Diadem wrote:Funny how you accuse someone of strawmanning while you've been going on about that camel for a few pages now.
You can clearly see someone violently throw back about 2 seconds before this 'camel' (at 1.01). Someone wearing something white (ie: cold). You then see him get up, he disappears behind someone and immidiately reappears as a camel. This is all in the same shot. Unless he shapeshifted, I'm going to go with the 'weird camera angle' theory.
Arguing that suggesting IDF / IFM sources are not objective = this means "zionist liars" "zionazis" is
a strawman argument.
Genuinely thinking you've seen a camel in grainy night vision footage and then asking about it, receiving a convincing counter-argument (most likely - the guy throwing a life jacket off / at the soldiers having been thrown on the ground), then accepting that there's no camel = how critical functions work. Taking grainy video from an non-objective source as Truth = non-critical thought.
Thesis: There's a camel!! Explain this!!
Antithesis: Its not a camel, for these reasons.
Synthesis: Ahh, Its not
a camel, however it sure looks like one if you don't know about reverse heat infrared cameras!
For the record - there's already a few websites out there a) pointing out the camel and b) the more radical ones (aka people who do
use the words "Zionazi" seriously) are suggesting it is faked. Kinda why I brought the whole camel thing in, really. Meta-debate *shrug*. I was making a point about sources, and so forth. More damagingly, some serious outlets are suggesting that at least one of the videos has been faked.
: Journalist reports she was tasered. Not just paintball guns?
Yes, the IDF / IFM do
produce bad propoganda and fake stuff! (shock, horror)
Internet sensationalist claims Israel's weapons-on-board pictures are doctored, since disproved, but this is all part of the muddied' water. For the record, the "weapons" aren't particularly military, and the "bulletproof vests" do indeed seem to be for the Red Crescent, who do get fired upon by Israel forces (citations can be provided for this). However, this is not to say the opposite doesn't happen - http://www.zombietime.com/fraud/ambulance/
for a site outlining what it thinks are anti-Israeli media manipulations in the past.
“We are being hit by tear gas, stun grenades, we have navy ships on either side, helicopters overhead,” he said. “We are being attacked from every single side. This is in international waters, not Israeli waters, not in the 68-mile exclusion zone. We are being attacked in international waters completely illegally.”
“The organizers are telling me now, they are raising a white flag — they are raising a white flag to the Israeli army,” the Al Jazeera reporter said. “This is after one person has been killed; a civilian has been killed by munition. That number could be more … Despite the white flag being raised, despite the white flag being raised, the Israeli army is still shooting, still firing live munitions.”
. Obviously, the very name "Al Jazeera" to some suggests bias and non-objective reporting. However, the raw video seems
to be reportage at the time, and it'd be an odd one to claim such things if the backing track was all quiet.
To make a non-strawman argument, as I did in my first post:
Stupidity from both sides, however I've a feeling the situation isn't as black and white as is being portrayed here by some posters.
Back to the topic - I'd really like to see the whole video log. And a bit more suspicion of both sides: we're living in a media age, aren't we?
(As a personal note - I'd really like the entire geopolitical zone to stop acting like solipsistic children all vying for the 'worst victim' status while throwing tantrums, and sort it out. The Middle East is one permanent blotch on the idea of Human Progress and mixes in the worst attributes of humanity to boot. As a personal note, I wouldn't view it as a major loss to humanity if the entire area was turned into a nature reserve and all sides
got told to go away. That won't happen, but that's my level of horrified ennui / distaste for all sides in the region. That includes pumping waste treatment facilities into the major rivers over borders (Israel, Syria, both guilty as charged) and causing the worst oil spill in an environmentally protected zone in the area (Israel bombing oil refineries in last conflict) or brainwashing your kids into religious unthinking zealots (all sides) or placing politics over food (Hamas) and so on. The entire spectacle is one running sore.)