Atheist Christmas Advertising

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Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby dedalus » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:15 am UTC

Source.
Article wrote:'You know it's a myth': Atheist billboard causes a storm at entrance to New York tunnel
By DAILY MAIL REPORTER
Last updated at 1:15 PM on 29th November 2010

The religious message of Christmas is often forgotten amid all the partying and gift-giving at this time of year.
So church leaders will be horrified to see their efforts further undermined by an atheist billboard which has gone up in New York.
A traditional nativity scene features a silhouette of a traditional nativity scene with manger, donkey and the Three Wise Men has been unveiled on a bridge tunnel.
But thanks to a group called American Atheists it comes with the message: 'You KNOW it's a Myth... This Season Celebrate REASON'.

'Celebrate REASON': The billboard, commissioned by the American Atheists, is looking to target 'closet' non-believers
The sponsors hope the provocative anti-Christian message will convince 'closet' non-believers who are ‘praying to air’ to join their cause.
It is located on Route 495 outside the Lincoln Tunnel in North Bergen, on the New Jersey side.
David Silverman, the president of the organisation, said he was hoping to 'attract atheists who are currently in the closet' with the billboard, which went up last Tuesday and is expected to remain up throughout the Christmas period.
‘I don’t think it’s any good for the kids,’ he said about Christmas.
Mr Silverman said atheists were unfairly targeted in the ‘war on Christmas’, a phrase often related to the public display of Christmas imagery on government funded property.

Controversial: The sign went up last Tuesday on Route 495 outside the Lincoln Tunnel, pictured here, and is expected to remain there for the duration of Christmas
He said: ‘We get blamed for a war on Christmas every year. This time we’re actually going to pay attention to that. We’re actually going to earn a little bit of that.
‘We have been blamed repeatedly for being unpatriotic, we have been told that there are not atheists in fox holes, we have been told that we are immoral.
‘Nobody has ever cared if we would be offended.’
While acknowledging ‘everybody has the right to believe as they see fit’, Mr Silverman said his group believed there were ‘a lot more people’ who were atheists, but feared publicly admitting it.
‘A lot of people in church, a lot of people in the mosque, a lot of people in the synagogue know they’re praying to air.’
Mr Silverman said despite the fact that the billboard has only been up for a few days, he and his group are calling the campaign a success.
‘We’re getting a lot of response from closeted atheists saying: “Thank you for putting it up.”’


I think the ad is pretty cool :D
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby The Reaper » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:28 am UTC

Isn't christmas the time that americans celebrate a man that went around trying to destroy capitalism by giving have-nots toys by embracing capitalism on a massive scale, with such ferocity that local prices on useless trinkets skyrocket?

Oh, and the birth of some guy they think is going to save them from eternal damnation which is just a state of mind anyway?

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Xeio » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:55 am UTC

The Reaper wrote:Isn't christmas the time that americans celebrate a man that went around trying to destroy capitalism by giving have-nots toys by embracing capitalism on a massive scale, with such ferocity that local prices on useless trinkets skyrocket?

Oh, and the birth of some guy they think is going to save them from eternal damnation which is just a state of mind anyway?
Yea, but all the adults know that other adults are actually buying the presents, thus capitalism is still good.

Also, wasn't that guy born in July or something?

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby G.v.K » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:56 am UTC

praying to air. what a great idea. here's a go:-

Air, invisible and yet viscous substance, imbued with the special power of oxygenating my blood, grant that I may continue to breathe your plentiful bounty. And take from me those gaseouses wastes which my body no longer needs. Transport them to those lifeforms who may benefit therefrom, that we may all receive that which does us good. Amen.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Glass Fractal » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:57 am UTC

I'm more curious about why he doesn't think Christmas is any good for the kids, than anything else.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby The Reaper » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:01 am UTC

G.v.K wrote:praying to air. what a great idea. here's a go:-

Air, invisible and yet viscous substance, imbued with the special power of oxygenating my blood, grant that I may continue to breathe your plentiful bounty. And take from me those gaseouses wastes which my body no longer needs. Transport them to those lifeforms who may benefit therefrom, that we may all receive that which does us good. Amen.

You do know that air kills you, right?

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Thirty-one » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:02 am UTC

Glass Fractal wrote:I'm more curious about why he doesn't think Christmas is any good for the kids, than anything else.


I can think of two possible reasons, not sure how good you'd think they were though.

