Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

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Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Box Boy » Sat Nov 28, 2009 7:02 pm UTC

Source

Spoiler:
By Daniel Emery
Technology reporter, BBC News



The Netherlands-based file-sharing website Mininova has removed all torrents that enabled users to download copyright-protected material.

The move follows a ruling in a Netherlands district court three months ago ordering the firm to remove links to illegal content.

The court said that Mininova's notice and take down policy was insufficient to keep it operating within the law.

The news is the latest in an ongoing campaign against file-sharing sites.

Although Mininova has not totally shut down operation, it has now removed all torrents that would enable users to download copyright-protected material, opting instead to only host a limited 'featured content' service, which offers legal licensed files.

Tim Kuik - director of Dutch anti-piracy group Brein, said: "We applaud the fact that Mininova now uses the BitTorrent technology for legal business.

"We are not against the technology but only against the use of that technology for illegal purposes."

In a blog post, Mininova staff said the court ruling leaves "no other option than to take our platform offline, except for the content distribution service".

But they added that they were still considering an appeal against the court order.

Although Mininova ending illegal file sharing will be a small step forward for representatives of the music and film industry - who have been campaigning for years against illegal file sharing - the worlds two largest sites , isoHunt and The Pirate Bay, continue to operate.

Last month, a different Dutch court ordered The Pirate Bay to remove all links to the material of a group of Netherlands-based music and film makers.

The action, brought by Stichting Brein, was against The Pirate Bay's former spokesperson Peter Sunde, along with founders Frederik Neij and Gottfrid Svartholmmen.

However, the founders dispute the ruling saying that they sold The Pirate Bay and no longer had any control over its content.

The current owner of The Pirate Bay is a Seychelles-based company called Riversella Ltd.


Although it doesn't come as a surprise to me, I'm still a bit sad to see it go down this path.
I mean now where am I going to get all my music, movie and game backups from?
>.>

<.<
Last edited by Box Boy on Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:19 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby Indon » Sat Nov 28, 2009 7:05 pm UTC

Man, clearly, the Pirate Party isn't pulling their weight in that country.
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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby el_loco_avs » Sat Nov 28, 2009 7:25 pm UTC

Dutch gov was close to getting piratebay blocked here too.

Ugh.
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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby LongLiveTheDutch » Sat Nov 28, 2009 7:54 pm UTC

While it is a disappointment, some of the music on there is pretty good. I'd suggest looking up The Black Atlantic.

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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby Box Boy » Sat Nov 28, 2009 9:21 pm UTC

LongLiveTheDutch wrote:While it is a disappointment, some of the music on there is pretty good. I'd suggest looking up The Black Atlantic.

I'm not saying the stuff they still have is bad, it is actually pretty good sometimes, but I'm just dissapointed to see such a large torrent site go down.
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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby Admiral Valdemar » Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:04 am UTC

Torrent sites are a penny a dozen. For every Pirate Bay and Mininova we lose, we get several more popping up. It's like trying to contain flu, and all the RIAA and MPAA are doing is throwing money into a black hole that is not going to be sated.

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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby LongLiveTheDutch » Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:24 am UTC

Box Boy wrote:I'm not saying the stuff they still have is bad, it is actually pretty good sometimes, but I'm just dissapointed to see such a large torrent site go down.


QFT.

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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby Internetmeme » Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:30 am UTC

LongLiveTheDutch wrote:
Box Boy wrote:I'm not saying the stuff they still have is bad, it is actually pretty good sometimes, but I'm just dissapointed to see such a large torrent site go down.


QED.

What I read.
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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby Joeldi » Sun Nov 29, 2009 9:36 am UTC

You can take the quotes out of the title. That it's illegal is indisputable; that it should be in under debate.
I already have a hate thread. Necromancy > redundancy here, so post there.

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Re: Mininova Removes "Illegal" Torrents.

Postby Box Boy » Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:18 am UTC

I'll do that now.
Admiral Valdemar wrote:Torrent sites are a penny a dozen. For every Pirate Bay and Mininova we lose, we get several more popping up. It's like trying to contain flu, and all the RIAA and MPAA are doing is throwing money into a black hole that is not going to be sated.
Yeah, but it will take them months to get enough people visiting to have even half the seeders of Mininova and you have no proof of wheter or not any of their files are legit, half of them could be riddled with viruses for all you know.
I'm just saying the vig ones are always more reliable.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Mat » Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:35 am UTC

Wasn't mininova just a search site?

