The Mafia with the Golden Gun (Day 004)

[plytho]

Knowing that wam is still in the game also makes it hard to go forward...

1. No I didn't know I would survive an arrest.

Why did you survive?

[wam]

Apparently I bribed the police.

[moody7277]

So, some people we lynch don't stay lynched, and so far no one has any more info to determine bad guys based on night actions. It's hard to scumhunt when the scum are just as confused as town.

[plytho]

There was no flaw and I'll gladly explain why after the game.

How about explaining it now?

[Sabrar]

I don't think so. It apparently relied on some false assumptions but revealing them would not be beneficial.

[Sabrar]

After some consideration I have decided that I don't believe wam when he says that he didn't know about his lynch-immunity. There is about a 15% chance that the game is even more bastard that I currently think it is, but 85% is good enough.

Vote: wam

[plytho]

I don't think so. It apparently relied on some false assumptions but revealing them would not be beneficial.

Yeah, "oops ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ " doesn't really cut it when your flawless plan turns out to be anything but. Especially when the flaw was pointed out explicitly.

[Mark_Cangila]

I also survived. Just been busy sorry. I was told that MI6 made a deal to get me out and covered it as a prison inspection.

[moody7277]

And suddenly, the "vote everyone" strategy takes on a disturbingly plausible look to it.

[freezeblade]

Well, I for one don't like this, as we basically NL'd two days in a row, and have no extra information (that people are willing to divulge).

My actions failed last night (well, the ones that weren't defensive actions, which I didn't get any feedback on). I tried to follow someone, and lost them in a crowded bus terminal.

[moody7277]

Well, I for one don't like this, as we basically NL'd two days in a row, and have no extra information (that people are willing to divulge).

My actions failed last night (well, the ones that weren't defensive actions, which I didn't get any feedback on). I tried to follow someone, and lost them in a crowded bus terminal.

On the plus side, there hasn't been a night kill go through yet (although bessie mentioned someone got poisoned), which means we're in part three of D1 (and isn't Madge lucky she's not in the game).

[Sabrar]

Yeah, "oops ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ " doesn't really cut it when your flawless plan turns out to be anything but. Especially when the flaw was pointed out explicitly.

And suddenly, the "vote everyone" strategy takes on a disturbingly plausible look to it.

The flawless plan is still flawless. Unless everyone has an infinite number of get-out-of-the-jail-for-free cards, but I really doubt that.

[freezeblade]

It's only flawless if your assumptions about the setup and mechanics are correct. And well *gestures to everyone still alive*

[moody7277]

Calling it a "flawless plan" without so much as an iota of data in favor seems a bit grandiose, but seeing our alternative is lacking:

Vote: wam

ninja'd P.S. Yeah, what freezeblade said.

[Sabrar]

1. Where were you leaning town on wam in Texas?
2. You wanted him vigged at the end of D1.

1. In my head. I don't always openly defend people whom I find townie while others find them scummy if my conviction isn't strong enough. The reason is somewhat selfish, I want to avoid getting connected to them in case they get lynched and I was wrong (see Vicarin defending bessie in Texas).
2. No, I just had to include him in the list. It wouldn't have been the worst case scenario anyway, getting rid of a scummy-looking town with Vig is preferable to mislynching them.

[plytho]

And suddenly, the "vote everyone" strategy takes on a disturbingly plausible look to it.

Can you explain why? I'm having trouble following your reasoning here.

So now there are three people that want to arrest everyone?

[moody7277]

I know I have an ability that, were I to be arrested, I would be back out the next day. It is therefore an allowed hypothesis that all town have such an ability, although if you trust the flavor wam gave with his it's a bit shadier (might just be Bangkok). There might also have been interference with night abilities that would be mitigated if all of the scummier persons were out of the way.

[Sabrar]

Unvote

I feel like the only way in this game to remove someone from the game entirely is to shoot them. I don't think this game should have been labelled as mafia. Whatever.

Party at my house, everyone's invited. We'll hold a shoot-out and sort out the bodies tomorrow.

