Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Of the Tabletop, and other, lesser varieties.

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Aug 11, 2011 8:07 pm UTC

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broken_escalator wrote:it seems like we're talking about VI here.

I understand the confusion pertaining to the numbering scheme, but;
Izawwlgood wrote:I just read about low level or natural magic challenges for FF3, but can't seem to find anything about how this is actually possible to do (or if they are two different things?). I've seen videos of people at average character level 8 or so, killing Kefka, and I just don't get what's going on.

Also, do natural magic challenges exist in any other FF?
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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Endless Mike » Thu Aug 11, 2011 8:32 pm UTC

You could try to play FF8 without junctioning GFs.

Emphasis on try.

Although I guess that wouldn't be the same since there's no such thing as "natural" magic in that game.

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Dark567 » Thu Aug 11, 2011 8:39 pm UTC

Endless Mike wrote:You could try to play FF8 without junctioning GFs.

Emphasis on try.
If I recall, the only thing you could do is attack. IIRC you can't even use items without GF's.

...Yeah. Attacking over and over isn't going to get you far.
EDIT: And level scaling would make it impossible to just grind through
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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby philsov » Thu Aug 11, 2011 9:40 pm UTC

From my experience when discussing FF2 and 3 (SNES) there's just some letters at the end to denote which game you're referring to. Specifically, FF2j and FF3j refer to the nes incarnations while FF2us and FF3us refer to the SNES versions, nowadays known also as 4 and 6.

Also, do natural magic challenges exist in any other FF?


Not as far as I know. I know for FF12 international they included a zodiac-like job system instead of giving everyone everything, and so for people who have the game but not the international version they can easily self-limit the ability grid to only go along the lines that the job class offers to emulate the international version. But otherwise there's no distinction between "natural/known" and "unnatural/learned" magic for any other portion of the series.
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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby ProZac » Fri Aug 12, 2011 1:22 pm UTC

Dark567 wrote:
Endless Mike wrote:You could try to play FF8 without junctioning GFs.

Emphasis on try.
If I recall, the only thing you could do is attack. IIRC you can't even use items without GF's.

...Yeah. Attacking over and over isn't going to get you far.
EDIT: And level scaling would make it impossible to just grind through

There is a 'challenge' associated with FF8 though, which is to be the game at the level you start at. Since all enemies scale with you (I believe), bosses are still possible. You don't gain XP from killing bosses, so you just run from all non-boss fights.

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Dark567 » Fri Aug 12, 2011 1:42 pm UTC

ProZac wrote:
Dark567 wrote:
Endless Mike wrote:You could try to play FF8 without junctioning GFs.

Emphasis on try.
If I recall, the only thing you could do is attack. IIRC you can't even use items without GF's.

...Yeah. Attacking over and over isn't going to get you far.
EDIT: And level scaling would make it impossible to just grind through

There is a 'challenge' associated with FF8 though, which is to be the game at the level you start at. Since all enemies scale with you (I believe), bosses are still possible. You don't gain XP from killing bosses, so you just run from all non-boss fights.
Yeah, on my second run through I beat 8 at like level 17(Which as you start at level 7, I guess that's still 10 levels to high). I know people generally hate level scaling in games, but it works really well in FF8. It basically makes sure the game is constantly the right difficulty, but it absolutely solves the level grinding problems associated with many of the other Final Fantasies.
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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Mishrak » Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:17 pm UTC

I'm surprised no one has mentioned this already.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/snes/554041-fin ... faqs/28939 - Natural Magic challenge for SNES/PSX FF6(3)

Gamefaqs also has quite a few low level guides.

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby SecondTalon » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:04 pm UTC

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Jesse » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:48 pm UTC

Dark567 wrote:
ProZac wrote:
Dark567 wrote:
Endless Mike wrote:You could try to play FF8 without junctioning GFs.

Emphasis on try.
If I recall, the only thing you could do is attack. IIRC you can't even use items without GF's.

