May 18, 2012 5:24 pm UTC

Thought it's be funny to add "Klout" to the subjects that @xkcd (Randall's Twitter account) is influential about on Klout. I got this message:
http://p.twimg.com/AtMY7lHCEAAXlzX.jpg:large

For the record, I think Klout is alright, so long as you don't take it too seriously. Good for finding tweeps who share your interests.
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Otto
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Otto » Fri May 18, 2012 5:48 pm UTC

Wow. If you guys are just now finding out about Klout, then do yourself a favor and don't go looking for "Empire Avenue".

Zylon
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Zylon » Fri May 18, 2012 5:53 pm UTC

Badion wrote:Randall, I promise I will hold you to this.

You get a punch in the face for having that.... THING in your signature.

hordriss
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby hordriss » Fri May 18, 2012 5:55 pm UTC

I know a great way to unsubscribe from this kind of scheme. Fire-bomb their headquarters, and compromise their servers.

Fire Brns
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Fire Brns » Fri May 18, 2012 6:01 pm UTC

hordriss wrote:I know a great way to unsubscribe from this kind of scheme. Fire-bomb their headquarters, and compromise their servers.

second this, also any company that gives phones number to call foreign centers. I hate companies that just log your info and broadcast it to the world under the banner of "providing a service to the public".
Pfhorrest wrote:As someone who is not easily offended, I don't really mind anything in this conversation.
Mighty Jalapeno wrote:It was the Renaissance. Everyone was Italian.

hoffmanj
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby hoffmanj » Fri May 18, 2012 6:28 pm UTC

Klout? I prefer Flout:
http://flout.me wrote:Your social influence is too important to leave to others. Sites like Klout try to tell you how important you are. That's ridiculous! Only you know how important you are.

My Flout score is 21! (It was 20 last year, but I'm feeling more important now, so I increased it.) What's yours?

paladinsama
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby paladinsama » Fri May 18, 2012 8:14 pm UTC

peri_renna wrote:
Jack21222 wrote:So how long before employers use your Klout score in making hiring decisions?

It's already too late. Wired had an article about someone who was rejected because his Klout score was too low in the May issue.


This is the article.

http://feeds.wired.com/~r/wired/index/~3/c_upAPcQg7Y/

Also this:

http://klouchebag.com/

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby bmonk » Fri May 18, 2012 8:29 pm UTC

Ardee wrote:"I always hear 'punch me in the face' when you're speaking, but it's usually subtext..."

Anyone?


LOL! I have to admit I did think of that briefly.

I think I will henceforth treat Klout as I do Ms. Spears, or Ms. Hilton, or any of various other pop celebs. Only hopefully I will learn less about it to begin with.
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ADCFixer
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby ADCFixer » Fri May 18, 2012 11:31 pm UTC

"Klout" sounds like a brand of recycled rags for mopping up baby toilet accidents..

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matt96
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby matt96 » Sat May 19, 2012 12:45 am UTC

Badion wrote:Randall,
I promise I will hold you to this. Though to be fair I have no social network so I may not be able to prove it was you and in fact I may just punch you in the face for even mentioning this thing. Yes, that's my plan.

I agree, making a comic about how horrible clout is is a form of interracting with klout that is not opting out, anyone know if Randall has opted out yet, if not, his score probably breaks the scoring system, unless it doesn't count the XKCD comic in which case his score will be much closer to average than otherwise, kind of like the way that the modern day is closer to when the last of the dinosaurs died than when the first dinosaurs came about is.

Aurora Borealis
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Aurora Borealis » Sat May 19, 2012 2:48 am UTC

In a mud that's probably the geekiest environment I know, the big question today is "what's Klout?" and the usual answer is "Something to be avoided it seems!" ... which makes me worry that Randall even knows about it.

sep332
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby sep332 » Sat May 19, 2012 3:45 am UTC

I have no idea what you guys are yelling about. Klout ONLY uses your PUBLIC facebook and twitter info. It doesn't track you across the internet, it doesn't sell you to advertisers, it doesn't do anything evil as far as I can see. Here's how the score is calculated: http://corp.klout.com/blog/category/understanding-the-klout-score/ Bascially, anyone with a web browser can get the same info.

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Karilyn
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Karilyn » Sat May 19, 2012 3:53 am UTC

joee wrote:I gave up when I found out Justin Bieber is the only one with a perfect Klout score.

It's a little infuriating to realize that Klout ranks Justin Bieber as more influential than Barack Obama.