Still sucks though :(

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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Box Boy » Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:42 am UTC

Yeah, but it was a good one. :(
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Joeldi » Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:49 am UTC

Lol, I hope you don't think I'm a mod or anything. Or trying to moderate, because the mods don't like it when you try to moderate...
On Topic. Yeah, I haven't noticed any real drop in the amount of torrenting going down despite all these big names falling.
I already have a hate thread. Necromancy > redundancy here, so post there.

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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Box Boy » Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:58 am UTC

I have, I was, em, procuring a rather obscure album recently from Mininova and yesterday half the seeders dissapeared. Now I've had to stop, because it would have taken a week to download.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Gelsamel » Sun Nov 29, 2009 12:34 pm UTC

I use isohunt mostly so I have not noticed much change.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Paranoid__Android » Sun Nov 29, 2009 1:29 pm UTC

Or we could actually buy the music :roll:
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Box Boy » Sun Nov 29, 2009 1:38 pm UTC

Paranoid__Android wrote:Or we could actually buy the music :roll:

I know those words but I can't understand that sentence.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Paranoid__Android » Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:17 pm UTC

Box Boy wrote:
Paranoid__Android wrote:Or we could actually buy the music :roll:

I know those words but I can't understand that sentence.


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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Chfan » Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:49 pm UTC

Yeah, can someone please explain to me why it is such a deal that you actually have to BUY their products so that the artists PROFIT from it? Boo hoo, we don't get to watch stuff for free that they spent millions of dollars making!
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Darkscull » Sun Nov 29, 2009 2:53 pm UTC

Chfan wrote:Yeah, can someone please explain to me why it is such a deal that you actually have to BUY their products so that the artists PROFIT from it? Boo hoo, we don't get to watch stuff for free that they spent millions of dollars making!


Please tell me you're taking the piss.
Even if you disagree with pirating stuff, that's a pretty stupid post.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Diadem » Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:13 pm UTC

What I don't understand about this court ruling is that downloading in the Netherlands is actually legal. Only uploading stuff is illegal. So if downloaders are not themselves breaking the law, how can enabling them to download something (by providing them with links) be illegal?
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Chfan » Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:43 pm UTC

Darkscull wrote:
Chfan wrote:Yeah, can someone please explain to me why it is such a deal that you actually have to BUY their products so that the artists PROFIT from it? Boo hoo, we don't get to watch stuff for free that they spent millions of dollars making!


Please tell me you're taking the piss.
Even if you disagree with pirating stuff, that's a pretty stupid post.


Half and half. I disagree with pirating stuff, but I'm also in a bad mood today, so yeah. I would like to know, in all seriousness though, what the issue is here. I'm kind of confused as to why the MPAA and RIAA are so evil or whatever.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Zorlin » Mon Nov 30, 2009 5:18 am UTC

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According to my account, Content Distribution stuff seems to be in high demand.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby SlyReaper » Mon Nov 30, 2009 10:47 am UTC

Chfan wrote:
Darkscull wrote:
Chfan wrote:Yeah, can someone please explain to me why it is such a deal that you actually have to BUY their products so that the artists PROFIT from it? Boo hoo, we don't get to watch stuff for free that they spent millions of dollars making!


Please tell me you're taking the piss.
Even if you disagree with pirating stuff, that's a pretty stupid post.


Half and half. I disagree with pirating stuff, but I'm also in a bad mood today, so yeah. I would like to know, in all seriousness though, what the issue is here. I'm kind of confused as to why the MPAA and RIAA are so evil or whatever.


Not evil, just incredibly misguided. They seem to have this idea that pirating is somehow damaging their profits, apparently failing to realise that the "pirates"* would not have bought that film/music/game anyway. In fact, since the downloaders are exposed to a greater range of content, there are indications that they actually spend far more on this stuff than people who don't download it. If true (and I can believe it), they're just punishing their own customers.

Secondly, there is the more powerful argument. That the content is not even AVAILABLE to buy legally. A lot of foreign films and TV shows fall under this category, or American shows that don't get released abroad for weeks or months. If you want to watch it, you HAVE to break the law. That is just wrong in my not-very humble opinion.

*I hate the use of the word pirate in this context. It makes no sense. Yarr, plunder and booty ahoy, let's go make replicas of that there cargo!
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Ixtellor » Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:35 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:A lot of foreign films, TV shows, [Child Pornography] fall under this category, or American shows that don't get released abroad for weeks or months. If you want to watch it [child pornography], you HAVE to break the law.


