Anthony Weiner

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Tirian
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Tirian » Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:12 pm UTC

An interesting perspective from the Wall Street Journal notes that the New York state legislature needs to remove two Congressional districts, and one obvious two-birds-with-one-stone tactic would be to consciously fracture Weiner's district and blend it in with his neighbors to force his retirement at the end of this term. As I said before, I think he's bound to fall and he only gets to choose whether to jumps with dignity or be pushed without it.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby cephalopod9 » Tue Jun 07, 2011 8:47 pm UTC

Dauric wrote:
cephalopod9 wrote:First off, why does anyone ever feel the need to add -gate to something already as concise and self explanatory as Weiner Picture?
Watergate Scandal was one of the first 'modern' media-driven political scandals.
I am aware of Watergate. I am in fact aware enough to know that Watergate was not about water, so replacing water with the topic at hand to form Topicgate is not only ridiculously over used, it does not even make sense. I am sick of it.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Dauric » Tue Jun 07, 2011 9:00 pm UTC

cephalopod9 wrote:
Dauric wrote:
cephalopod9 wrote:First off, why does anyone ever feel the need to add -gate to something already as concise and self explanatory as Weiner Picture?
Watergate Scandal was one of the first 'modern' media-driven political scandals.
I am aware of Watergate. I am in fact aware enough to know that Watergate was not about water, so replacing water with the topic at hand to form Topicgate is not only ridiculously over used, it does not even make sense.

You're expecting modern media to make sense? I mean sure they should be accurate if they were presenting news, and one would wish for more wit if they were providing entertainment, but those ships have sailed and we're left with the S.S. Infotainment, a hybrid compromise between the two that doesn't have the performance of News or Entertainment but tries desperately to do both while doing nothing really well.

I am sick of it.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby LtNOWIS » Tue Jun 07, 2011 10:03 pm UTC

Etymologies don't need to make sense.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby aleflamedyud » Tue Jun 07, 2011 10:47 pm UTC

FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Xeio » Tue Jun 07, 2011 11:01 pm UTC

aleflamedyud wrote:FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!
For president? I don't think this scandal is anywhere near the level you need to be unelectable for just senate or something. Have you seen what our politicians are up to?

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Garm » Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:31 am UTC

Xeio wrote:
aleflamedyud wrote:FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!
For president? I don't think this scandal is anywhere near the level you need to be unelectable for just senate or something. Have you seen what our politicians are up to?


Seriously... wait like 10 years and suddenly serving divorce papers to your wife while she's in the hospital so you can marry the woman you already proposed to seems like a vague memory.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Silknor » Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:08 am UTC

Garm wrote:
Seriously... wait like 10 years and suddenly serving divorce papers to your wife while she's in the hospital so you can marry the woman you already proposed to seems like a vague memory.


Not True.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby omgryebread » Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:10 am UTC

Silknor wrote:
Garm wrote:
Seriously... wait like 10 years and suddenly serving divorce papers to your wife while she's in the hospital so you can marry the woman you already proposed to seems like a vague memory.


Not True.
The beautiful* thing about scandals is that the truth isn't the truth. The facts of what occurred become columns sidelined by the headlines yelling what the accepted truth is. Eventually, that becomes the Truth. 10 years down the line, everyone knows and talks about the Truth, and what actually happens becomes an obscure column that doesn't affect public debate.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Garm » Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:21 am UTC

Silknor wrote:
Garm wrote:
Seriously... wait like 10 years and suddenly serving divorce papers to your wife while she's in the hospital so you can marry the woman you already proposed to seems like a vague memory.


Not True.


Hey, good to know. He's still a scumbag, but it's nice to know that he didn't double down on that particular wife's suffering.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby iChef » Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:06 am UTC

This is another reason I'm amazed we won the Cold War. Russian politicians would never flake our like our sissies (on both sides of the isle, not to mention pro athletes Mr. Farve) I can just see Vladimir Putin right now "da that's my penis, I send to over 100 women weekly" Right before he strips to the waist and kills a bear with his hands. That's the kind of guy I'll vote for. Not that I endorse unsolicited penile pictures, but if you're going to do it own up to it. With the kind of money these guys make put it on a damn billboard, at least then it will look HUGE.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Lucrece » Wed Jun 08, 2011 7:03 am UTC

Eh, I'd rather have something as dreadful as a Mike Huckabee over that backwater human rights hellhole that is the Russian government.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Nath » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:18 am UTC

cephalopod9 wrote:
Dauric wrote:
cephalopod9 wrote:First off, why does anyone ever feel the need to add -gate to something already as concise and self explanatory as Weiner Picture?
Watergate Scandal was one of the first 'modern' media-driven political scandals.
I am aware of Watergate. I am in fact aware enough to know that Watergate was not about water, so replacing water with the topic at hand to form Topicgate is not only ridiculously over used, it does not even make sense. I am sick of it.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Gelsamel » Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:16 pm UTC

I can.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Robot_Raptor » Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:04 pm UTC

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Jave D » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:50 pm UTC

This man makes apt, vocal and plentiful criticisms of the GOP for months if not years, but the only time the country as a whole pays attention to him is when he gets caught having an active sex life and not immediately telling the whole world all the details about it.

