Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

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afarnen
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby afarnen » Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:49 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:
afarnen wrote:The only problem would be making the change from two decimal places to one. It wouldn't rip anyone off, because there's no rounding involved. There's also the problem with the quarter being worth $0.25. I guess we could change it to $0.2
Currency in fifths? Madness!

It's not in fifths. It's in tenths. We'd have the dime ($0.1), the quarter ($0.2), the half-dollar ($0.5) and the dollar ($1.0) coins. Seems good to me!

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Vaniver
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby Vaniver » Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:54 am UTC

afarnen wrote:It's not in fifths. It's in tenths. We'd have the dime ($0.1), the quarter ($0.2), the half-dollar ($0.5) and the dollar ($1.0) coins. Seems good to me!
I'm commenting on the .2 piece being a fifth (please don't call it a quarter).
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afarnen
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby afarnen » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:02 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:
afarnen wrote:It's not in fifths. It's in tenths. We'd have the dime ($0.1), the quarter ($0.2), the half-dollar ($0.5) and the dollar ($1.0) coins. Seems good to me!
I'm commenting on the .2 piece being a fifth (please don't call it a quarter).

I guess it'd be called a fifth, instead of a quarter. Or we could just keep the name "quarter" fro tradition. But by that point, we've already destroyed enough traditions, one more wouldn't hurt

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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby BrainMagMo » Sat Aug 16, 2008 6:11 am UTC

zealo wrote:
BrainMagMo wrote:1) Biased poll is biased. All self-report polls are biased.
2) Your poll does not test for the REASONS for the opposition, merely whether it is opposed or not. The most you can say from that poll is the American xkcdians oppose sobriety check points, and non-American xkcdians do not. You CANNOT ASSUME that this is because of tradition. I'm American, and oppose that because it goes against our constitution, though I am willing to admit I'm mostly ignorant on the statistics for the issue of sobriety checkpoints.
3) Take a poll of THIS ISSUE, before making claims.
4) Biased poll is biased.


1) biased towards what? and why? how would you reword it?
2) 1st and 2nd sentences i agree with. 4th; i consider the constitution of group X to reflect the values and traditions of X, if X feel this is not true, they could/should/would change their constitution. hence, imo, you fall into 'against because it would mean changing things'. 3rd; not from the poll, but the thread gives the indication that most opposition is similar to yours.
3) from what i see, most 'lets keep the penny' arguments here are:
a) (Lincoln?)'s head is on the penny though! indicates i) an emotional connection to a coin that i find strange ii) unwillingness to change who's head is on what coin
b) the economy will suffer because you wouldn't be able to advertise stuff as $*.99 instead of $*+1indicates i) not everyone was taught how rounding works in 2nd grade ii) that many americans have never been to a country without 1c coins where *.99 prices are common
Spoiler:
related discussion regarding having a fixed sales tax % across all states indicates a lack of willingness to change anything

c) it would cost people too much when they buy stuff if they don't get their extra 1c change! indicates i) not everyone was taught how rounding works in 2nd grade ii) many Americans are poor enough to consider the (imaginary) loss of about 1c deeply worrying
4) since you repeated yourself here accidentally, i'll take the opportunity to bring up another example which supports my view: imperial measurements.
1)I said it in my first post: All self-report polls are biased. Any poll where the the respondents are not randomly chosen is biased. That doesn't mean the bias is known.
2)I would not oppose it out of tradition, but out of privacy issues, though I'd consider effectiveness more of an issue. I really haven't discussed that issue much.
3)I agree, there are no good arguments for the penny.
3.spoiler)Don't know about that issue either. Since am minor, have not looked seriously at taxes.
4)I also agree. It makes NO sense for us to continue the imperial measurements. Maybe we can use the Obama "change" to properly reform our currency, standards, etc. <3

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electronic mily
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby electronic mily » Wed Sep 03, 2008 5:42 pm UTC

You know, as much as I'm the kind of person who develops stupid emotional attachments to things like little red coins, I can't wait for them to get rid of the penny. They're more trouble than they're worth, what with the change purses and the paper rolls and the thousands of worthless coins accumulating in animal cracker jars in your bedroom, et cetera. But the thing I'd be most excited to get rid of is the "Only $29.99!!!" method of advertising.* The only thing I'd be concerned about would be figuring out tax, because I can see people getting a bit perturbed about having to round that up to the next five-cent mark.

I say go for it. Small tradition is no reason to spend money needlessly.

I'd also like to see coins in dollar denominations. I spent a couple of weeks in europe, and the one, two, and five euro coins were really handy for little things like drinks and sandwiches.

*Yeah, I know, they'd just change it to $29.95, but it's a small victory.

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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby bigglesworth » Wed Sep 03, 2008 10:56 pm UTC

People are complaining that dollar coins never caught on.

In the UK, when we wanted to get people to use £1 coins?

We stopped £1 notes being legal tender.
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby Philwelch » Wed Sep 03, 2008 11:24 pm UTC

bigglesworth wrote:People are complaining that dollar coins never caught on.

In the UK, when we wanted to get people to use £1 coins?

We stopped £1 notes being legal tender.


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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby Silas » Thu Sep 04, 2008 1:21 am UTC

Yeah, that really isn't going to fly. Disclaiming liability for Federal Reserve notes (say, by revoking their legal tender status) would amount to defaulting on a loan. That's not something we're keen on doing.