Then you pause, think about it for a minute, and realize that it's probably true.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIUmLbXyKaQ

As one person said, "Time to Godwin this. I bet Hitler would've had a perfect Klout score. Influence doesn't have to be good influence. It can just as easily be bad influence, or inconsequential influence. But influence is influence."
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vodka.cobra
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby vodka.cobra » Sat May 19, 2012 4:30 am UTC

I hate Klout because PHP by itself is not a topic, and Cakephp (a goddamned framework!) is.
sep332 wrote:I have no idea what you guys are yelling about. Klout ONLY uses your PUBLIC facebook and twitter info. It doesn't track you across the internet, it doesn't sell you to advertisers, it doesn't do anything evil as far as I can see. Here's how the score is calculated: http://corp.klout.com/blog/category/und ... out-score/ Bascially, anyone with a web browser can get the same info.

It isn't that Klout is evil in the typical "We steal your info for profit" sense. Klout is evil because it gives elitist pricks a sense of entitlement and validation in their hollow sense of superiority. "My epenis I mean klout score is 10 points above yours. Mmmm yes *monocole*"
If the above comment has anything to do with hacking or cryptography, note that I work for a PHP security company and might know what I'm talking about.

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SeaBeecb
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby SeaBeecb » Sat May 19, 2012 8:29 am UTC

So I had some similar questions to the ones above and I just want to check my understanding here and I have one remaining question.

Q1. What is Klout?
Klout is a company whose sole function involves collecting information on how many people "respond" to "users" posts on social networking sites.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klout

Q2. What is wrong with Klout?
Their methodology is questionable and they prey on people's social anxiety. Also just the fact that they exist is kind of disturbing.

Q3.How do you opt out of Klout?
You have to opt in to opt out.

Remaining Question: If I have not opted in to Klout why do I want to opt in to opt out? That is to say, are they collecting information on people who have not "opted-in"? If so and I opt out, will this information no longer be available to potential employers?

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vodka.cobra
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby vodka.cobra » Sat May 19, 2012 1:27 pm UTC

SeaBeecb wrote:So I had some similar questions to the ones above and I just want to check my understanding here and I have one remaining question.

Q1. What is Klout?
Klout is a company whose sole function involves collecting information on how many people "respond" to "users" posts on social networking sites.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klout

Q2. What is wrong with Klout?
Their methodology is questionable and they prey on people's social anxiety. Also just the fact that they exist is kind of disturbing.

Q3.How do you opt out of Klout?
You have to opt in to opt out.

Remaining Question: If I have not opted in to Klout why do I want to opt in to opt out? That is to say, are they collecting information on people who have not "opted-in"? If so and I opt out, will this information no longer be available to potential employers?

Yes, I had a klout score before I signed in. If you have a Twitter account, they are collecting data on you.
If the above comment has anything to do with hacking or cryptography, note that I work for a PHP security company and might know what I'm talking about.

tormeh
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby tormeh » Sat May 19, 2012 1:40 pm UTC

If I were hiring someone for marketing, and found out he had low Klout score, i.e. he has a lot of status updates with little likes or comments and few listed friends then I would reconsider, since he probably has fewer real friends and people care less about his opinion than they would about someone with higher score's. This would be indicative of a less persuasive and likeable personality.

Cold stuff, I know. I'm not at the center of any of the communities I live my social life in, and NO ONE should employ me as a marketer. I think there's a link between those two.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby vodka.cobra » Sat May 19, 2012 3:14 pm UTC

tormeh wrote:If I were hiring someone for marketing, and found out he had low Klout score, i.e. he has a lot of status updates with little likes or comments and few listed friends then I would reconsider, since he probably has fewer real friends and people care less about his opinion than they would about someone with higher score's. This would be indicative of a less persuasive and likeable personality.

Cold stuff, I know. I'm not at the center of any of the communities I live my social life in, and NO ONE should employ me as a marketer. I think there's a link between those two.

What if, bear with me, he has a low Klout score personally... but he also runs another account not tied to his personal life with a score in the 80s?

You'd feel like a jerk for basing your decision on this crappy system, that's what! :D
If the above comment has anything to do with hacking or cryptography, note that I work for a PHP security company and might know what I'm talking about.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby darthmark » Sat May 19, 2012 3:29 pm UTC

Just another attempt to monetize, monetize, monetize.

sep332
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby sep332 » Sat May 19, 2012 4:38 pm UTC

SeaBeecb wrote:So I had some similar questions to the ones above and I just want to check my understanding here and I have one remaining question.

Q1. What is Klout?
Klout is a company whose sole function involves collecting information on how many people "respond" to "users" posts on social networking sites.