That's how politics is done in this country. Attack not the message, but the messenger. Hell, IGNORE the message. Just burn it! There are penis jokes to be made!

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Jave D » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:56 pm UTC

aleflamedyud wrote:FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!


So you support "hardcore progressives," but if they get caught having penises they're sleazebags?

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Eseell » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:02 am UTC

Jave D wrote:
aleflamedyud wrote:FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!


So you support "hardcore progressives," but if they get caught having penises exposing themselves sans solicitation they're sleazebags?

Yes.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Dark567 » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:54 am UTC

Today they found out his wife is pregnant and expecting their first child.

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/ ... -pregnant/
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Jave D » Thu Jun 09, 2011 1:14 am UTC

Eseell wrote:
Jave D wrote:
aleflamedyud wrote:FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!


So you support "hardcore progressives," but if they get caught having penises exposing themselves sans solicitation they're sleazebags?

Yes.


What's this "sans solicitation" nonsense now? Admittedly I've been away from the computer a few days so I may not have been keeping up with the media echo chamber as far as what he is or is not guilty of. Who was he exposed to, without solicitation? Andrew Breitbart?

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Eseell » Thu Jun 09, 2011 1:24 am UTC

Jave D wrote:
Eseell wrote:
Jave D wrote:
aleflamedyud wrote:FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!


So you support "hardcore progressives," but if they get caught having penises exposing themselves sans solicitation they're sleazebags?

Yes.


What's this "sans solicitation" nonsense now? Admittedly I've been away from the computer a few days so I may not have been keeping up with the media echo chamber as far as what he is or is not guilty of. Who was he exposed to, without solicitation? Andrew Breitbart?

I'm pretty sure that not all of his twitter followers wanted to see him pitch a tent.It appears that isn't what happened, and I misunderstood this whole story. Still, carrying on an affair makes you a sleazebag, but not an unelectable one.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Vaskafdt » Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:02 am UTC

I remember watching a tv show where a young politician that was running for office and got caught having sex with his wife in their car.

The whole democrat Vs Republican was best surmised by the news reporter in that episode.

this young politician was caught having sex in his car, that means he can't be a republican.
This just in, he was having sex with his wife.. he can't possibly be a democrat.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Tirian » Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:17 am UTC

Jave D wrote:
aleflamedyud wrote:FUCK! And there goes one of the really few hardcore progressives in the Democratic Party. I was fucking rooting for that guy and now he's completely unelectable and a sleazebag! FUCK!!!!!!


So you support "hardcore progressives," but if they get caught having penises they're sleazebags?


I don't have a problem with him having a penis. I have problem with a pattern of sexual harassment against young women who appreciate Weiner's mission, trusting that they will feel compromised into silence lest they harm the progressive movement by exposing* him. That behavior is despicable, and I think that it demeans the progressive movement to suggest that this crapsack can't be replaced by a progressive who doesn't think that young women exist to feed his exhibitionism.

* See what I did there?

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby podbaydoor » Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:19 am UTC

Do we know that they were unsolicited? (Edit: this isn't a combative question, I haven't been keeping up today so I don't know if new evidence has come to light.)
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Eseell » Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:23 am UTC

No, I was wrong, they probably were not unsolicited.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Garm » Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:24 am UTC

podbaydoor wrote:Do we know that they were unsolicited? (Edit: this isn't a combative question, I haven't been keeping up today so I don't know if new evidence has come to light.)


No. And we don't know if he committed adultery. Thought I'd toss that out there since people are jumping to conclusions like a bunch of lemmings.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby mr_pathetic » Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:48 am UTC

Perhaps it is just a prophesy of the movie Idiocracy coming true to have a congressman named Weiner, led by a Boehner. :wink:

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Tirian » Thu Jun 09, 2011 4:28 am UTC

podbaydoor wrote:Do we know that they were unsolicited? (Edit: this isn't a combative question, I haven't been keeping up today so I don't know if new evidence has come to light.)