...Yeah. Attacking over and over isn't going to get you far.
EDIT: And level scaling would make it impossible to just grind through

There is a 'challenge' associated with FF8 though, which is to be the game at the level you start at. Since all enemies scale with you (I believe), bosses are still possible. You don't gain XP from killing bosses, so you just run from all non-boss fights.
Yeah, on my second run through I beat 8 at like level 17(Which as you start at level 7, I guess that's still 10 levels to high). I know people generally hate level scaling in games, but it works really well in FF8. It basically makes sure the game is constantly the right difficulty, but it absolutely solves the level grinding problems associated with many of the other Final Fantasies.


I never noticed the scaling on bosses. I seemingly remember grinding against T-Rex things in the Gardens and then one-shotting Seifer the first time you gith him.

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Dark567 » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:54 pm UTC

Jesse wrote:I never noticed the scaling on bosses. I seemingly remember grinding against T-Rex things in the Gardens and then one-shotting Seifer the first time you gith him.
It's there. They just don't necessarily scale equally. So enemy X at level 7 while you are at 7 are really easy, and enemy Y at level 7 is really hard, but if you are level 100 enemy X can be really hard and enemy Y is easy. People out there on the internetz have figured out all the best times to grind or not to grind. But even with the differences, with good strategy and upgrades and what not, you can beat it without leveling up almost at all. In any other FF game that would be outright impossible if I remember correctly.

EDIT: Again, I think this is one of the reason why I like VIII so much. Its the one game I can think of that does level scaling right(unlike say, Oblivion). Not only do the enemy's stats get better, but they start to drop different loot and use different strategies. And it eliminates grinding.

EDIT2: I guess Mass Effect 2 is also a good example of level scaling.... I didn't even notice until I looked it up right now.
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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Kag » Sat Aug 13, 2011 12:45 am UTC

Dark567 wrote:In any other FF game that would be outright impossible if I remember correctly.


It's possible, although extremely tedious, to beat IX without gaining any levels at all.
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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Jorpho » Sun Aug 14, 2011 6:20 pm UTC

Dark567 wrote:Yeah, on my second run through I beat 8 at like level 17(Which as you start at level 7, I guess that's still 10 levels to high). I know people generally hate level scaling in games, but it works really well in FF8. It basically makes sure the game is constantly the right difficulty, but it absolutely solves the level grinding problems associated with many of the other Final Fantasies.
Level grinding in FF8 is replaced by Drawing, over and over and over again. And then you Refine the magic, and you Draw some more, and then the enemies level up so you can Draw different magic from them, and you Refine, and you Draw some more, and so on. Blah.

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Sir_Elderberry » Sun Aug 14, 2011 8:53 pm UTC

Kag wrote:
Dark567 wrote:In any other FF game that would be outright impossible if I remember correctly.


It's possible, although extremely tedious, to beat IX without gaining any levels at all.

People have done No Sphere Grid runs of FFX, I believe.
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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Aug 15, 2011 12:01 am UTC

ProZac wrote:
Dark567 wrote:
Endless Mike wrote:You could try to play FF8 without junctioning GFs.

Emphasis on try.
If I recall, the only thing you could do is attack. IIRC you can't even use items without GF's.

...Yeah. Attacking over and over isn't going to get you far.
EDIT: And level scaling would make it impossible to just grind through

There is a 'challenge' associated with FF8 though, which is to be the game at the level you start at. Since all enemies scale with you (I believe), bosses are still possible. You don't gain XP from killing bosses, so you just run from all non-boss fights.

There's a handful of fights early on that you have to actually win, but beyond that the rest of the non boss fights you run from until you learn the card ability since I believe that gives your GFs AP but doesn't give XP to your characters.

