Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Tue Jun 03, 2008 3:21 am UTC

Man, there are actually people who think that those who live without our modern technology are actually less happy or less fullfilled than us?

Seriously, I love my computer, and my iPod, and my big soft bed, and my 75 different kinds of beer to choose from at the store... but these people don't have gas prices. They don't have American Idol (a good thingtm for them) and they aren't asking for it. Like Belial said... if they wanted in, they'd come get in. And if someone picked me up tomorrow and said, "Hey, you get to stop worrying about nuclear war, and nanobots, and the inevitable end of fossil fuels creating a depression for your country, but you're gonna go live in M. Night Shamalamalamlalamlaan's the Village."

I'd be like, "Can I have a blue dress please?"

Some people are actually content with simplicity, as much as you can call any sentient being's life simple.

We could go send missionaries to them (cause that's who'd go! Governments won't touch that, just gods) and give them t-shirts and vitamins and whatever the hell else other people decide they need, except then they'd be a third-world nation. And no doubt at the bottom of the social caste of their area. And oh yeah, it's not like they can afford to buy this technology what with their no money at all, so what the fuck would the point be?

Also, and this is something out of left field, I know, but these people are essentially just an example of natural selection. Both on the tribal level and on the personal level, because they don't have modern first-world hospitals and vaccines and shit. So I'd imagine that their individuals are usually pretty healthy. Or dead. Kind of like the planet's current inhabitants are out there in the future with our moon rockets. Or getting pushed out of the jungle.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 22/7 » Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:45 am UTC

artifex wrote:
cypherspace wrote:
artifex wrote:I'd say it's arrogant to deny them the choice in service of your own philosophy.

That's a fair point of view, I suppose. I'm just trying to get rid of this idea that "advancing" civilisation is always better for the peoples involved. "Oh, we simply MUST contact these poor, underprivileged savages who were perfectly content with their own life until we came along."
?


Well, hold on- put yourself in their shoes for a moment. Wouldn't you rather represent your own interests to the outside world, and know about any possibility of acquiring medicine or other life-saving things for your family, rather then having these things decided for you by people interested in keeping you content? If being consulted about these things meant that your preconceptions had to be challenged, and you culture shocked, would that necessarily be a bad thing? I mean, trying to assimilate these people would be very wrong, but isn't refusing to let them know about things relevant to their lives just as much an exertion of control?

Let's not forget that they may not have any conception of land ownership, or why they would need to keep someone from slaughtering a metric shit-ton of (simultaneously) their houses, money, food, whatever else they might use those trees for. To compound things further, why are you threatening me and my family, and why can't you speak an intelligible language? Just putting it out there.
Meaux Pas wrote:We could go send missionaries to them (cause that's who'd go! Governments won't touch that, just gods) and give them t-shirts and vitamins and whatever the hell else other people decide they need, except then they'd be a third-world nation.
First, you're pretty much condemning people for their (morally good to neutral) motives, rather than their actions. Second, contact with missionaries would not require contact with other people in their area, nor would it require any changes in their day to day lives. Sure, they could choose to do what they want with these outsiders, but being on a world stage like this, I doubt there'd be too many Cortez repeats.
Totally not a hypothetical...

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:00 pm UTC

Wait, who the hell was condemning anything? Not me. I'm just saying what would happen. Governments want nothing to do with these people. The only people who want to contact these tribes are the kind of people who want to do it to bring them to God or The Internet. (take your pick of gods, really)

And I wasn't suggesting a repeat of Cortez, dude. I know a lot of missionaries. But the scenario that people were discussing was to bring these peoples into the future with us, and our pretty sparkly technology. If you imagine that that can be done without having these tribes interact with their neighbors, that's a fascinating idea indeed.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Robin S » Tue Jun 03, 2008 1:02 pm UTC