  • It's massively materialistic, possibly implying to kids that behaving well should always be rewarded with stuff.
    Some kids might have poor parents and not get much of anything compared to other kids in their school. Could suck for them if they
    feel they've been more well behaved that these kids.

  • Gateway fantasy person.

:)

His actual reasons could of course be more well thought out than that.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Box Boy » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:05 am UTC

Xeio wrote:Also, wasn't that guy born in July or something?

Yeah, Christmas was moved to this time of year (If I recall correctly) to help stamp out the whole "Pagan Rituals on the Solstice" thing a while back.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby G.v.K » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:06 am UTC

The Reaper wrote:
G.v.K wrote:praying to air. what a great idea. here's a go:-

Air, invisible and yet viscous substance, imbued with the special power of oxygenating my blood, grant that I may continue to breathe your plentiful bounty. And take from me those gaseouses wastes which my body no longer needs. Transport them to those lifeforms who may benefit therefrom, that we may all receive that which does us good. Amen.

You do know that air kills you, right?


is that what you call "Celebrating Reason"?

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby 22/7 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:06 am UTC

Interesting concept. I hadn't really thought of atheists advertising before, but I guess if theists do it...

Pretty much what I thought, Thirty-one. Though, to be honest, I think saying that a holiday is outright harmful to kids is a bit more simplification than is helpful, especially when you're already getting people as defensive as I'm sure they'll get.
Totally not a hypothetical...

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Kizor » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:18 am UTC

Image?

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby frezik » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:24 am UTC

Xeio wrote:Also, wasn't that guy born in July or something?


Probably closer to Sept-Oct, but definitely not December, in any case. Since the Gospel account speaks of sheperds being in their fields, we can safely assume they wouldn't be out during a wet and cold season in the region.

Plus, the Gospels don't specify the number of the Wise Men, and they actually came several months after Jesus was born. Nothing is right about nativity scenes, no matter if you believe the literal truth of the Bible or not.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby meataxe » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:37 am UTC

Glass Fractal wrote:I'm more curious about why he doesn't think Christmas is any good for the kids, than anything else.

I took that to mean that the religious overtones of Christmas are not good for kids, not Christmas itself. And I agree with that. Tim Minchin says it better than I ever could:
White Wine in the Sun by Tim Minchin wrote:And yes I have all of the usual objections to the miseducation
Of children forced into a cult institution and taught to externalise blame
And to feel ashamed and to judge things as plain right and wrong

The song is celebrating the fact that he enjoys Christmas because of the time he gets to spend with his family, but dislikes the fact that the holiday is so intertwined with religion. But anyway, back to the topic at hand.

I particularly agree with the content in the final paragraph of that article. Mr Silverman makes some good points, and while over here in Australia it seems more acceptable to be atheist or agnostic, there's still an air of inferiority. I particularly sympathise with "Nobody has ever cared if we would be offended." It seems that religion gives a free pass to say whatever you like about atheists (not that all religious people use this free pass, and I really appreciate them for being so accepting of other people's beliefs), and to their faces no less, but as soon as an atheist speaks out against this, it's as if they've spoken the cruelest and most hateful thing ever. At least in my experience.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jessica » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:39 am UTC

22/7 wrote:Interesting concept. I hadn't really thought of atheists advertising before, but I guess if theists do it...

Pretty much what I thought, Thirty-one. Though, to be honest, I think saying that a holiday is outright harmful to kids is a bit more simplification than is helpful, especially when you're already getting people as defensive as I'm sure they'll get.
To be fair, the quote was probably a sound byte from the interview that sounds good in the article. I'm sure that he explained himself, but it didn't get into the article. Because a well reasoned critique doesn't sound as good as an atheist saying "Oh me yarm CHRISTMAS ART BAD FOR THE KIDS".
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Dec 01, 2010 3:07 am UTC

I just really love this t.v. news segment I saw on that sign where this lady claimed that you can believe whatever you want but you shouldn't put it on a billboard. I wonder if she's ever taken the time to drive 44 from St. Louis with a trip through Oklahoma. I'll go ahead and inform every other billboard that they shouldn't be promoting their religion via billboards.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Triangle_Man » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:22 am UTC

Honestly, this seems like a bit of a jerk move on the part of the atheists. If I had any strong religious views whatsoever, I'd probably be offended by a sign telling people that my beliefs were crap.