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Re: Final Fantasy 3 or 6 or 12 or ?? Challenge - Natural Mag

Postby Dark567 » Mon Aug 15, 2011 12:16 am UTC

Jorpho wrote:
Dark567 wrote:Yeah, on my second run through I beat 8 at like level 17(Which as you start at level 7, I guess that's still 10 levels to high). I know people generally hate level scaling in games, but it works really well in FF8. It basically makes sure the game is constantly the right difficulty, but it absolutely solves the level grinding problems associated with many of the other Final Fantasies.
Level grinding in FF8 is replaced by Drawing, over and over and over again. And then you Refine the magic, and you Draw some more, and then the enemies level up so you can Draw different magic from them, and you Refine, and you Draw some more, and so on. Blah.
People say this, but I never remember it. I've played through it twice and neither time do I remember hunting enemies to just to draw magic. When I randomly got in a fight with an enemy I would sometimes draw something, but never specifically went out of my way to "draw grind". Then again I usually didn't have my magic maxed out, so I guess if that was important to you, you would... but its not necessary.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Xanthir » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:21 am UTC

I remember quite a lot of draw grinding, particularly against bosses who exposed a spell way before normal enemies would. Anytime I saw a new spell I got excited and spent ten minutes drawing until I was full.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Decker » Mon Aug 15, 2011 1:58 pm UTC

FF8's magic system was one of the reasons I didn't really get into it. There are others as well, but this was a big part of it.
Seven, nine, ten, and twelve I loved. Eight, I don't think I ever cleared disk 1.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby philsov » Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:19 pm UTC

People have done No Sphere Grid runs of FFX, I believe.


It's actually not that bad -- Bring in characters with "initiative" weaponry, and then spam summons all day long. Happily boost summon stats with your abundant amount of level up spheres and stolen goods. On bosses an overdriven Yuna plus another summon or two primed for overdrive makes for a good execute provided you can survive the delay inbetween overdrives.

FFX has so many challenges and variants the nomenclature is a bloody mess. Like I'm supposed to know what a NSGNSNCTO challenge is.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Dark567 » Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:57 pm UTC

Decker wrote:FF8's magic system was one of the reasons I didn't really get into it. There are others as well, but this was a big part of it.
Seven, nine, ten, and twelve I loved. Eight, I don't think I ever cleared disk 1.

Admittedly it probably does have the worst magic system of any FF since... one? Even so I think it is made up for with the best summoning system of any of the games. Along with a good limit system and large number of side quests, non-superdeformed characters, plus it definitely had the highest production values of any of the PS era games, and the music is probably the best of any FF. I mean I understand not liking the magic system... but I always felt there were weaker points to a lot of the other games(XII's gambit system).

Any way because I am just looking for an excuse:
VIII>VI>VII>IX>X>IV>XIII>V>X-2>II>III>I>XII*
(I don't play MMO's, so XI and XIV are omitted)

* I really don't like the gambit system... but you shouldn't take that so seriously as I still completed the game. Basically even though its my least favorite FF, that's not really that much of a strike against it.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Decker » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:23 pm UTC

See, now the Gambit system I actually liked. It was interactive enough that I didn't feel that the game was taking control away from me, and it could be interrupted at any time in case something different needed to happen.
Maybe it appealed to the programmer in me.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby mosc » Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:01 pm UTC

The gambit system was fine if they had unlocked the entire thing from the start. Making you play through a huge percentage of the game before you have access to, say, health <50%, was annoying. Gambits were fine when they existed but when they weren't unlocked yet you were just left with a clunky interface not designed to be used on a turn by turn basis. Also, the main draw of the gambit system was not needing to micromanage your characters but with only 3 characters to deal with, that advantage was useless. It could have easily supported all 6 characters in your party which would have more than justified the automation gambits provided. 12 also had completely generic characters from a gameplay system, the worst limit break concept in the history of limit breaks, 3 characters that had near-zero purpose compared to the other 3 you wanted to use, a time consuming overly annoying travel system, and incredibly stupid randomized chests. 12 was to me pretty much the definition of everything that is wrong with final fantasy. You can pretty much compare 12 to 10 and see that every addition was terrible and every omission sorely missed. Not that 10 was perfect, but it was at least solidly playable in the style we are accustomed to.

