In other news... (humorous news items)

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eSOANEM
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby eSOANEM » Thu May 30, 2013 5:03 pm UTC

Diadem wrote:
eSOANEM wrote:gig = hard g (both times)
gill = hard g
gin = soft g
git = hard g
give = hard g

It seems to me that what you are calling a 'hard g' is actually more a k-like sound. English doesn't even have a hard g, you will only find it in loan words such as "Loch Ness" or "Schadenfreude".


This is complete bollocks. I will explain more fully later in this post, but you are completely wrong. The g-like sound you describe in loch ness is a soft g not a hard g and is not present in schadenfreude.

CorruptUser wrote:The English g is pronounced as an audible 'ch' or an audible 'k'. Audibles being the sounds you can't whisper. Go ahead, try to whisper 'dig'; it comes out 'tick'. Spanish doesn't have the audible part, so to a Spanish speaker, p and b sound alike, as do j and ch, g and k.

The rhotics (r and l) are... complicated.

Mandarin doesn't have a ch, zh (Jacques, azure, illusion) or j sounds exactly. The versions of those sounds are made with the tongue at the top of the mouth rather than near the front, which are almost the same but not quite. So you will see Chinese words written with Q for the ch, Zh for the j, and X for the zh.


No, this is a terrible way of analysing phonics.

English hard g is a voiced velar plosive. That is what it is. English k is an unvoiced velar plosive. What you mean by "audible" is voiced (and using ch and zh etc. isn't a great way of desribing locations/methods of production for various sounds because orthography is not a bijection).

English soft g varies but, depending on context is either a voiced postalveolar fricative or voiced postalveolar affricate. The former of these is the French (and, I believe, Italian) soft g.

The ch is "loch" is a velar fricative and doesn't exist in any standard English dialect except in loans. This is also the Spanish soft g.

In IPA:

hard g (agreed upon across Europe) = [g]
English soft g = [ʒ] or [ʤ] (I don't think this distinction is phonemic but the latter is more common in native words than the former)
French soft g = [ʒ]
Spanish soft g (and German and Scottish ch) = [x] or [ç] (no phonemic distinction, it depends entirely on the surrounding vowels)

All of these languages have a hard/soft g distinction and have the same hard pronunciation, but the soft variant varies a lot.

Spanish does have phonemic voicing (see peso/beso) at least with some consonants. Neither the "j" or "ch" sounds (by which I assume you mean those sounds in "jeans" and "chat" respectively) exist in Spanish (at least not in native words) so of course they aren't distinguished.

It is not surprising that Mandarin does not have directly the same consonants as in English. Besides, the hard/soft g distinction is a feature of European languages (and I think, more specifically a romance distinction which presumably got brought across to English with the Normans) so of course no such distinction really exists there.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby addams » Thu May 30, 2013 5:10 pm UTC

Tyndmyr wrote:
yurell wrote:I don't understand why the creator isn't Word of God when it comes to the pronunciation* of the name of their product.
*With obvious leeway given for accents


Why should they be? If I invent a different form of something, and decide to call it something ridiculous...or even merely lengthy, or not memorable, people might even invent an entirely different term to call it. Different pronunciation? Hell, even normal English words change over the years, let alone pronunciations. There basically is no word of god in English.

Or, Any other language.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Diadem » Thu May 30, 2013 10:14 pm UTC

eSOANEM wrote:
Diadem wrote:It seems to me that what you are calling a 'hard g' is actually more a k-like sound. English doesn't even have a hard g, you will only find it in loan words such as "Loch Ness" or "Schadenfreude".


This is complete bollocks. I will explain more fully later in this post, but you are completely wrong. The g-like sound you describe in loch ness is a soft g not a hard g and is not present in schadenfreude.

Well the correct pronounciation of "loch" is extremely hard for a native english speaker, so most people pronounce it something like "lock". But the correct pronunciation is with a hard g, like the first audio file in this link. A sound that doesn't exist in English, but does exist in a number of other languages, including Scottish, German and Dutch.

Schadenfreude is indeed a slightly different sound, though the difference is subtle enough that I don't think most people who haven't studied language would notice. I used the example because it came up earlier in this thread, and is an English word. But better examples from German are "Kuchen" (cake) or "Bach".

eSOANEM wrote:The ch is "loch" is a velar fricative and doesn't exist in any standard English dialect except in loans. This is also the Spanish soft g.