Meaux_Pas wrote:This is nature, and shit happens. It's not up to us what happens to them.
I basically agree with the contents of your post, but this last line sounds dangerously close to the arguments of some people with anti-technology sentiments.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Tue Jun 03, 2008 1:17 pm UTC

Dangerously close is not the same thing as being there. I'm all about technology, I just don't believe that people necessarily need it to improve their way of life. It improves mine, sure, but I'm an American. I can't really determine what will improve another culture's way of life, and I'm not about to advocate foisting knowledge of the world on a culture that hasn't bothered to ask for it.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 4=5 » Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:08 pm UTC

something that may benefit them it the knowledge that if you put charcoal in the soil it keeps nutrients from washing away. (if they farm at least)

I think the risk of disease is rather too high to contact them directly but my desire for knowledge is too high not to hope that we can at least talk through a long chain of people.

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:40 pm UTC

Ok. Why, again? Why would we do this? I don't see the point.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby sophyturtle » Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:55 pm UTC

I don't think they like planes. It looks like they are trying to shoot it down. I think we should just leave them alone. They dislike us already...
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby zealo » Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:21 pm UTC

why is no one worried about catching diseases from them? seems arrogant to me.

even if they are left alone completely, eventually they will expand enough NEED (from their point of view) to attack some nearby village/town, more modern tribe, loggers, etc to continue expanding (or they die out before this point)

assuming we want to contact them before this happens, what would be the best way to do so, from their point of view?

i think language barrier will be the biggest thing, once we learn that, we ask them to nominate one person to come with us, who will be returned in 10 days. he/she gets world tour and stuff explained, then can explain to rest of tribe, who can 'decide stuff for themselves'.

Meaux_Pas wrote:Dangerously close is not the same thing as being there. I'm all about technology, I just don't believe that people necessarily need it to improve their way of life. It improves mine, sure, but I'm an American. I can't really determine what will improve another culture's way of life, and I'm not about to advocate foisting knowledge of the world on a culture that hasn't bothered to ask for it.

just because they haven't asked doesn't mean they don't want. if i find out about some alpha centaurian discussions where someone claims i could have had the faster than light spacecraft, with lasers, and an on board brewery, but i never asked for it, and it would damage my culture, i would be unhappy about it.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 22/7 » Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:33 pm UTC

Meaux_Pas wrote:Wait, who the hell was condemning anything? Not me. I'm just saying what would happen. Governments want nothing to do with these people. The only people who want to contact these tribes are the kind of people who want to do it to bring them to God or The Internet. (take your pick of gods, really)
It's this sentiment you express at the end here that I was replying to. There are still many missionaries who do what they do to help people, not to bring them to God. But this is all a tangent.

Meaux Pas wrote:And I wasn't suggesting a repeat of Cortez, dude. I know a lot of missionaries. But the scenario that people were discussing was to bring these peoples into the future with us, and our pretty sparkly technology. If you imagine that that can be done without having these tribes interact with their neighbors, that's a fascinating idea indeed.
Right, but that's not what I'm suggesting, and you were equating missionary contact with moving to third world status. I don't think that third world status is necessarily the end result of contact with missionaries. I'm not saying it's the best idea, it appears that they simply want to be left alone, but if we could pass on some simple things (or even help them defend their land from the logging industry) then I think it's certainly something worth considering.

zealo wrote:why is no one worried about catching diseases from them? seems arrogant to me.
Probably because we actually have the technology and medicine to deal with what they'd throw at us? And our civilization is orders of magnitude larger than theirs, so any damage we'd do to them would probably be orders of magnitude worse than what they'd do to us? Of course, I suppose they might introduce us to capital letters, and that might be pretty awful.
Totally not a hypothetical...