My favorite was 6 for those who want to put my comments in reference to which I liked the best.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Decker » Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:05 pm UTC

I didn't hate 12, but I will agree that 10 was much better.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Dark567 » Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:14 pm UTC

mosc wrote: 12 was to me pretty much the definition of everything that is wrong with final fantasy. You can pretty much compare 12 to 10 and see that every addition was terrible and every omission sorely missed. Not that 10 was perfect, but it was at least solidly playable in the style we are accustomed to.
It's funny because a lot of people would say the same thing about 13, yet 13 took all of the things from 10 that 12 didn't. I mean 12 got away with the entire idea of a separate menu based battle system and had exploring etc. 13 was just battle, walk, battle, walk, cutscene, no time for town, or conversation or shop... battle, battle, BATTLE. The entire game was taking the central premise of Final Fantasy and distilling it to its essence... except an FF with nothing but its essence feels severely lacking, because part of an FF game is supposed to be the feeling that its a fleshed out world and story. 12 though lost the essence of FF by not having a good battle system.

I really wish that XV returns to the SNES/PS/X style of Final Fantasy. But I don't have my hopes up as the last 'traditional' Final Fantasy was X, and that was a decade ago.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:46 pm UTC

I really liked the FF12 battle system. There was something incredibly satisfying about walking up to a group of enemies and putting down the controller to see a set of well-designed gambits work their magic.

The fact that I only hated a few of the FF12 characters was a significant improvement over FF10 where I only liked a couple. Especially since you basically never have to use the ones I hated after the first four or so hours of game, whereas the FF10 ones were the main characters.

That said, FF10 was undeniably better put together since it didn't have anywhere near the problems that FF12 had in its development.

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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby mosc » Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:54 pm UTC

I agree Dark567. I found some stuff good about FF13. It was certainly playable. Similar to 12, the combat system was not fully unlocked until after the game was basically over (in 13's case, that's a rather literal truth). 13 was pretty awesome combat was once everything was unlocked but it basically turned the entire "game" into an extended tutorial. Once you were able to flop classes around (things like 3x level 5 sentinels) things got much more interesting and you understood why most of the direct commands were automated. FF13 at it's best was a twitch game. The plot was weird but didn't bother me too much. I did miss the atmosphere of a FF game with an overworld and revisiting old locations as well as towns.

Endless Mike wrote:I really liked the FF12 battle system. There was something incredibly satisfying about walking up to a group of enemies and putting down the controller to see a set of well-designed gambits work their magic.

How is putting the controller down any different than walking into a typical FF battle and just holding down X? In some games, you could even set X to repeat the last inputted command so you could have, say, Rosa use pray to put some healing in with your 3 attacks and yawn your way through random encounters.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby ProZac » Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:03 pm UTC

Endless Mike wrote:I really liked the FF12 battle system. There was something incredibly satisfying about walking up to a group of enemies and putting down the controller to see a set of well-designed gambits work their magic.

The fact that I only hated a few of the FF12 characters was a significant improvement over FF10 where I only liked a couple. Especially since you basically never have to use the ones I hated after the first four or so hours of game, whereas the FF10 ones were the main characters.

You and I, very different. FFXII is my least favorite specifically because it was "Walk up to a group of enemies and set the controller down." During the final 4 or however many there are boss fights, that chain the end of the game together, aside from walking from one to the other, I touched the controller once, and it was to break what had become an infinite loop of "Characters cast buffs, Boss dispels, repeat". I tried to play the game without using Gambits, but it's clunky and not feasible. Once you start using them, as a player your only interaction is exploring, which I hate. Yes, I found FFXIII quite enjoyable since there was so little exploration. In both XII and XIII though I did find the hunts to be most enjoyable, as you actually had to essentially take full and precise control over the team to win those fights.