In fact, all US currency, once issued (has to be recognizable) is still held to be legal tender.
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby flguy1980 » Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:12 am UTC

No coin should be minted that costs more than its own face value to mint. Heck, we have special laws in place to keep people from selling massive amounts of pennies to recyclers--since they're worth about $0.02 apiece to recyclers. Last I checked, nobody in their right mind would ship a few tons of _dimes_ to a recycler...

Let's get rid of the penny. If the mint can't reduce the cost of minting a nickel to below $0.05, that should go too. This would actually probably happen if Congress didn't tell the Mint what types of metals to use. We should also retire the half-dollar and $2 bill (we shouldn't print currency that's practically a novelty), and retire the $1 bill in favor of the $1 coin.

Our currency would be much simpler: nickel, dime, quarter, $1. Bills would be $5, 10, 20, 50, and 100.

Wyvernlink wrote:There has been a few bills introduced to retire the penny (America's lowest value coin) from circulation. The penny has been with us for a long time but recently it has been nearly impossible to find things that you can buy with a few dozen pennies let alone a single one. It also currently costs more to make a penny than the penny itself is worth, and with the mint making several billion of them each year it's costing us a lot of money to keep them in circulation.

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bigglesworth
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby bigglesworth » Thu Sep 04, 2008 1:28 pm UTC

Silas wrote:Yeah, that really isn't going to fly. Disclaiming liability for Federal Reserve notes (say, by revoking their legal tender status) would amount to defaulting on a loan. That's not something we're keen on doing.


It would amount to no such thing.

There is a few months where it is still legal tender, but you can cash it in at a bank. For a few months after, you can not spend it, but you can still cash it in at a bank.
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby The Tagger » Thu Sep 04, 2008 2:08 pm UTC

I apologize if someone already suggested this earlier on this board, but I don't have the time (read: I'm too frakkin' lazy) to read all the posts.

My idea has always been to get rid of the penny and always round up to the nearest nickel. (if the total ends up divisible by 5, there is no rounded amount). The rounded amount does not go to the business, rather it is a additional sales tax. You take those extra cents, which will build up to a big number, and put it towards schools, roads, public transportation, anything that people complain about now not having enough funds.

In each individual purchase, you are talking a maximum of 4 cents extra. If the average person makes 1 purchase a day, that is a maximum of a reasonable 15 bucks a year (where as the average, 2 cents extra, would be 7 bucks a year). And if you look nationally, 300 million people (not all of whom make purchases, but others who make more purchases make up the difference) paying an average of 2 cents a purchase, an average of 1 purchase a day, amounts to over 2 billion dollars. Wanna get rid of the nickel too, and round up to the nearest dime? Maximum of 33 bucks a year per person, average of 17 bucks a year per person, and almost 5 billion dollars nationally on average. I don't know, seems to be OK to me :)
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby Mountainhawk » Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:21 pm UTC

The Tagger wrote:I apologize if someone already suggested this earlier on this board, but I don't have the time (read: I'm too frakkin' lazy) to read all the posts.

My idea has always been to get rid of the penny and always round up to the nearest nickel. (if the total ends up divisible by 5, there is no rounded amount). The rounded amount does not go to the business, rather it is a additional sales tax. You take those extra cents, which will build up to a big number, and put it towards schools, roads, public transportation, anything that people complain about now not having enough funds.

In each individual purchase, you are talking a maximum of 4 cents extra. If the average person makes 1 purchase a day, that is a maximum of a reasonable 15 bucks a year (where as the average, 2 cents extra, would be 7 bucks a year). And if you look nationally, 300 million people (not all of whom make purchases, but others who make more purchases make up the difference) paying an average of 2 cents a purchase, an average of 1 purchase a day, amounts to over 2 billion dollars. Wanna get rid of the nickel too, and round up to the nearest dime? Maximum of 33 bucks a year per person, average of 17 bucks a year per person, and almost 5 billion dollars nationally on average. I don't know, seems to be OK to me :)



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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby Philwelch » Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:55 pm UTC

bigglesworth wrote:
Silas wrote:Yeah, that really isn't going to fly. Disclaiming liability for Federal Reserve notes (say, by revoking their legal tender status) would amount to defaulting on a loan. That's not something we're keen on doing.


It would amount to no such thing.

There is a few months where it is still legal tender, but you can cash it in at a bank. For a few months after, you can not spend it, but you can still cash it in at a bank.


You kind of HAD to do that when you decimalized, though, and the Euro countries had to do that when they switched currencies. If you really wanted to eliminate all consumer choice you wouldn't have to do that with $1 bills, you'd just have to stop printing them for a few years and they would slowly become more rare.
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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby Rippy » Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:18 am UTC

One problem I can see with getting rid of the penny is the rounding issue. Think of coffee shops, for example. Their entire business is built on small purchases. So, everything's going to be rounded up by 2 or 3 cents. When you think of how much coffee is sold in a chain like Starbucks, those 2 and 3 cents add up to a sizeable amount of free profit.

If it weren't for that, I'd be all for it. But I don't really want to be paying extra money on everything just because everything got rounded up.

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Re: Should America retire the Penny? (Also, let's compare money)

Postby Philwelch » Thu Oct 02, 2008 11:25 pm UTC

Some things are going to be rounded down. It'll even out in the end, just like the "take a penny, leave a penny" tray.
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