I'm no language expert. Wikipedia calls it a "voiceless velar fricative". But it also calls the exact same sounds "voiced velar fricative" and "voiceless uvular fricative", so I have no idea what they are on about. I don't speak Spanish, I have no idea how the sound is called in Spanish, or even if it's really the same sound. Maybe they call it a soft g, maybe they have an even harder g in there somewhere.

But my point still stands: In English they speak of a soft g (gin) and a hard g (girl), but both are really soft g's compared to the g in loch.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby nitePhyyre » Thu May 30, 2013 11:24 pm UTC

Diadem wrote:But my point still stands: In English they speak of a soft g (gin) and a hard g (girl), but both are really soft g's compared to the g in loch.
Did you just Purity 'g' sounds?
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Diadem » Thu May 30, 2013 11:34 pm UTC

'hard' and 'soft' are not value judgements are they?
It's one of those irregular verbs, isn't it? I have an independent mind, you are an eccentric, he is round the twist
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby eSOANEM » Fri May 31, 2013 1:06 am UTC

Diadem wrote:
eSOANEM wrote:
Diadem wrote:It seems to me that what you are calling a 'hard g' is actually more a k-like sound. English doesn't even have a hard g, you will only find it in loan words such as "Loch Ness" or "Schadenfreude".


This is complete bollocks. I will explain more fully later in this post, but you are completely wrong. The g-like sound you describe in loch ness is a soft g not a hard g and is not present in schadenfreude.

Well the correct pronounciation of "loch" is extremely hard for a native english speaker, so most people pronounce it something like "lock". But the correct pronunciation is with a hard g, like the first audio file in this link. A sound that doesn't exist in English, but does exist in a number of other languages, including Scottish, German and Dutch.


No.

This is not a hard g. Hard and soft are conventional terms given to the two phonemes represented by the letter g. They are consistent with the concepts of lenition and fortition and so the convention is that stops are hard and fricatives and affricates are soft. The ch is loch is a fricative. It is phonemically soft. Whether you consider a hard sound is irrelevant. It is a soft g.

Diadem wrote:Schadenfreude is indeed a slightly different sound, though the difference is subtle enough that I don't think most people who haven't studied language would notice. I used the example because it came up earlier in this thread, and is an English word. But better examples from German are "Kuchen" (cake) or "Bach".


Schadenfreude is a loan word so cannot be expected to follow English rules of prounciation. German does have this ch sound corresponding to the Spanish soft g.

Diadem wrote:
eSOANEM wrote:The ch is "loch" is a velar fricative and doesn't exist in any standard English dialect except in loans. This is also the Spanish soft g.

I'm no language expert. Wikipedia calls it a "voiceless velar fricative". But it also calls the exact same sounds "voiced velar fricative" and "voiceless uvular fricative", so I have no idea what they are on about. I don't speak Spanish, I have no idea how the sound is called in Spanish, or even if it's really the same sound. Maybe they call it a soft g, maybe they have an even harder g in there somewhere.

But my point still stands: In English they speak of a soft g (gin) and a hard g (girl), but both are really soft g's compared to the g in loch.


There are allophonic variations in spanish with the back fricatives (which can be represented as j, g (when in its soft form) or x). They are not distinguished phonemically though.

The point is, the "g" in girl is a hard g because that is how "hard" is defined when it comes to the different g phonemes. All fricative and affricate phonemes associated with the letter are considered soft. That this disagrees with your intuition is irrelevant and does not matter. Gin does have a soft g, girl does have a hard g and the ch in loch is (in some languages (not Scots English)) a soft g.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Iulus Cofield » Fri May 31, 2013 1:25 am UTC

"Hard" and "soft" are not technical terms. It is not surprising that different people would assign different meanings to them. In fact, the total lack of consistency in terms like hard, soft, dark, and guttural is why they were abandoned by linguists in the first place.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Carlington » Fri May 31, 2013 4:31 am UTC

And, as a quiet aside, "Schadenfreude" does not have the same consonant as "loch" (or "Kuchen", or "Bach") anywhere in it. The consonant in "loch", as pointed out by eSOANEM, is a voiceless velar fricative, which is the same as this Spanish g sound, and is the same as the final consonant in "Bach" and the middle consonant in "Kuchen". This is represented, in the IPA, by /x/ or /ç/. The initial sound in "Schadenfreude", on the other hand, is a voiceless postaveolar fricative, represented by /ʃ/.