Also, I didn't like a single character in XII, and couldn't tell you what the story was about except that the most obnoxious character was always complaining about thick mist.

VIII was my favorite, but that's mostly due to characters/story. I think X is probably the strongest in the series though. It may not be the best in all regards, but I don't think there's anything it does terribly.

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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Dark567 » Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:06 pm UTC

Endless Mike wrote:The fact that I only hated a few of the FF12 characters was a significant improvement over FF10 where I only liked a couple. Especially since you basically never have to use the ones I hated after the first four or so hours of game, whereas the FF10 ones were the main characters.
There is something of double edged sword with that though, I don't remember any characters being annoying in 12(a rarity in the series), but also I don't really remember very many of the characters at all other then Balthier and the rabbit woman(Fran???).

That also makes me wonder.... there were a lot less annoying characters before they added speech. Maybe when it was just text I interpreted characters in such a way that it didn't annoy me, but its impossible to not be annoyed by the crack of Tidus' voice.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Decker » Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:09 pm UTC

Dark567 wrote:
Endless Mike wrote:The fact that I only hated a few of the FF12 characters was a significant improvement over FF10 where I only liked a couple. Especially since you basically never have to use the ones I hated after the first four or so hours of game, whereas the FF10 ones were the main characters.
There is something of double edged sword with that though, I don't remember any characters being annoying in 12(a rarity in the series), but also I don't really remember very many of the characters at all other then Balthier and the rabbit woman(Fran???).

Fun fact that I have no idea if it's true: Balthier was originally supposed to be the main character, hence all his references to being "the leading man". I think I would have preferred that game to be honest.
And yes, Fran was...memorable.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby mosc » Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:14 pm UTC

Penlo was just as annoying as any other character ever. Also, you had characters entering and leaving randomly for about a third of the game which has always been a huge annoyance. Adding characters is fine but you would think they'd get the hang out of not letting us deal with inventory related issues only to take the character away again. Seriously.

And look. I've stopped walking because I'm physically on top of the chest. Can I please open it? No, I have to walk 3 inches to the left and re-approach. Then I open it for 4 gold. Which probably just prevented me from ever getting the zodiac spear. Fuck you FF12, burn in hell.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Dark567 » Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:18 pm UTC

mosc wrote:I agree Dark567. I found some stuff good about FF13. It was certainly playable. Similar to 12, the combat system was not fully unlocked until after the game was basically over (in 13's case, that's a rather literal truth). 13 was pretty awesome combat was once everything was unlocked but it basically turned the entire "game" into an extended tutorial.
This is why the fan boy in me is tentatively looking forward to XIII-2. Hopefully it will be the same awesome combat, except unlocked the entire time.

Although if the last direct sequel was representative maybe this should be the case.....
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:37 pm UTC

ProZac wrote: I think X is probably the strongest in the series though. It may not be the best in all regards, but I don't think there's anything it does terribly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5FTJxfV3pc

EDIT: I will admit that I am biased in that I ABSOLUTELY HATE Nomura's character designs.

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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Kag » Tue Aug 16, 2011 3:53 am UTC

Every 3D FF except IX has bad characters, some worse than others.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Xanthir » Tue Aug 16, 2011 5:59 am UTC

Heh, I think IX had terrible characters. ^_^ Tastes differ significantly.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Telchar » Tue Aug 16, 2011 6:21 am UTC

Man, 10 had the worst characters until 13 and by far the stupidest plot. I was a huge fan of both 3us and 12 precisely because of the more open world design and better story. The gambit system never bothered me. The only fights that I ever felt limited by it were the debuff fights (several plant bosses and one green dragon come to mind) and some of those were kind of awkward, but other than that it was never more tedious than any other FF game at high levels.

"Oh, we aren't fighting a boss? Okay, just hit x" doesn't seem any more fun than "Oh, we aren't fighting a boss? I'll set everyone to gambits and grab a drink."