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby zealo » Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:50 pm UTC

i'm torn between a lame pun on capital criticism or pointing out your grammar errors. :(

if they do have something our medicine can't deal with, is it not likely to spread to a number of people which is higher than the number of people in their tribe?
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Tue Jun 03, 2008 6:33 pm UTC

22/7 wrote:Right, but that's not what I'm suggesting, and you were equating missionary contact with moving to third world status. I don't think that third world status is necessarily the end result of contact with missionaries. I'm not saying it's the best idea, it appears that they simply want to be left alone, but if we could pass on some simple things (or even help them defend their land from the logging industry) then I think it's certainly something worth considering.

Uh, it's not missionary work that I was equating with third-world status. Many missionaries actually manage to help communities out of third world status. What I'm saying is that such an underdeveloped culture interacting with more developed settlements naturally will not have the benefits of having developed along the same rate, and will be a third-world caliber nation.
What I'm saying is, it takes a god-feeling, like 'oh hey let's give them this stuff because it would totally help them out' to want to contact these people. Except that contacting them is not only a bit silly, it's incredibly arrogant and presumptuous. What in the world makes any of us think that we can improve the life of a culture we know nothing about that exists in the south american rainforest- a place that remains largely explored and misunderstood.
I actually agree with this sentiment:
even if they are left alone completely, eventually they will expand enough NEED (from their point of view) to attack some nearby village/town, more modern tribe, loggers, etc to continue expanding (or they die out before this point)
except for the word attack. They may just begin trading, expanding, and, oh shit, advancing. At their own pace. I see no reason not to let them do so.

I am all for more measures to reduce logging and clearcutting, and allow them to move back into the wilderness undisturbed. I just don't think they need to be involved for that.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby artifex » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:25 pm UTC

Meaux_Pas wrote:Man, there are actually people who think that those who live without our modern technology are actually less happy or less fullfilled than us?

Some people are actually content with simplicity, as much as you can call any sentient being's life simple.

We could go send missionaries to them (cause that's who'd go! Governments won't touch that, just gods) and give them t-shirts and vitamins and whatever the hell else other people decide they need, except then they'd be a third-world nation. And no doubt at the bottom of the social caste of their area. And oh yeah, it's not like they can afford to buy this technology what with their no money at all, so what the fuck would the point be?

Also, and this is something out of left field, I know, but these people are essentially just an example of natural selection. Both on the tribal level and on the personal level, because they don't have modern first-world hospitals and vaccines and shit. So I'd imagine that their individuals are usually pretty healthy. Or dead. Kind of like the planet's current inhabitants are out there in the future with our moon rockets. Or getting pushed out of the jungle.
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I'm sure they're entirely fulfilled most of the time. I just rather suspect they aren't when they slowly and painfully die from easily preventable problems.

It's easy to imagine that people in the third-world are mired in despair, but that tribal villages exist a state of naturalistic grace. This clearly isn't the case, on either count. Putting aside practical considerations like the communication barrier and the possibility that they're still vulnerable to European diseases, people shouldn't be excluding them from the same aid (Red Cross, Doctors Without Borders, et cetera) that 's being given to other communities out of a frankly misanthropic sense of the moral primacy of 'pure' cultural memes over the individual.

Also, how socially viable they are should absolutely never come into consideration (seriously, dude- social darwinism? Also, Hume's Law regarding "This is nature").

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Robin S » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:30 pm UTC

Meaux_Pas wrote:Dangerously close is not the same thing as being there.
True. I was merely pointing out that the same arguments you were using could be used to justify a significantly different attitude to technology.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 22/7 » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:51 pm UTC

zealo wrote:i'm torn between a lame pun on capital criticism or pointing out your grammar errors. :(

if they do have something our medicine can't deal with, is it not likely to spread to a number of people which is higher than the number of people in their tribe?

Well, shit or get off the pot, man. And I'm sure there was at least one grammatical error in there, as I was multitasking at the time and didn't ever give it a reread before posting it.

Also, did you actually have a response to my post?
Totally not a hypothetical...