In short, the sound represented in German orthography by "ch" is /x/ or /ç/, depending on context. This is also the sound represented in Spanish orthography by "g", in some instances. However, again as pointed out by eSOANEM, since there are two separate phonemes represented in English by the letter "g", a convention was developed by phoneticists to refer to the sound that is more lenis as "soft g", this being the affricate /ʒ/ (as in beige) or /dʒ/ (as in giraffe, gin), and that which is more fortis as "hard g", being the plosive /g/ (as in gate, give)
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby eSOANEM » Fri May 31, 2013 10:30 am UTC

Iulus Cofield wrote:"Hard" and "soft" are not technical terms. It is not surprising that different people would assign different meanings to them. In fact, the total lack of consistency in terms like hard, soft, dark, and guttural is why they were abandoned by linguists in the first place.


They are technical terms, just deprecated ones. When applied generally they are not useful. In specific cases (primarily those where a single grapheme can represent two distinct phonemes, one of which is a stop and the other is an affricate, fricative, approximant etc.) it is still a useful term. Hard and soft also survive in the terms lenition and fortition which are still used. These terms imply a hierarchy of hardness from stops -> affricates -> fricatives -> approximants (sometimes with some extra stages thrown in).

That said, it is better to talk about /g/ and /j/ (and [g], [ʤ], [ʒ] and [x]) than hard and soft g which is why I've been trying to use the IPA wherever possible. Unfortunately it has the disadvantage of making the post less accessible.

Hard and soft are certainly not ideal terms and ought to be avoided however, in this context the context of the grapheme <g> they have always meant the same thing which is that the stop is hard and whatever other phoneme it sometimes represents is soft.

Carlington wrote:And, as a quiet aside, "Schadenfreude" does not have the same consonant as "loch" (or "Kuchen", or "Bach") anywhere in it. The consonant in "loch", as pointed out by eSOANEM, is a voiceless velar fricative, which is the same as this Spanish g sound, and is the same as the final consonant in "Bach" and the middle consonant in "Kuchen". This is represented, in the IPA, by /x/ or /ç/. The initial sound in "Schadenfreude", on the other hand, is a voiceless postaveolar fricative, represented by /ʃ/.

In short, the sound represented in German orthography by "ch" is /x/ or /ç/, depending on context. This is also the sound represented in Spanish orthography by "g", in some instances. However, again as pointed out by eSOANEM, since there are two separate phonemes represented in English by the letter "g", a convention was developed by phoneticists to refer to the sound that is more lenis as "soft g", this being the affricate /ʒ/ (as in beige) or /dʒ/ (as in giraffe, gin), and that which is more fortis as "hard g", being the plosive /g/ (as in gate, give)


It's worth pointing out that French and Spanish also both have this hard/soft distinction with <g> being /g/ before /a/, /o/ and /u/ but being /j/ before /e/ and /i/. There are of course exceptions but the rule is broadly thus.

English messes with this because it's a germanic language and so many words with the <gi> or <ge> cluster are pronounced with /g/ not /j/ because they have a Germanic root.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Iulus Cofield » Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:08 am UTC

Theft of ribs gets five-time felon 50 years in prison

All Willie Smith Ward wanted was his baby-back ribs, but it cost him 50 years in prison.

His problems started when he tucked a large rack under his shirt and tried to leave the H-E-B store at 1102 Speight Ave. without paying in September 2011.

A jury in Waco’s 19th State District Court also didn’t like the 43-year-old Ward’s previous five felony and four misdemeanor convictions and recommended that Ward be sentenced to 50 years in prison as a habitual criminal.

Jurors took two minutes Wednesday to convict Ward on robbery charges and about an hour to decide his punishment.
...


Being Texas, I assume if he had been a six time felon he would have been sentenced to death by cowboy shootout.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Jun 01, 2013 2:46 am UTC

He threatened the guy with a knife. He should get like, 6 months in prison total, tops. But everything has to be bigger in Texas. Wonder what they are compensating for.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby iamspen » Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:08 am UTC

I'd prefer giving him debilitating fines rather than spending millions upon millions to incarcerate him. One of those is lucrative, the other is a colossal waste of money (especially in such a red state, where wasteful spending is allegedly frowned upon).

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:50 am UTC

He was stealing ribs. Doubt he'd pay the fines anyway, and even if he was forced to, he'd what, steal to pay the fines?

