Madge, thank you for sharing your excellent game tips! Mark, really, try some of those in the next game. I’m thinking of following them myself by just tunneling plytho and ignoring everyone else.
jimbob, is this a mistake?
If I’m macho scum didn’t need a strongman to kill me, and a doctor couldn’t protect me against a regular kill, so follow the cop wasn’t a workable strategy anyway.jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Scum aren't in a good situation. Town now have two doctors able to protect bessie, and no longer have their strongman to deal with them. So if town realise this, they can essentially follow the cop to victory.
Ok, game notes! I’ve been screwing with this for two days because I keep thinking I have more to say, but it’s time to move it along. If I have more later, I’ll just post again.
Things I like:
-Flavor: A+, nuff said.
-Setup: Well, since my guess was 8 town, 2 mafia, 1 recruit/supporter/traitor/whatever from the beginning, it should be no surprise that I believe this aspect of the setup was just right! The town roles (standards like cop/doc/jailer/watcher/tracker with limitations) and mafia roles (strongman and ninja + other powers, unlimited to balance the numbers) were what I was expecting. So for the most part, I think the balance was good.
-moody’s ter’angreal- I thought this was a great mechanic (even if I think it was meh as a secondary win con). It also could have been an interesting power if moody had lived, because he always knew where it was (he could have confirmed BoomFrog was roleblocked). It could also been used by scum to cover the kill.
-No alignment/win condition changing roles.
Where I think the game missed: Sabrar’s role.
Things I like:
-Traitor knew his alignment from the beginning, this wasn’t recruitment. (Question for jimbob, would Sabrar have copped as “not town” the entire game?)
-The traitor voting power was interesting, would have liked to see it used.
-Inheriting the kill mechanism, I think not knowing in advance was ok but for such a small game perhaps should have been immediate.
Things I don’t like:
-No mechanism for mafia and traitor to at least find out who all their partners were. It appears from reading your flavor notes that wam was not informed that Sabrar was traitor, only Vicarin. Perhaps the more traditional “traitor joins team if targeted” would have been better.
-No N0 or day chat was especially difficult for such a small team, since they couldn’t share their abilities until N1. (I had guessed in my setup spec that was mafia all-chat, with a mason pair to balance it out.)
Personal observation, not game commentary, I think we should use all-chat and pseudo nightless (night actions due within a few hours of EOD so that people can use the lynch result to choose night actions) more often. If you’re town the night cycle sucks. And our games are small so there’s potential mafia never have the opportunity to chat.
Re secondary win cons: I had some pretty harsh comments in game because I seriously wasn’t expecting anyone to submit something that would actually have an effect on game play. I really expected more like this:
I love this one! I wish I thought of it.BoomFrog wrote: I predict that Vicaran's bonus win-con is too be quoted by every player. (maybe before D1, maybe he just has to make sure he gets everyone before they die.)
Anyway, I couldn’t believe we had so many lyncher-type secondary win cons. I suppose it was just bad luck that the scummiest secondary win cons were assigned to scum, because I think claiming definitely hurt them. And I was ready to rant yet again about this, when I realized that TBH it was scum’s own fault that they claimed their win cons, and that they revealed they had ever even considered pursuing them (and in doing so showed their scum card). They could have ignored them as I ignored mine (note: I deliberately started picking LaserGuy on N2 because he’s the only person that didn’t claim, so it couldn’t affect my gameplay, like if I had chosen mpolo again I might have been predisposed to vote for him). So jimbob, I am ok with everything you did with the secondary win cons.
Re #2, might I humbly suggest that the secondary win cons are more whimsical, or perhaps that instead of making secondary win cons, perhaps having a goal that triggers a bonus or a power? Like for example, if there was a tied vote, then the next day BoomFrog would get a double vote. Or for Mark’s, on days he was the post leader he could use his watcher on whomever he wanted.jimbobmacdoodle wrote: In retrospect, I'd have changed a couple of things: 1) switched around the scum abilities so that redirect was paired with the (in this setup) weaker ninja, so that scum didn't lose all their good abilities in one go, and 2) found a way to make the secondary win conditions impact the game more. I decided against making them compulsory, as that would have been hard to balance, but I wonder if I'd strengthened town it could have made more of a difference. It's difficult to know. I think more that actually had a direct game effect like moody's would have worked.
Re #1, I don't necessarily think the ninja was weaker than the strongman, the perspective would be altered if BoomFrog and mpolo had died early instead of moody and heury, or if Madge had absorbed an investigative power.
Anyway, thank you again jimbobmacdoodle, I always look forward to your games.
dimochka, you need to hang around here more often.