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Sebeka2 » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:23 pm UTC

They've gotten along fine this far without direct contact with the western world, why should anyone disturb them? Perhaps they'll muliply to the point that contact is inevitable, get the adventuring bug and set out to contact us on their on, die out, or continue like they are for another few generations, but none of that is our business. Regardless, I wouldn't like a low-flying plane to zoom over my house snapping pictures.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 22/7 » Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:12 pm UTC

Sebeka2 wrote:They've gotten along fine this far without direct contact with the western world, why should anyone disturb them? Perhaps they'll muliply to the point that contact is inevitable, get the adventuring bug and set out to contact us on their on, die out, or continue like they are for another few generations, but none of that is our business. Regardless, I wouldn't like a low-flying plane to zoom over my house snapping pictures.

Normally I'd completely agree with you, but it sounds like their land is in jeopardy. It might be worth it to try to contact them to attempt to help save that land. But, again, that's fraught with its own difficulties.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Sebeka2 » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:05 am UTC

Isn't their land in danger because of illegal logging? It sounds like we already know the boundaries of their lands but have failed to properly enforce them. Do we really need to contact them for that? Can't we just contact the illegal loggers and screw with their way of life instead? ;)
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Vaniver » Wed Jun 04, 2008 6:34 am UTC

Sebeka2 wrote:Isn't their land in danger because of illegal logging? It sounds like we already know the boundaries of their lands but have failed to properly enforce them. Do we really need to contact them for that? Can't we just contact the illegal loggers and screw with their way of life instead? ;)
I imagine it went something like this:

A: So, we'd like to log this stretch of forest here.
B: Oh, I'm sorry, a tribe lives there.
A: Really? Huh, I guess we'll go try and buy the land from them.
B: Oh no, you can't do that- we won't let anybody contact them because of the repercussions.
A: So... how do we know you didn't just make up the tribe? Do you have pictures of them?
B: Umm... that would be contacting them, so no.
A: Yeah, about that. We're going to need some proof.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Turambar » Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:01 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:
Sebeka2 wrote:Isn't their land in danger because of illegal logging? It sounds like we already know the boundaries of their lands but have failed to properly enforce them. Do we really need to contact them for that? Can't we just contact the illegal loggers and screw with their way of life instead? ;)
I imagine it went something like this:

A: So, we'd like to log this stretch of forest here.
B: Oh, I'm sorry, a tribe lives there.
A: Really? Huh, I guess we'll go try and buy the land from them.
B: Oh no, you can't do that- we won't let anybody contact them because of the repercussions.
A: So... how do we know you didn't just make up the tribe? Do you have pictures of them?
B: Umm... that would be contacting them, so no.
A: Yeah, about that. We're going to need some proof.

They already knew the tribe was there. That's why the area was protected. The Brazilian government's awareness of the tribe is proved by the fact that they knew where to send a plane to take pictures (because you could randomly fly across the Amazon for months without happening to fly directly above an uncontacted tribe). It was established that the tribe existed, the loggers were questioning that because of selfish interests. It's really quite simple.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Vaniver » Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:05 am UTC

Turambar wrote:They already knew the tribe was there. That's why the area was protected. The Brazilian government's awareness of the tribe is proved by the fact that they knew where to send a plane to take pictures (because you could randomly fly across the Amazon for months without happening to fly directly above an uncontacted tribe). It was established that the tribe existed, the loggers were questioning that because of selfish interests. It's really quite simple.
Obviously the tribe exists; we have pictures of them. My point is that a sane check on government action is proof that it's necessary; if the government says to someone "you can't do X because of Y" I feel that someone has a right to proof that Y is true.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Pathway » Wed Jun 04, 2008 8:50 am UTC

Meaux_Pas wrote:I'm all about technology, I just don't believe that people necessarily need it to improve their way of life. It improves mine, sure, but I'm an American. I can't really determine what will improve another culture's way of life, and I'm not about to advocate foisting knowledge of the world on a culture that hasn't bothered to ask for it.