The Merc is reporting that Gennette Cordova was not expecting to receive the photo and was puzzled by it, so I would categorize that as unsolicited. (Other new outlets seem to be chasing down the story that she's the sort of person who have been subtly "asking for it". For the record, I'm very unhappy about slut-shaming, and it's still the Congressman's responsibility to act like he's older than 21.) The article goes on to say that there is no pattern in the response among the six women known to been sexting partners, and evidently some of them could be said to have welcomed the overture.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby cephalopod9 » Thu Jun 09, 2011 4:36 am UTC

Know what makes this really weird for me? Trying to imagine an internetless parallel.
Would a senator exchanging romantic/erotic letters with women be treated as the same level of scandalousness as "sexting"?
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Lucrece » Thu Jun 09, 2011 7:32 am UTC

If that woman receiving the letters wasn't his wife, but instead several other women, yes.

Adultery as a possibility isn't the only scandalous aspect. It's that this guy is engaging in behavior that is stereotyped to immature teens. Imagine a gamer politician -- people would take him less seriously because we have expectations of ways to exert social status.

And then there was the whole elaborate lie that blamed somebody else. Do you really want a politician willing to conceal truths from his constituents calling the shots in Washington?

Because a guy who's willing to throw someone else under the bus to avoid backlash and then shamelessly and ineffectively lies to about everyone in the media until he's cornered is not someone I'd trust with the powers of public office.

No matter his positive record on issues important to ME. If we start putting our interests ahead of the integrity of the office, that's a quick way to corrupt government.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Princess Marzipan » Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:02 am UTC

I fully admit that you are CORRECT that a politician whose gaming hobby were publicized could lose political status. But I don't think that's acceptable, and I don't think it's acceptable to vilify Weiner politically over any consensual sexting acts or over infidelity to his wife.

There ARE things to vilify him over. I prefer not to, but I am likely biased and am holding off on deciding how I feel about the use of an "official" twitter account and the time spent lying. But sexting and cheating? I don't see him building his politics and his own name by leveraging his marriage, so its health and sanctity aren't shouldn't be politically relevant.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby LtNOWIS » Thu Jun 09, 2011 12:46 pm UTC

A wrecked or troubled marriage is a big distraction for a person. If someone is hugely distracted by personal problems, that can impact their job performance, judgement, etc. It's not good for a mayor or president to be preoccupied with personal drama. It matters a bit less for a legislator.

New York is losing seats in the House this cycle. The legislature needs to eliminate a downstate Representative, and there's a pretty high chance it will be Weiner.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Tirian » Thu Jun 09, 2011 1:30 pm UTC

Princess Marzipan wrote:I fully admit that you are CORRECT that a politician whose gaming hobby were publicized could lose political status. But I don't think that's acceptable, and I don't think it's acceptable to vilify Weiner politically over any consensual sexting acts or over infidelity to his wife.


There is a hierarchical power imbalance between Weiner and his Twitter groupies, and so I'm not fully prepared to use the word "consensual". It's nearly up there with getting it on with the intern. Weiner is evidently using his Twitter pool to find women with whom he can advance a relationship on his own terms, provided he is at least delicate enough that the woman wouldn't ever want to blow the whistle on him because that would compromise the political cause they share. I find that to be an implicitly coercive dynamic, and I think it would properly require much more indirect finesse than I am led to believe that Weiner used.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Heisenberg » Thu Jun 09, 2011 2:02 pm UTC

podbaydoor wrote:Do we know that they were unsolicited?
I think the first reports implied that they were, but Breitbart himself says they were part of an exchange.
Andrew Breitbart wrote:On Wednesday, May 18, 2011, Rep. Weiner sent an email to the young woman from that same Yahoo! email address that included the now-infamous grey underwear photograph (attached to the email as “package.JPG”):

Later that same day, apparently after receiving several images from the young woman, Rep. Weiner allegedly sent another photograph to her from the same Yahoo! email address.

That photograph (attached to the email as “ready.JPG”) is extremely graphic, and leaves nothing to the imagination.
It's an assumption to say that an exchange of images was probably consensual, but it's a pretty safe one.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Lucrece » Thu Jun 09, 2011 5:41 pm UTC

Princess Marzipan wrote:I fully admit that you are CORRECT that a politician whose gaming hobby were publicized could lose political status. But I don't think that's acceptable, and I don't think it's acceptable to vilify Weiner politically over any consensual sexting acts or over infidelity to his wife.

There ARE things to vilify him over. I prefer not to, but I am likely biased and am holding off on deciding how I feel about the use of an "official" twitter account and the time spent lying. But sexting and cheating? I don't see him building his politics and his own name by leveraging his marriage, so its health and sanctity aren't shouldn't be politically relevant.


Yeah, I never meant to imply that the judgement passed on being a gamer would be right. I just meant to say that the dalliances aren't the only aspect in the scandal harming him.