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby iamspen » Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:21 am UTC

Okay. So we'll jail him for 50 years instead? Quality solution!

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Magnanimous » Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:45 pm UTC

Magnetic monopoles created! ... kind of.
Spoiler:
A team of researchers from Cologne, Munich and Dresden have managed to create artificial magnetic monopoles. To do this, the scientists merged tiny magnetic whirls, so-called skyrmions. At the point of merging, the physicists were able to create a monopole, which has similar characteristics to a fundamental particle postulated by Paul Dirac in 1931. In addition to fundamental research, the monopoles may also have application potential. The question of whether magnetic whirls can be used in the production of computer components one day is currently being researched by a number of groups worldwide.

When a magnet is divided, a new magnet with north and south poles is always created. However, a monopole, i.e. a north pole without a south pole or a south pole without a north pole has not yet been discovered. In the current edition of the journal Science, researchers from Cologne, Munich and Dresden describe the discovery of new type of artificial monopole in a solid, i.e. particles, which have similar characteristics to monopoles, but which only exist within materials.

Over the last few years, materials in which magnetic whirls, so-called skyrmions, are formed, have been examined intensively. These whirls influence the movements of the electrons in exactly the same manner as magnetic fields. For this reason, artificial magnet fields are used to describe these whirls as well as their influence on the electrons.

Even if these are not "real" magnetic fields, it is possible to measure them experimentally in the same manner as normal magnet fields as they deflect electrons.

The researchers asked questions as to the consequences of attempting to destroy the magnetic whirls. To do this, the group working under the direction of Prof. Eng from the Technischen Universität Dresden observed magnetic whirls with a magnetic force microscope: a tiny magnetic tip samples the surface of the magnets and measures the direction of the magnetization thus making the ca. 50 nanometer sized whirl visible. They were able to observe on the surface that the magnetic whirls apparently coalesce when the skyrmion phase is destroyed.

What happens, however, within the materials? Measurements taken by the group working under the direction of Prof. Pfleiderer in Munich using neutron scattering suggest that similar processes occur there, but individual whirls were not observed in this manner. For this reason, Stefan Buhrandt and Christoph Schütte working in Prof. Rosch's group at the University of Cologne conducted computer simulations. These showed that the whirls neighbouring the merging process observed on the surface in the experiment also occur within the materials.

Due to the fact that every whirl carries an artificial magnetic field, their creation or destruction occurs at the point of merging. "This means that an artificial magnetic monopole has to sit on this point," describes Prof. Rosch, "whenever two magnetic whirls merge in the experiment, an artificial magnetic monopole has flown through surface."

Magnetic monopoles have been searched for in vain in the area of particle physics for a long time. In 1931, Paul Dirac postulated the existence of a fundamental particle to explain why electrons and protons carry electrical charges of the same size. This is surprising because the elements of the protons and electrons are completely different fundamental particles. Dirac, however, argued that the existence of a single magnetic monopole would be enough to explain that the charges of all fundamental particles have to be quantized, i.e. exactly an integer multiple of an elementary charge. The newly discovered artificial monopoles fulfil exactly this quantization requirement. "It is fascinating that something as fundamental as a magnetic monopole can be realized in a piece of material," describes Stefan Buhrandt. Despite this, artificial monopoles cannot solve Dirac's problem: only electrons in solid state, but not protons, feel the artificial magnet fields.

In addition to their use for fundamental research, artificial monopoles could also have application potential. Many groups worldwide are currently researching the question of whether magnetic whirls could be used in the production of computer components. If this were possible, one would also have to create and destroy whirls: magnetic monopoles would then play an important role in this.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Iulus Cofield » Sun Jun 02, 2013 12:54 am UTC


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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Sheikh al-Majaneen » Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:18 am UTC

I thought the meaning of Pope Francis's remarks was clear and obvious. Not sure why the confusion.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Mighty Jalapeno » Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:28 am UTC

Sheikh al-Majaneen wrote:I thought the meaning of Pope Francis's remarks was clear and obvious. Not sure why the confusion.

Exactly. Heretical.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Iulus Cofield » Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:59 am UTC

Indeed. Pope Benedict must be spinning in his grave.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby PhoenixEnigma » Sun Jun 02, 2013 6:06 am UTC

Iulus Cofield wrote:Indeed. Pope Benedict must be spinning in his grave.