Spoiler:

just for bessie's sake: above plan is not serious

[Mark_Cangila]

I would agree that shooting is probably the only kill method. I also couldn't do any actions while arrested.

[somitomi]

I also survived. Just been busy sorry. I was told that MI6 made a deal to get me out and covered it as a prison inspection.

I'm going to have stern words with the police chief about releasing everyone they've arrested so far.

And suddenly, the "vote everyone" strategy takes on a disturbingly plausible look to it.

What? How does everyone being lynchproof make the "vote everyone" plan more sensible?

The flawless plan is still flawless. Unless everyone has an infinite number of get-out-of-the-jail-for-free cards, but I really doubt that.

How is this plan still "flawless" at this point? We just saw the pitfalls bessie and I pointed out D2 are not just possible but probable as well. Sure, infinite get-out-of-jail-free is unlikely, but scum only needs to survive a limited number of arrests before all of town is dead.

Unvote
I feel like the only way in this game to remove someone from the game entirely is to shoot them. I don't think this game should have been labelled as mafia. Whatever.

I have the feeling you might be right and I kind of share your frustration to be honest. Is anyone going to burst in guns blazing and save the day?

[somitomi]

EBWOP:

On the plus side, there hasn't been a night kill go through yet (although bessie mentioned someone got poisoned), which means we're in part three of D1 (and isn't Madge lucky she's not in the game).

Yay, even less information!

[plytho]

I know I have an ability that, were I to be arrested, I would be back out the next day.

It's odd that you are aware of it while Wam claims he wasn't and Mark seemed to imply the same.

[freezeblade]

I know I have an ability that, were I to be arrested, I would be back out the next day.

It's odd that you are aware of it while Wam claims he wasn't and Mark seemed to imply the same.

I also have this mechanic. Although I will say that it is not as cut and dry as "arrest immune" (granted it is the same mechanic) and discussion of it in this way has pretty much convinced me that both Mark and Wam aren't town (or at least, not the same flavor as I).

To be clear, Wam: you had no idea how you avoided prosecution once being arrested? (This includes that you took no action on your part)

[bessie]

Some of you are lying liars. I won’t be home until late tonight so I won’t have time to FoS you until then, but you know who you are.

I don't think so. It apparently relied on some false assumptions but revealing them would not be beneficial.

I love it when Sabrar is wrong. This made my day.

Ok, I have no idea how the game is supposed to progress. It doesn't seem to be from lynching or night killing. Hmmmmm. . .


I know where the Solex Agitator is.

[wam]

@freeze flavour says I paid a bribe, not something I was aware of before being arrested.

Sabrar is missing the point. Scum could be arrested get free and then just lurk the whole way through the game.

[plytho]

town
plytho
bessie: no way scum bessie is going to admit poisoning people and then giving them an antidote.

freezeblade: I like how freezeblade claimed his result to start discussion. Scum has no reason to move away from the confusion (and his claim is verifiable)
somitomi: I like his pushing on Sabrar's plan
moody: seems to be concerned about the right things. I like how worried he was about getting wam arrested.

Sabrar: keeps making unfounded assumptions, weird double down on the plan.
wam: Still looking scummy. Not really giving the impression of trying to figure this thing out.
Mark: Like wam, but worse.
scum

If we think the 'get out of an arrest free' cards are exhaustible we should probably just arrest wam and Mark again? It's not like they're giving any arguments for keeping them active.

Hmm, maybe arrests are just roleblocks on scummy people? From that pov I think I'm in favor of arresting Sabrar along with wam and Mark.

@wam: why did you steal those pressure plates?
@Mark: what did you do N1?

[Sabrar]

Sabrar is missing the point. Scum could be arrested get free and then just lurk the whole way through the game.

What is this in relation to?

Sabrar: keeps making unfounded assumptions,

I assumed. i do that occasionally. #sarcasm

[wam]

Sabrar is missing the point. Scum could be arrested get free and then just lurk the whole way through the game.

What is this in relation to?

Sabrar: keeps making unfounded assumptions,

I assumed. i do that occasionally. #sarcasm

The grand plan.