Its total BS that I can't do whatever I want when I want. I have a right to watch or listen to whatever I want and I shouldn't be expected to pay for it. Those stupid companies don't realize that by letting me get everything I want for free, they will profit. Its ludicrous to think that charging for a product is profitable, it actually hurts their bottom line.
Giving away everything for free is the wave of the future, and these stupid companies don't realize that with the internet and the belief in liberty and freedom, people have a GOD GIVEN right to get it all for free.

I would write more, but I am knee deep in downloading the new movie Avatar for free, because its my right. I am doing them a favor, because if I like it, I will write a nice blog about it, then millions of people will watch it for free then... Profit.

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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby SlyReaper » Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:46 pm UTC

Ixtellor wrote:
SlyReaper wrote:A lot of foreign films, TV shows, [Child Pornography] fall under this category, or American shows that don't get released abroad for weeks or months. If you want to watch it [child pornography], you HAVE to break the law.


Its total BS that I can't do whatever I want when I want. I have a right to watch or listen to whatever I want and I shouldn't be expected to pay for it. Those stupid companies don't realize that by letting me get everything I want for free, they will profit. Its ludicrous to think that charging for a product is profitable, it actually hurts their bottom line.
Giving away everything for free is the wave of the future, and these stupid companies don't realize that with the internet and the belief in liberty and freedom, people have a GOD GIVEN right to get it all for free.

I would write more, but I am knee deep in downloading the new movie Avatar for free, because its my right. I am doing them a favor, because if I like it, I will write a nice blog about it, then millions of people will watch it for free then... Profit.

Ixtellor


Did you just compare copyright infringement with CP? Cos I think you just compared copyright infringement with CP. Nice strawman, but you'll note I never said anything about rights. I'm simply pointing out that content which would be legal if only it were available is unavailable. You may be perfectly willing and able to fork over 50 quid to watch a series, but "sorry, this product is not available in your country". Since it's unavailable, what do the series producers lose by you downloading it for personal use?
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Telchar » Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:25 pm UTC

You buying it later?

In some instances, I totally agree that arbitrary restrictions on distribution, particularly in Australia, are terrible. I also agree that there is a lot of evidence that p2p sharing actually helps sales of things like movies and music.

However, making bad business decisions is the industries prerogative. If they don't want you getting it for free, then you shouldn't be able to override their decision just because you really wanna watch something. I can't steal the new Call of Duty just because I think they have a shitty marketing campaign and no dedicated servers. That doesn't make sense and neither does the "it makes them money" argument.

Should copyright laws be changed so after purchase you can do what you want? Yeah. I'm all for removing dumb restrictions on distribution or otherwise.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Indon » Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:36 pm UTC

Paranoid__Android wrote:I have the moral high ground, you cannot win!


Money funneled into your "moral high ground" goes to fund the intimidation and persecution of customers (legitimate ones even, for now) by companies. In essence, corporate terrorism.

Yeah, I went there. What of it? What're you going to do, sue me for a gabjillion dollars?*


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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Paranoid__Android » Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:43 pm UTC

Indon wrote:
Paranoid__Android wrote:I have the moral high ground, you cannot win!


Money funneled into your "moral high ground" goes to fund the intimidation and persecution of customers (legitimate ones even, for now) by companies. In essence, corporate terrorism.

Yeah, I went there. What of it? What're you going to do, sue me for a gabjillion dollars?*


*-Please don't sue me for a gabjillion dollars. I'll do whatever you want, honest.


Hmmm, I'll be contacting my layer...
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Ixtellor » Mon Nov 30, 2009 5:49 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:Did you just compare copyright infringement with CP?


Well your argument is you want to do X, but the law prevents it. So inorder to do X, you HAVE to break the law.
People who like child pornography could make the same claim. I mean 15 year olds are rational persons capable of making rational decisions with the ability to consent right? Furthermore, access to CP means they don't have to fulfil fantasies on real children... in fact if you look at it logically, CP saves children!!!!

It doesn't appear that you have considered that X is illegal for a reason. You make up any excuse you can to justify the fact you want to break the law and do exactly what society has deemed harmful and bad... just like CP.

Secondly, have you made an honest attempt to find legitimate (read non illegal) ways to get what you want. Are you telling me it is impossible to legally purchase copies of the programs you want to watch?