Just to be clear (and for others that aren't), you're aware that Benedict is the sole living expope, right?
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Iulus Cofield » Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:35 am UTC

That is the joke, yes, along with his reputation as a distinguished and very conservative theologian.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby addams » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:12 am UTC

It must be so weird for people that take what The Pope says to heart.

I think about that stuff from time to time.
First version: Those that are Saved will go to Heaven.
(The fine points on what it is to be Saved changes like hem lines.)

Then: All persons through JC; Our Lord.

The last Pope saw that Not All will be welcome: "Many, Most, will go to Heaven and Live with the Love of God."

Now; The People are asked to open their minds, again.
We are back to All persons. I was so Good with that, once upon a time.

I am not good with it, anymore.
The Pope may be such a sweet and charming man, he may be able to convince me.

I have met some people in the last few years.
If I discovered there IS a God.
I would be able to point to these Men and Women and say to God,
"If you are OK with him and her, then I am Not OK with you!"

What? Is this new Pope a Buddhist? oh; HoHum.
His Job is to bring the Light of God into the world.

It has Got to be a tough Job. That man may believe he answers to God.
I understand the point of view that says, "Terrible people change and there is a place for forgiveness."

If The Pope says All people can be good, then All people can be good.
It is harder work for some than for others.

I don't have to forgive. That is the Pope's job.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby bentheimmigrant » Mon Jun 03, 2013 1:44 pm UTC

"Comment is free, but facts are sacred" - C.P. Scott

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:01 pm UTC

The old 'stfu we aren't as bad as X' gambit. Only works if 1) X isn't getting any attention, and 2) you actually aren't as bad as X.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby KrytenKoro » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:05 pm UTC

Pope Francis didn't actually say anything that hasn't been official church doctrine for ages...it basically amounted to "even if you're an atheist, you shouldn't just give up and kill yourself now, because you still have the opportunity to convert!"

The whole hullaballoo about this is just because of irresponsible journalism hyping a non-issue.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby bentheimmigrant » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:38 pm UTC

Pretty much. There are verses in the bible saying Christ died for all men. Francis came out with an iteration of that, and people who don't actually know what's in the book got mad.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby nitePhyyre » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:04 pm UTC

Aren't magnetic monopoles a necessary and sufficient prerequisite for a whole host of magical new sci-fi tech?

bentheimmigrant wrote:Pretty much. There are verses in the bible saying Christ died for all men. Francis came out with an iteration of that, and people who don't actually know what's in the book got mad.
It is kind of confusing though. Christ died to save all men, but you can only be saved through christ. So christ filled his end of the bargain, I have to do something for my end, but that something isn't "be a christian" and it apparently isn't "believe in god". I know I can't blaspheme against the holy spirit, Jesus won't forgive that, but outside of that, what the hell do you want from me?
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Xeio » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:39 pm UTC

Well that's interesting...

Also potentially interesting; Scalia, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, and Kagan as the dissenting opinion?

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Роберт » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:55 pm UTC

Xeio wrote:Well that's interesting...

Also potentially interesting; Scalia, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, and Kagan as the dissenting opinion?

Worth quoting:
Justice Antonin Scalia summarized his dissent from the bench, a rare move signaling deep disagreement.

“Make no mistake about it: because of today’s decision, your D.N.A. can be taken and entered into a national database if you are ever arrested, rightly or wrongly, and for whatever reason,” he said.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby firechicago » Mon Jun 03, 2013 5:27 pm UTC

Xeio wrote:Also potentially interesting; Scalia, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, and Kagan as the dissenting opinion?

4th amendment cases have a long history of producing strange bedfellows between libertarian conservatives and liberals who are skeptical of police overreach.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby dudiobugtron » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:17 pm UTC

It's silly that 'being arrested' is the cut-off line for DNA sampling. IMO, DNA records should be made at birth and everyone's DNA should be on file, to help the police (state) do it's job. But if they're not going to do that, then I don't see why some innocent people should be subjected to this, and others not, based on how much the police like you.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:31 pm UTC

firechicago wrote:
Xeio wrote:Also potentially interesting; Scalia, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, and Kagan as the dissenting opinion?

4th amendment cases have a long history of producing strange bedfellows between libertarian conservatives and liberals who are skeptical of police overreach.


Or maybe, just maybe, we all kind of agree on most things? And that often our differences are not the goal, but the means?