Researchers have been using this data for years. Check out Bluefin for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYka7D8FiZI

SeaBeecb wrote:Remaining Question: If I have not opted in to Klout why do I want to opt in to opt out? That is to say, are they collecting information on people who have not "opted-in"? If so and I opt out, will this information no longer be available to potential employers?

Klout only uses public information like your tweets and public facebook posts. For a long time they didn't even have an opt-out button, because they don't have any info that anyone with a web browser couldn't easily collect. You can't stop people from talking about you on the internet.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby vodka.cobra » Sat May 19, 2012 5:45 pm UTC

sep332 wrote:
SeaBeecb wrote:So I had some similar questions to the ones above and I just want to check my understanding here and I have one remaining question.

Q1. What is Klout?
Klout is a company whose sole function involves collecting information on how many people "respond" to "users" posts on social networking sites.

Researchers have been using this data for years. Check out Bluefin for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYka7D8FiZI

SeaBeecb wrote:Remaining Question: If I have not opted in to Klout why do I want to opt in to opt out? That is to say, are they collecting information on people who have not "opted-in"? If so and I opt out, will this information no longer be available to potential employers?

Klout only uses public information like your tweets and public facebook posts. For a long time they didn't even have an opt-out button, because they don't have any info that anyone with a web browser couldn't easily collect. You can't stop people from talking about you on the internet.

Just because they consume publicly available data doesn't mean that it's fair for people to be given a number that expresses their worth when they didn't opt-in.
If the above comment has anything to do with hacking or cryptography, note that I work for a PHP security company and might know what I'm talking about.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby J Thomas » Sat May 19, 2012 6:46 pm UTC

vodka.cobra wrote:Just because they consume publicly available data doesn't mean that it's fair for people to be given a number that expresses their worth when they didn't opt-in.


But it doesn't express their worth. It only expresses their ability to get responses -- their trollishness.
And their ability to get likes -- their cuteness.

This is a valuable measure for some jobs, because some jobs are best done by cute trolls.
The Law of Fives is true. I see it everywhere I look for it.

danicastone
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby danicastone » Sat May 19, 2012 10:03 pm UTC

Klout does indeed use LinkedIn now, and a couple other weird things... let's see, iirc it's Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, Google+, and... oh, Foursquare. Maybe others by now. I thought Foursquare was a particularly weird add. I GUESS there are people who use Foursquare a lot and have a ton of friends and influence them to, you know, go to the local ice-cream store or something. Personally, I avoid people who are constantly checking in at meaningless places with no commentary.

I use Klout (on my resume and all, and boy was I pissed when my current job blocked Facebook and my score plummeted) because I'm building up my social media strategist career, but I think employers using it for anything else is a real reach. But then, if the "somebody got passed over for having a bad Klout score" is anything like the "Employers ask you for your Facebook password" brouhaha that turned out to have been something like ONE employer in the whole world, that also did extensive background checks and a million other things.... then I don't think it's a thing.

Seems to me that most people (including employers) don't know what regular social media is, much less Klout... but maybe I'm biased because I'm trying to explain to an organization that skews mostly white-rich-and-50s how a blog can... be a thing, basically. And why having one doesn't mean that they are constantly going to be plagued by trolls and scammers and assholes destroying their reputation for them.

("But we had a bulletin board one time that was disastrous!" Still trying to find out a way to explain to them that they don't actually need to control how polite every user is being - that if you leave them alone, they basically work themselves out, but if you try to control them, it becomes a huge dramasplosion real fast.)

Also: OH GOD "WHUFFIE". "Whuffie Bank"?! I absolutely hate "whuffie", just because that is the worst most cringe-inducing word ever. It just screams out that somebody made it up to try to get notoriety. We already have words for this. And for that matter, Klout does let you give other people points for having expertise and influencing you in specific areas, so what is the difference? I guess Whuffie says it's a nonprofit and lets you donate your "whuffie" to people and organizations, but... what the hell good does that do them? Their FAQ doesn't explain that part at all.

ETA: Tried to open an account on the Whuffie Bank just to see. Not only will it not give me a registration form (just a search page), but when I try to let them know it doesn't load, it just directs me to a place where somebody else already notified them of that problem... three months ago, with no response from the staff. Robust!

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby nzqrc » Sun May 20, 2012 4:09 am UTC

Let's not forget that Klout is the company with the infamous job listing "Wanna bro down and crush some code?". Also they list Klout score of 10 or higher as a "requirement" on their current job openings.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby waltwhitmanheadedbat » Sun May 20, 2012 2:28 pm UTC

Anyone else get a 502 error when you try to opt-out?

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby jamie64 » Mon May 21, 2012 1:01 pm UTC

Most of the discussion so far seems to miss a rather major point.