[Sabrar]

But then if everybody is always released and target number for arrest does not go down we will know that they are lurking...
I don't see your point.

[wam]

But then if everybody is always released and target number for arrest does not go down we will know that they are lurking...
I don't see your point.

If you look at the start of this day people didn't know about Mark and I still playing.

[bessie]

Vote: wam

Please post the votals and the deadline.

Sabrar, why did you unvote?

[Sabrar]

Because I don't think we can shoot wam in jail.

[plytho]

@Bessie: the current deadline is in the Op

[bessie]

I don’t beilieve this explanation from wam:

1. No I didn't know I would survive an arrest.

Refer to a comment I made here on D2:

I agree with sabrars plan and tbh I should probably go first just as Bessie is locked on and it will allow the rest of you to focus on getting scum.

I’m not usually able to lead a lynch. There have been many many times where I’ve locked on to someone and been unable to get anyone to follow. It is puzzling to me as to why you would give up so easily.

Ninja’d by Sabrar. Hmm, I didn’t even consider that the arrest mechanics might actually be that of a traditional “jailer”. Will think about this while I am at work today.

Unvote.

[SuicideJunkie]

Sorry, I'd typed this up but didn't hit submit.
Votals:

• Wam <--(1, max 2)
  
  • Sabrar
  • Moody7277
  • Bessie

Countdown

[somitomi]

I know I have an ability that, were I to be arrested, I would be back out the next day.

It's odd that you are aware of it while Wam claims he wasn't and Mark seemed to imply the same.

I also have this mechanic. Although I will say that it is not as cut and dry as "arrest immune" (granted it is the same mechanic) and discussion of it in this way has pretty much convinced me that both Mark and Wam aren't town (or at least, not the same flavor as I).

I also have that machanic, although it's conditional and the nature of this condition makes it less likely to happen as the game progresses. It doesn't expire after any set number of uses or days.

Ok, I have no idea how the game is supposed to progress. It doesn't seem to be from lynching or night killing. Hmmmmm. . .

I've been thinking about mobilizing whatever vigilantes might be in the game (presumably targeting a democratically chosen person), but I haven't yet found a way to avoid multiple people targeting the same person and "wasting" a kill. I know there were no kills but absence of evidence is hopefully not evidence of absence.

If we think the 'get out of an arrest free' cards are exhaustible we should probably just arrest wam and Mark again? It's not like they're giving any arguments for keeping them active.

Hmm, maybe arrests are just roleblocks on scummy people? From that pov I think I'm in favor of arresting Sabrar along with wam and Mark.

Hmmm. We can't be sure the get out of jail free cards are indeed finite and Sabrar does have a point about arrested players being immune to kills, I need to think about this over dinner.

[bessie]

Well, I tried following Sabrar's point last night, but apparently I suck at espionage because I still have nothing to report.

I don’t understand this comment.

I guess I'm really not understanding this game, as it appears again that we have all the players in the game still.

Does anyone have any idea what the hell is going on?

Seriously what?
@Mark: are you still in the game as well?

It appears freezeblade and somitomi are puzzled as to how wam and Mark survived the lynch, however these are very odd comments considering both of them also claim to have some lynch immunity.

It's hard to scumhunt when the scum are just as confused as town.

Interesting. Why do you think scum is confused? Of whom in particular were you thinking?

I've been thinking about mobilizing whatever vigilantes might be in the game (presumably targeting a democratically chosen person), but I haven't yet found a way to avoid multiple people targeting the same person and "wasting" a kill.

Since when? D1, D2, or just now? When did you start thinking that we have multiple vigilantes? And you can’t think of any plan at all? Like say, even players target wam, odd players target Mark? This whole statement is very suspicious, like you want to appear like you’re trying to figure out the game, but you aren’t really trying very hard.

[plytho]

Freezeblade, Mark and moody have all been quiet for over 24 hours. With days this short, that's a lot of time to lose.

[plytho]

Like say, even players target wam, odd players target Mark?

That's actually not a bad plan.

[Sabrar]

What happens if A tracks B, B tracks A and both of them are successful? At which location do they end up? If C tracks either A or B will s/he be there as well?