As much as we hate it, politics are all about appearances until we see some shift in education and initiative to research our representatives in a manner that makes us value really knowing and understanding the nuances of positions over taking the easy way out and watching cable news/reading some newspaper summary endorsement.

Can't really blame people, though. Legislation has been warped to be a tool of the elite, complete in obfuscation. Tell me how many people are capable of fully understanding ballots, let alone the full text of legislation. The layman has been marginalized, and they come to naively rely on people claiming that they have distilled the esoteric laws for the average man.

I will say that I'd have no problem ignoring infidelity or most other socially unorthodox behavior. But lying to keep constituents in the dark? No way. Didn't put up with that shit from the triangulating douchebag that is Clinton, and I won't put up with it with Weiner. The party needs to be cleansed of all the John Edwards. If anything, I deeply resent Weiner because he jeopardizes the seat to some GOP pondscum to take.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby jakovasaur » Fri Jun 10, 2011 12:22 pm UTC

Lucrece wrote:I will say that I'd have no problem ignoring infidelity or most other socially unorthodox behavior. But lying to keep constituents in the dark? No way. Didn't put up with that shit from the triangulating douchebag that is Clinton, and I won't put up with it with Weiner. The party needs to be cleansed of all the John Edwards. If anything, I deeply resent Weiner because he jeopardizes the seat to some GOP pondscum to take.

I agree with this, and would also like to add "blatantly bad judgment" as something that can't be overlooked. Even if he did nothing morally wrong (which he did by lying) he still lacked the foresight to see that this would end badly. That is not something I value in a politician.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Xeio » Fri Jun 10, 2011 12:31 pm UTC

jakovasaur wrote:
Lucrece wrote:I will say that I'd have no problem ignoring infidelity or most other socially unorthodox behavior. But lying to keep constituents in the dark? No way. Didn't put up with that shit from the triangulating douchebag that is Clinton, and I won't put up with it with Weiner. The party needs to be cleansed of all the John Edwards. If anything, I deeply resent Weiner because he jeopardizes the seat to some GOP pondscum to take.

I agree with this, and would also like to add "blatantly bad judgment" as something that can't be overlooked. Even if he did nothing morally wrong (which he did by lying) he still lacked the foresight to see that this would end badly. That is not something I value in a politician.

I don't think it should matter what they do with their personal lives (assuming it doesn't have an impact on the professional, such as conflicts of interest).

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby jakovasaur » Fri Jun 10, 2011 12:51 pm UTC

Xeio wrote:
jakovasaur wrote:
Lucrece wrote:I will say that I'd have no problem ignoring infidelity or most other socially unorthodox behavior. But lying to keep constituents in the dark? No way. Didn't put up with that shit from the triangulating douchebag that is Clinton, and I won't put up with it with Weiner. The party needs to be cleansed of all the John Edwards. If anything, I deeply resent Weiner because he jeopardizes the seat to some GOP pondscum to take.

I agree with this, and would also like to add "blatantly bad judgment" as something that can't be overlooked. Even if he did nothing morally wrong (which he did by lying) he still lacked the foresight to see that this would end badly. That is not something I value in a politician.

I don't think it should matter what they do with their personal lives (assuming it doesn't have an impact on the professional, such as conflicts of interest).

I agree, but the fact remains that it does matter, and he knows that it does, as evidenced by his lying. Just because it would be nice for the world a certain way doesn't justify acting as though you live in that world. Not when you have a responsibility to represent your constituents.

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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby Princess Marzipan » Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:50 pm UTC

The lying is bad, but it's indicative of the objective morality of his actions, just of the expected consequence of people knowing about them. I'm not excusing it by any means, but you're using it to bassackwardsly prove that ah HA he clearly IS a bad person for sexting, or else why would have lied about sexting?

I think the current media flurry is answer enough for that, especially since no in the media is even making a big deal anymore out of the days he spent lying. They're not REPORTING on the lying, they're reporting on the sexting. Which makes lying an attractive decision. A wrong one, but lying about something doesn't mean the thing being lied is necessarily objectively bad.
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Re: Anthony Weiner

Postby KnightExemplar » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:05 pm UTC

"Sex scandal" and "lying" are the least of my concerns when it comes to elected representatives.

I mean, the difference between Weiner and say... Governor Schwarzenegger is that Schwarzenegger was a better liar, and was able to keep his 14-year old illegitimate son a secret for his whole political career. (and his son, his wife, and his former employee were all good on keeping their mouths shut on the issue)

A liar is not necessarily a corrupt politician. Its just a politician who has something to hide. But all humans have something to hide...
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