Third, what gives you the right to watch those programs to begin with? They producers of them have made them unvailable (allegedly) and how does that translate into you having the right to get it anyway?

Your argument hinges on "Nobody is getting hurt", but we have laws for a reason.... its because your hurting people.
People put their time, effort, and most importantly MONEY into producing a product, and then you come along and take it for free even though they have directly and explicitly said "THIS IS NOT FOR FREE, YOU MUST PAY TO HAVE IT".
You and all the other illegal downloaders take the position, that they dont' have a right to deny you. They are evil jerks preventing you from getting exactly what you want, and for the price your willing to pay... ZERO.


Ixtellor

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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Telchar » Mon Nov 30, 2009 5:59 pm UTC

I invoke the Crossballs clause: I don't actually agree with Ix on the whole CP thing.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby SlyReaper » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:01 pm UTC

Ixtellor wrote:
SlyReaper wrote:Did you just compare copyright infringement with CP?


Well your argument is you want to do X, but the law prevents it. So inorder to do X, you HAVE to break the law.
People who like child pornography could make the same claim. I mean 15 year olds are rational persons capable of making rational decisions with the ability to consent right? Furthermore, access to CP means they don't have to fulfil fantasies on real children... in fact if you look at it logically, CP saves children!!!!

It doesn't appear that you have considered that X is illegal for a reason. You make up any excuse you can to justify the fact you want to break the law and do exactly what society has deemed harmful and bad... just like CP.

Secondly, have you made an honest attempt to find legitimate (read non illegal) ways to get what you want. Are you telling me it is impossible to legally purchase copies of the programs you want to watch?

Your argument hinges on "Nobody is getting hurt", but we have laws for a reason.... its because your hurting people.
People put their time, effort, and most importantly MONEY into producing a product, and then you come along and take it for free even though they have directly and explicitly said "THIS IS NOT FOR FREE, YOU MUST PAY TO HAVE IT".
You and all the other illegal downloaders take the position, that they dont' have a right to deny you. They are evil jerks preventing you from getting exactly what you want, and for the price your willing to pay... ZERO.


Ixtellor


Again you're talking about rights. I never claimed pirates (*shudder*) have the right to download copyrighted content. I'm explaining why it's a bad decision to spend so much time and effort to prevent it. Sure, it's their right to make bad decisions, but that doesn't stop me calling it misguided.

Oh and I notice you've now lumped me in with "all the other illegal downloaders". Where did I mention that I myself partake of this activity (actually I did in another thread, but that really is on stuff that is not likely to be available in the UK any time soon)?
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Random832 » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:10 pm UTC

Paranoid__Android wrote:
Indon wrote:*-Please don't sue me for a gabjillion dollars. I'll do whatever you want, honest.


Hmmm, I'll be contacting my layer...


This isn't meant as legal advice, but I think you'll find s/he will simply inform you that "gabjillion" is not a number. :mrgreen:

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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Indon » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:12 pm UTC

Ixtellor wrote:Well your argument is you want to do X, but the law prevents it. So inorder to do X, you HAVE to break the law.
People who like child pornography gay marriage could make the same claim.

I'll see your silly analogy and raise you a silly law.

Edit:
Random832 wrote:This isn't meant as legal advice, but I think you'll find s/he will simply inform you that "gabjillion" is not a number. :mrgreen:


You've seen to the core of my clever legal strategy - only get sued for numbers that do not exist!
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Spacemilk » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:17 pm UTC

Ixtellor wrote:It doesn't appear that you have considered that X is illegal for a reason. You make up any excuse you can to justify the fact you want to break the law and do exactly what society has deemed harmful and bad... just like CP.

There are a lot of flaws and stupid arguments in your post, but I'll focus on the one I've quoted here:

You are assuming that ALL laws which are currently enacted are well-thought-out and for the greater good. This is the most illogical, stupid thing I've heard today. The laws against child pornography are agreed upon by 99.9% of the population as being "for the greater good" (where the other 0.1% are pedophiles). The laws regulating distribution of media are NOT agreed upon by any majority of the population. Also the laws aren't protecting anyone, since they frequently harm legitimate consumers more than pirates.

In your inane and idiotic example, I could say that X = gay marriage. And, in your words, we can "make up any excuse you can to justify the fact you want to break the law and do exactly what society has deemed harmful and bad"... but no matter what excuse we come up with, CLEARLY society knows EXACTLY what it's doing when it prevents gay couples from getting married. 'Cause I mean, society says it's bad, so it's bad, right?!