Also, I will admit that Christmas has become a bit of materialistic holiday, but aside from the nice stuff I also see it as an excuse to get together with family and friends, go to some nice parties, watching heartwarming specials, and of course Candy Cane Ice Cream.

Also, in response for Jahoclave's post, I'm surprised to find out Billboards have a religion of their own. What is it called, the first church of graphic design?
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Glass Fractal » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:27 am UTC

Triangle_Man wrote:Honestly, this seems like a bit of a jerk move on the part of the atheists. If I had any strong religious views whatsoever, I'd probably be offended by a sign telling people that my beliefs were crap.


The point is probably that religions do this all the time and few people ever question it. As he says himself "Nobody has ever cared if we would be offended." Any sign that invites people to a religion is telling atheists that their beliefs are crap.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Glmclain » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:31 am UTC

Image

Image

Image
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:37 am UTC

I'd also point out that the first guy there really fails at basic logic.

Even assuming that anti-American is treason, treason often doesn't lead to civil war. In fact, treason often lends itself more towards supplying the actual enemy of the state with information of tactical importance, not encouraging rebellion of the people against themselves.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby dedalus » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:58 am UTC

Glass Fractal wrote:
Triangle_Man wrote:Honestly, this seems like a bit of a jerk move on the part of the atheists. If I had any strong religious views whatsoever, I'd probably be offended by a sign telling people that my beliefs were crap.


The point is probably that religions do this all the time and few people ever question it. As he says himself "Nobody has ever cared if we would be offended." Any sign that invites people to a religion is telling atheists that their beliefs are crap.

I think that a sign saying 'hey, come join our religion, we're pretty cool' isn't telling anyone else that their specific beliefs are crap. But there's a fair amount of religious advertising that's not like that.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:01 am UTC

Speaking of which, the Catholics responded. Link

Am I the only one who saw that billboard and thought it was an ad fora box of instant potatoes at first glance?

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Triangle_Man » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:02 am UTC

Glass Fractal wrote:
Triangle_Man wrote:Honestly, this seems like a bit of a jerk move on the part of the atheists. If I had any strong religious views whatsoever, I'd probably be offended by a sign telling people that my beliefs were crap.


The point is probably that religions do this all the time and few people ever question it. As he says himself "Nobody has ever cared if we would be offended." Any sign that invites people to a religion is telling atheists that their beliefs are crap.


Thanks for the explanation. Still, it'd be better if this kind of 'conversion attempts using billboards' stopped. It's an effective medium, but in all honesty it a bit infuriating.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:05 am UTC

Triangle_Man wrote:
Glass Fractal wrote:
Triangle_Man wrote:Honestly, this seems like a bit of a jerk move on the part of the atheists. If I had any strong religious views whatsoever, I'd probably be offended by a sign telling people that my beliefs were crap.


The point is probably that religions do this all the time and few people ever question it. As he says himself "Nobody has ever cared if we would be offended." Any sign that invites people to a religion is telling atheists that their beliefs are crap.


Thanks for the explanation. Still, it'd be better if this kind of 'conversion attempts using billboards' stopped. It's an effective medium, but in all honesty it a bit infuriating.


I don't really see it as a conversion attempt so much as a publicity stunt. Basically announcing, "hey fuckers, we exist and we're going to debate the merits of your religious beliefs, especially if you insist on codifying them into law." Though, probably in nicer terms than that.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Meem1029 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:08 am UTC

I think the main problem with the ad (for me at least) is that it is saying that no person with reason is a Christian. That is not acceptable to me. On the other hand, I do acknowledge that there are Christian groups who similarly attack atheists for their beliefs, which I do not condone either.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:18 am UTC

Meem1029 wrote:I think the main problem with the ad (for me at least) is that it is saying that no person with reason is a Christian. That is not acceptable to me. On the other hand, I do acknowledge that there are Christian groups who similarly attack atheists for their beliefs, which I do not condone either.