13 was by far the most chafing one for me however. Terrible story, characters I had no reason to care about, and you are on rails up until just before the final "dungeon". What a worthless optical orgasm.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Kag » Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:16 am UTC

Xanthir wrote:Heh, I think IX had terrible characters. ^_^ Tastes differ significantly.


You might argue that Vivi or Freya have uninteresting character arcs, but at least they have them.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Endless Mike » Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:15 pm UTC

Did Amarant have a character arc? It's been awhile since I played it, but I seem to recall him showing up and throwing out an occasional one-line and that's about it.

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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby IcedT » Thu Aug 18, 2011 6:33 pm UTC

Telchar wrote:Man, 10 had the worst characters until 13 and by far the stupidest plot...
13 was by far the most chafing one for me however. Terrible story, characters I had no reason to care about, and you are on rails up until just before the final "dungeon". What a worthless optical orgasm.

See, I thought 10's story was great. And there were some really awful moments in it (see above) but I thought the cast was generally likeable. 13's story was maybe too lean for the length they ended up making the game- about 3/4s of the storyline was prologue/tutorial- but, again, I generally liked the cast. Only Hope and Vanille ever bugged me much, but that's because they're the obligatory angsty teen and bubbly little girl. Everyone else seemed pretty sympathetic to me.

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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Dark567 » Thu Aug 18, 2011 6:47 pm UTC

IcedT wrote:See, I thought 10's story was great. And there were some really awful moments in it (see above) but I thought the cast was generally likeable. 13's story was maybe too lean for the length they ended up making the game- about 3/4s of the storyline was prologue/tutorial- but, again, I generally liked the cast. Only Hope and Vanille ever bugged me much, but that's because they're the obligatory angsty teen and bubbly little girl. Everyone else seemed pretty sympathetic to me.
Yeah, I found Lightning, Fang, Sazh and Snow to be much less grating then Wakka, Yuna and Tidus, and generally likable.

Hell Lighting and Fang are two of my Fang are two of my favorite character in the whole series. Lighting in particular is the first time they have created a cool, aloof protagonist that didn't get bogged down in angst(see Squall and Cloud). Plus gunblade. Gunblades make every character better.
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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby IcedT » Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:39 pm UTC

Dark567 wrote:Yeah, I found Lightning, Fang, Sazh and Snow to be much less grating then Wakka, Yuna and Tidus, and generally likable.

Hell Lighting and Fang are two of my Fang are two of my favorite character in the whole series. Lighting in particular is the first time they have created a cool, aloof protagonist that didn't get bogged down in angst(see Squall and Cloud). Plus gunblade. Gunblades make every character better.

I still liked Wakka, Yuna, and Tidus overall, but they did have some obnoxious features that made them tough to like sometimes. But at least we all love Auron.

And seriously, Lightning was an awesome character. It's pretty rare to get a real, believable hardass as the lead.

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Re: Final Fantasy Omnithread - All FF, all the time.

Postby Dark567 » Thu Aug 18, 2011 8:13 pm UTC

IcedT wrote:I still liked Wakka, Yuna, and Tidus overall, but they did have some obnoxious features that made them tough to like sometimes. But at least we all love Auron.

And seriously, Lightning was an awesome character. It's pretty rare to get a real, believable hardass as the lead.

Sure Wakka, Yuna, and Tidus weren't all bad, and had redeeming qualities. None were as bad as Vanille. And I forgot about Auron, but I filed him as mysterious badass supporting character(along with Vincent and Amarant). I mean their all cool characters, but they kinda just follow a trope.

Lighting might be my favorite video game character ever. She's just completely bad ass, but capable of having a compassionate streak when needed. But if you talk back your gonna get a mouth of fist. I... I ... I might have a crush.
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Yakk wrote:The question the thought experiment I posted is aimed at answering: When falling in a black hole, do you see the entire universe's future history train-car into your ass, or not?


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