If you can't determine what will improve another culture's way of life, then you should let them decide for themselves. Your only reason for not telling them the larger world even exists is that they haven't asked for it. But they can't ask for something they don't know about.

Without going into much detail: we live in an age of wonders! An age of information and of manufacturing, of medicine and sanitation. We have so much. It would be irresponsible not to offer to share.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 22/7 » Wed Jun 04, 2008 8:54 am UTC

Yay for ridiculous oversimplifications!
Totally not a hypothetical...

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby dubsola » Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:38 am UTC

It's not at all clear-cut that our world is better than theirs. Stop pretending it is.

There may well be a happy medium whereby it is possible to contact them, diagnose any basic medicinal/social problems, and provide cheap and easy solutions on a long term basis. It may also be possible to protect their environment from logging or other encroachment. However, I'm not aware of any success stories along these lines, and there are many, many cases where "advanced" involvement has destroyed societies.

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Freakish » Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:47 pm UTC

Lets just assume that we are happier. Now can we contact them?
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby LE4dGOLEM » Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:51 pm UTC

no.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:57 pm UTC

I still don't see why we would. And regardless... what's this 'we' shit, you got a mouse in your pocket?


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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Sebeka2 » Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:31 pm UTC

Turambar wrote:
Vaniver wrote:
Sebeka2 wrote:Isn't their land in danger because of illegal logging? It sounds like we already know the boundaries of their lands but have failed to properly enforce them. Do we really need to contact them for that? Can't we just contact the illegal loggers and screw with their way of life instead? ;)
I imagine it went something like this:

A: So, we'd like to log this stretch of forest here.
B: Oh, I'm sorry, a tribe lives there.
A: Really? Huh, I guess we'll go try and buy the land from them.
B: Oh no, you can't do that- we won't let anybody contact them because of the repercussions.
A: So... how do we know you didn't just make up the tribe? Do you have pictures of them?
B: Umm... that would be contacting them, so no.
A: Yeah, about that. We're going to need some proof.

They already knew the tribe was there. That's why the area was protected. The Brazilian government's awareness of the tribe is proved by the fact that they knew where to send a plane to take pictures (because you could randomly fly across the Amazon for months without happening to fly directly above an uncontacted tribe). It was established that the tribe existed, the loggers were questioning that because of selfish interests. It's really quite simple.

The loggers don't need reasons or proof that the government has *good* reasons to ban them from that plot of land anymore than the US government needs to convince me it's a sound and good idea to have to pay a tax to drive my car in order to make me pay it. It's a law already on the books, the loggers no doubt knew about that, and they are flaunting it anyway. Flying over the tribe is just one more instance of this law being broken.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 22/7 » Wed Jun 04, 2008 4:56 pm UTC

Meaux_Pas wrote:what's this 'we' shit, you got a mouse in your pocket?

I love that saying.
Totally not a hypothetical...

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Vaniver » Wed Jun 04, 2008 8:48 pm UTC

Pathway wrote:But they can't ask for something they don't know about.
Supposedly they know that the developed world exists. I don't know who told them about it, and their view could be pretty skewed. It's hard to understand things you haven't experienced.

Sebeka2 wrote:The loggers don't need reasons or proof that the government has *good* reasons to ban them from that plot of land anymore than the US government needs to convince me it's a sound and good idea to have to pay a tax to drive my car in order to make me pay it. It's a law already on the books, the loggers no doubt knew about that, and they are flaunting it anyway. Flying over the tribe is just one more instance of this law being broken.
Huh? Who do you think did the fly-over?
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Sebeka2 » Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:15 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:Huh? Who do you think did the fly-over?

Someone breaking at minimum the spirit and at most the letter (provided airspace is mentioned) of those international no-contact laws? I say this never having read those laws, but low-flying airplanes should count imb, no matter who is the one doing it.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Vaniver » Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:32 am UTC

Sebeka2 wrote:Someone breaking at minimum the spirit and at most the letter (provided airspace is mentioned) of those international no-contact laws? I say this never having read those laws, but low-flying airplanes should count imb, no matter who is the one doing it.
‘We did the overflight to show their houses, to show they are there, to show they exist,’ said uncontacted tribes expert José Carlos dos Reis Meirelles Júnior. Meirelles works for FUNAI, the Brazilian government’s Indian affairs department. ‘This is very important because there are some who doubt their existence.’