Well, it's still accurate. Historical evidence points to Christianity being a myth, especially the idea that Jesus was born on Christmas (which even the text doesn't support). Ergo, believing it to be true is unreasonable. The problem is holding belief as sacrosanct and above critique. If we treat belief as something that can't be critiqued then we lend ourselves into two propositions. We only allow belief we agree with as sacrosanct, or we allow a whole lot of dangerous shit through because we think it's rude to critique belief.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby ConMan » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:28 am UTC

I agree, I dislike the militancy with which the messages on both sides are being posted (but I'm a pretty non-confrontational guy). I'd prefer something like "You don't need God to be good this Christmas" with an image of people helping at a homeless shelter or a family spending time together or something. It still gets across a non-religious message, but in a way that I think better suggests "Can't we all just get along?" than "Christians are idiots for believing the things they do.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby SummerGlauFan » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:43 am UTC

Jahoclave wrote:
Meem1029 wrote:I think the main problem with the ad (for me at least) is that it is saying that no person with reason is a Christian. That is not acceptable to me. On the other hand, I do acknowledge that there are Christian groups who similarly attack atheists for their beliefs, which I do not condone either.

Well, it's still accurate. Historical evidence points to Christianity being a myth, especially the idea that Jesus was born on Christmas (which even the text doesn't support). Ergo, believing it to be true is unreasonable. The problem is holding belief as sacrosanct and above critique. If we treat belief as something that can't be critiqued then we lend ourselves into two propositions. We only allow belief we agree with as sacrosanct, or we allow a whole lot of dangerous shit through because we think it's rude to critique belief.


Sorry to disappoint, but history far from proves Christianity a myth. There are even historical documents outside of the Bible that mention Jesus as a person. Not trying to get into a debate, but that blanket statement was in error, mate.

You are correct, however, that the Bible does not say Jesus was born in the winter. It was likely sometime during spring/summer. However, that's hardly a crux on Christian faith.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:48 am UTC

SummerGlauFan wrote:
Jahoclave wrote:
Meem1029 wrote:I think the main problem with the ad (for me at least) is that it is saying that no person with reason is a Christian. That is not acceptable to me. On the other hand, I do acknowledge that there are Christian groups who similarly attack atheists for their beliefs, which I do not condone either.

Well, it's still accurate. Historical evidence points to Christianity being a myth, especially the idea that Jesus was born on Christmas (which even the text doesn't support). Ergo, believing it to be true is unreasonable. The problem is holding belief as sacrosanct and above critique. If we treat belief as something that can't be critiqued then we lend ourselves into two propositions. We only allow belief we agree with as sacrosanct, or we allow a whole lot of dangerous shit through because we think it's rude to critique belief.


Sorry to disappoint, but history far from proves Christianity a myth. There are even historical documents outside of the Bible that mention Jesus as a person. Not trying to get into a debate, but that blanket statement was in error, mate.

You are correct, however, that the Bible does not say Jesus was born in the winter. It was likely sometime during spring/summer. However, that's hardly a crux on Christian faith.

I would contend that point and point out that those documents don't conclusively prove the existence of Jesus and that there is a growing adherence to the non-existence of a historical Jesus. See the works of Richard Carrier. Beyond that, existence of a historical Jesus does not make the text any less of a myth. There is absolutely no evidence of any supernatural occurrence involved. The Biblical Jesus is a myth. Furthermore, if you accept that Jesus did exist as he was claimed to (even minus the miracles) then Acts is a largely inaccurate text in that the Romans would have acted differently.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby SummerGlauFan » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:52 am UTC

Jahoclave wrote:
SummerGlauFan wrote:
Jahoclave wrote:
Meem1029 wrote:I think the main problem with the ad (for me at least) is that it is saying that no person with reason is a Christian. That is not acceptable to me. On the other hand, I do acknowledge that there are Christian groups who similarly attack atheists for their beliefs, which I do not condone either.

Well, it's still accurate. Historical evidence points to Christianity being a myth, especially the idea that Jesus was born on Christmas (which even the text doesn't support). Ergo, believing it to be true is unreasonable. The problem is holding belief as sacrosanct and above critique. If we treat belief as something that can't be critiqued then we lend ourselves into two propositions. We only allow belief we agree with as sacrosanct, or we allow a whole lot of dangerous shit through because we think it's rude to critique belief.


Sorry to disappoint, but history far from proves Christianity a myth. There are even historical documents outside of the Bible that mention Jesus as a person. Not trying to get into a debate, but that blanket statement was in error, mate.

You are correct, however, that the Bible does not say Jesus was born in the winter. It was likely sometime during spring/summer. However, that's hardly a crux on Christian faith.