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby yurell » Mon Jun 03, 2013 10:59 pm UTC

dudiobugtron wrote:It's silly that 'being arrested' is the cut-off line for DNA sampling. IMO, DNA records should be made at birth and everyone's DNA should be on file


Ditto, and perhaps while they're at it they can increase the number of datapoints on the sample a bit more, so that unrelated people can't be matched at random (it does happen).
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby ConMan » Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:17 pm UTC

We had a little kerfuffle in Australia recently with a reasonably prominent Indigenous Australian football player being compared to an ape by a broadcaster who I suspect still doesn't fully understand why that's so stupid, and another broadcaster writes a fantastic article about privelege and institutionalised racism without mentioning either term, and how he knows nothing about racism.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Thesh » Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:29 pm UTC

yurell wrote:
dudiobugtron wrote:It's silly that 'being arrested' is the cut-off line for DNA sampling. IMO, DNA records should be made at birth and everyone's DNA should be on file


Ditto, and perhaps while they're at it they can increase the number of datapoints on the sample a bit more, so that unrelated people can't be matched at random (it does happen).


The database isn't the problem, it's the rules on using partial DNA samples as evidence from crime scenes. I remember hearing about a guy convicted solely off of a match in a DNA database with a partial DNA sample from crime scene evidence. It was along the lines of the number of markers in the crime scene sample were such that the odds of a match were 1 in 100 million and they searched a database of a million people (which means you have a pretty good chance of a match, no matter what), but thanks to the media the jury thinks DNA = 100% certainty.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Tyndmyr » Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:50 am UTC

Both are problems. I can think of a LOT of reasons why I wouldn't want my DNA to be recorded or shared. Basically all the same ones as any other privacy issue, really.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby dudiobugtron » Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:56 am UTC

Tyndmyr wrote:Both are problems. I can think of a LOT of reasons why I wouldn't want my DNA to be recorded or shared. Basically all the same ones as any other privacy issue, really.

Same here. But I can also think of a lot of reasons why I want everyone else's DNA to be shared, and overall I'm happy to have mine shared if needed to effect that.
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Fire Brns » Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:10 am UTC

nitePhyyre wrote:
Aren't magnetic monopoles a necessary and sufficient prerequisite for a whole host of magical new sci-fi tech?
Don't anti-trust laws prevent magnetic monopolies? :P

bentheimmigrant wrote:Pretty much. There are verses in the bible saying Christ died for all men. Francis came out with an iteration of that, and people who don't actually know what's in the book got mad.
It is kind of confusing though. Christ died to save all men, but you can only be saved through christ. So christ filled his end of the bargain, I have to do something for my end, but that something isn't "be a christian" and it apparently isn't "believe in god". I know I can't blaspheme against the holy spirit, Jesus won't forgive that, but outside of that, what the hell do you want from me?
Well, If the bible is to be believed at all then there is Acts 24:14 which -and I'm paraphrasing- says "there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked" So it basically comes down to "it doesn't matter what you do right now, as long as you are willing to do what god wants you to do after the resurrection then you are safe".
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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby Iulus Cofield » Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:22 am UTC

That's kind of a silly interpretation. If you just have to do the believing in God stuff after he's magically resurrected you at the end of the world, then you obviously aren't going to be an atheist then. Pascal clearly had it backwards, if that's true.

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Re: In other news... (humorous news items, etc)

Postby PhoenixEnigma » Tue Jun 04, 2013 3:05 am UTC

bentheimmigrant wrote:Pretty much. There are verses in the bible saying Christ died for all men. Francis came out with an iteration of that, and people who don't actually know what's in the book got mad.
It's a touch less straight forward than that. From the article:

Francis’ most recent remarks also tapped into a passionate debate in church circles over a new translation of the Mass that was ordered by Benedict XVI. One of the most problematic aspects of the new translation concerns a crucial Eucharistic prayer in which the priest used to say that Jesus’ blood was “shed for you and for all.” Now the Latin phrase has been translated to read “for you and for many.”

The twerk from “all” to “many” may sound like inside baseball for church geeks, but it actually has profound implications for how Catholics view the nature of salvation, the mission of Jesus and the church’s role in the world.

“Do church leaders want to signal that the grace of Christ is available only to the regular, traditional churchgoer? Is their intention to leave out the rest?” the Rev. Paul Philibert asked in a 2011 essay in America magazine. “More and more it looks as if the covert message beneath the written text is one of effective exclusion rather than antecedent inclusion of all humanity in God’s will for salvation.”
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