Assume you're on a social network (e.g Facebook), and have nailed down all your privacy settings to "only friends can see this". Somehow or other, different interactions your friends may make with Klout (having the Klout app installed, having a Klout account at the same time as you're posting to their wall, ...) can result in Klout accessing your profile or some of your interactions and putting a "Klout score"/"Klout profile" online for you. Moreover, on Twitter at least, you don't need to do anything or have any friends; the simple creation of a private account will result in a Klout profile of you being created.

(Some sources are claiming Klout have stopped doing this - I have no way of confirming this, however.)

People are also saying that they've found Klout's site displaying, publically, screenshots of what they thought were their private profiles along with the scores they didn't want. See:

http://dannybrown.me/2011/10/27/is-klou ... r-privacy/
http://www.business2community.com/socia ... ut-0103332

Also:
http://www.jenders.com/2011/12/06/unans ... d-privacy/
http://thezargon.org/googleplus/2011/10 ... rmanently/ (includes instructions for EU users on which piece of European law to cite to get themselves removed from it)
Last edited by jamie64 on Tue May 22, 2012 3:52 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

J Thomas
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby J Thomas » Tue May 22, 2012 2:48 pm UTC

jamie64 wrote:Assume you're on a social network (e.g Facebook), and have nailed down all your privacy settings to "only friends can see this". Somehow or other, different interactions your friends may make with Klout (having the Klout app installed, having a Klout account at the same time as you're posting to their wall, ...) can result in them accessing your profile or some of your interactions and putting a "Klout score"/"Klout profile" online for you. Moreover, on Twitter at least, you don't need to do anything or have any friends; the simple creation of a private account will result in a Klout profile of you being created.


Three internet users can keep a secret, provided none of them actually use the internet.
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Lathe
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Lathe » Tue May 22, 2012 4:20 pm UTC

Why is everyone being such a sour-klout?

[ducks to dodge thrown laptop, doesn't see the thrown CRT coming from behind...]

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby Mirkwood » Tue May 22, 2012 5:25 pm UTC

Klout uses the fact that the information they gather is public as justification, but that misses a crucial point: the whole is more than the sum of its parts. It's not an invasion of my privacy if someone happens to see me walking into my house and as such knows I'm at home, but if they have a tracking system that records whenever I enter and leave the house, that's darned creepy. Similarly, Klout invades privacy by taking all the little bits of public information and connecting them together into a whole; there is a ton of information that people could access through Klout, which they would otherwise have to know a lot about me for, because it's scattered about.

And then there's the fact that what's public in one setting may be private in another. My name is right outside my door, so you'd think it's public---but to the people on the XKCD forum, it's private. You need to know where I live and feel the need to drive down here to access that information. Just because something is public somewhere does not mean it's public everywhere.

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby daten » Wed May 23, 2012 5:32 pm UTC

jamie64 wrote:Most of the discussion so far seems to miss a rather major point.

Assume you're on a social network (e.g Facebook), and have nailed down all your privacy settings to "only friends can see this". Somehow or other, different interactions your friends may make with Klout (having the Klout app installed, having a Klout account at the same time as you're posting to their wall, ...) can result in Klout accessing your profile or some of your interactions and putting a "Klout score"/"Klout profile" online for you. Moreover, on Twitter at least, you don't need to do anything or have any friends; the simple creation of a private account will result in a Klout profile of you being created.

...


I agree. Even if all of your settings are "friends only" or restricted to specific people, any app those people activate can potentially collect any information you are sharing with them.

In short, you're not only trusting Facebook to protect your "private" information, but you have to trust the decisions of all of your friends as well.

On another note, I'm curious if you have to leave the "Klout Opt-Out" app active on your Facebook account to remain in "opt-out" status. Do they use that app to flag your account as "do-not-track"? Or is it only needed for authentication for the initial opt-out?

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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby evac156 » Wed May 30, 2012 2:19 pm UTC

Ardee wrote:"I always hear 'punch me in the face' when you're speaking, but it's usually subtext..."

Anyone?

Funny. Over the long weekend, the GF discovered Sherlock. I watched one episode with her, and when it came to this line, I knew I'd heard it before somewhere... Finally dawned on me that I'd read it in this thread. So instead of reading it here and recognizing it as a line from Sherlock, I heard it in Sherlock and recognized it as a line from the XKCD forums.

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muntoo
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Re: 1057: "Klout"

Postby muntoo » Thu May 31, 2012 12:09 am UTC

@Naysayers:

Klout is destined to take over the world.

However, unlike Google, I suspect they will use that power for evil.


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