I would contend that point and point out that those documents don't conclusively prove the existence of Jesus and that there is a growing adherence to the non-existence of a historical Jesus. See the works of Richard Carrier. Beyond that, existence of a historical Jesus does not make the text any less of a myth. There is absolutely no evidence of any supernatural occurrence involved. The Biblical Jesus is a myth. Furthermore, if you accept that Jesus did exist as he was claimed to (even minus the miracles) then Acts is a largely inaccurate text in that the Romans would have acted differently.


I didn't say they proved Jesus, merely that they are evidence. I'm contending your point that history proves Christianity a myth.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Jahoclave » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:55 am UTC

SummerGlauFan wrote:
Jahoclave wrote:
SummerGlauFan wrote:
Jahoclave wrote:
Meem1029 wrote:I think the main problem with the ad (for me at least) is that it is saying that no person with reason is a Christian. That is not acceptable to me. On the other hand, I do acknowledge that there are Christian groups who similarly attack atheists for their beliefs, which I do not condone either.

Well, it's still accurate. Historical evidence points to Christianity being a myth, especially the idea that Jesus was born on Christmas (which even the text doesn't support). Ergo, believing it to be true is unreasonable. The problem is holding belief as sacrosanct and above critique. If we treat belief as something that can't be critiqued then we lend ourselves into two propositions. We only allow belief we agree with as sacrosanct, or we allow a whole lot of dangerous shit through because we think it's rude to critique belief.


Sorry to disappoint, but history far from proves Christianity a myth. There are even historical documents outside of the Bible that mention Jesus as a person. Not trying to get into a debate, but that blanket statement was in error, mate.

You are correct, however, that the Bible does not say Jesus was born in the winter. It was likely sometime during spring/summer. However, that's hardly a crux on Christian faith.

I would contend that point and point out that those documents don't conclusively prove the existence of Jesus and that there is a growing adherence to the non-existence of a historical Jesus. See the works of Richard Carrier. Beyond that, existence of a historical Jesus does not make the text any less of a myth. There is absolutely no evidence of any supernatural occurrence involved. The Biblical Jesus is a myth. Furthermore, if you accept that Jesus did exist as he was claimed to (even minus the miracles) then Acts is a largely inaccurate text in that the Romans would have acted differently.


I didn't say they proved Jesus, merely that they are evidence. I'm contending your point that history proves Christianity a myth.

Except that even evidence of a person named Jesus doesn't make it not a myth. Christianity meets every definition of a myth straight to the nonacademic use of being false. It is, in every sense of the definition, a myth. And, unless we're granting supernatural resurrection, it's a story that didn't happen.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Larry » Wed Dec 01, 2010 5:58 am UTC

ConMan wrote:I agree, I dislike the militancy with which the messages on both sides are being posted (but I'm a pretty non-confrontational guy). I'd prefer something like "You don't need God to be good this Christmas" with an image of people helping at a homeless shelter or a family spending time together or something. It still gets across a non-religious message, but in a way that I think better suggests "Can't we all just get along?" than "Christians are idiots for believing the things they do.

This is a much better idea. There's no need to be a dick about it.
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White Wine in the Sun by Tim Minchin wrote:And yes I have all of the usual objections to the miseducation
Of children forced into a cult institution and taught to externalise blame
And to feel ashamed and to judge things as plain right and wrong

The song is celebrating the fact that he enjoys Christmas because of the time he gets to spend with his family, but dislikes the fact that the holiday is so intertwined with religion. But anyway, back to the topic at hand.

Linked. Because it's a beautiful song in it's own right.

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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby folkhero » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:05 am UTC

I'm not really sure what's so dickish, offensive or militant about trying to get people to think about their beliefs and where they came from. Whet I find interesting is that I think that the Catholic billboard also furthers this purpose; it makes an epistemological argument instead of an emotion based on emotion or the rejection of blasphemy. If someone sees both of these billboards, they might actually stop to think about what they believe, what they think that they know and how they came to those beliefs and that supposed knowledge.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Internetmeme » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:27 am UTC

Okay, regardless of religion, when did Christmas stop being a Western holiday and start being a dicking-match between all the religions and not-religions?
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Steax » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:39 am UTC

Wait, I thought that while it's easy to prove something as true, disproving something is a whole different matter. Unless you can say "no, no males were born in the area and time where Jesus (as a human) was," then how could you say that "historical evidence indicates that it's a myth"? Unless you know some historical evidence that I don't, which is a big possibility since I don't really know much about this topic.