Also, it isn't actually loggers who want the land- it's oil drillers. [edit-Reading another article, it seems that illegal logging may be driving one uncontacted tribe into the territory of another uncontacted tribe, which will probably cause conflict]

It is believed to be the biggest oil find in Peru in thirty years and the Peruvian president, Alan Garcia, has expressed hopes it will transform the Peruvian economy.

And people wonder why oil supply isn't growing.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Sebeka2 » Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:43 am UTC

I didn't mean to suggest there were loggers in the planes, but I honestly don't see why it matters who was. If the land is protected by international laws and contact forbidden, then low-flying planes are/out to be in violation of that. So what if the people who did it say they had good intentions?
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby 22/7 » Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:07 pm UTC

Are you honestly arguing that it's better for them to not have the low-flying plane and their land be sold off than that they do have a low-flying plane and their land protected?
Totally not a hypothetical...

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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Sebeka2 » Thu Jun 05, 2008 5:10 pm UTC

I'm arguing that they don't need low-flying planes to ban logging, when the area is already supposed to be protected (the articles called it "illegal" logging, after all). I'm also arguing that any sort of low-flying plane violates no-contact agreements.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby cypherspace » Thu Jun 05, 2008 5:20 pm UTC

The argument they use is that proof of the tribe's existence is necessary to keep the land protected. Do you disagree?
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Sebeka2 » Thu Jun 05, 2008 6:33 pm UTC

cypherspace wrote:The argument they use is that proof of the tribe's existence is necessary to keep the land protected. Do you disagree?

Yes. For one thing, I believe someone said earlier in this thread that they already had proof that this tribe (or at least *a* tribe) lived in that area and the land was already listed as protected for that reason. Wanting a new picture to put on their website isn't a very good enough reason to disturb these folks.

At the very least they could have used satellite photos or much higher flying planes with better cameras. Have you ever had a plane fly low over you? It rattles the building, the sound is loud, sometimes things get blown around, etc. In our society we have laws against flying over neighborhoods and businesses below a certain height and yet Google manages to produce air photos of my local swimming pool in which the water looks undisturbed. Why not extend the same courtesy to these people, esp. since there's a no-contact agreement?
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:08 pm UTC

Guh, I KNEW this thread would have turned to "we preserve their isolationism!!! Oh me yarm we're going to ruin their lives with our imperialist bullshit!".

So... some thoughts to fuel the flames

Tribes have come out of jungles and requested the conveniences of modernism before. Should we deny them because it is counter to their 'way of life'? Who are we to foist our standards of preserving the old on them?

The 'simplicity' of a non-technological lifestyle includes things like parasites, malnutrition, high infant death rates, and lower education due to everyone being forced to partake in manual labor about 10 hrs a day.

They have been spotted, anthropologists should attempt contacting them under careful and considerate venues, and offer THEM the choice as to what happens. If they wish to continue their lifestyle, they should be allowed to do so, but that doesn't mean we should reroute all our resources towards keeping them from the harsh, metal glint of our modernism.

Hell, anthropologically I think we could learn a lot from them.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Belial » Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:17 pm UTC

Except they already know about us. If they want to come see us, they can.

Going in and forcing them to join the modern world is another thing entirely.
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Re: Photographs of un-contacted tribe make the news...

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:22 pm UTC

I never said a thing about forcing ourselves on them. I hardly think approaching them and assessing their culture or asking some questions is immoral or imperialistic. Theres a wide margin between sending a few individuals/translators and saying "Hello, I'd like to ask you a few questions", and Cortez.
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