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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Indon » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:19 pm UTC

Chfan wrote:Half and half. I disagree with pirating stuff, but I'm also in a bad mood today, so yeah. I would like to know, in all seriousness though, what the issue is here. I'm kind of confused as to why the MPAA and RIAA are so evil or whatever.


Well, from a free-market perspective, they're oligopolies who control the industry to their benefit, and the industry's detriment, and it would benefit us (the prospective customers of these industries) if they and their member organizations went out of business.

From an ethical perspective, they're assholes who have spent years engaging in illegal intimidation tactics against their customers (Well, the RIAA anyway, I don't know to what extent the MPAA has done so), not to mention manipulating the law to their advantage.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Spacemilk » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:26 pm UTC

Indon wrote:
Chfan wrote:Half and half. I disagree with pirating stuff, but I'm also in a bad mood today, so yeah. I would like to know, in all seriousness though, what the issue is here. I'm kind of confused as to why the MPAA and RIAA are so evil or whatever.


Well, from a free-market perspective, they're oligopolies who control the industry to their benefit, and the industry's detriment, and it would benefit us (the prospective customers of these industries) if they and their member organizations went out of business.

From an ethical perspective, they're assholes who have spent years engaging in illegal intimidation tactics against their customers (Well, the RIAA anyway, I don't know to what extent the MPAA has done so), not to mention manipulating the law to their advantage.

Yeah, this. They also create silly laws that make it illegal - or at the very least, questionable and potentially litigious - to do things with content you already own. They add in cumbersome and annoying technology that makes it difficult to do anything with content, including upgrade to a new computer. Rather than think up a new way to regulate and sell their content, they sue transgressors for unbelievable amounts (the best one was the single mom in Michigan who had something like $1.8 million to pay for some 14 songs) so that their lives would be essentially ruined if they had to pay the whole amount... but don't worry, they ARE willing to settle for the price of, say, a new car! (which is far outside the means of most of these people)
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Sourire » Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:28 pm UTC

Indon wrote:
Ixtellor wrote:Well your argument is you want to do X, but the law prevents it. So inorder to do X, you HAVE to break the law.
People who like child pornography gay marriage could make the same claim.

I'll see your silly analogy and raise you a silly law.

Your silly law and those that Ixtellor alludes to are entirely different, however.

Namely, that there is no law (I'm aware of) stopping any person from claiming to be married to...anything. Living, dead, male, or female. The governments of our nation, however, choose which to recognize and "legitimize."* That law serves as more restraint than punishment.

Now if you wanted (what I feel to be) a more proper analogy, you could compare file sharing to jaywalking. Both are against the law (if I understand jaywalking correctly) and society tends to have lax attitudes towards both. For instance, near my current residence, there's a very, very small street with a clearly indicated crossing light for pedestrians. However, it takes approximately three seconds to cross the (one-lane) street, and often takes up to ten times that for the light to signal you on. We don't typically prosecute people doing this, and it's very possible they're not hurting anyone-but they are, in a very real sense, breaking the law. And if some cop is pissed off enough, he or she is entitled to take action. Each person at the intersection makes the calculated risk of doing what they're legally supposed to do, or what they'd prefer to do because it conveniences them.

*-Let's just establish now this isn't a debate about gay marriage, and shouldn't devolve into one.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Indon » Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:00 pm UTC

Sourire wrote:Your silly law and those that Ixtellor alludes to are entirely different, however.

Marriage carries tax benefits. File taxes as if you're married without a recognized marriage and you go to prison for tax fraud. Marriage is Serious Business, and works perfectly for this analogy.
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Re: Mininova Removes Illegal Torrents.

Postby Felstaff » Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:45 pm UTC

Christ on a bike, I don't know what the hell Ixtellor is on--some kind of doucheresidue I'm lead to believe--but for goodness sakes, drop the child pornography talk. It was a stupid analogy made by a--fuck it; just cease.

Of course, I can chime in right here, in a blatant abuse of my powers. SlyReaper is complaining that making watching otherwise unwatchable shows illegal, the law itself is stupid. Applying that thought to CP is, well, I don't really have words for it. I'm just going to walk away from this thread with the conclusion that Ixtellor is desperate to find some teenybopper action and wants to tell the world he has a problem.
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