Interestingly, the atheists are going against Muslims too in this regard (they believe in Jesus too, just in a different light). I wonder how this ends up.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Not A Raptor » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:46 am UTC

Internetmeme wrote:Okay, regardless of religion, when did Christmas stop being a Western holiday and start being a dicking-match between all the religions and not-religions?

When has the entire world and everything in it not been a giant dicking-match? All through history, you'll see almost nothing but dicking-matches and the products of people sick of said dicking-matches. I begin to suspect that it is impossible that the time-honored (snicker) dicking-match will ever cease to exist... or even see a decline in use.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby folkhero » Wed Dec 01, 2010 6:55 am UTC

Well if, for example, the census in the story of Christmas had a complete lack of any historical evidence outside of scripture, despite the fact that a census requiring that everyone returned to their home town would have been so unusual and monumental that someone else almost certainly would have written it down. So while historical evidence might not conclusively prove, in a purely logical sense, that it's a myth, it can certainly suggest that any explanation other than 'it's a myth' is entirely implausible.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Steax » Wed Dec 01, 2010 7:02 am UTC

The problem is that the term "myth" can indicate something as ambiguously true/false, or it could indicate something as being "almost-false-like-bigfoot-kind-of-false-as-in-conclusively-false-just-lacking-a-final-proof". Atheists are probably along the first interpretation ("can you prove it happened?") while religious people see the second, thus getting offended. The "REASON" bit also has an air of condescending to it.

In either case, the mythbusters will be busy this christmas.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby doogly » Wed Dec 01, 2010 7:11 am UTC

As an atheist I can clarify that Jesus has the same likelihood to me as Bigfoot. Bigfoot is more likable though.
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Greyarcher » Wed Dec 01, 2010 7:58 am UTC

Jahoclave wrote:Speaking of which, the Catholics responded. Link
Well done, Catholics. I really like how you've placed "Jesus" in contradistinction to "Reason". :lol:

Steax wrote:The problem is that the term "myth" can indicate something as ambiguously true/false, or it could indicate something as being "almost-false-like-bigfoot-kind-of-false-as-in-conclusively-false-just-lacking-a-final-proof". Atheists are probably along the first interpretation ("can you prove it happened?") while religious people see the second, thus getting offended. The "REASON" bit also has an air of condescending to it.
Less like "false" and more like "nowhere near enough reason to believe". Less like Bigfoot and more like Greek gods, Hindu gods, Aztec gods, Egyptian gods, Sumerian gods, etc. ...though actually, I guess those are equally dubious for both monotheists and non-believers. :D
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Re: Atheist Christmas Advertising

Postby Brooklynxman » Wed Dec 01, 2010 8:44 am UTC

Greyarcher wrote:
Jahoclave wrote:Speaking of which, the Catholics responded. Link
Well done, Catholics. I really like how you've placed "Jesus" in contradistinction to "Reason". :lol:

Steax wrote:The problem is that the term "myth" can indicate something as ambiguously true/false, or it could indicate something as being "almost-false-like-bigfoot-kind-of-false-as-in-conclusively-false-just-lacking-a-final-proof". Atheists are probably along the first interpretation ("can you prove it happened?") while religious people see the second, thus getting offended. The "REASON" bit also has an air of condescending to it.
Less like "false" and more like "nowhere near enough reason to believe". Less like Bigfoot and more like Greek gods, Hindu gods, Aztec gods, Egyptian gods, Sumerian gods, etc. ...though actually, I guess those are equally dubious for both monotheists and non-believers. :D


Greek gods are easy to disprove, as all you have to do is climb Mount Olympus, shout "Zeus likes to suck the big ones, especially Hades', who's dick is much bigger then Zeus's". When you aren't either immediately killed by lightning or raped by whatever animal Zeus feels like being now, you have proven that Zeus doesn't exist (at no point ever has Zeus shown himself to be able to hold his temper).

I will say I think as long as their are religious billboards, there can and should be atheist ones. I think this one was done somewhat tastelessly, which, given its position and time of year make it extremely unfortunate. They didn't need to call it a myth or equate believing it to a lack of reason, and in fact I could argue they showed a lack of reason not realizing their choice of words would make things worse. However, no matter what they did, there would be Christians up in arms about this, which makes me find it hard to lay too much blame on the atheists.
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